DO salary

[tbone1234]

Hey all,

So I'm quite sure this question has popped in our minds at some point. I'm not in medicine for the money, but if somebody told me they were pursuing medicine purely for the sake of "helping people", I'd call them a liar (as would adcoms, yes? )

I'm wanting to pursue surgery, specifically cardiothoracic. Would this be achievable with a DO degree, and would they be equivalent to MD surgeons? I also don't want to lose the osteopathic philosophy, so I'd like to be in the clinic too. Is there a way to go into internal medicine, and subspecialize in surgery? What would be opportunities/salary look like?

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[DbDan]

Internal medicine and surgical specialties are separate. CT surgery is possible through DO but the path of least resistance would be through MD. If you are able to get and complete the residency you would be judged on your performance, not the letters after your name, you would be equivalent to MD surgeons.

 

[willen101383]

Dont forget to address the OPs all important question of salary. YES...same education and training=the same salary. The only primary care type specialty you are going to be able to do any surgery with is obgyn....someone correct me if I am overlooking something.

 

[Helen Wheels]

There are DOs working in every medical specialty available so I am sure there are CT surgeons out there who are DOs.

A DO I shadowed did tell me that having a DO degree would not affect my medical career except if I wanted a competitive surgical specialty. He did say it would be hard to do that as a DO. I don't want to be a surgeon so it isn't an issue for me.

Truthfully, it is probably pretty hard for the MDs to get into those programs, as well.

 

[Slane]

There are DO residencies and fellowships for the advanced specialties like cardiothoracic surgery, but there aren't very many of them. Your best bet would definitely be to take both the COMLEX and the USMLE and apply to both DO and MD residencies, put the odds more in your favor. Either way though, for something that competitive, you'll need to rock the boards, especially the USMLE to be competitive against the top MD's that will be competing against you for the same spots.

 

[tbone1234]

Hmm.. interesting thoughts.

I understand surgery can lean towards the MD-side. What about cardiology, oncology, radiology, general surgery, etc. These are high paying jobs, but are these likely to lean to MD over DO, or are there good osteopathic residencies for these?? I also hear that even if a DO matches into a allopathic residency, they won't match into a allopathic fellowship?? is this true?

I just love the hands on aspect of surgery and hope my options aren't limited due to pursuing osteopathic medicine.

 

[Slane]

The numbers tend to lie with the MD programs. There are osteopathic programs for pretty much any specialty or sub-specialty, there just aren't as many spots available (For some of the highly competitive specialties, there might be fewer than ten total positions across the nation in DO programs.) There does seem to be quite a few general surgery programs for DO's though. Cardio and Onco are both fellowships after an internal medicine residency, and there's plenty of internal medicine programs with open spots. The other thing with DO residencies is that they're usually not at bigger institutions. For example, if you wanted to do an EM residency at a big, level one trauma center, you'd pretty much have apply to MD residencies to do so. If you don't mind working at a small to medium sized institution though, then there's more than likely a DO program that will work for you. It all depends on what you want in your residency program.

I just know from the upperclassmen at my school (LECOM) that pretty much anybody looking to highly specialize, and anybody on the fence about specializing, takes the USMLE and goes down the allopathic residency route. It just makes sense to go where the numbers are.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Hmm.. interesting thoughts.

I understand surgery can lean towards the MD-side. What about cardiology, oncology, radiology, general surgery, etc. These are high paying jobs, but are these likely to lean to MD over DO, or are there good osteopathic residencies for these?? I also hear that even if a DO matches into a allopathic residency, they won't match into a allopathic fellowship?? is this true?

I just love the hands on aspect of surgery and hope my options aren't limited due to pursuing osteopathic medicine.

Cardiology : ACGME residency highly recommended; competitive fellowship which depends on residency performance.
Oncology : ACGME residency again highly recommended; competitive and depends on residency performance.
Radiology : Don't bother going to DO school, only 5 DO's matched last year ( ACGME). Though its difficult for MD's as well. ( Don't let this however discourage you from DO schools because most doctors have very little interests in radiology).
General surgery : not very difficult for a DO to match into.

To some extent if your goal is a fellowship then its better to do a MD residency as it'll make your life a lot easier. Overall if you're looking at most residencies outside of ROADS ( Anesthesia is relatively not too difficult for a DO to match) its relatively easy for them to match. But if your interested in the other specialties of ROADS such as surgical specialties like ENT or Optho then you should be considering only MD because its very difficult for a DO to match into them.

 

[tbone1234]

Ah I understand now. This makes me feel better about pursuing osteopathic medicine.

Serenade, you used a couple terms I'm not familiar with. What is ROADS? And I tried looking up what ACGME is but didn't understand. Could someone explain?

I wasn't planning on pursuing radiology, that was just out of curiosity. I don't blame so many people avoiding it.. it pays extremely well, but it's so BORING (in my opinion).

I thought anesthesiology was nearly impossible to pursue without going MD. Is this true?

Also... how difficult is it for a DO to get into an MD residency? I'm assuming it relies on the USMLE/COMLEX... how similar are the two exams? Do you have to study for them separately? (I imagine there would be a great deal of overlap material).

Once accepted into an MD residency, would you be on equal playing field with the MD's to match into a fellowship? Or is there still that lovely disadvantage DO's have?

Lastly.... let's say I went into an internal medicine residency. Afterwards, I would (try to) match into a cardiology fellowship. Once completed, does this mean I would earn the same salary as an MD cardiologist? (400k +)??

I apologize for all the questions, and appreciate all the answers ya'll can give.

 

[willen101383]

serenade.....not to be a dick....buttttt

6 People matched into Rads last year at PCOM alone...so I dont know where you got your info...

 

[willen101383]

Anesthesiology
Hershey Med Ctr/Penn State -HERSHEY, PA
Pontiac Osteopathic Hospital -Pontiac, MI
Virginia Commonwealth University Health System -RICHMOND, VA
Delaware County Memorial Hospital -Philadelphia, PA
University of Medicine & Dentistry New Jersey School of Osteopathic Medicine (UMDNJ)-Stratford, NJ

Emergency Medicine/Family Medicine
Christiana Care-DE -Newark, DE
Aria Health -Philadelphia, PA (2)
ARIA HEALTH FRANKFORD HOSPITAL – Philadelphia, PA
Naval Air Station Naval Hospital Jacksonville -Jacksonville, FL

Emergency Medicine
Albert Einstein Medical Center -Philadelphia, PA (2)
Geisinger Health System-PA -DANVILLE, PA
Hershey Med Ctr/Penn State-PA -HERSHEY, PA
Lehigh Valley Health Network -Allentown / Bethlehem, PA
Lehigh Valley Health System -Allentown, PA (2)
St Luke's Hospital -Allentown, PA
St. Luke's Hospital -Bethlehem, PA
Temple Univ Hosp-PA -PHILADELPHIA, PA
University Maryland Med Ctr -BALTIMORE, MD
UMDNJ-SOM (University of Medicine and Dentistry, New Jersey School of Osteopathic Medicine) -Stratford, NJ
York Hospital-PA -YORK, PA

