Highly Restricted Study Abroad Option, Problem?

[derpie_sk8r_boy]

Good afternoon, sunshines.

Here's the scene:

I will be going to a Chicago University College**. And, it only offers study abroad programs in Oxford. There are not any other study abroad options, just at Oxford Uni***.

Now, I'm all down and good with studying abroad, especially at Ox. I'd probs takes tutorials related to medicine, etc. and get involved in medical research at Ox, wherever possible; and a whole bunch of extra-curricular stuff.

But, what I'm wondering is will med schools look at this as something negative? I've noticed that most pre-med students complete study abroad programs in under developed or developing nations; i.e.: Sudan or Argentina. I wont have that option, Ox only.

... ... ...

FOOT NOTES:
**I will neither disclose the uni nor the constituent college I'll be going to, in Chicago, because I feel like I'll be found out. >.< PM me, and I'll tell you. I'll give you a clue; it's in Bronzeville, Northern part of the South side.

***Most of the students, from the uni college I'll be going to, seem to do their tutorials at Wadham College, Ox. I think it's because Wadham has a history of being very liberal, and my uni coll has some strong partisans of liberalism, but not very many.

Further Notes/Thoughts:

-Financing my education wont be a problem, I got a full-tuition scholarship. Also, I'm a very disciplined individual and have a good work ethic. So, I could easily pull a full time job on weekends (12/16 hour shifts) to pay off other stuff, like room and board.

-For Med School, I'm leaning towards the following schools (in order of preference):
1. MD/PhD program at the Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences
2. MD/PhD program at the University of Vermont, College of Medicine
3. MD/PhD program at the University of Colorado - Denver/Aurora, Anschutz Medical Campus & Hospital Complex
4. MD program at the University of Chicago, Pritzker School of Medicine (on HPSP scholarship, hopefully)
5. MD/PhD program at the University of Washington - Seattle
6. MD/PhD program at the Oregon Health & Science University

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[Ismet]

Do it. It will be a good experience.

Also, there's a difference between "study abroad" and "mission trips." Some people travel to developing nations and do mission trips, volunteer, etc. The main part of studying abroad is the education and experiencing a different culture. There are underserved people in every country, even the US and the UK, so if that's something you're passionate about, you can still volunteer over there.

 

[LizzyM]

I see hundreds of students who studied at Oxford and in Ireland, Australia, Spain, France and Italy just to name a few. No big deal. Just be sure you understand the grading system and the teaching methods which are different from our own. I have seem some students take a GPA hit when courses taken at Oxford are factored. in.

 

[seeinghowitgoes]

Good afternoon, sunshines.

Here's the scene:

I will be going to a Chicago University College**. And, it only offers study abroad programs in Oxford. There are not any other study abroad options, just at Oxford Uni***.

Now, I'm all down and good with studying abroad, especially at Ox. I'd probs takes tutorials related to medicine, etc. and get involved in medical research at Ox, wherever possible; and a whole bunch of extra-curricular stuff.

But, what I'm wondering is will med schools look at this as something negative? I've noticed that most pre-med students complete study abroad programs in under developed or developing nations; i.e.: Sudan or Argentina. I wont have that option, Ox only.

... ... ...

FOOT NOTES:
**I will neither disclose the uni nor the constituent college I'll be going to, in Chicago, because I feel like I'll be found out. >.< PM me, and I'll tell you. I'll give you a clue; it's in Bronzeville, Northern part of the South side.

***Most of the students, from the uni college I'll be going to, seem to do their tutorials at Wadham College, Ox. I think it's because Wadham has a history of being very liberal, and my uni coll has some strong partisans of liberalism, but not very many.

Further Notes/Thoughts:

-Financing my education wont be a problem, I got a full-tuition scholarship. Also, I'm a very disciplined individual and have a good work ethic. So, I could easily pull a full time job on weekends (12/16 hour shifts) on weekends to pay off other stuff, like room and board.

-For Med School, I'm leaning towards the following schools (in order of preference):
1. MD/PhD program at the Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences
2. MD/PhD program at the University of Vermont, College of Medicine (on HPSP scholarship, hopefully)
3. MD/PhD program at the University of Colorado - Denver/Aurora, Anschutz Medical Campus & Hospital Complex (on HPSP scholarship, hopefully)
4. MD program at the University of Chicago, Pritzker School of Medicine (on HPSP scholarship, hopefully)
5. MD/PhD program at the University of Washington - Seattle (on HPSP scholarship, hopefully)
6. MD/PhD program at the Oregon Health & Science University (on HPSP scholarship, hopefully)

Can't imagine it will be looked down upon, and getting to see the UK health system up close can be quite eye-opening (for better and worse). Plus, you'll be getting exposure to being immersed in another culture just like you would if you lived somewhere else (trust me, just because they speak english doesn't make it the same as the good ol' us of a).

One word of caution - the British system is really different, and undergrads just popping in and doing research can be more difficult to start. It's a delicate game, because you don't want to be the overly enthusiastic Amefican, but at the same time if you don't take the initiative it will probably never happen. Just something to think about as you prepare to make the most of your time abroad!

 

[derpie_sk8r_boy]

Do it. It will be a good experience.

Of course!

Also, there's a difference between "study abroad" and "mission trips." Some people travel to developing nations and do mission trips, volunteer, etc. The main part of studying abroad is the education and experiencing a different culture.

Ooooh. Okay.

There are underserved people in every country, even the US and the UK, so if that's something you're passionate about, you can still volunteer over there.

