Do I stay or do I go? (PsyD)

[PsyDocStudent]

Hi everyone,

Longtime lurker, but this is my first post.

Thanks for taking the time to read this (it’s long!).

I am looking for some advice or words of wisdom regarding what feels like a huge decision to leave my very well regarded, top tier PsyD program, or stick it out for another 3 years.

Some background and context: I graduated from Occupational Therapy school in 2017 and worked in the OT field exclusively for about 2 years. At the time, I had my eye on a doctorate, and most likely a doctorate in mental health. I then took a research coordinator/psychometrician position at a large R1 university, and did OT work on the side. From there (in the months before COVID), I applied to programs, got in, and moved with my husband, up the northeast corridor for the program.

The current situation:

I am in year 3 of the program (I took a semester off for maternity leave), and can say with some certainty that I’ve been unhappy or at least unsure for the better part of the past 3 years. I’ve realized that I can do *a lot* of interventions (CBT-I, CBIT (for tics), organizational skills training, etc.) with just my OT license. I enjoy all of these behavior-focused interventions. Yes, the going rate for sessions in private practice is a little different ($125ish-$150 -OT; $200ish PsyD)……
I never enjoyed doing traditional psychotherapy (CBT for anxiety/depression for example), and thought, originally, that I wanted to specialize in neuropsych. After completing several neuropsych assessments (ASD diagnostics, ADHD diagnostics, dementia, etc.), I’m realizing that I dread the report-writing aspect of this work. I’ve dragged my feet through completing all of my required assessment cases, putting off the report writing longer than I should have.
Also, I’m fundamentally exhausted and burned out. I can’t imagine obtaining 400 more intervention hours over the next 3 years (this needs to happen so I’m competitive for internship).

Between taking care of a baby, doing the doc program, and working a little as an OT to try to offset some of the cost (my program does offer some funding), I’m at the end of my rope. I just don’t give a wit anymore.

In the OT-world, I’m realizing I can get specialized training in various areas, including bodywork for infants with oral motor and tongue tie issues. I also have a special place in my heart for OT using horses, and am getting specialized training in this soon (after landing a part-time position in this specialty area).
Regret is a funny thing, and I’m worried I will have it if I leave the doc program. I worked so so so hard to get in, and have put 3 years (plus maternity leave) into it. That said, I feel frustrated when I think about spending another $30,000 over the next few years to finish. It feels counter-productive when I know I could make $90,000+ in the OT field, more in private practice.
If I finish, more doors will certainly be open for me in terms of teaching (in OT and PsyD programs), consulting work, etc.
I’ve considered trying to get some training in qualitative data analysis while in school, to see if I could take on a marketing/brand strategy role after the doc program is over…..
I dunno.
I feel like I turned my life upside down for this program, and I’m worried about regret, for sure, but my heart isn’t in it right now (and maybe hasn’t been for the last couple of years)…..do I push through anyway?

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[WisNeuro]

So, you're saying that you do not enjoy psychotherapy, assessment, or research, and do not want to do these things day in and day out in a career sense?

 

[summerbabe]

If I finish, more doors will certainly be open for me in terms of teaching (in OT and PsyD programs), consulting work, etc.
I’ve considered trying to get some training in qualitative data analysis while in school, to see if I could take on a marketing/brand strategy role after the doc program is over…..
I dunno.

Unlike most people who are considering quitting a doctorate program, you have multiple viable pathways forward that sound like they would be meaningful and can support your family financially.

After completing several neuropsych assessments (ASD diagnostics, ADHD diagnostics, dementia, etc.), I’m realizing that I dread the report-writing aspect of this work. I’ve dragged my feet through completing all of my required assessment cases, putting off the report writing longer than I should have.
Also, I’m fundamentally exhausted and burned out. I can’t imagine obtaining 400 more intervention hours over the next 3 years (this needs to happen so I’m competitive for internship).

It can be hard to differentiate between the effects of burnout and fundamental dislike of an activity (but is very worthwhile to try to).

If you know for sure it's the latter (or strongly suspect it), acceptance of the sunk costs related to starting your doc program and leaving would probably be in your best interest.