Family Medicine
Abington Memorial Hospital -Abington, PA (3)
Aria Health -Langhorne, PA (2)
Bryn Mawr Hospital -Bryn Mawr, PA (2)
Boston Univ Med Ctr-MA -BOSTON, MA
CMMC -Lewiston, ME
Crozer-Chester Hospital, Delaware County Memorial Hospital -Drexel Hill, PA
Crozer-Keystone - Drexel Hill, PA
Florida Hospital East Orlando -Orlando, FL
Geisinger Wyoming Valley -Wilkes-Barre, PA
Largo Medical Center -Largo, FL
Latrobe Hospital -Latrobe, PA (3)
Lehigh Valley Hospital -Allentown, PA
Memorial Hospital -York, PA (2)
Memorial Hospital of Rhode Island -Pawtucket, RI
Mercy Suburban Hospital -Norristown, PA (2)
Mercy Suburban -Philadelphia, PA
Naval Hospital Camp Lejeune -Camp Lejeune, NC
Naval Air Station Naval Hospital -Jacksonville, FL
Pinnacle Health-Harrisburg, PA
Providence Hospital -Southfield, MI
Scott Air Force Base -Belleville, Ill
St. Joseph Medical Center -Reading, PA (2)
St. Joseph's Hospital-Reading, PA
St. Joseph's Hospital, NY -Syracuse, NY
St. Luke's Hospital -Bethlehem, PA (2)
U Connecticut Hlth Ctr -FARMINGTON, CT
U Massachusetts Med School -WORCESTER, MA (2)
UPMC Presbyterian Shadyside-PA -PITTSBURGH, PA
UPMC St Margaret-PA -PITTSBURGH, PA
Wilkes-Barre General Hospital -Kingston, PA
Williamsport Hospital and Medical Center -Williamsport, PA (2)

General Surgery
Community General -Harrisburg, PA
Darnall Army Medical Center -Killeen, TX
Geisinger Wyoming Valley -Wilkes Barre, PA
Lankenau Hospital -WYNNEWOOD, PA
Med Coll Georgia-Augusta -AUGUSTA, GA (2)
Mercy Suburban – Philadelphia, PA
PCOM -Philadelphia, PA (2)
St. Barnabas-Bronx -Bronx, NY
UMDNJ Kennedy/ Our Lady of Lourdes -Stratford, NJ

Internal Medicine
Abington Memorial Hospital -Abington, PA
Albert Einstein Medical Center -Philadelphia, PA (2)
Aria Health -Philadelphia, PA
Broward General Medical Center -Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Christiana Care -Christiana, DE
Christiana Care-Newark, DE (2)
Community General Osteopathic -Harrisburg, PA
Cooper University Hospital -NJ
Crozer Chester - Chester, PA
Geisinger Medical Center/Health System-Danville, PA (6)
Grady Memorial Hospital -Atlanta, GA
Johns Hopkins/Bayview-MD -Baltimore, MD
Lankenau Hospital -Philadelphia, PA (3)
Lankenau Hospital -Wynnewood, PA
Largo Medical Center -Largo, FL
Lehigh Valley Hospital -Allentown, PA (3)
Madigan Army Medical Center -Tacoma, WA
Mercy Catholic Medical Center -Darby, PA
Naval Medical Center Bethesda -Bethesda, MD
Naval Medical Center Portsmouth -Portsmouth, VA
Navy Medical Center San Diego (NMCSD) -San Diego, CA
Pennsylvania Hospital -Philadelphia, PA (3)
Pinnacle Hospital System CGOH -Harrisburg, PA
Providence Hospital-DC -Washington, DC
Riverside Methodist-OH -Columbus, OH
San Antonio Military Medical Center Wilford Hall/Brooke Army Medical Center -San Antonio, TX (2)
Temple University Hosp -Philadelphia, PA
UMDNJ-Kennedy and Our Lady of Lourdes -Stratford, NJ (2)
UMDNJ-Robert Wood Johnson-Camden, NJ (2)
University of Hawaii -Honolulu, HI
Winthrop-University Hospital -Mineola, NY

Internship
Aria Health -Philadelphia, PA
Delaware County Memorial Hospital/Crozer-Keystone -Drexel Hill, PA (2)
Health Education Consortium (SAUSHEC) at Brooke Army Medical Center (BAMC)
Lehigh Valley Health Network -Allentown, PA
Lankenau Hospital -Wynnewood, PA
Largo Medical Center -Largo, FL (2)
Madigan Army Medical Center -Tacoma, WA
Mercy Catholic -Darby, PA
Mercy Suburban Hospital -Norristown, PA (5)
National Naval Medical Center -Bethesda, MD
Nassau University Medical Center -East Meadow, NY
Palmetto General Hospital - FL
Palms West Hospital -West Palm Beach, FL
Riverside County Regional Medical Center -Riverside, CA
San Antonio Military Medical Center Brooke Army Medical Center – San Antonio, TX
San Antonio Uniformed Services – San Antonio, TX
St Joseph Hospital Medical Center -Reading, PA (2)
St. Joseph's Hospital -Philadelphia, PA
St. Luke's Hospital -Allentown, PA (3)
St. Petersburg General Hospital -St. Petersburg, FL
UMDNJ-SOM –Camden/Stratford/Cherry Hill, New Jersey
UMDNJ-Kennedy and Our Lady of Lourdes -Stratford, NJ (3)

Neurology
Mercy Catholic Medical Center - Darby, PA (2)
Pennsylvania Hospital - Philadelphia, PA
Pontiac Osteopathic Hospital - Columbus, OH

Neurosurgery
St. Barnanbas Hospital -Livingston, NJ

Obstetrics and Gynecology (OB/GYN)
Geisinger Medical Center -Danville, PA
Lankenau Hospital-PA -Wynnewood, PA
Lehigh Valley Hosp-PA -Allentown, PA
Lenox Hill Hospital-NY –New York, NY
Naval Medical Center Portsmouth -Portsmouth, VA
Reading Hospital Med Center -Reading, PA
Tripler Army Medical Center -Honolulu, HI
Western Pennsylvania Hosp -Pittsburgh, PA
York Memorial Hospital -York, PA (2)

Ophthalmology
Grandview Hospital -Dayton, OH
Madigan Army Medical Center -Tacoma, WA
St. John Macomb-Oakland Hospital -Madison Heights, MI

Orthopedics
PCOM – Philadelphia, PA
Pinnacle Health System - Harrisburg, PA
Memorial Hospital - York, PA
UMDNJ-Kennedy and Our Lady of Lourdes -Stratford, NJ

Otolaryngology/Facial Plastic Surgery
UMDNJ-SOM-Stratford, NJ

Pathology
Drexel University/Hahnemann Hospital -Philadelphia, PA

Pediatrics
Advocate Lutheran Gen Hosp-IL –Park Ridge, IL
Baystate Med Ctr-MA -Springfield, MA
Cooper University Hospital -Camden, NJ
Crozer-Chester Med Ctr-PA -Upland, PA
Eastern VA Med School-VA -Norfolk, VA
Geisinger Medical Center -Danville, PA (3)
Hershey Med Ctr/Penn State-PA -Hershey, PA
Jefferson Med Coll/duPont Childrens-PA -Philadelphia, PA (3)
Loma Linda University-CA –Loma Linda, CA (2)
Maria Fareri Children's Hospital -Valhalla,, NY
Schneider Childrens Hospital -New Hyde Park, NY
Stony Brook Teach Hosps-NY –Stony Brook, NY
UMDNJ-Robert Wood Johnson-Camden -Camden, NJ
University at Buffalo SOM-NY -Buffalo, NY

