Have Goucher Postbac Qs?

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killdevil

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Hi pre-postbac folks,

Just wanted to let you all know - if you have questions about the Goucher College Postbac program, I'll be happy to answer them. I was a student in the program last year.

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You can PM me or just post in-thread... either way is fine.
 
Thanks for the post...I do have questions about Goucher so here goes:

1 What schools did you apply to and why Goucher?


2 I keep hearing and reading that post-bac is intense. What was your typical week as far as studying goes...did you study 3 hours a day, 5, 7? (I went to a liberal arts school and am used to studying a lot so I'm trying to compare).


3 Where did you do your Tuesday volunteering?



4 What was your classes attrition rate and why did these people drop out?



5 Where you prepared for MCAT and med school. IF you aren't in med school, what are you doing now? Does Goucher help with finding jobs for the glide year?


6. Were your teachers good and were they supportive?

THANKS!
 
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I second those questions listed above!
 
I third the questions above...

Also, what were the stats of incoming students. I am still trying to figure out if I would have a chance at this school (2006 Econ grad, 3.2 GPA, starting to volunteer at the end of this month).
 
I third the questions above...

Also, what were the stats of incoming students. I am still trying to figure out if I would have a chance at this school (2006 Econ grad, 3.2 GPA, starting to volunteer at the end of this month).

I didn't attend Goucher, but I think their entering averages are around 3.5 GPA, IIRC. It's been awhile since I interviewed.
 
Okay, answers to your questions are below.

1 What schools did you apply to and why Goucher?


I applied to all of the well-regarded postbac programs and was accepted at all of them. I chose Goucher because of the small class size, the postbac-only classes, the quality of instruction I perceived during my visit, and because of how impressed I was by the students I spoke to on my interview day. They seemed less stressed out and more confident about the whole process than postbacs I'd spoken to at other institutions.


2 I keep hearing and reading that post-bac is intense. What was your typical week as far as studying goes...did you study 3 hours a day, 5, 7? (I went to a liberal arts school and am used to studying a lot so I'm trying to compare).



The postbac year is intense. No getting around that. Goucher's program begins in the summertime with General Chemistry, and I'd say I spent around 4-5 hours per day studying from Monday-Thursday during that period. Exams are on Fridays at noon during the summer, and you're encouraged to take the whole weekend off -- which I did.

In the fall and the spring, I was studying whenever I wasn't in class, as a general rule, though I certainly took time out to socialize with my classmates, exercise, sleep, and do various other things that were important to me. I didn't think of it in terms of #s of hours, really... it's simply that studying became my "default" activity.

There's a lot of group study and collaboration that happens in such a small, intense program, so it was nice to be able to work with other people... I never felt I was going it alone, so to speak.


3 Where did you do your Tuesday volunteering?


I volunteered with an orthopedic surgeon at Sinai Hospital in Baltimore, and also worked as a counselor at an STD clinic in Baltimore City. People choose all sorts of different things to do for their Tuesday volunteerism, and the program directors are really good about steering each student towards good volunteer activities in light of their particular interests and circumstances. The program has ties with lots of community organizations and research institutions, and postbacs get a thick booklet over the summer with names, descriptions, and contact details for all of the most highly-recommended volunteer opportunities. This makes it easy to "jump right in" and start volunteering in the fall.


4 What was your classes attrition rate and why did these people drop out?



No one dropped out of my class. This isn't unusual, although sometimes there will be one or two. I can't speak to why people drop out, but I can speculate that it's because they realize they're not as committed to medicine as they thought they were, or because they're having overwhelming difficulty with academics. I think the reason people drop out so infrequently is that the program only accepts those who have demonstrated that they're committed, and that they can do the work at a very high level.


5 Where you prepared for MCAT and med school. IF you aren't in med school, what are you doing now? Does Goucher help with finding jobs for the glide year?

The program includes intensive MCAT preparation that begins in the fall (once weekly) and accelerates in the spring (4 meetings weekly, and practice exams on Saturdays). At the end of all of that, you're more than prepared. As to preparation for med school, the study skills you develop as a postbac are, by all accounts, readily applicable to the first two years of med school. My classmates who linked and are now 1st-year med students tell me that while the volume of material is larger, the complexity is comparable. I look at my postbac year as having been "boot camp" for medical school, from an academic standpoint. It's very good preparation.

Goucher does help you find glide year jobs, if you choose not to link and go directly to med school. The program directors keep in touch with a large network of former postbacs, and also with researchers and clinicians who have positions available from year to year, and use this network to identify lots of great positions around the U.S.. These get sent out to students in the spring of the postbac year.


