Getting off waitlist: LOI...again?

[natler]

I sent a combined letter of update and interest to all of my schools in late November. I've been recently waitlisted by a few of my top choices and I want to send these schools another letter of interest, but how can I do so without saying the exact same things? Unfortunately, I do not have any updates this time since I've been taking second semester extremely lightly. Should I simply reword my original letter and send a short paragraph to these schools expressing why I still want to attend (without any updates)? I feel like not sending anything definitely will not help me get off the waitlists.

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[OneTwoThreeFour]

Most waitlist movement does not happen until late May. I would wait for your semester grades to finalize, then send an update with said grades. Most WLs I have seen that they appreciate substantive updates, with course grades being THE most substantive addition. Just my .02

 

[Goro]

You realize most schools pay no attention to LOI? They already know you want to go there.

I sent a combined letter of update and interest to all of my schools in late November. I've been recently waitlisted by a few of my top choices and I want to send these schools another letter of interest, but how can I do so without saying the exact same things? Unfortunately, I do not have any updates this time since I've been taking second semester extremely lightly. Should I simply reword my original letter and send a short paragraph to these schools expressing why I still want to attend (without any updates)? I feel like not sending anything definitely will not help me get off the waitlists.

 

[natler]

I am aware that schools don't take LOIs into much account, but what else can I send? I feel like I need to continue some sort of communication with the school if I want to get off the waitlist. Unfortunately, senioritis hit me hard after I got my first acceptance and I don't think I should send my spring semester grades..

 

[chenzt]

I am aware that schools don't take LOIs into much account, but what else can I send? I feel like I need to continue some sort of communication with the school if I want to get off the waitlist. Unfortunately, senioritis hit me hard after I got my first acceptance and I don't think I should send my spring semester grades..

You kind of shot yourself in the foot on that one... If you have nothing else, guess you have to just

 

[Pythagorean]

You realize most schools pay no attention to LOI? They already know you want to go there.

What if you accomplished something of meaningful merit since being interviewed/waitlisted such as a publication, a recently written LOR from a physician you've been shadowing, or higher MCAT/GPA, and you want to put that in your LOI. Does it really still fall on deaf ears at most institutions?

I'm in OP's position where I feel the need to keep communication. I just feel like a sitting duck otherwise.

 

[Goro]

An update's OK, as long as the school welcomes them. Anything significant like what you have beleow is something that can help you.

However, a LOR is rarely going have any influence on waitlist movement, even if from a Nobel Laureate or a US senator, and I've seen those.

What if you accomplished something of meaningful merit since being interviewed/waitlisted such as a publication, a recently written LOR from a physician you've been shadowing, or higher MCAT/GPA, and you want to put that in your LOI. Does it really still fall on deaf ears at most institutions?

I'm in OP's position where I feel the need to keep communication. I just feel like a sitting duck otherwise.

 

[ducksau5]

What if the LOR is your PI saying that you will be published eventually but it won't be in the next month?

 

[Pythagorean]

What if the LOR is your PI saying that you will be published eventually but it won't be in the next month?

That statement wreaks of b.s. - not because I doubt your ability to be published - because it reflects such an unpredictable time table. Any applicant could send a statement saying they will eventually accomplish a feat... just not in the next month. I do not think sending it would hurt your chances, but I feel like if you want to help your chances then you should ask your PI to add more foreseeable updates to the LOR.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

Waste of time and potentially would piss off admissions. I'd reject an applicant that can't be considerate of my time by sending what is basically a duplicate letter.

 

[ducksau5]

That statement wreaks of b.s. - not because I doubt your ability to be published - because it reflects such an unpredictable time table. Any applicant could send a statement saying they will eventually accomplish a feat... just not in the next month. I do not think sending it would hurt your chances, but I feel like if you want to help your chances then you should ask your PI to add more foreseeable updates to the LOR.

Hmm I see, well the letter should not be as vague as I made it seem. She essentially outlined everything that has happened since she wrote my LOR (which is essentially an entire project + data analysis) and the time frame of the project (I should be published before I matriculate). Anyways I figured I would send it because it is the one thing that has changed the most since I applied and for reasons beyond my control the project cannot finish at a faster rate.

Sorry to hijack the thread OP, I'm trying to figure out the best way to get off waitlists too!

 

[Jimsy]

An update's OK, as long as the school welcomes them. Anything significant like what you have beleow is something that can help you.

However, a LOR is rarely going have any influence on waitlist movement, even if from a Nobel Laureate or a US senator, and I've seen those.

Is a new shadowing experience something that is update-worthy?

 

[Goro]

I'm going to play devil's advocate.