Pediatrics-Medicine
Geisinger Health System-Danville, PA (2)
Physical Medicine & Rehabilitation (PM&R)
Crozer-Keystone Health System -Drexel Hill, PA
Delaware County Memorial Hospital/Crozer-Keystone System –Drexel Hill, PA (4)
St. Joseph Medical Center - Reading, PA

Psychiatry
Tripler -Honolulu, HI
UMDNJ-Robert Wood Johnson-Piscataway - New Brunswick, NJ
University of New Mexico SOM – Albuquerque, NM
University of Virginia - Charlottesville, VA

Radiology-Diagnostic
Christiana Care-DE -Newark, DE
Delaware County Memorial Hospital -Drexel Hill, PA
Lehigh Valley Hospital -Allentown, PA
Maimonides Medical Center -Brooklyn, NY
UMDNJ-SOM-Stratford, NJ
Walter Reed Army Medical Center -Washington, DC

Urologic Surgery
Albert Einstein Medical Center -Philadelphia, PA

Urology
Albert Einstein Medical Center -Philadelphia, PA

 

[willen101383]

PCOM 2009 match list

Anesthesiology
Hahnemann University-PA

Temple University Hospital
Thomas Jefferson University
UPMC Medical Education Program
Univ. Arkansas-Little Rock


Diagnostic Radiology
Henry Forde Macomb-Warren Campus
Mercy Catholic

Emergency Medicine
Baystate Medical Center-MA
Brooke Army Medical Center
Drexel University/Hahnemann University Hospital
Geisinger Health System
LECOM/ Conemaugh Valley Memorial Hospital
Madigan Army Medical Center
NYU School of Medicine
PCOM/Albert Einstein Medical Center (2)
PCOM/ Frankford Hospitals
St. Barnabas Health Care System
St. Joseph's Regional Medical Center
Temple University Hospital
Thomas Jefferson University
UMDNJSOM/Kennedy Memorial/University Medical (3)

Emergency Medicine/ Internal Medicine
Ohio Valley Medical Center

York Hospital-PA

Family Medicine & Family Practice
Bryn Mawr Hospital (3)
Chino Valley Medical Center
Eisenhower Army Medical Center
Erlanger Medical Center
LECOM/Washington Hospital
Martin Army Community Hospital
Mercy Suburban Hospital (2)

Naval Hospital (Jacksonville)
NSUCOM/North Broward Hospital District

NSUCOM/ Saint Vincent's Medical Center (2)NYCOM/ Jamaica HospitalProvidence Hospital-DC
PCOM/ Frankford Hospitals (3)
PCOM/Geisinger Health System
PCOM/ Latrobe Area Hospital
PCOM/ Lehigh Valley Hospital Health Network (3)
PCOM/ Pinnacle Health General Hospital
PCOM/ Sacred Heart Hospital
PCOM/Saint Joseph Medical Center
PCOM/St. Luke's Hospital (2)
PCOM/UPMC Shadyside Hospital
PCOM/Williamsport Hospital (3)

Tripler Army Medical Center
UMDNJSOM/Christ Hospital
UMDNJSOM/Kennedy Memorial/University Medical (2)
UNECOM/University of Massachusetts
University of Arizona
Wilson Memorial Regional Medical Center (2)


General Surgery
Berkshire Medical Center-MA
Christiana Care-DE (2)
Mercy Suburban Hospital
Naval Medical Center-Portsmouth
Naval Medical Center-San Diego
OUCOM/Grandview Hospital & Medical Center
PCOM/Geisinger Health System (2)
PCOM/Philadelphia Consortium (5)
PCOM/ Pinnacle Health General Hospital
Pitt County Memorial Hospital/Brody SOM-NC
Temple University Hospital-PA
UPMC Horizon

Preliminary Surgery
Waterbury Hospital-CT

Preliminary Internal Medicine
PCOM/ Geisinger Health System (2)
Abington Memorial Hospital

Internal Medicine/ UIH
University Illinois COM - Chicago

Internal Medicine/Pediatrics
Christiana Care-DE (2)
Hershey Medical Center/Penn State - PA
Loyola University Med. Center - IL (2)

Internal Medicine
Banner Good Samaritan Medical Center-AZ
Brooke Army Medical Center
Case Western/MetroHealth Medical Center-OH
Christiana Care-DE
Cleveland Clinic (2)
Crozer Chester Hospital
Crozer Chester Medical Center (3)
Drexel University/Hahnemann University Hospital (4)
Georgetown University Hosp.-DC
Hahnemann University Hospital
Hershey Medical Center/Penn State University-PA
Madigan Army Medical Center (Ft. Lewis)
Maine Medical Center
Mercy Catholic Medical Center (2)
Mercy Suburban Hospital (3)
Methodist Health System- Dallas
National Naval Medical Center-Bethesda
Northside Hospital and Heart Institute
PCOM
PCOM/Abington Memorial Hospital (2)
PCOM/ Frankford Hospitals (2)
PCOM/ Geisinger Health System (4)
PCOM/ Lankenau Hospital
PCOM/ Pennsylvania Hospital
PCOM/ Philadelphia Consortium (4)
PCOM/Reading Hospital and Medical Center
PCOM/ Pinnacle Health General Hospital
St. Luke's - Roosevelt - NY
St. Vincent's Hospital - NY
Temple University Hospital - PA (3)
Thomas Jefferson University- PA
UMDNJ/ Robert Wood Johnson
UMDNJ/ Kennedy Memorial/ University Medical Center (3)
UPMC Mercy Hospital - PA (2)
Virginia Commonwealth Univ. Health System
Walter Reed Army Medical Center
Washington Hospital Center
Wright Patterson Air Force Base

Internship
Crozer-Chester Medical Center (4)
Crozer-Keystone Health System
Delaware County/ Crozer-Keystone (6)
LECOM/ Western Pennsylvania Hospital (2)
Long Beach Medical Center
Madigan Army Medical Center (Ft. Lewis) (2)
Mercy Catholic Medical-PA
Montgomery Regional Hospital
Naval Medical Center-Portsmouth
NYCOM/Long Beach Med. Center Nassau University Medical Center
NYCOM/Maimonides Medical Center
NYCOM/Nassau Univ. Med. Center
NYCOM/Peninsula Hosp. Center
PCOM/ Abington Memorial Hospital (3)
PCOM/ Albert Einstein Medical Center (3)
PCOM/ Frankford Hospitals (3)
PCOM/ Christiana Care Riverside
PCOM/ Lankenau Hospital (4)
PCOM/ Lehigh Valley Hosp. Health Net (7)
PCOM/ Saint Joseph Med. Center
PCOM/ UPMC Shadyside (2)
St. John's Episcopal Hosp.
St. Joseph's Hospital NPHS (7)
St. Luke's Hospital- Allentown (2)
Tripler Army Medical Center
UMDNJ/ Kennedy Memorial/ University Medical Center
University Hospitals Richmond Medical Center
UPMC Mercy (2)
UPMC Pittsburgh
Walter Reed Army Medical Center (2)