6. Were your teachers good and were they supportive?

Yes, teachers were uniformly supportive and enthusiastic, and generally speaking, the quality of instruction ranged from good to excellent. The professors at Goucher like teaching, and they like teaching postbacs in particular, and it shows.

Somebody else asked about GPAs of accepted students. I am not sure, but I believe that the floor for accepted students is around a 3.5, but probably averages somewhat higher than that.

Hope this all is helpful.
 
Thanks for all of the info! It's definitely helpful. One more question though- what type of interview questions did you get asked at your interviews (if you interviewed at more than one place) ?
 
Though I'm actually more interested in the Bryn Mawr program than Goucher, I think this applies equally to students of either: why did you choose not to link? In my mind, I can't see why a linkage wouldn't make sense ... Quite possibly I'm missing something, but I'm not sure what. Is it that you weren't interested in the schools that offered linkages?

Additionally, what sort of requirements were there to link into a med school? What sort of undergraduate GPA seemed to be required to get a link into the various schools? And what were the requirements in order to maintain the linkage?

Thanks so much ...
 
Thanks for all of the info! It's definitely helpful. One more question though- what type of interview questions did you get asked at your interviews (if you interviewed at more than one place) ?

I interviewed at Bryn Mawr, Scripps, Goucher, Penn, Tufts and a few other places. In general, interviews were of a "narrative" nature; in other words, my interviewers wanted me to tell the story of my journey towards medicine. While I told the story, they interrupted to ask more specific questions about aspects of my background and experiences they were most interested in. I suppose postbac applicants are well-advised to think through how they'll tell that story, because it's incredibly important in postbac admissions, and equally important in the medical school admissions process.

When I did postbac interviews, there were few if any of the "hardball" sorts of questions you sometimes get during the medical school admissions process (though, to be fair, my med school interviews have most all been similarly conversational thus far).
 
Though I'm actually more interested in the Bryn Mawr program than Goucher, I think this applies equally to students of either: why did you choose not to link? In my mind, I can't see why a linkage wouldn't make sense ... Quite possibly I'm missing something, but I'm not sure what. Is it that you weren't interested in the schools that offered linkages?

I chose not to link because I couldn't quite say, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that I wouldn't wonder "what if" if I'd chosen to link. Doing the glide year and going through the whole medical school admissions cycle has been tough, but by doing it this way I get the chance to be a "savvy shopper," comparing and contrasting the schools I visit for interviews. Admittedly, link programs allow you to sidestep 90% of the rigamarole and 90% of the cost associated with med school admissions, and keep up the momentum of your postbac year. It was a difficult decision not to link.

In my class, around half the class chose to link, and the other half chose to do the full process. It's a fantastic option to have, and basically everybody considers linking during the fall (and you get to visit the link schools during the fall to determine whether or not you like them well enough to commit).


Additionally, what sort of requirements were there to link into a med school? What sort of undergraduate GPA seemed to be required to get a link into the various schools? And what were the requirements in order to maintain the linkage?

Basically everyone who is accepted to the Goucher program has the numbers to be able to link successfully. It may not be true that every student could successfully link to one of the more selective schools like Pitt or Chicago, but the program directors will be pretty up-front in telling you (during the fall of the postbac year) where you're best advised to submit a link application.

Once you are accepted to a med school via a link program, you sign a contract that says you pledge to matriculate, and the school pledges to accept you, provided you maintain a minimum GPA in the spring of the postbac year and get above some minimum on the MCAT. In general, the numbers one has to hit are lower than you might expect. This is because the school has decided you'd be a good "fit," regardless of whether or not you get a 40 on the MCAT. It'd take some pretty horrible performance for them to start questioning their decision to accept you...

Hope this helps.
 
Do you recommend taking calculus as an undergrad (especially if you want to link)?
 
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Basically everyone who is accepted to the Goucher program has the numbers to be able to link successfully. It may not be true that every student could successfully link to one of the more selective schools like Pitt or Chicago, but the program directors will be pretty up-front in telling you (during the fall of the postbac year) where you're best advised to submit a link application.

Killdevil -- thanks so much ... That was exactly what I wanted to know. Just one question: any recollection of what kind of stats your classmates needed to attempt the Chicago or Pitt linkages? (Trying to get the vaguest sense of what my shot would be at linking to that tier of med school ...)

Thanks a million ...
 
IIRC, Pitt's linkage (from all schools that link there) requires 3.75/33 but I could be wrong about the exact numbers for BM/Goucher. I know that number is correct for Scripps, though.
 
IIRC, Pitt's linkage (from all schools that link there) requires 3.75/33 but I could be wrong about the exact numbers for BM/Goucher. I know that number is correct for Scripps, though.

