Disability insurance?

[drRumi]

what anesthesia-specific insurance plans are you boys and girls signing up for?

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[2win]

I went with Metlife.

 

[OB1🤙]

Guardian and Standard.

 

[drRumi]

Guardian and Standard.

HB, why two separate plans?

 

[coprolalia]

Disability insurance salespeople are one layer of pond scum above used car salesmen.

-copro

 

[OB1🤙]

HB, why two separate plans?

To double the amount of coverage I can get once I make attending money.

 

[cchoukal]

I just went thru this process, so let me share what I know. There are 3 companies that offer specialty specific coverage, Standard, Guardian, and MetLife. They all have slight differences and costs. One might have a limited benefit if your disability is psych related (drug abuse), where the other might offer a long term care benefit. Ultimately, you'll need to buy this thru an agent or financial planner anyway, so they will go over those subtle differences with you. Each plan has a maximum monthly benefit, and as I recall, any one policy will pay up to $15000 per month. In order to get more coverage (I think the overall max is $20000 permonth, no matter how many policies you have), you have to buy 2 policies. There's an art to mixing and matching which ones to get, but your agent will work thru that with you.

Most people purchase during residency, where the max is $5000 per month, but you buy a future purchase option, which allows you to increase to the max (15 or 20, depending on how many policies you buy) without going thru the underwriting/exam process again.

It's important to note, though, that the coverage you buy may not actually yield the monthly payment you think it will. Even if you buy $15000/mo worth of coverage, if you get disabled, the company will pay some amount UP TO $15000, depending upon how much you actually earn by working AND how much a group disability policy (many private groups and most academic groups have these) is paying on your behalf. What my planners told me was that in order to actually GET $20000 per month payment, I'd have to have no group policy with my practice AND be grossing like $650K per year, even if I were paying for $20000 per month in coverage.

Since I'm probably doing academics, and since even private groups in big cities rarely pay this kind of money, I went with a single policy up to $15000.

 

[Antigunner]

My understanding is that if you get your policy in place BEFORE starting residency, you can get the maximum benefit per month (because at that point you don't have any group coverage), and that if you stick with that policy, which can be upgraded for more coverage after you start making the real money, you still get the full benefit.

 

[mcgreen]

Disability insurance salespeople are one layer of pond scum above used car salesmen.

-copro

Disability insurance is all too often a false promise. Insurance companies when faced with writing a big check seldom do the right thing but usually send out their claims examiners, lawyers or in house doctors to deny the claim. The only true insurance is self insurance; when you become an attending continue to live like a resident, save as much as you can, create your own disability insurance policy.

I know of three doctors who were legitimately disabled and were initially denied coverage. They all needed to contact a lawyer to threaten to sue the Insurance Company and fight for a number of years before getting any payment on their disability claim.

I am suggesting that only paying for disability insurance is not enough, At the very least you need to save up enough money to fight the insurance company for two years until they decide to pay your claim.

 

[drRumi]

Disability insurance is all too often a false promise. Insurance companies when faced with writing a big check seldom do the right thing but usually send out their claims examiners, lawyers or in house doctors to deny the claim. The only true insurance is self insurance; when you become an attending continue to live like a resident, save as much as you can, create your own disability insurance policy.

I know of three doctors who were legitimately disabled and were initially denied coverage. They all needed to contact a lawyer to threaten to sue the Insurance Company and fight for a number of years before getting any payment on their disability claim.

I am suggesting that only paying for disability insurance is not enough, At the very least you need to save up enough money to fight the insurance company for two years until they decide to pay your claim.

very sound advise. this guy was "invited" to speak to us about disability insurance. he only mentioned principle, metlife and standard. no mention of guardian. which makes me wonder. anywhooo, i think im leaning towards principle. from just the numbers they seem to have the best benefits. i need to find out more about guardian. honestly this whole thing (including the guy selling the policies) seems a bit shady.

 

[drRumi]

I just went thru this process, so let me share what I know. There are 3 companies that offer specialty specific coverage, Standard, Guardian, and MetLife. They all have slight differences and costs. One might have a limited benefit if your disability is psych related (drug abuse), where the other might offer a long term care benefit. Ultimately, you'll need to buy this thru an agent or financial planner anyway, so they will go over those subtle differences with you. Each plan has a maximum monthly benefit, and as I recall, any one policy will pay up to $15000 per month. In order to get more coverage (I think the overall max is $20000 permonth, no matter how many policies you have), you have to buy 2 policies. There's an art to mixing and matching which ones to get, but your agent will work thru that with you.

Most people purchase during residency, where the max is $5000 per month, but you buy a future purchase option, which allows you to increase to the max (15 or 20, depending on how many policies you buy) without going thru the underwriting/exam process again.

It's important to note, though, that the coverage you buy may not actually yield the monthly payment you think it will. Even if you buy $15000/mo worth of coverage, if you get disabled, the company will pay some amount UP TO $15000, depending upon how much you actually earn by working AND how much a group disability policy (many private groups and most academic groups have these) is paying on your behalf. What my planners told me was that in order to actually GET $20000 per month payment, I'd have to have no group policy with my practice AND be grossing like $650K per year, even if I were paying for $20000 per month in coverage.

Since I'm probably doing academics, and since even private groups in big cities rarely pay this kind of money, I went with a single policy up to $15000.

great post. thank you.

 

[cchoukal]

My understanding is that if you get your policy in place BEFORE starting residency, you can get the maximum benefit per month (because at that point you don't have any group coverage), and that if you stick with that policy, which can be upgraded for more coverage after you start making the real money, you still get the full benefit.

My understanding is that the benefit is still income-adjusted.


And as for the person that mentioned Principle, I know nothing about the company, but for a long time, just standard and guardian offered specialty-specific coverage, and MetLife recently started doing so. I would be certain that Principle is offering specialty-specific (not just "physician") coverage before buying a policy.

As others have mentioned, getting a policy to pay out may not be straight-forward. I've been told that having the lawyers duke it out is fairly standard with any such claim. Get ready.

 

[GasEmDee]

Is there a benefit to doing this before finishing residency?

My understanding is that the benefit is still income-adjusted.


And as for the person that mentioned Principle, I know nothing about the company, but for a long time, just standard and guardian offered specialty-specific coverage, and MetLife recently started doing so. I would be certain that Principle is offering specialty-specific (not just "physician") coverage before buying a policy.

As others have mentioned, getting a policy to pay out may not be straight-forward. I've been told that having the lawyers duke it out is fairly standard with any such claim. Get ready.

 

[cchoukal]

yes. you can lock in at a lower rate for life ( price goes up each year; you lock in the rate for life for the initial $5000). also, you buy a future purchase option to add coverage when you start making more (and are older with potentially more medical problems) without having to incur a new exam/underwriting process.

 

[DJPJ69Camaro]

Have you guys gotten rejected for any particular reasons. I am in the process of applying for disability insurance as well. But I went to the dermatologist once in the last year. And it wasn't anything serious. But I've never been to a doctor otherwise. Do I need to report this if they don't ask about it. And would this prevent me from getting insured?

I'm looking into Guardian, MetLife, Union Central and Standard.