Neurology
Drexel University/Hahnemann University Hospital-PA

Walter Reed Army Medical Center


Neurological Surgery
PCOM/Philadelphia Consortium (2)



Obstetrics & Gynecology
Baystate Medical Center - MA
Lankenau Hospital - PA
Mercy Suburban Hospital
PCOM/Lourdes Medical Center Burlington (2)
Reading Hospital Medical Center - PA
Rush University Med. Center - IL
UMDNJ-Robert Wood Johnson - Camden
York Hospital - PA

Ophthalmology
MSUCOM/Hillsdale Community Health Center

Orthopedic Surgery
Memorial Hospital-PA
NSUCOM/North Broward Hospital District
PCOM/ Philadelphia Consortium (3)
PCOM/ Pinnacle Health General Hospital (2)
UMDNJ/ Kennedy Memorial/ University Medical Center
University Hospitals Richmond Medical Center

Oto-Facial Plastic Surgery
PCOM/Philadelphia Consortium

Pathology
Drexel University/Hahnemann University Hospital
Pennsylvania Hospital


Pediatrics
Albert Einstein Medical Center
Hershey Med. Center/Penn State - PA (2)
INOVA Fairfax Hospital
Thomas Jefferson University/ DuPont Children's Hospital (4)
Nationwide Children's Hospital - OH
Orlando Health Regional Healthcare - FL
PCOM/Geisinger Health System (3)
St. Christopher's Hospital-PA (2)
SUNY HSC Brooklyn-NY
UMDNJ/ Robert Wood Johnson-Piscataway-NJ
UMDNJSOM/Children's Hospital - Cooper
Walter Reed Army Medical

Physical Medicine & Rehabilitation
Walter Reed Army Hospital-DC
Temple University -PA (4)
Jefferson Hospital-PA (2)
University Pittsburgh Medical Center

Psychiatry
Albany Medical Center Hospital
Allegheny General Hospital - PA
Drexel University/Hahnemann University Hospital
St. Vincent's Hospital
UMDNJ/ Kennedy Memorial/ University Medical Center
Walter Reed Army Medical

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Ah I understand now. This makes me feel better about pursuing osteopathic medicine.


Serenade, you used a couple terms I'm not familiar with. What is ROADS? And I tried looking up what ACGME is but didn't understand. Could someone explain?

ACGME = MD residency. ROADS or ( Radiology Ophthalmology Anesthesiology Dermatology Surgical-sub-specialties) they are considered the most desired specialties within residencies. However this is due to them having overall better life styles and thus has nothing to do with overall people liking those fields.

I wasn't planning on pursuing radiology, that was just out of curiosity. I don't blame so many people avoiding it.. it pays extremely well, but it's so BORING (in my opinion).
Radiology is a very interesting field. But don't go into a field simply for money. You need to go into a field because you love it.
I thought anesthesiology was nearly impossible to pursue without going MD. Is this true?
No, its very DO friendly and considered the easiest of the ROADS specialties to go into because of the sheer demand and as such amount of overall residencies.

Also... how difficult is it for a DO to get into an MD residency? I'm assuming it relies on the USMLE/COMLEX... how similar are the two exams? Do you have to study for them separately? (I imagine there would be a great deal of overlap material).
Depends on the residency. For ROADS not considering ane its difficult. But its difficult for MD's to go into those fields as well. USMLE and COMLEX are similar. I believe the main difference is the COMLEX tests OMM/OMT and doesn't test biochemistry.
There are also some dual managed residencies and can take the COMLEX without the USMLE. But overall you might need to take both.


Once accepted into an MD residency, would you be on equal playing field with the MD's to match into a fellowship? Or is there still that lovely disadvantage DO's have?
Depends on the program. Some are very DO friendly and some aren't and won't take them.

Lastly.... let's say I went into an internal medicine residency. Afterwards, I would (try to) match into a cardiology fellowship. Once completed, does this mean I would earn the same salary as an MD cardiologist? (400k +)??
DO = MD in a clinical and business setting. In the yellow pages you'll be called a Cardiologist just like the MD's.

I apologize for all the questions, and appreciate all the answers ya'll can give.

Yup...

 

[willen101383]

PCOM 2008 Match list

Anesthesiology (see theres 8 anesthesia matches right there)
Jackson Memorial Hospital
Thomas Jefferson University (3)
UMDNJ/ Robert Wood Johnson
University of Maryland Medical Center
UPMC Medical Education Program
Western Pennsylvania Hospital

Emergency Medicine
Albert Einstein Medical Center
Botsford Hospital
Darnall Army Medical Center
Henry Ford Wyandotte Hospital
LECOM/ Conemaugh Valley Memorial Hospital
Memorial Hospital
PCOM/ Lehigh Valley Hospital & Health Network (4)
St. Barnabus Health Care System
St. James Hospital and Health Care System
St. Joseph's Regional Medical Center
SUNY Upstate Medical University

Emergency Medicine/ Family Medicine
St. Barnabus Health Care System

ENT
NCC- Walter Reed Army Medical Center
Geisinger

Family Medicine & Primary Care
Altoona Regional Health System (2)
Beth Israel Medical Center
Bryn Mawr Hospital
Clarion Hospital
Ehrling Bergquist Hospital
Eisenhower Army Medical Center (2)
Florida Hospital East Orlando
John Peter Smith Hospital
Kingman Regional Medical Center
Medical College of Georgia-Augusta
Mercy Suburban Hospital (3)
Millcreek Community Hospital
NSUCOM/ Medical College of Georgia
NYCOM/ Jamaica Hospital
PCOM/ Frankford Hospitals (2)
PCOM/ Lehigh Valley-Cedar Crest
PCOM/ Medical Center of Beaver (2)
PCOM/ Saint Joseph Medical Center (3)
PCOM/ Williamsport Hospital (2)
Pitt County Memorial Hospital/ Brody School of Medicine
Providence Hospital
South Pointe Hospital
University of Massachusetts Hospital System (2)
Wilson Memorial Regional Medical Center

General Surgery
Christiana Care (2)
Madigan Army Medical Center
Mercy Catholic Medical Center
Mercy Suburban Hospital
NCC- Walter Reed Army Medical Center
NYCOM/ Peninsula Hospital Center
PCOM/ Philadelphia Consortium (3)
PCOM/ Pinnacle General Hospital (2)
St. James Hospital and Health System (2)
UMDNJ/ Kennedy Memorial/ University Medical Center
UPMC Horizon

Internal Medicine/ Emergency Medicine
PCOM/ Frankford Hospitals

Internal Medicine/ Pediatrics
Case Western/ Metro Health Medical Center
Christiana Care
Geisinger Health System

Internal Medicine
Cambridge Health Alliance (2)
Drexel University College of Medicine (4)
Lenox Hill Hospital
Mercy Suburban Hospital
National Naval Medical Center
NCC-Walter Reed Army Medical Center
New Hanover Regional Medical Center
NYCOM/ Nassau University Medical Center
PCOM/ Frankford Hospitals (2)
PCOM/ Geisinger Health System (2)
PCOM/ Lankenau Hospital
PCOM/ Pennsylvania Hospital (2)
PCOM/ Philadelphia Consortium (3)
PCOM/ Pinnacle Health General Hospital
PCOM/ St. Luke's Hospital
SAUSHEC- Brooke Army Medical Center (3)
St. James Hospital and Health System
St. Vincent's Hospital
Temple University Hospital
Tripler Army Medical Center (2)
UMDNJ/ New Jersey Medical Center (2)
UMDNJ/ Robert Wood Johnson
UMDNJ/ Kennedy Memorial/ University Medical Center (3)
University of South Florida College of Medicine
William Beaumont Army Medical Center