Also logistically speaking, full board certification in neuropsych is going to include an internship and 2 year fellowship that may require two separate moves for your family. Plus a whole bunch more psychotherapy training, report writing and lots of didactic about the brain.

How feasible is that? Because if you don't/can't go down that path and continue with the doctorate, you'll be left in an ambiguous position of having a license to do assessment for your career and either lacking the full qualifications to do all types of assessment (which may or may not limit your career options) or find yourself potentially practicing beyond the scope of your license. And if you fundamentally can't produce reports efficiently, it'll catch up with you eventually. Good luck!

 

[Sanman]

My initial thoughts are that you are taking on too much, lack direction, and sound a bit burned out. I agree with the above that it can be hard to differentiate between fundamental dislike of the program and burnout. By year 3, I and all of my classmates were pretty burned out as well. You mentioned needing another 3 years? That seems longer than normal, are you behind on clinical rotation hours? Do you need to complete a dissertation as well? Where are you in that process?

My suggestion is take a breather, find some time to rest, and think about what it is you actually want to do for work. Once you figure that out, your decision will be a lot more clear.

 

[WisNeuro]

Jeez, you kids these days and your "burnout."

 

[Sanman]

Jeez, you kids these days and your "burnout."

The original burnout:

 

[WisNeuro]

The original burnout:

Bender just had SLS.

 

[Mama Bear]

To clarify, do you need 3 more years of the program then internship? Or 2 more years plus the year of internship?

You mentioned having a baby. I had my child during the third year of my program. It was… a challenge. I mean, you’ve got a new person to keep alive. How much of this parenting burnout would still be present if you were somewhere else entirely?

You don’t like writing reports. Do the other aspects of neuro compensate? Are they interesting enough to drive you to keep doing it? There may come a day when you have processes that expedite the report writing part, but for now in training you have to do the tedious stuff.

I’m sorry you have to make these big decisions. Being an adult sucks.

 

[GT_Neuro]

The amount of money that most Psychologists make varies depending on a variety of factors including your activities and location. However, from a financial perspective only, you will probably make around the same or more as an OT. This assumes you did clinical work as a Psychologist. If you want to teach you are going to make a lot less. Most of those positions do not pay well.

 

[R. Matey]

Between taking care of a baby, doing the doc program, and working a little as an OT to try to offset some of the cost (my program does offer some funding), I’m at the end of my rope. I just don’t give a wit anymore.

Yeah, it sounds like the grass is starting to look really nice and green over there on that other side of the fence. Questions I would ask myself in this situation: what did I see my day-to-day looking like when I began this program? Is that still what I want? Can I realistically complete my program with all these responsibilities? Can I accomplish what I want with the education and training I already have?

You might also consider heading over the OT boards here, they may some insights for you on the road (currently) not taken.

 

[PsyDocStudent]

Thank you all so so much. I really, truly appreciate all of your thoughtful responses. Given me lots to think about and to consider.

 

[PsyDr]

1) Equine therapy is not evidence based.

2) I'll differ from my colleagues: at some point in graduate school, it's wiser to just get the degree and license.

3) If writing is the issue, I would try using text to speech (e.g., Dragon Naturally Speaking). Then create a template, to organize where everything goes. Then physically organize the tests in order that you will dictate.

4) Those numbers don't add up. If 75% of your time is billable, then at $200/hr vs $125/hr, you're comparing $300k to $187k. That's just not the same range of money.

5) With intended kindness: this timeline sounds more like you want to be home with the baby, and less like you have a problem with the educational process.

 

[WisNeuro]

I'll echo PsyDr on a few points here. I'd just get the degree at this point, unless I absolutely loathed every aspect of the work. As for report writing, it's pretty much the easiest part of the job in the clinical world. Super easy to make a template based on certain diagnoses wherein most of the report is find and replace. All you have to do is write a 1-2 paragraph and summary that is more individualized. Takes me about 15-20 mins for a standard clinical report.

 

[PsyDocStudent]

Wanted to clarify a few things:
1) I should have said I’m going into my third year(just finished year 2).