You're the Dean of Admissions. You have Jimsy's file in your hand. You just got an update that Jimsy has recently shadowed Dr X, who does Y, for Z hrs.

Is that really going to make you think "Hmmm...time for this guy to be given a seat!"

Is a new shadowing experience something that is update-worthy?

 

[Mr Roboto]

Is that really going to make you think "Hmmm...time for this guy to be given a seat!"

...Yes?

Because if so, I've got an LOI to mail asap!

 

[Jimsy]

I'm going to play devil's advocate.

You're the Dean of Admissions. You have Jimsy's file in your hand. You just got an update that Jimsy has recently shadowed Dr X, who does Y, for Z hrs.

Is that really going to make you think "Hmmm...time for this guy to be given a seat!"

Hi Goro, I have another question. Is it a good idea to send additional files along with the LOI/update that are directly related with the mentioned updates? (Like sending copies of posters that have been presented)

 

[tiedyeddog]

Only send an update if you have something to update them about. Getting a 4.0 during your most recent semester or getting a paper published would be worthy of that.

It sounds like you just want to send a "pay attention to me, I still want in" letter. This will not help you get in off of a waitlist. Additionally, if you have already sent in one update then you shouldn't send in another. That's a good way to get added to the last spot on the waitlist.

 

[gyngyn]

Unless you are holding an acceptance at a cheaper or arguably better school these LOI's/updates are not going to have an influence. At least make sure they accept them if you feel compelled to contact them again. If they have a ranked waitlist, don't bother.

 

[Goro]

Tiedye and gyngyn have already answered the question. Patience is a virtue.

Hi Goro, I have another question. Is it a good idea to send additional files along with the LOI/update that are directly related with the mentioned updates? (Like sending copies of posters that have been presented)

 

[PlOkmIjn]

.

 

[gyngyn]

Would sending in updates that are not super significant (publication, last semester grades) ever hurt a file? Since the committee is sick of reading so they hold it against the applicant (for schools that welcome updates)? Just wondering since apparently a few posters in this thread have mentioned this.

At my school we have clear guidelines. Those who cannot follow them go to the bottom of the stratum in which they would otherwise be called from the waitlist.
I cannot speak for those schools that indicate that they actually want to see these things. I cannot believe that any of these updates have any effect on the outcome for applicants who are holding nowhere. We already know you will come! We are no longer evaluating your worthiness. That has pretty much been decided by the committee. The person pulling from the waitlist only wants to know if you will come or not.

 

[Xenoblade]

Only send an update if you have something to update them about. Getting a 4.0 during your most recent semester or getting a paper published would be worthy of that.

It sounds like you just want to send a "pay attention to me, I still want in" letter. This will not help you get in off of a waitlist. Additionally, if you have already sent in one update then you shouldn't send in another. That's a good way to get added to the last spot on the waitlist.

I almost sent in a second loi. Thanks for the advice and keeping me from making a fatal mistake.

That almost seems like double speak on adcom's part, because they told me that they welcome update/loi letters.

 

[Xenoblade]

Unless you are holding an acceptance at a cheaper or arguably better school these LOI's/updates are not going to have an influence. At least make sure they accept them if you feel compelled to contact them again. If they have a ranked waitlist, don't bother.

I still don't understand this logic.

So writing a loi to a more expensive school that I want to get pulled off of the wl implies that I am super serious about attending because I am willing to pay a premium to go there, which shows that I would be genuinely interested?

 

[xffan624]

I still don't understand this logic.

So writing a loi to a more expensive school that I want to get pulled off of the wl implies that I am super serious about attending because I am willing to pay a premium to go there, which shows that I would be genuinely interested?

If expensive school X sees that you have been accepted to cheaper school Y, they might have some trepidation that if they pull you off the waitlist you might still go to Y. This hurts their stats. Sending them an LOI letting them know that you are their first choice school would be a way to alleviate their concern. If you have no acceptances, they already know you will accept their offer.

 

[tiedyeddog]

That almost seems like double speak on adcom's part, because they told me that they welcome update/loi letters.

I agree with you but you have to think of it from their perspective. They get thousands of these letters every cycle. You're lucky if they even get read.

 

[Goro]

To further clarify my learned colleague's comment, people who can't follow simple instructions, or have such a high sense of entitlement to think that the rules don't apply to them, make very poor medical students, and we actively try to keep them out of our school (kneecap breaking being illegal and all).

An update might be useful if a borderline candidate has some recent grades come into further demonstrate s/he can handle medical school. But the key is that the updates must be welcomed in the first place. Capeesh?