Internship
Crozer-Chester Medical Center (2)
Cuyahoga Falls General Hospital
Delaware County/ Crozer-Keystone (11)
Franklin Square Hospital
LECOM/ St. Petersburg General Hospital
LECOM/ Washington Hospital
Mercy Catholic Medical Center (3)
Mercy Suburban Hospital
Naval Medical Center (3)
NSUCOM/ The Medical Center
NYCOME/ North Shore University Hospital-Plainview
NYCOM/ Nassau University Medical Center
PCOM/ Abington Memorial Hospital (2)
PCOM/ Albert Einstein Medical Center (3)
PCOM/ Frankford Hospitals (3)
PCOM/ Geisinger Health System
PCOM/ Lankenau Hospital (5)
PCOM/ Lehigh Valley- Cedar Crest (3)
PCOM/ Philadelphia Consortium (2)
PCOM/ UPMC Shadyside
PCSOM/ Central Washington
PCSOM/ University of Tennessee
Providence Hospital/ St. John Osteopathic Division
St. Joseph's Hospital (2)
St. Luke's Hospital- Allentown (4)
St. Mary's Hospital
St. Peter's University Hospital
UMDNJ/ Kennedy Memorial/ University Medical Center (4)
UNECOM/ St. Vincent's Hospital-Worcester
University of Massachusetts Medical Center
Wellington Regional Medical Center
Westview Hospital
William Beaumont Army Medical Center

Neurology
Albany Medical Center Hospital
Drexel University College of Medicine
George Washington University
Hershey Medical Center/ Penn State
Long Island Jewish Medical Center
Rhode Island Hospital/ Brown University
Temple University Hospital
Thomas Jefferson University
University of Connecticut Health Center
University of Massachusetts Medical Center
UPMC Medical Education Program

OB/Gyn
Abington Memorial Hospital
Boston University Medical Center
Hershey Medical Center/ Penn State
Naval Medical Center
OUCOM/ O'Bleness Memorial Hospital
PCOM Consortium
Reading Hospital Medical Center
Tripler Army Medical Center
Western Pennsylvania Hospital
York Hospital

Ophthalmology
Drexel University College of Medicine
Geisinger Health System

Orthopedic Surgery
Memorial Hospital
PCOM/ Philadelphia Consortium
PCOM/ Pinnacle Health General Hospital
UMDNJ/ Kennedy Memorial/ University Medical Center (2)

Oto-Facial Plastic Surgery
MSUCOM/ Huron Valley-Sinai Hospital

Pediatrics
Christiana Care
Geisinger Health System
Goryeb Children's Hospital at Morristown Memorial Hospital
Hershey Medical Center/ Penn State
INOVA Fairfax Hospital
Madigan Army Medical Center
NYCOM/ Maimonides Medical Center
Orlando Regional Healthcare
PCOM/Geisinger Health System
St. Christopher's Hospital (3)
Thomas Jefferson University/ DuPont Children's Hospital (5)
UMDNJ/ Robert Wood Johnson
University of Rochester/ Strong Memorial
University of Texas (2)

Physical Medicine & Rehab
Einstein/ Montefiore Medical Center

Preliminary Surgery
St. Luke's Roosevelt

Psychiatry
Drexel University College of Medicine (2)
Temple University Hospital
Thomas Jefferson University
Virginia Commonwealth University Health System

Radiology
Bryn Mawr Hospital
Christiana Care
Hershey Medical Center/ Penn State
Stony Brook Teaching Hospitals

 

[willen101383]

And FYI...I PERSONALLY met a ENT resident who came from NSUCOM literally last week at a party....along with his friend who was an orthopedic surgery resident from NSU as well.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

serenade.....not to be a dick....buttttt

6 People matched into Rads last year at PCOM alone...so I dont know where you got your info...

ACGME my friend . Though I'm surprised that number is high.

 

[willen101383]

Here is the match list for NYMC (randomly pulled...my dad went here and I think I would consider PCOM and NYMC to be pretty on par) Is this that significantly different? Eh aside from the few top tier matches and stuff like rads I dont see much difference.


Family Practice
Stamford Hospital 1
Oregon Health & Science Uni 1
Carl R. Darnall Army Med 1
Family Practice Total 3

Pediatrics/Child Psychiatry Rhode Island Hospital
Pediatrics/Child Psychiatry Total 1

Pediatrics Univ. of So. Florida Coll 1
The New York Hosp. Cornell 2
Univ. Hlth. Ctr. of Pitts 1
North Shore-LIJ Health Sys 1
U.W. Hospital and Clinics 2
Childrens Memorial Hospital 1
Childrens Hosp. of Phil 1
UMDNJ-Robert W. Johnson M 1
Stony Brook Teaching Hosp 1
N.Y.U. Medical Center 1
Montefiore/Einstein Affil 4
Pediatrics Total 20

Internal Medicine
Cedars-Sinai Medical Cent
1
CA Pacific Med. Ctr.
3
Yale Univ Sch of Med
2
Jackson Memorial Hospital
1
Univ. of So. Florida Coll
1
Univ. of Chicago Hospital
1
The Johns Hopkins Hospita
1
Beth Israel Deaconess Med
2
Boston Univ Med Ctr
2
SUNY HSC Brooklyn-NY
1
Beth Israel Medical Cente
5
The New York Hosp. Cornel
1
Univ. Hosp. of Cleveland
1
Oregon Health & Science U
1
Rhode Island Hospital
4
North Shore-LIJ Health Sy
2
Univ North Carolina Sch o
1
U.C.L.A. Medical Center
2
St. Lukes-Roosevelt Hosp.
1
UMDNJ-Robert W. Johnson M
4
Montefiore/Einstein Affil
2
Walter Reed Army Med Ctr
1
Internal Medicine Total 40

Neurology
U Colorado SOM-Denver
1
U Southern California
1
NYP Hosp-Columbia Univ Me
1
Boston Univ Med Ctr-MA
1
Neurology Total 4

Ophthalmology
New York Medical College
2
New York Eye & Ear Infirm
1
Stroger/Cook Cty-Chicago
1
Mayo Clinic
1
Ophthalmology Total 5

Psychiatry
Univ. of CA-San Francisco
1
Beth Israel Medical Cente
1
The New York Hosp. Cornel
1
U Rochester/Strong Memori
1
Hosp. of The Univ. of PA
1
St. Lukes-Roosevelt Hosp.
1
Stony Brook Teaching Hosp
1
Montefiore/Einstein Affil
1
Univ of Hawaii
1
Naval Medical Center - Sa
1
Psychiatry Total 10

Ob/Gyn
Metropolitan Hosp Ctr-NYM
2
Temple University Hospita
1
Univ. of Washington Med C
1
Stony Brook Teaching Hosp
1
Montefiore/Einstein Affil
2
NCC-Walter Reed Army Med
1
Ob/Gyn Total 8