2) Regardless of whether it’s grad school or OT, I will be working full time (my own mental health is no good when I’m home all day with baby, day in and day out, plus she loves her daycare center

3) thank you all for the report-writing tips. I will try and put many of them into practice (speech-to-text might be a game changer for me, as well as getting ahold of really good, solid templates

4) it’s worth considering whether the parenting burnout would still be there if the school stuff were taken away. My instinct is to say ‘’No.’ it’s really the combination of school+parenting…

 

[R. Matey]

2) I'll differ from my colleagues: at some point in graduate school, it's wiser to just get the degree and license.

The wisdom of this advice widely depends on how much the OP is paying per year in their program vs. what they expect to make once they finish.

 

[jdawg2017]

It looks like you are getting a lot of good advice and things to think about already!

I will add briefly that you need to match and complete the APA internship, which may involve moving, and then secure post-doc training (which could result in a move again) in order to be license-eligible. If you are doing psychotherapy work, a one-year post-doc is fine in most states, whereas two years is the standard for neuropsych (despite technically being license-eligible after one year in most states). My understanding of most internships and fellowships is that as a condition of employment you cannot work outside of the institution, or if you can it is for very limited amounts of time and is typically supposed to be in non-mental-health areas (e.g., consulting on a stats project or something like that). I and my partner don't yet have children, but we are now moving two times in 13 months for internship and fellowship, and it is frankly exhausting. You may or may not have to move depending on where you are, but especially for internship the odds of moving are quite high unless you are willing to roll the dice by being geographically restricted.

It sounds like you can make a good amount of money in OT with normal work hours and enjoy your life without pursuing this program further. As it stands, it sounds like you may be working something like 50-70 hours during the week on top of having a child at home (??). That must be exhausting!

It's definitely good you are getting input before making a choice, since leaving the program has clear pros and cons.

 

[PsyDr]

The wisdom of this advice widely depends on how much the OP is paying per year in their program vs. what they expect to make once they finish.

Even if she is paying $50k/yr which would you rather have?

A. A resume that shows you completed a degree and moved in to something else. With $300k in debt

B. A resume that looks like you failed out in the third act? With $250k in debt.

 

[smalltownpsych]

I am behind on my report writing so am paying a postdoc to do that for me and am going to have the postdoc do almost everything for me going forward, I still get to do the part I like which is provide interpretation and recommendations. Also, writing during grad school is way more detailed and extensive typically than what you do in the real world and building up templates is key.

 

[R. Matey]

Even if she is paying $50k/yr which would you rather have?

A. A resume that shows you completed a degree and moved in to something else. With $300k in debt

B. A resume that looks like you failed out in the third act? With $250k in debt.

I see your point, but my guess is that it would matter little to OT positions (OP, ask on the OT board!). A good friend of mine dropped out of a engineering program their first year and now works in tech making a six figure salary. It's all how you market yourself. I think you've said as much in other threads.

 

[PsyDocStudent]

I see your point, but my guess is that it would matter little to OT positions (OP, ask on the OT board!). A good friend of mine dropped out of an engineering program their first year and now works in tech making a six figure salary. It's all how you market yourself. I think you've said as much in other threads.

Yes R. Matey, I agree with this. I don’t think OT positions are going to care, honestly…especially because I’ve maintained my license(s) and am currently working in the OT field (and have been throughout my whole time in the doc program).


I so appreciate everyone’s thoughts, and will happily take any other things to consider. I’m on a mission to get my quality of life back .

 

[ImAFreudNot]

Having just had my first child, I wanted to validate and maybe commiserate with you, OP, on just how hard it is to raise children and find balance between work and family. I graduated from my 6 year program (5 years in house before internship) in 2020, did a post-doc, and wasn't licensed until Spring 2022 - then had a baby 9 months later. (I provide my timeline partly as a reference as to how long it took a fellow early career professional to get licensed post-graduation.) It felt impossible for me to have work/life balance before being licensed and able to enter private practice, although I believe it's possible at some internships, postdocs, and organizations that value employee quality of life. Now that I know firsthand how much work it takes to raise children, I cannot imagine how difficult it must be to have an infant while still being in grad school - accruing clinical hours, meeting milestones, writing a dissertation, while also keeping another living being fed, clothed, rested, and alive... I think it's very reasonable for you to want to have work/life balance, especially now that you've got a new huge priority to consider.

