**Help with editing a GPR program list in East NJ and NYC (Bronx/Brooklyn)**

[dds2013]

Hello everyone,

I’ve spend the last 2 weekends looking at GPR programs in NJ and NY; it’s time for me to finalize my list and start working on my PASS app. I basically started by making a large Microsoft Word document with all the programs in NJ and NY (62 programs total). I then started eliminating programs based on multiple factors: location, evaluation of the program by SDN members, and by reading the program descriptions on their websites. After looking at these factors, I dropped the number of programs from 62 to 14. My goal is to apply to no more than approximately 8 programs. However, the key is to apply to the right programs that suit me. When I applied to dental school exactly 4 years ago, I did this same exact process. I selected the programs I applied by process of elimination; and then, when I couldn’t eliminate any more programs, I went to SDN for assistance. Here I am now, 4 years later, asking for the same request: help me select the right programs for me. So I’ve tried to learn as much as I can about the programs below, but not a lot of recent info is available. So, if you know or heard absolutely anything about the programs below, please comment and let me know. Also, please give me all the advice you can; any information is good information. Thanks in advance!

A little bit about me:
- Who am I: 4th year dental student
- What I want to be: “well rounded general dentist” in private practice, and attend at a school or hospital 1 or 2 days a week
- Where I plan on living during residency: East New Jersey (Passaic County area)
- Cumulative GPA: 3.40
- Rank: Average (middle of my class)
- NBDE part 1: Not great (low 80s)
- Why am I interested in only NJ and NY: 1) My family is in NJ/NY; I’m a big family person, so I want to stay close. 2) I like the area, but to be honest, I like NJ more than NY because I hate traffic. 3) NJ/NY have a huge number of GPR programs, so my chances of getting in might be a little more higher than at other locations in the country
- Areas of dentistry that I don’t enjoy too much: Oral Surgery (I enjoy extractions, I just don’t enjoy wisdom teeth surgical extractions)
- Areas of dentistry that I don’t know if I like or not yet (due to little clinic exposure): Ortho
- Areas of dentistry that I love: Implants, Crown and bridge, Endo, Surgical Perio (CL, GTR/GBR, etc)
- My dream GPR program: one that is well rounded in all areas of dentistry (a little bit of everything). I do not want to go to a program that is strictly Oral Surgery based.

FYI: the only AEGD program I’m interested in is Lutheran NY. If you know anything about that program, please let me know.


12-month AEGD program in NY
1) Lutheran Medical Center - Metropolitan, NY
- ?? positions available
- They have a lot of positions available
- 60 minute drive (traffic in Brooklyn is variable)
- You end up getting assigned to different sites in NYC (you can rank your preferences); your experience will depend on where you end up getting assigned.


12-month GPR programs in NJ
1) St. Joseph's Regional Medical Center
- 4-6 positions available
- 10 minute drive
- My NYU friend: Surgical based, at interview a resident said they do 80 RCTs, which is awesome
- They had 3 post-match positions available in 2012

2) Morristown Memorial Hospital
- 4 positions available
- 30 minute drive (right off of interstate highway)
- My NYU friend’s classmate goes there, and he said it’s a good program
- You’re on call every 4th week

3) Overlook Hospital
- ?? positions available
- 40 minute drive (its slightly past Newark Airport)
- Morristown and Overlook are both owned by the same parent company

4) Jersey City Medical Center
- 4 positions available
- 40 minute drive (right by Newark airport)

5) Newark Beth Israel Medical Center
- ?? positions available
- 30 minute drive (its right next to Newark Airport)
- My NYU friend’s co-resident went to the interview, and she didn’t like it because the residents that were there said there isn’t enough work for all the residents.
- Website: “There are no specialty training programs at the Beth, so our GPR’s do ALL of the Oral & Maxillofacial Surgery and ALL of the Operating Room General Dentistry treatment procedures.”
- It’s part of the Barnabas Health System, which also owns St. Barnabas in Bronx


12-month GPR programs in NY
1) The Mount Sinai Hospital
- 9 positions available
- 30 minute drive (traffic in Manhattan is variable)
- My NYU friend talked to a resident, she said it’s decent. NYU students who did OS rotation there said it was very busy
- SDN: It’s a good program