Surgery - General
Cedars-Sinai Medical Cent
1
USC Med Center
1
Tufts Medical Center
1
Brookdale Hospital Med. C
1
Nassau County Medical Cen
1
Beth Israel Medical Cente
1
North Shore-LIJ Health Sy
1
Virginia Mason Hosp.
1
Stanford Affiliated Hospi
1
St. Lukes-Roosevelt Hosp.
1
UMDNJ-Robert W. Johnson M
1
Univ. of Massachusetts Co
2
Montefiore/Einstein Affil
1
Univ of Hawaii
1
Univ of Pennsylvania Hlth
1
Surgery - General Total 16

Surgery - Neurosurgery
NY Med. Coll. - West. Co.
1
Surgery - Neurosurgery Total 1

Surgery-Ortho Surgery
Univ. of Connecticut Hlth
1
St. Josephs Hosp. & Med.
1
Maimonides Medical Center
1
The Mount Sinai Hospital
1
Long Island Jewish Med. C
1
St. Lukes-Roosevelt Hosp.
1
NY Med. Coll. - West. Co.
1
Montefiore/Einstein Affil
2
Naval Med Ctr Portsmouth
1
Surgery - Ortho Surgery Total 10

Surg - Otorhinolaryngology
New York Eye and Ear Infi
1

UVM/Fletcher Allen
1

Walter Reed Army Med Ctr
1
Surg - Otorhinolaryngology Total 3

Pathology
U.C.L.A. Medical Center
1
Pathology Total 1

Emergency Medicine
Harbor-UCLA Med Ctr
1
Synergy Med Edu Alliance
1
Albany Medical College
1
Brooklyn Hospital Ctr
1
SUNY HSC Brooklyn-NY
2
The Methodist Hospital
1
North Shore University Ho
2
The Mount Sinai Hospital
1
Univ. of Cincinnati Hospi
1
Univ. of Virginia
1
NY Hosp/Med Ctr Queens
1
Wright Patterson AFB
1
Univ. of Massachusetts Co
1
SUNY at Buffalo Grad. Med
1
Einstein/Jacobi Med. Ctr.
2
Emergency Medicine Total 18

Anesthesiology
U Southern California
1
Cedars-Sinai Medical Cent
1
UC Davis Med Ctr-CA
1
UC San Francisco-CA
1
Univ. of CA-Irvine Medica
2
Univ. of CA-San Francisc
1
Yale-New Haven Hosp-CT
2
UPMC Mercy Hospital-PA
1
Tufts Medical Center-MA
1
Univ. of Virginia
1
Westchester Med Ctr-NY
1
Univ. of Washington Med C
1
U Southern California
1
Stony Brook Teaching Hosp
1
Westchester Med Ctr-NY
1
Anesthesiology Total 17

Physical Medicine & Rehab
UMDNJ-New Jersey Med-Newa
1
VA Greater LA Hlth Sys-CA
1
NYP Hosp-Columbia & Corne
1
NYU School Of Medicine
1
Physical Medicine & Rehab Total 4

Radiology - Diagnostic
UC Irvine Med Ctr-CA
1
Yale-New Haven Hosp-CT
2
Boston Univ Med Ctr-MA
1
U Massachusetts Med Schoo
1
Lenox Hill Hospital-NY
3
Long Island Jewish Med Ct
1
UC Davis Med Ctr-CA
2
Westchester Med Ctr-NY
1
Morristown Mem Hosp-NJ
1
Maimonides Med Ctr-NY
1
SUNY Upstate Med Universi
1
Lenox Hill Hospital-NY
5
Brigham & Womens Hosp-MA
1
Allegheny Gen Hosp-PA
1
Advocate IL Masonic Med C
1
Bronx Lebanon Hosp-NY
4
Long Island Jewish Med Ct
1

 

[willen101383]

ACGME my friend . Though I'm surprised that number is high.

Got you.


OP....DO schools arent all lumped together into one category. Program directors know which programs are more highly regarded...and produce better quality residents.

 

[tbone1234]

Wow those are some amazing stats!! Thank you for posting them!

10 DO's got into orthopedic surgery?! That's amazing!! Same with anesthesiology (17). Wow...

 

[willen101383]

Wow those are some amazing stats!! Thank you for posting them!

10 DO's got into orthopedic surgery?! That's amazing!! Same with anesthesiology (17). Wow...

Not all the appointments are ACGME...but just shows you that you arent going to get stuck @ podunk hospital on the gomer service for the rest of your life.

PCOM is a very well known DO school that is respected. KCOM, ATSU,NSU,CCOM,MSU,etc and the like are also really well known and you will see good match lists from those schools as well. However you also have some other DO schools that may not be very well established and they may have trouble placing residents.

Do really well academically at a solid DO school and I personally dont think you are really closing any doors for yourself. Unless you are some A list type who needs to be at the top of everything in their life and really needs name recognition....go MD.

But if you are like me...who wants to get a good education, care for my patients to the best of my ability, and have a great (well paying) career...DO is going to be fine for you. I dont really see myself trying to be on staff at a place like harvard or anything. My father is a hematologist/oncologist who went to NYMC, trained at Long Island Jewish Medical Center......and hes on staff at like 4 hospitals in Albany NY including Albany med. Hes not trying to be some big wig at a top 5 med school. He makes a good living...and we always had what we wanted as kids...within reason....went on vacations...and just had a great upbringing. Thats exactly what I want to provide for my family.

Wow sorry for the rambling!

 

[millepora]

Urologic Surgery
Albert Einstein Medical Center -Philadelphia, PA

Urology
Albert Einstein Medical Center -Philadelphia, PA

What is this, are they trying to do doubles or something? It can be called urologic surgery in other countries, but why would you refer to the same thing as two different pseudonyms on the match list?

 

[MedicinaeDoctor]

Serenade, it's usually referred to as ROAD specialties. I don't know where you came up with the extra S from.

 

[willen101383]

What is this, are they trying to do doubles or something? It can be called urologic surgery in other countries, but why would you refer to the same thing as two different pseudonyms on the match list?

I was thinking the same thing earlier. I have no idea what that is.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Serenade, it's usually referred to as ROAD specialties. I don't know where you came up with the extra S from.

There are multiple variations to this acronym. Such as UP-ROAD-E ( Urology, Psychiatry, Emergency medicine). These residencies are extremely competitive and offer great life styles. S ( surgical sub-specialties - ENT,Urology, Plastics, Etc.) are considered by many people to be even more competitive then many of the traditional ROAD specialties and offer a life style better then many other specialties.

 

[TexasTriathlete]

Sometimes I accidentally click on this board, and it usually makes me want to stab myself in the face. This thread is no exception.

And you think rads is boring, but you want to go into cardiothoracic surgery?

There might not be a specialty that does the exact same **** over and over and over more than ct surgery. They should change the name of it to "CABG Drone"

 

[JimT30]

Not all the appointments are ACGME...but just shows you that you arent going to get stuck @ podunk hospital on the gomer service for the rest of your life.

PCOM is a very well known DO school that is respected. KCOM, ATSU,NSU,CCOM,MSU,etc and the like are also really well known and you will see good match lists from those schools as well. However you also have some other DO schools that may not be very well established and they may have trouble placing residents.

Do really well academically at a solid DO school and I personally dont think you are really closing any doors for yourself. Unless you are some A list type who needs to be at the top of everything in their life and really needs name recognition....go MD.