On the one hand, you've worked so hard and committed a lot of personal and family resources to get to where you are today. On the other hand, what you're doing now doesn't feel sustainable or fulfilling long-term. Is there a middle path somewhere here? Is it possible to take a leave of absence from your program for a semester or a year to explore OT or other career options? The time off might provide some helpful perspective.

My impression is that taking time off/longer to complete a program/leaving a program impacts your prospects more if you're looking to obtain a competitive academic position or job at an AMC or some other prestigious organization with lots of applicants. If so, include that in your calculations as you make your decision. If that's not the case, then it will likely be more about how you explain your career choices and market yourself that matters. Now that I'm in a position to hire, I care way more about experience and interpersonal interactions than about timelines or gaps in someone's resume.

I hope with time and opportunity to recover from burn out, you'll be able to find the path that works best for you and your family.

 

[PsyDocStudent]

Having just had my first child, I wanted to validate and maybe commiserate with you, OP, on just how hard it is to raise children and find balance between work and family. I graduated from my 6 year program (5 years in house before internship) in 2020, did a post-doc, and wasn't licensed until Spring 2022 - then had a baby 9 months later. (I provide my timeline partly as a reference as to how long it took a fellow early career professional to get licensed post-graduation.) It felt impossible for me to have work/life balance before being licensed and able to enter private practice, although I believe it's possible at some internships, postdocs, and organizations that value employee quality of life. Now that I know firsthand how much work it takes to raise children, I cannot imagine how difficult it must be to have an infant while still being in grad school - accruing clinical hours, meeting milestones, writing a dissertation, while also keeping another living being fed, clothed, rested, and alive... I think it's very reasonable for you to want to have work/life balance, especially now that you've got a new huge priority to consider.

On the one hand, you've worked so hard and committed a lot of personal and family resources to get to where you are today. On the other hand, what you're doing now doesn't feel sustainable or fulfilling long-term. Is there a middle path somewhere here? Is it possible to take a leave of absence from your program for a semester or a year to explore OT or other career options? The time off might provide some helpful perspective.

My impression is that taking time off/longer to complete a program/leaving a program impacts your prospects more if you're looking to obtain a competitive academic position or job at an AMC or some other prestigious organization with lots of applicants. If so, include that in your calculations as you make your decision. If that's not the case, then it will likely be more about how you explain your career choices and market yourself that matters. Now that I'm in a position to hire, I care way more about experience and interpersonal interactions than about timelines or gaps in someone's resume.

I hope with time and opportunity to recover from burn out, you'll be able to find the path that works best for you and your family.

Thanks for providing your timeline…it gives me some perspective! (And it sounds like you completed the licensure process before having your baby?)

I joke that I feel like I haven’t recovered from my birth yet (18 months ago!), but my timeline was: Nov/Dec 2021 -pregnancy turned high risk (still trying to complete assessments and collect intervention hours);
Dec 2021- birth (emergency C-section with pre-eclampsia)
March 2022 - applying for practicum/interviewing for the following June
May 2022 - went back to school to take a summer class
June 2022 - summer class plus new practicum (neuropsych placement)
Sept 2022 - back in classes full time 3 classes plus TAing 1 class) plus 1 main practicum and 2 ‘on the side’ practicum —I was/am quite behind in clinical hours because of the pregnancy/Mat leave

And now, a year+ into school again, I just want to help some people, want my day to end by 5:30p, want to enjoy what I’m doing (for the most part…), and want to make a decent living to support my family. That’s it.

 

[quickpsych]

2) I'll differ from my colleagues: at some point in graduate school, it's wiser to just get the degree and license.

This ^. The degree is great and all but the license opened so many doors and so many opportunities , practically overnight. You have so much more opportunity and freedom.

And now, a year+ into school again, I just want to help some people, want my day to end by 5:30p, want to enjoy what I’m doing (for the most part…), and want to make a decent living to support my family. That’s it.

Finishing the degree and getting the license will give you quite a bit of freedom on all of these things.