2) Montefiore Medical Center/Albert Einstein College of Medicine
- 36 positions available
- 30-45 minute drive (traffic through Bronx is variable)
- Multiple sites; your clinical experience will depend on which site you get assigned
- Around 20 students from NYU go there every year
- Youre on-call every 12th night (5 nights per month)
- They had 29 post-match openings

3) St. Barnabas Hospital
- 20 positions available
- 30-60 minute drive (traffic through Bronx is variable)
- My NYU friend’s colleague say it’s a good program
- Their website states some really nice stuff about the program
- They had 5 post-match openings

4) Bronx Lebanon Hospital Center
- 27 positions available
- 30 minute drive
- 5 different sites other than the hospital. Experience based on luck of site you get assigned to
- You don’t place any implants.
- You’re on call for 6 months and the other 6 months you’re not.
- Program is funded by HIV grant; you have to see a lot of HIV patients. It is a very busy program, a lot of dentistry. The clinics are not that organized (but hey, most aren’t)
- They had 13 post-match openings

5) Jacobi Medical Center
- 8 positions available
- 45-60 minute drive (traffic in Bronx is variable)
- My NYU friend said the NYU students rotating there did absolutely nothing because there’s not enough work to support all the NYU students in addition to the residents. He doesn’t know how it is for the GPR residents
- SDN: a guy said you do a lot of work for the OS residents
- Website: “Youre on-call every 7th night”

6) Lutheran Medical Center - LICH Campus
- 12 positions available
- 45-90 minute drive (traffic in Brooklyn is variable)
- SDN: Heavy on OS
- My NYU friend had a classmate who went there; she said she liked 1st year, and decided to do a 2nd year for implant placement because you don’t get to place any your first year
- They had 2 post-match openings
- SDN: “Lutheran (I don’t know if they meant LICH or LMC) is big on OS!”

7) Lutheran Medical Center - LMC Campus
- 10 positions available
- 45-90 minute drive (traffic in Brooklyn is variable)
- They had 2 post-match positions available
- SDN: “Lutheran (I don’t know if they meant LICH or LMC) is big on OS!”

8) Woodhull Medical and Mental Health Center
- 15 positions available
- 45-60 minute drive (traffic in Brooklyn is variable)
- My NYU friend said area is bad, but it’s a busy program. One of his friends is there, and he is happy for with the program.
- SDN: Terrible facilities, very low patient pool, inadequate attendings, not much clinical experience (2002 post)
- Website: “Residents are on-call 3-5 nights per month”
- They had 8 post-match openings

9) Kings County Hospital Center
- 9 positions available
- 60-100 minute drive (traffic in Brooklyn is variable)
- Website: GP residents place 75-100 fixtures; 75/9 residents = 8 implants per resident!!!

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[Vapor1122]

What I can tell you about Woodhull since I'll be going there this July:
- It's up to 22 positions now, but there aren't as many chairs. Supposedly this isn't a problem after the first month when rotations start and not every GPR resident is there.
- Area looks ghetto, but the J train literally drops you off at the front entrance so I don't expect that to be a problem. If you'll be driving, your experience may be different. Still, the area doesn't look as bad as say, Brownsville. Poke around Google street view and get an idea.
- From what I saw of the facilities, they don't look terrible. The furnishings and color schemes aren't the latest, but they're passable. No idea how things will be with regard to things being broken, etc., but I should have a better idea in a month or so.
- The patient pool is low? All the times I went there, the waiting area was standing room only, with people spilling out into the hallway. I can't imagine everyone there was just waiting on a family member...
- Clinical experience: everyone tells me you'll do a tremendous amount of endo and extractions at WMC. Again, hearsay, but the story has been consistent.
- Call is in-house and my buddy there says it's only 1-2 times/month.

As for the other programs:
- Jacobi has really nice facilities. I did my OS rotation there, and actually did get to do a fair amount of extractions, so I think you'll hear different stories depending on who you ask. Not that that's very relevant to a GPR.
- LICH, apparently, is in a state of flux and undergoing a lot of changes. I heard this from a guy who's there now. I don't know anything beyond that, but you'll probably want to have especially current information about that place when making your decisions.

Good luck!

 

[dds2013]

Thank you Vapor! I'm going to give Woodhull a closer look now with that input.