At my school we have clear guidelines. Those who cannot follow them go to the bottom of the stratum in which they would otherwise be called from the waitlist.
I cannot speak for those schools that indicate that they actually want to see these things. I cannot believe that any of these updates have any effect on the outcome for applicants who are holding nowhere. We already know you will come! We are no longer evaluating your worthiness. That has pretty much been decided by the committee. The person pulling from the waitlist only wants to know if you will come or not.

 

[Jimsy]

 

[Mad Jack]

I am aware that schools don't take LOIs into much account, but what else can I send? I feel like I need to continue some sort of communication with the school if I want to get off the waitlist. Unfortunately, senioritis hit me hard after I got my first acceptance and I don't think I should send my spring semester grades..

You messed up the only thing that would have possibly made an update worth reading.

 

[ranson]

Does anyone know why some school waitlist so many students (over 300), when only 10-30 get pulled off? It really doesn't make any sense to give people false hope when the admission committee knows that many have no shot of getting off. Are these schools too lazy to evaluate waitlist applicants and shorten the list or are these school just attention ******, desiring hundreds of LOIs?

 

[tiedyeddog]

Does anyone know why some school waitlist so many students (over 300), when only 10-30 get pulled off? It really doesn't make any sense to give people false hope when the admission committee knows that many have no shot of getting off. Are these schools too lazy to evaluate waitlist applicants and shorten the list or are these school just attention ******, desiring hundreds of LOIs?

They have no incentive to make the list shorter. They probably don't read most LOIs anyway.

It is beneficial for them to make the lists longer because they have wiggle room if they need it. Their concern for an applicants false hope is pretty low.... The process sucks, deal with it.

 

[repititionition]

To further clarify my learned colleague's comment, people who can't follow simple instructions, or have such a high sense of entitlement to think that the rules don't apply to them, make very poor medical students, and we actively try to keep them out of our school (kneecap breaking being illegal and all).

An update might be useful if a borderline candidate has some recent grades come into further demonstrate s/he can handle medical school. But the key is that the updates must be welcomed in the first place. Capeesh?

capisce?

 

[Goro]

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=capeesh
capeesh?
Do you understand? From the Italian
I'm the boss here. Capeesh?

capisce?

 

[KYmed]

Does anyone know why some school waitlist so many students (over 300), when only 10-30 get pulled off? It really doesn't make any sense to give people false hope when the admission committee knows that many have no shot of getting off. Are these schools too lazy to evaluate waitlist applicants and shorten the list or are these school just attention ******, desiring hundreds of LOIs?

I don't think schools with waitlists of 300 would be taking 10 students most years. If a list is that big, I'm sure they average lots of movement. In fact, I can only think of one or two that may be 300 deep. That would be an enormous list.

The thing that is frustrating to me about wait lists is that you don't know if a school has 50 or 250 on it's wait list, and you have no way of knowing exactly which side of that spectrum a school falls on.

Obviously a top tier school likely only accepts a couple off the wait list, while a mid tier school ( and/or maybe a state school in a state with multiple state schools) may usually accept many more off the wait list most years. I don't really know obviously. @gyngyn and @Goro would know much more, but I doubt they can comment on much. The waitlist seems to be so different at most schools, so everyone speaks in generalities.

 

[Goro]

All I can add is that patience is a virtue.

I don't think schools with waitlists of 300 would be taking 10 students most years. If a list is that big, I'm sure they average lots of movement. In fact, I can only think of one or two that may be 300 deep. That would be an enormous list.

The thing that is frustrating to me about wait lists is that you don't know if a school has 50 or 250 on it's wait list, and you have no way of knowing exactly which side of that spectrum a school falls on.

Obviously a top tier school likely only accepts a couple off the wait list, while a mid tier school ( and/or maybe a state school in a state with multiple state schools) may usually accept many more off the wait list most years. I don't really know obviously. @gyngyn and @Goro would know much more, but I doubt they can comment on much. The waitlist seems to be so different at most schools, so everyone speaks in generalities.

 

[KYmed]

All I can add is that patience is a virtue.

Yeah. Like I said, I doubt you guys would be allowed/able to comment on much.

 

[natler]

.

 

[gyngyn]

If I applied with a low 3.8 GPA, would it be worthwhile at all to update with senior year grades that got me a 3.7 and a low 3.8? If I do, should I list all the individual grades or just the two GPA's? I also have a couple other minor, commonplace updates but nothing especially noteworthy.

This is not noteworthy. Sorry.

 

[CrypticMind]

This is not noteworthy. Sorry.

What do you think about sending a letter of intent to a school if you clarify it is your top choice and you have other acceptances, but will come to their school (declining all other acceptances), if offered a seat in the class?

 

[bearded frog]

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