 

[VirginiaIsForLovers]

I am looking for some advice or words of wisdom regarding what feels like a huge decision to leave my very well regarded, top tier PsyD program, or stick it out for another 3 years.

Maybe I missed this, but why another 3 years? Typically students apply for internship in their 4th year. If you can, I would say stick it out for another year, apply for internship, and finish it out. I can understand feeling burnt out, but I actually enjoyed applying for internship, interviewing, and that whole process. It felt fun, I got to travel some (to internship sites), besides dissertation writing, the course work was lighter that year so we could focus on internship interviews. At some point I was just sort of coasting... doing what was being asked but not more: show up to externship and supervision; pick and choose which readings I felt were pertinent to get my papers and exams done; chip away at dissertation and report writing.

Also, I’m fundamentally exhausted and burned out. I can’t imagine obtaining 400 more intervention hours over the next 3 years (this needs to happen so I’m competitive for internship).

How many hours do you currently have? For me the goal was to have enough hours to apply to competitive sites. A cursory glance at the APPIC Directory there are plenty of sites that will look at your application with 300-400 hours. The AAPI number on there is just the minimum cut off.

I would probably talk to your spouse about ideal geographical locations, go through the APPIC Directory and see sites that interest you, and check the numbers to see what their min are. You might be surprised that you don't need another 400+ hours.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Maybe I missed this, but why another 3 years? Typically students apply for internship in their 4th year. If you can, I would say stick it out for another year, apply for internship, and finish it out. I can understand feeling burnt out, but I actually enjoyed applying for internship, interviewing, and that whole process. It felt fun, I got to travel some (to internship sites), besides dissertation writing, the course work was lighter that year so we could focus on internship interviews. At some point I was just sort of coasting... doing what was being asked but not more: show up to externship and supervision; pick and choose which readings I felt were pertinent to get my papers and exams done; chip away at dissertation and report writing.



How many hours do you currently have? For me the goal was to have enough hours to apply to competitive sites. A cursory glance at the APPIC Directory there are plenty of sites that will look at your application with 300-400 hours. The AAPI number on there is just the minimum cut off.

I would probably talk to your spouse about ideal geographical locations, go through the APPIC Directory and see sites that interest you, and check the numbers to see what their min are. You might be surprised that you don't need another 400+ hours.

The only thing I would add is that I think the data still shows (although I haven't checked recently) that the modal time to completion is 5+1 rather than 4+1. So if the OP is in year 3, and if they follow the most common path, they'll be applying in 2 years and then of course the 1 year for internship (i.e., 3 years total).

That being said, there are definitely folks who apply in their 4th year. Also, I would second that I enjoyed applying for internship, and I also greatly enjoyed my internship year. It was a much different and generally more structured experience than the typical grad school schedule, although I also enjoyed grad school.

 

[PsyDocStudent]

Maybe I missed this, but why another 3 years? Typically students apply for internship in their 4th year. If you can, I would say stick it out for another year, apply for internship, and finish it out. I can understand feeling burnt out, but I actually enjoyed applying for internship, interviewing, and that whole process. It felt fun, I got to travel some (to internship sites), besides dissertation writing, the course work was lighter that year so we could focus on internship interviews. At some point I was just sort of coasting... doing what was being asked but not more: show up to externship and supervision; pick and choose which readings I felt were pertinent to get my papers and exams done; chip away at dissertation and report writing.



How many hours do you currently have? For me the goal was to have enough hours to apply to competitive sites. A cursory glance at the APPIC Directory there are plenty of sites that will look at your application with 300-400 hours. The AAPI number on there is just the minimum cut off.

I would probably talk to your spouse about ideal geographical locations, go through the APPIC Directory and see sites that interest you, and check the numbers to see what their min are. You might be surprised that you don't need another 400+ hours.

I should have clarified. Because of my maternity leave pushing my time clock back, this coming year, I am going into year 3. I haven’t completed it.

And Im sitting right around 250 hours currently, with time in year 3 and (part of) year 4 to collect hours. My DCT is adamant that I need at least 500 (closer to 600 is better) before I apply to internship…

 

[WisNeuro]

I should have clarified. Because of my maternity leave pushing my time clock back, this coming year, I am going into year 3. I haven’t completed it.