But I assume not everyone with a cGPA of 3.75 gets accepted into the linkage, do they? (I basically mean, what are the cGPAs/pre-MCAT stats of people who got accepted into linkages at schools of that tier ... Don't know if people remember this data, but if so ...)

Again, thanks ...
 
But I assume not everyone with a cGPA of 3.75 gets accepted into the linkage, do they? (I basically mean, what are the cGPAs/pre-MCAT stats of people who got accepted into linkages at schools of that tier ... Don't know if people remember this data, but if so ...)

Again, thanks ...

Nearly everyone in my class who wanted to link was able to link successfully. I think this is due to the fact that it's such a small class. There was never a feeling that people were competing with one another for link spots (or in any other way, for that matter).

As to the numbers... grab a copy of the U.S. News rankings or the MSAR (the AAMC's official guidebook to medical schools) and take a look at the GPA numbers published for the various link schools. My sense is that the science and non-science GPAs of successful linkers will align pretty closely with those of non-linkers who are accepted during the regular admissions cycle.

I wouldn't worry so much about the numbers, though. The thing you should remember is that, if you're accepted to a good postbac program, you WILL go to a good medical school. You will end up somewhere you'll be happy, no question about it. Sometimes I think that reading the SDN forums causes one to get a little over-focused on the numbers.
 
Do you recommend taking calculus as an undergrad (especially if you want to link)?

Well, medical school math requirements break down as follows:

  • No college math required (many, perhaps most schools)
  • One semester of unspecified college math required (a few schools)
  • One semester of calc required (a few schools)
  • One semester of calc and one of stats required (a couple of schools)
  • A year of calc required (a couple of schools)

So yeah, for maximum flexibility, you might want to take a semester of calc IF and ONLY IF you think that you'll do well in it. I had one semester of calc in college, and for those couple of schools I applied to that require another semester, I've just indicated that I'll complete integral calc over this coming summer if need be.

I don't believe that any of the Goucher link schools require calculus, for what it's worth. Many, many good schools have no math requirement at all.
 
But I assume not everyone with a cGPA of 3.75 gets accepted into the linkage, do they? (I basically mean, what are the cGPAs/pre-MCAT stats of people who got accepted into linkages at schools of that tier ... Don't know if people remember this data, but if so ...)

Again, thanks ...

The 3.75 isn't cumulative, it's the GPA in the program necessary, or BCPM if you will.

Most people in BM, Scripps, or Goucher are entering with 3.6 or above, so I imagine that gives them a cumulative between 3.6 and 3.7 given those parameters. There are exceptions, and I was one of them, but most of the time candidates with weaker GPAs make it up with very very strong test scores. I had perfect ACT/SAT scores and nearly perfect GMAT/LSAT scores, which correlated fairly well with my MCAT performance.

I know Scripps requires a semester of Calc. I had thought Goucher did as well, but it's been three years since I visited, so certainly I could be remembering incorrectly.
 
The 3.75 isn't cumulative, it's the GPA in the program necessary, or BCPM if you will.

No, I understood that. My original question was slightly different -- not only what you needed to *maintain* a linkage, but what you needed to gain *acceptance* to a linkage in the first place. (Since one would not have a complete BCPM upon application.) Since you're accepted based on your undergrad GPA (and chem grades), I would assume certain GPAs are necessary to get a linkage spot at certain schools in the first place.

Still, as an earlier poster said -- I think it's true, and I shouldn't get too number obsessed. I want to be a doctor -- not a graduate of a certain med school.
 
No, I understood that. My original question was slightly different -- not only what you needed to *maintain* a linkage, but what you needed to gain *acceptance* to a linkage in the first place. (Since one would not have a complete BCPM upon application.) Since you're accepted based on your undergrad GPA (and chem grades), I would assume certain GPAs are necessary to get a linkage spot at certain schools in the first place.

Still, as an earlier poster said -- I think it's true, and I shouldn't get too number obsessed. I want to be a doctor -- not a graduate of a certain med school.

The two people that linked to Pitt from Scripps had about 3.7 GPAs coming in and ~3.8 or so in the program, with MCATs around 35 (but the MCAT just needed to be above 33) I think those stats would be good enough to get in the school in the open pool, but they save a year.

As killdevil mentioned, your stats to link to top 25 schools should be approximately as good as the MSAR for the school for you to be a competitive linkage candidate. Consider it a similar situation to EDP.

GWU, on the other hand, is a significantly different situation. I believe the entering stats necessary in the program for all linkage schools is 3.5 and a 9 on each section on the MCAT, which would make what you need significantly lower then their average for matriculants.
 