But if you are like me...who wants to get a good education, care for my patients to the best of my ability, and have a great (well paying) career...DO is going to be fine for you. I dont really see myself trying to be on staff at a place like harvard or anything. My father is a hematologist/oncologist who went to NYMC, trained at Long Island Jewish Medical Center......and hes on staff at like 4 hospitals in Albany NY including Albany med. Hes not trying to be some big wig at a top 5 med school. He makes a good living...and we always had what we wanted as kids...within reason....went on vacations...and just had a great upbringing. Thats exactly what I want to provide for my family.

Wow sorry for the rambling!

You do realize that NYMC is not a DO school right? Not sure what the point you're trying to make is...

 

[BassCaster]

read it again a few times... it'll click sooner or later.

 

[willen101383]

You do realize that NYMC is not a DO school right? Not sure what the point you're trying to make is...

The point I was trying to make is (as I stated above) I am trying to do a comparison between a good DO school and a good MD school (albeit one that isnt top 10). And how for your average medical student just looking to be a doctor and not some top researcher you are going to be fine going to a good DO school. I picked NYMC because it was the first thing that popped into my head last night because that is where my father went to med school.

 

[JaggerPlate]

Sometimes I accidentally click on this board, and it usually makes me want to stab myself in the face. This thread is no exception.

And you think rads is boring, but you want to go into cardiothoracic surgery?

There might not be a specialty that does the exact same **** over and over and over more than ct surgery. They should change the name of it to "CABG Drone"

I swear to God I was just going to leave some comment about how these type of threads make my soul sad ... but you did it for me. Thank you.

 

[gettheleadout]

I swear to God I was just going to leave some comment about how these type of threads make my soul sad ... but you did it for me. Thank you.

Jagger you seem to be a fairly unhappy fellow in general

 

[willen101383]

Jagger you seem to be a fairly unhappy fellow in general

I think jagger is just sick of people on SDN....as am I. It gets draining reading about this stuff constantly....DO vs MD......listening to people $hit on DO degrees.....17 year olds posting about becoming cardiothoracic surgeons before even starting college, people saying DOs cant do anything, etc. I came on this website a long while ago to get advice...and stayed to give advice to others about what I have learned along the way. But when your advice falls on deaf ears....or people with no experience claim to know more than you, it just gets annoying and pointless to post anymore.

Ive had a lot of fun posting here...but with med school starting next week I think my days may be numbered....

 

[JaggerPlate]

Jagger you seem to be a fairly unhappy fellow in general

I'm far more cynical than necessary. I also don't have a ton of patience, and worry too much about issues that only vaguely affect me. Other than that though ...

I think jagger is just sick of people on SDN....as am I. It gets draining reading about this stuff constantly....DO vs MD......listening to people $hit on DO degrees.....17 year olds posting about becoming cardiothoracic surgeons before even starting college, people saying DOs cant do anything, etc. I came on this website a long while ago to get advice...and stayed to give advice to others about what I have learned along the way. But when your advice falls on deaf ears....or people with no experience claim to know more than you, it just gets annoying and pointless to post anymore.

Ive had a lot of fun posting here...but with med school starting next week I think my days may be numbered....

Bingo. Same story. I made an account here years ago to PM a mod and ask about a math requirement at Touro-MI. The rest is history. The thing about SDN is that it seriously does offer some golden advice. I don't think I would have made it to medical school without some of the info from this site. However, for every med student/resident who leaves a post that's pure money, 50-100 young pre-meds make wild accusations, assumptions, say absurd things, or ask the same questions over and over again without using the search function.

Frankly, I really didn't think this thread was overtly annoying; it was just funny that I was planning on leaving some pity "roll eyez" comment and Tex beat me to it. Also, I'm sure I'll be on this site a LOT less when school starts, which is only a few weeks away!

 

[The Poet Sings]

I think jagger is just sick of people on SDN....as am I. It gets draining reading about this stuff constantly....DO vs MD......listening to people $hit on DO degrees.....17 year olds posting about becoming cardiothoracic surgeons before even starting college, people saying DOs cant do anything, etc. I came on this website a long while ago to get advice...and stayed to give advice to others about what I have learned along the way. But when your advice falls on deaf ears....or people with no experience claim to know more than you, it just gets annoying and pointless to post anymore.

Ive had a lot of fun posting here...but with med school starting next week I think my days may be numbered....

at first i was like then i was like . hope that makes sense...

 

[avatarftw]

Good luck in school; medical school is pretty hard right now. I estimate the workload to be about 20 credit hours but it should increase after the summer semester (MSUCOM is strange).

There is PLENTY of time to do what you want, but you have to be dedicated. I'm spending about 50 hours a week on school but I'm not doing that well; need to study more effectively and stop going to bed so late. (whoops)

By "plenty" of time, I mean that you can devote 2 hours daily to your hobby but don't expect to be able to do everything that you like. You may have to choose between playing guitar and going to the gym, for example. I find med school to be kind of stressful; some people may have 40 hour/week jobs right now but many times their jobs are low-key. Some jobs don't require great expenditure of your brain cells; memorizing is getting kind of lame and its only been 1 month...

I'm far more cynical than necessary. I also don't have a ton of patience, and worry too much about issues that only vaguely affect me. Other than that though ...



Bingo. Same story. I made an account here years ago to PM a mod and ask about a math requirement at Touro-MI. The rest is history. The thing about SDN is that it seriously does offer some golden advice. I don't think I would have made it to medical school without some of the info from this site. However, for every med student/resident who leaves a post that's pure money, 50-100 young pre-meds make wild accusations, assumptions, say absurd things, or ask the same questions over and over again without using the search function.

Frankly, I really didn't think this thread was overtly annoying; it was just funny that I was planning on leaving some pity "roll eyez" comment and Tex beat me to it. Also, I'm sure I'll be on this site a LOT less when school starts, which is only a few weeks away!

 

[willen101383]

at first i was like then i was like . hope that makes sense...

Haha numbered in terms of posting here much....not like I am going to die haha. Ive actually already taken histology and anatomy at the grad school level in the last 2 years...so I think this block might be okay....

 

[willen101383]

I'm far more cynical than necessary. I also don't have a ton of patience, and worry too much about issues that only vaguely affect me. Other than that though ...


Back in 05-06 right when I graduated college...and was basically dead in the water in terms of getting into med school SDN really did give me confidence. There was this thread "The new improved low GPA thread," which may or may not still be around that really gave me hope (and was nice to be able to show my parents, who were pushing me hard to move on from my med school dream bc of my horrid GPA back then). So SDN really does have great advice...you just need to know where to look, and be able to sift through the bull**** to get that nugget of gold.

 

[The Poet Sings]

Haha numbered in terms of posting here much....not like I am going to die haha. Ive actually already taken histology and anatomy at the grad school level in the last 2 years...so I think this block might be okay....

ok good to know that you're not expecting med school to kill you

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

I think if Jagger & Will leave then.. well this will be a boring network. Anyways I need help deciding the most epic decision of my life. Janitor v.s DO .

 

[willen101383]

I think if Jagger & Will leave then.. well this will be a boring network. Anyways I need help deciding the most epic decision of my life. Janitor v.s DO .