And Im sitting right around 250 hours currently, with time in year 3 and (part of) year 4 to collect hours. My DCT is adamant that I need at least 500 (closer to 600 is better) before I apply to internship…

I would definitely plan on getting at least that 500. People below that figure were not seriously considered at my past sites.

 

[borne_before]

Do you have a lil postpartum depression bro? Could a lil SSRI help rebuild the ole serotonin a lil? TBH you sound burnt out. But like, for different reasons. If you started a lil prozac today, that stuff would be slappin by the start of the next semester and you might have like 5 to 20% a better time and vibe about life.

Also, you might need more hours, but a lot of people will be like "oh ****, you're a mom and have all this OT experience, so like it's cool." Just apply - and see what happens.

That 530 thing is totally possible. Finding enjoyment is up to you. You just sound a little ground down. I'm dead serious about seeing if an SSRI is right for you.

Either way, being a mom of young children is hard. I was always impressed by my classmates who did it. Although you can be a good psychologist without having kids, that experience helps you to be a better one.

 

[mind_over_matter277]

You also want to consider whether you will regret leaving the program in 5 or 10 years. It’s easy to get caught up in the moment by your current thoughts and feelings without examining the big picture. I know a lot of people in my grad program who experienced severe burnout and strongly contemplated leaving. They were ultimately happy that they stuck it out. I know some people who completed their doctorates but eventually opted not to engage in any clinical work. They indicated that their degrees opened several other doors to professional opportunities outside the realm of psychology /mental health (e.g., business, marketing, consulting, law, HR, publishing). Some ended up missing clinical practice and went back and obtained licensure. Regardless of the circumstances, the door was always open to return to psychology in the future.

If you were to quit now, you wouldn’t have that opportunity in the future. You never know where your career journey will take you in the future and it would be disappointing to miss out on any career opportunities involving psychology in the future.

Also, I get the frustration about report writing. I imagine with some additional supervised training you may learn to generate reports more efficiently.

I sense that there are still different clinical experiences that can be explored. You might want to consider seeking out Practicum placements that provide new training experiences with populations that you are not familiar with. I know a lot of people, including myself entered grad school with the goal of working in one specialty area but ended up focusing on something entirely different.

 

[WisNeuro]

Do you have a lil postpartum depression bro? Could a lil SSRI help rebuild the ole serotonin a lil? TBH you sound burnt out. But like, for different reasons. If you started a lil prozac today, that stuff would be slappin by the start of the next semester and you might have like 5 to 20% a better time and vibe about life.

Also, you might need more hours, but a lot of people will be like "oh ****, you're a mom and have all this OT experience, so like it's cool." Just apply - and see what happens.

That 530 thing is totally possible. Finding enjoyment is up to you. You just sound a little ground down. I'm dead serious about seeing if an SSRI is right for you.

Either way, being a mom of young children is hard. I was always impressed by my classmates who did it. Although you can be a good psychologist without having kids, that experience helps you to be a better one.

I imagine the number of programs that say something like this will be the exception rather than the rule.

 

[borne_before]

I imagine the number of programs that say something like this will be the exception rather than the rule.

Our field is so toxic.

 

[WisNeuro]

Our field is so toxic.

Moreso that there are a ton of people with similar stories, who have well over 500 hours. Internship and postdoc are to train advanced clinical knowledge and practice, not replace foundational work that should have been completed in grad school. Choices have consequences.

 

[PsyDocStudent]

Thanks to each and every one of you for taking the time to read and reply. I read and considered everyone’s thoughts and responses, and will continue to do so over the coming days. I truly appreciate all the insight and perspectives, and will take it all into careful consideration as I decide the path that works best for me. Thanks again.

 

[PsyDr]

Our field is so toxic.

It is and it isn’t. It’s an interesting fine line, akin to CBT.