 

[setdoc7]

Jacobi has dropped the NYU students because there is not enough room for them and the short rotation does not allow them to acclimate to the system. What I can tell you it offers the GPRs:
restoration of plenty of implants
crown and bridge
removable
unlimited patient pool
endo, both traditional and rotary
surgical perio
pedo
strong training in dento alveolar surgery
Call is real, as Jacobi is a level 1 trauma center and sees lots of trauma, so there is plenty of interaction with the OMFS residents. That's what a hospital experience is about. There is a large attending staff that is salaried and show up all the time. Check out other hospitals that have all voluntary staffs and see if there is always proper attending coverage.
Salary is one of the highest is the city. Facility brand new, all digital. 8 spots that match on match day, no post match for the last 6 years of a program which is only seven years old. OMFS, Pedo, Dental Anesthsiology programs associated with GPR are all top contenders. This program is not for everyone. You will be tested on your ability to be both a dentist and a hospital dentist, two very different things. Residents graduate with a broad knowledge of dentistry and are prepared to enter the workforce, which is the primary goal of the program.

 

[dds2013]

Thank you setdoc. The reason why i kept Jacobi is because i never heard anything negative about it on SDN. I knew for a fact that the experience of pre-docs doing rotation there is going to be drastically different than the residents. And i really like the fact that it has OMFS, pedo and anesthesia programs, because the residents can learn a lot from them as well.

 

[Streetwolf]

Newark Beth Israel has 12 resident positions.

It's tricky to get new cases as of maybe 2 years ago but they do exist if you make an effort. If you have a good roster then you should be able to do a little bit of everything.

I'm working on 5 or 6 ortho cases. I've started 1 of them and finished 1 of them... maybe a 2nd in a week.
I've done endo on almost 15 teeth this year (all kinds, rotary + warm vertical). If you show interest in it you could eventually do a re-treat or apico with the attendings.
Cemented 20-25 crowns.
Cemented 3-4 bridges (3-4 units each).
Done 7 perio surgeries (goal is 8... I'll be just short... no big deal) + multiple quads ScRP.
Delivered about 15 arches RPD and about 5 arches CD (varies from resident to resident).
Extracted 200+ teeth, both simple and complex (probably ~70 complex). If you do enough and show interest in it you could do impacted 3rds with the attendings and also closed reductions (open in the OR).
Seen a lot of kids. Done maybe 5-10 pulpotomies / SSC (did about the same in dental school so I wasn't looking to do a lot more) + maybe 20 restorations on kids. Nitrous oxide too.
Plenty of restorative.
Few OR cases.
Plenty of emergency triaging and hospital consults.
On call every 12th night on average (can go home at night and be called in from there).

Wonderful faculty. Very rarely is there no one in the clinic to help out if needed.

We aren't able to take on any patient we want like in the past but if you keep your eyes open for a good case you should be able to keep your roster pretty full.

 

[dds2013]

Thank you streetwolf!!! I was a tiny bit worried when i saw that NBI said "we have no OS residency, so our residents do everything." I was worried because i didnt want to get stuck with doing extractions for all the hospital emergencies that come in. I am definitely going to apply now that i know there is a little bit of everything. Thank you!!

 

[dds2013]

Does anyone have ANY info regarding the GPR programs at Lutheran (LMC and LICH), Mount Sinai, Morristown/Overlook, and Jersey City?

 

[Streetwolf]

Thank you streetwolf!!! I was a tiny bit worried when i saw that NBI said "we have no OS residency, so our residents do everything." I was worried because i didnt want to get stuck with doing extractions for all the hospital emergencies that come in. I am definitely going to apply now that i know there is a little bit of everything. Thank you!!

Very very very rarely do you take out teeth during night call. I think the only exceptions would be if either the patient needs to have open heart surgery like ASAP and they absolutely need a tooth out beforehand (and clinic is closed) or if a tooth is so loose it is at risk for aspiration. Otherwise they can get pain killers / antibiotics and come back during the next clinic session.

Multiple times during the year you will have oral surgery rotation for a full week. Depending on where you are in the list it will either be 4 weeks or 5 weeks (12 residents with 52 weeks). This is mostly for extractions (non-impactions).

 

[nyc4lyfe]

bump anyone want to update this thread with more info regarding NYC GPRs.