Well, medical school math requirements break down as follows:
  • No college math required (many, perhaps most schools)
  • One semester of unspecified college math required (a few schools)
  • One semester of calc required (a few schools)
  • One semester of calc and one of stats required (a couple of schools)
  • A year of calc required (a couple of schools)
So yeah, for maximum flexibility, you might want to take a semester of calc IF and ONLY IF you think that you'll do well in it. I had one semester of calc in college, and for those couple of schools I applied to that require another semester, I've just indicated that I'll complete integral calc over this coming summer if need be.

I don't believe that any of the Goucher link schools require calculus, for what it's worth. Many, many good schools have no math requirement at all.

Thanks for the info. I think I will take calc, but I'm just trying to decide whether or not to do it next semester (so that it will be on my transcript by the time I apply to post bacs) or in the fall semester (I could probably just indicate that I'm currently taking it on my application).
 
Hello,
I was wondering if anyone knew what percentage of people that Goucher interviews actually get in? Just for personal interest. Thanks!
 
Hey Globalhealth!

I'm not sure about the percentages who interview and get in. But I was told recently by one of our program staff that there are approximately 300-400 applications each year for approximately 30 spots (we have 28 in our program this year).

Let me know if you have any more questions.
 
I'm almost certain I want to apply for the Goucher program, but I need a couple of months still to pull together all of my application materials. Is there any disadvantage to waiting until, say, late December or early January to submit the application? It seems that the deadline is in February, but with such a small class and competitive applicant pool, I wonder to what extent the program holds spaces open for later applicants.

Also, I know this is an annoying question, but what are the average SAT/GRE scores for the program? I think I've got a competitive GPA, but my SAT scores (790 verbal / 660 math) are old, and that math is really so-so. Maybe submit a GRE instead?
 
Ishiguro,

There are definitely advantages to applying early because typically (from what I was told) more people apply later in the application cycle. I, for instance, applied right around the time that the process began, and was interviewed and accepted before Thanksgiving. That being said, there were a couple people in my program this year who applied early and were put on hold and then interviewed later in the cycle. And we also had people who applied very late in the cycle and were accepted as well. I guess what I would recommend is work on putting together the best application that you can because you really only get one shot at it.

One thing that Goucher really tries to do is give itself time for applicants that do apply later (which is part of the reason that many good applicants are put on hold). So don't feel that applying later in the cycle will have such a bad effect on your application.

As far as your SAT score goes, I think that's very competitive. They're not looking for one certain score, but they definitely want to see something semi-competitive. With your score, as long as your GPA is decent, you have good activities, and your essay is convincing, you'd stand a good chance.

Let me know if you have any other questions about the program. I'd be happy to answer them!

I'm almost certain I want to apply for the Goucher program, but I need a couple of months still to pull together all of my application materials. Is there any disadvantage to waiting until, say, late December or early January to submit the application? It seems that the deadline is in February, but with such a small class and competitive applicant pool, I wonder to what extent the program holds spaces open for later applicants.

Also, I know this is an annoying question, but what are the average SAT/GRE scores for the program? I think I've got a competitive GPA, but my SAT scores (790 verbal / 660 math) are old, and that math is really so-so. Maybe submit a GRE instead?
 
Runner,

That's reassuring and helpful. If I don't need to prepare for the GRE now (I think my scores are about to expire, but I'm currently in grad school and have other things to concentrate on), I can submit the SAT and apply earlier. Maybe I'll redo the GRE in the winter if I get placed on hold. I'll focus my efforts on trying to articulate exactly how my work and volunteer experience, which has been sort of at the edge of medicine and public health for years, has led me to this decision. Ah, statements of purpose.
 
i agree with everything runner1323 said, but just to emphasize--goucher understands that there are lots of great applicants who may get their apps in later in the game, so they tend to set aside some spots till around spring. i would recommend getting your stuff in early if possible, but there's no huge rush if you feel that waiting till december/january would make you a stronger candidate. i sent in my app in the middle of february. ultimately, if in doubt, don't hesitate to call the office. betsy is really nice and she'd be glad to address any concerns you may have.
 
bumping this thread since it seems we're hitting high tide in the postbac application season
 
Bumping this hoping somebody can answer my questions since its now a few years later and i cant seem to find anything that updated....what are the average gpas and sat scores that are competitive for this program?
 
Anyone know what the stats are of people who want to link from Goucher's postbac program to various programs?
 
I am very worried about my SAT scores and getting accepted. Do you know how heavily weighted that is in admission decisions?
My GPA is a 3.9 but my high school sat was average
 
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