1) The older people have increased requirements, while simultaneously declaring that these requirements don't apply to them. This exceptionalism is toxic.
2) Despite emphasizing the importance of direct communication, our field is HORRIBLE at direct communication. This is toxic.
3) If you emphasize feelings over actions in training, this trained expectation is toxic in the workforce (e.g., you work less because you need to process, so you are less productive, and you make less money). It is also toxic in clinical settings (e.g., instead of helping patients overcome obstacles, teaching patients that their obstacles prevent them from doing things).
4) There is a bunch of in-group, out-group stuff in our field, which is not empirically supported (e.g., There is no empirical support for the idea that who you train under leads to improved clinical acumen). This is toxic.

 

[ImAFreudNot]

I just want to validate how challenging your current situation may be, and how difficult a decision this would be for me if I were in your shoes. Both being a parent and completing graduate school are full-time jobs, 40+ hours/week. Yes, others have had children while in graduate school, but that doesn't mean it's not HARD. I cannot imagine being a new mom while also trying to accrue hours and meet milestones. We all know what graduate school is like, although each of us have had distinct experiences due to differences between programs, advisors, and personal characteristics. But before becoming a parent, I could not fathom just how difficult/time consuming/exhausting/never-ending taking care of another human being is. Did the high stress load of graduate school contribute in part to complications during your pregnancy? I was post-licensure when I was pregnant and had the best work/life balance that I had had since pre-grad school, and self-care was still vital. Pregnancy was stressful and physically taxing in a way that I hadn't fathomed.

Also, an emergency c-section? I am so sorry. Medical trauma is a real thing, and going through a major emergency surgery while experiencing raging hormones and knowing it's not just your life on the line but your child's too... I can't begin to imagine how scary that must have been.

I am impressed by anyone who doesn't get burnt out in graduate school. Certainly anyone who is juggling parenthood and graduate school at the same time; burn out sounds like an understandable response to impossible demands on your time. I agree that it gets easier the further along you go (2nd and 3rd year are the most challenging in my program), so it could be that if you hang in there for just one more year, it might get a lot more manageable. I hope you have a supportive advisor and DCT who will help you progress through the program while being understanding of how much you have on your plate.

I also 100% agree that licensure is the key to all the things you want - flexibility, balance, getting to enjoy what you do. It is likely still at least 3-4 years away, and possibly 2+ geographical moves away. Hence why this would be such a difficult decision if I were in your shoes. I really love the work that I do now (did not love everything about grad school, that's for sure), but that doesn't mean that everyone needs to become a psychologist to be happy. Your priorities are your priorities, and only you can set them.

Best of luck to you as you make your decision!

 

[PsyDocStudent]

I just want to validate how challenging your current situation may be, and how difficult a decision this would be for me if I were in your shoes. Both being a parent and completing graduate school are full-time jobs, 40+ hours/week. Yes, others have had children while in graduate school, but that doesn't mean it's not HARD. I cannot imagine being a new mom while also trying to accrue hours and meet milestones. We all know what graduate school is like, although each of us have had distinct experiences due to differences between programs, advisors, and personal characteristics. But before becoming a parent, I could not fathom just how difficult/time consuming/exhausting/never-ending taking care of another human being is. Did the high stress load of graduate school contribute in part to complications during your pregnancy? I was post-licensure when I was pregnant and had the best work/life balance that I had had since pre-grad school, and self-care was still vital. Pregnancy was stressful and physically taxing in a way that I hadn't fathomed.

Also, an emergency c-section? I am so sorry. Medical trauma is a real thing, and going through a major emergency surgery while experiencing raging hormones and knowing it's not just your life on the line but your child's too... I can't begin to imagine how scary that must have been.

I am impressed by anyone who doesn't get burnt out in graduate school. Certainly anyone who is juggling parenthood and graduate school at the same time; burn out sounds like an understandable response to impossible demands on your time. I agree that it gets easier the further along you go (2nd and 3rd year are the most challenging in my program), so it could be that if you hang in there for just one more year, it might get a lot more manageable. I hope you have a supportive advisor and DCT who will help you progress through the program while being understanding of how much you have on your plate.

I also 100% agree that licensure is the key to all the things you want - flexibility, balance, getting to enjoy what you do. It is likely still at least 3-4 years away, and possibly 2+ geographical moves away. Hence why this would be such a difficult decision if I were in your shoes. I really love the work that I do now (did not love everything about grad school, that's for sure), but that doesn't mean that everyone needs to become a psychologist to be happy. Your priorities are your priorities, and only you can set them.