I doubt I will go anywhere...I probably wont post as much but I bet me quitting SDN will go just as smoothly as me quitting facebook...omgomg i gotta go check my wallllllllll

 

[JaggerPlate]

I think if Jagger & Will leave then.. well this will be a boring network. Anyways I need help deciding the most epic decision of my life. Janitor v.s DO .

I'm not going to leave, but I think I'll be less of a Luke Skywalker and more of an Obi-Wan (eps 4-6) on these boards ... here for guidance, but not so active in the rebellion.

 

[JaggerPlate]

Oh, and btw ... I think because the title of this thread is 'DO salary,' it should be changed to a discussion on how much an OMM/NMM guy running a cash only OMM practice makes. Frankly, this is probably the only real 'DO' salary out there. I've heard some wild numbers ... people claim 7 figures from some posh practices in NY, and I've also had someone on these boards say their OMM specialist charges around $180 for 45 minutes (all cash).

Any other numbers??

 

[COMedic2Doc]

I'm not going to leave, but I think I'll be less of a Luke Skywalker and more of an Obi-Wan (eps 4-6) on these boards ... here for guidance, but not so active in the rebellion.

Hmmmmm.... now there's a generation definition, knowing the difference between episodes 4-6 and 1-3 for characters, as well as which ones were able to get a start in their careers based off the original Star Wars trilogy. Very similar to some shows like Firefly and others....

Jagger, thanks for your insight into some of the forums that you've posted in and good luck with MS-1.

 

[VeeTeeHokies]

Oh, and btw ... I think because the title of this thread is 'DO salary,' it should be changed to a discussion on how much an OMM/NMM guy running a cash only OMM practice makes. Frankly, this is probably the only real 'DO' salary out there. I've heard some wild numbers ... people claim 7 figures from some posh practices in NY, and I've also had someone on these boards say their OMM specialist charges around $180 for 45 minutes (all cash).

Any other numbers??

All I can say on this is that the DO I shadowed gave me a brief rundown of billing for OMM within his practice and he said he can spend an extra 10-15 minutes with a patient, which is amazing for several reasons as I'm sure you all know, and make an extra $65 (I'm about 90% sure this is the fee he told me). I know it was over $50, and that's pretty awesome considering we get to spend additional time with our patients, build a stronger rapport, get paid for all of the typical medical services, and snag a few extra ducats all the while.

 

[JaggerPlate]

All I can say on this is that the DO I shadowed gave me a brief rundown of billing for OMM within his practice and he said he can spend an extra 10-15 minutes with a patient, which is amazing for several reasons as I'm sure you all know, and make an extra $65 (I'm about 90% sure this is the fee he told me). I know it was over $50, and that's pretty awesome considering we get to spend additional time with our patients, build a stronger rapport, get paid for all of the typical medical services, and snag a few extra ducats all the while.

Yeah. I've heard differing things on billing insurance for OMM. Luckily, you can bill for it as a procedure in the same appointment (meaning you don't have to make the patient set another appointment to get paid nor do you have to perform OMM in a standard appointment without getting paid). However, some of the stories I've heard regarding cash based practices (which are anecdotal, but there are a least 2 practices where I currently live that charge BIG bucks per hour and are clearly finding volume) sound pretty good $ wise.

 

[avatarftw]

Big deal about the OMM specialist! I know of radiology locum tenems jobs that pay 200-225 dollars/hour. Granted, they are in undesirable places, but still...

Oh, and btw ... I think because the title of this thread is 'DO salary,' it should be changed to a discussion on how much an OMM/NMM guy running a cash only OMM practice makes. Frankly, this is probably the only real 'DO' salary out there. I've heard some wild numbers ... people claim 7 figures from some posh practices in NY, and I've also had someone on these boards say their OMM specialist charges around $180 for 45 minutes (all cash).

Any other numbers??

 

[DbDan]

Big deal about the OMM specialist! I know of radiology locum tenems jobs that pay 200-225 dollars/hour. Granted, they are in undesirable places, but still...

his point was that OMM specialists are the only real "DO" profession. The rest are physicians in line with MD physicians. There are going to be plenty of people who can make more money than the OMM specialist, the point was that OMM specialists are unique to DO and still make a good salary

 

[JaggerPlate]

Big deal about the OMM specialist! I know of radiology locum tenems jobs that pay 200-225 dollars/hour. Granted, they are in undesirable places, but still...

For sure. I'd never sit here and say other specialties don't get paid more (or even that these OMM practices are common/easy to do), but a few things ...

1. I'm not sure of the malpractice/overhead differences (especially when it's locum tenems works), but I know OMM guys pay essentially nothing for either

2. The OMM guys I was referring to (specifically) take cash only. This means no insurance companies, no delays, and no FAT cuts coming to reimbursements to their services (like the image guys have coming - 17% I think )

 

[JaggerPlate]

his point was that OMM specialists are the only real "DO" profession. The rest are physicians in line with MD physicians. There are going to be plenty of people who can make more money than the OMM specialist, the point was that OMM specialists are unique to DO and still make a good salary

Yup, yup.

 

[DoctorPenguin]

Holy cow I had no idea OMM specialists were paid that much; but you're absolutely right about the malpractice thing. I don't think many people pay much attention to that when thinking about how much money is made. It seems likely that a surgeon would be paid more than the average primary care physician even after malpractice, etc... but imagine the stress that's off your mind not having to worry about it! haha.

Of course... if you can't handle the stress, you probably shouldn't be a surgeon to begin with I think!

While on the topic... I did the DO search on the AOA site (which is an amazing feature btw) to look for closeby DO's to shadow. It was really cool to see neurologists, orthopedic surgeons, plastic surgeons, dermatologists, and neurosurgeons! It confirmed to me everything I've been reading on SDN.

I'm hoping to be able to shadow one of these doctors... do ya'll have any advice on how to ask a doctor if you can shadow them? Do you email them? Call? Fax (lol)? Do you tell them straight up you're needing to shadow for a LOR, or do you just tell them you want to learn more about osteopathic medicine, and assume they'll know you'll be asking for a LOR.

Thanks!

 

[DbDan]

Holy cow I had no idea OMM specialists were paid that much; but you're absolutely right about the malpractice thing. I don't think many people pay much attention to that when thinking about how much money is made. It seems likely that a surgeon would be paid more than the average primary care physician even after malpractice, etc... but imagine the stress that's off your mind not having to worry about it! haha.

Of course... if you can't handle the stress, you probably shouldn't be a surgeon to begin with I think!

While on the topic... I did the DO search on the AOA site (which is an amazing feature btw) to look for closeby DO's to shadow. It was really cool to see neurologists, orthopedic surgeons, plastic surgeons, dermatologists, and neurosurgeons! It confirmed to me everything I've been reading on SDN.

I'm hoping to be able to shadow one of these doctors... do ya'll have any advice on how to ask a doctor if you can shadow them? Do you email them? Call? Fax (lol)? Do you tell them straight up you're needing to shadow for a LOR, or do you just tell them you want to learn more about osteopathic medicine, and assume they'll know you'll be asking for a LOR.

Thanks!

Send a polite e-mail with an attached CV stating your reasons for wanting to shadow or make a phone call. Don't say you are shadowing just for a LOR, it will rub people the wrong way and will likely not yield an opportunity.