Best of luck to you as you make your decision!

Thank you thank you for your thoughtful insight and your kind words. Yes, I agree that licensure is the key to flexibility and enjoyment …I am licensed (and working ) as an OT currently, and love the flexibility/autonomy (and I do enjoy the work).


Re: the program, I can’t help but think that in 3-4 years, my baby will be 5 (or 6)…and I am considering what impact having an overwhelmed, over-stretched, irritable, moody, always-in-survival-mode, (depressed?) mom may have on her well-being and sense of safety.

My intuition says “if I can just take a year off…” (to go back to ‘regular’ work, process my birth, breathe, pick up fun hobbies again, and let her get a year older (so she would be 3ish)…I think I could get through the program….

My latest thought is to potentially re-think my practicum site for this coming year. I am slotted to be at a very very demanding site with incredible training. That said, there is a level of extreme commitment (to the site, to the training etc.) that I don’t know that I can psychologically make right this moment, while also juggling (lots of) sick days, night-time wake-ups, 3 classes, assessment cases, etc.

My gut is saying to take a year off, but I have a meeting with my DCT tomorrow to discuss other options.
In the long run, I know I CAN do it, the question is, what kind of toll will it take on my own mental and physical health, and that of my baby’s….and also are the financial and personal gains “worth it,” —I recently was offered a year-long position as an OT working 4 days a week for $95,000 —so that is something else I’m weighing.

 

[Sanman]

Thank you thank you for your thoughtful insight and your kind words. Yes, I agree that licensure is the key to flexibility and enjoyment …I am licensed (and working ) as an OT currently, and love the flexibility/autonomy (and I do enjoy the work).


Re: the program, I can’t help but think that in 3-4 years, my baby will be 5 (or 6)…and I am considering what impact having an overwhelmed, over-stretched, irritable, moody, always-in-survival-mode, (depressed?) mom may have on her well-being and sense of safety.

My intuition says “if I can just take a year off…” (to go back to ‘regular’ work, process my birth, breathe, pick up fun hobbies again, and let her get a year older (so she would be 3ish)…I think I could get through the program….

My latest thought is to potentially re-think my practicum site for this coming year. I am slotted to be at a very very demanding site with incredible training. That said, there is a level of extreme commitment (to the site, to the training etc.) that I don’t know that I can psychologically make right this moment, while also juggling (lots of) sick days, night-time wake-ups, 3 classes, assessment cases, etc.

My gut is saying to take a year off, but I have a meeting with my DCT tomorrow to discuss other options.
In the long run, I know I CAN do it, the question is, what kind of toll will it take on my own mental and physical health, and that of my baby’s….and also are the financial and personal gains “worth it,” —I recently was offered a year-long position as an OT working 4 days a week for $95,000 —so that is something else I’m weighing.

I don't know you. However, being the parent of a young child, it will be just as much of a challenge in a year (just a different one). Taking a year off may significantly improve your mental health. However, I do think getting used to not going to the program will make it harder to go back than it already is. You likely need to make a decision between pursuing this degree full-time and working as an OT, whether it is now or next year. Frankly, I am impressed you kept up the juggling act this long. Most people could not.

 

[eeor1006]

A student three years my senior were in a similar situation. She took a year of absence, came back and finished all classes, failed and redid (successfully) her dissertation proposal, completed a local APA accredited internship. Then somehow no one told her our qualifying exam is only good for 3 years so she had to retake that. She finally graduated last year I think. This all happened on top of having three kids. I can't imagine how much hardships she had to go through to get her degree. I had my first child during my fellowship and it was probably the hardest thing I have ever done. My son was a horrible sleeper and we had to hold him all night long in shifts. The physical and mental exhaustion almost broke me. On most days I get maybe three or four hours of sleep and have to go pretend to be a psychologist. Sleep training was the best thing we have done to save our sanity and careers.

Having said that, I still vote for completing the degree. You are rightfully burned out and want a way out. But down the road, you have a lot more control over what type of therapy you practice, the length and structure of the reports etc.. The long-term financial gain and career flexibility is a lot better.