Due to the financial austerity measures and increase in poverty across the UK, especially in bleak Northern England, there are a lot of people who are, so called, "undeserved." So, I'll keep that in mind. Thanks, Ismet! I mean...I see them all the time here, too, in CO. But, uberthanks, again. :3

 

[seeinghowitgoes]

I see hundreds of students who studied at Oxford and in Ireland, Australia, Spain, France and Italy just to name a few. No big deal. Just be sure you understand the grading system and the teaching methods which are different from our own. I have seem some students take a GPA hit when courses taken at Oxford are factored. in.

Seconding this and relating it back to what I mentioned about how different things are in higher ed between the two countries. Often less rigorous classes with the responsibility on the student to learn on his/her own time, one test/essay determines whole grade, grading system only goes up to ~75-80 for all intents and purposes (which you'll need to explain to adcoms without an understanding of the difference), the list could go on...

That being said, different doesn't necessarily mean bad - new perspectives and exposures may have a profound effect in you/your view of how health topics should be approached.

 

[derpie_sk8r_boy]

Can't imagine it will be looked down upon, and getting to see the UK health system up close can be quite eye-opening (for better and worse).

The NHS is purrty interesting.

Plus, you'll be getting exposure to being immersed in another culture just like you would if you lived somewhere else (trust me, just because they speak english doesn't make it the same as the good ol' us of a).

What are you talking about? Of course it means we're all the same!! (LOL jk) I've heard British food isn't the best...but I'm not too worried about that, I guess. >.<

One word of caution - the British system is really different, and undergrads just popping in and doing research can be more difficult to start. It's a delicate game, because you don't want to be the overly enthusiastic Amefican, but at the same time if you don't take the initiative it will probably never happen. Just something to think about as you prepare to make the most of your time abroad!

Ooooh...more wisdom/knowledge/info on this puhlease! >.<

 

[derpie_sk8r_boy]

I see hundreds of students who studied at Oxford and in Ireland, Australia, Spain, France and Italy just to name a few. No big deal. Just be sure you understand the grading system and the teaching methods which are different from our own. I have seem some students take a GPA hit when courses taken at Oxford are factored. in.

Advice on avoiding this, pwease?

 

[Catalystik]

Mentioning Bronzeville is a pretty strong clue. I used to live in Prairie Shores.

You might be interested in reviewing some information about what makes for a strong MD/PhD candidate:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=539268
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=64282

 

[seeinghowitgoes]

The NHS is purrty interesting.



What are you talking about? Of course it means we're all the same!! (LOL jk) I've heard British food isn't the best...but I'm not too worried about that, I guess. >.<



Ooooh...more wisdom/knowledge/info on this puhlease! >.<

British food is not good (mayo and ketchup on everything...), but there really are great kebabs and Indian. Also, I feel like it's a stereotype that there is really good beer here - it's much weaker than it is in the US, and while fine, general consensus amongst my friends is it has nothing on a good US microbrew

As for some differences in higher ed, I tried to list some of them in my other post. It's just much less hand-holding; most things are left up to the student. As such, a student that is pestering a professor (note professors in the UK are different that professors in the US - professors are the big wigs and most others would be called lecturers or something like that) can be a bit of a turn off because professors expect, especially for people only there temporarily, that the student is going to learn on his/her own and not really involve the prof too much. That being said, if you don't make the effort to get involved (like be persistent about networking) you can see how you might never even speak to a professor in your time at the uni. It can be done, don't get me wrong, and the NHS is strapped for cash, so if you'll work for free they may be happy to provide you projects, but it isn't always as institutionalized a process.

Just to reiterate, these differences aren't necessarily ba things. I think a student that uses his/her time to understand how historical and cultural differences led to the rise of a very different health system and beliefs about health (again, some parts better and some parts worse than our own) may be able to take more back to the US than the person going on those short term medical "mission trips," etc

 

[derpie_sk8r_boy]

Seconding this and relating it back to what I mentioned about how different things are in higher ed between the two countries.

Hmmmmm.... ( http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_GC-ssBUjTkc/TKLCKIS-IpI/AAAAAAAAAOc/gM1xfIaVeuE/s1600/thinking+statue.jpg )

Often less rigorous classes with the responsibility on the student to learn on his/her own time, one test/essay determines whole grade.

About that...

The constituent college I'm going to matriculate into, all of its courses are discussion/seminar based (no lectures/tests), with class enrollment capped at 12 students max. I'll be taking all of my liberal arts courses there, some scientific philosophy/history courses. Its program is already very rigorous. Tons of essay, thesis projects, oral examination-inquisitions...etc. My favorite part is the culminating senior thesis done during the last year of attending the college, which always tends to be on the level of Masters-Degree theses, I've been told

Average pages read per night, I've heard, is around the upper 200s/lower 300s. Add on top of that I'll have to be ready to inquire/debate/discuss/proof Newton's Principia and Plato's theory of Justice the next day to my fullest potential.

At the university that the college is based off of, I'll take the general pre-med courses. These would be the stereotypical 100-people degree mill lectures [derpie_sk8r_boyp pukes]; with labs, no doubt!

Basically, the high-caliber intellectual liberal arts courses at my constituent college; and the pre-med course tranche of courses at the uni.

@.@

I mean, academically, my development as a critical thinker, a writer....etc.; I think I'll be ready for Oxford. My admissions counselor has told me that they don't let people who aren't ready go to Ox.

But, it's still enough for me to be nervous about going to Ox...thinking I wont be ready.

 

[derpie_sk8r_boy]

Mentioning Bronzeville is a pretty strong clue. I used to live in Prairie Shores.

Shhhhh. >.< lol

You're very close to combustion and being on fire, there. You probs already know the university being referred to. >.< I hope you don't find out the constituent college. ~crosses_fingers~

You might be interested in reviewing some information about what makes for a strong MD/PhD candidate:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=539268
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=64282

Oooooooooooooh.

Thank! :3

 

[derpie_sk8r_boy]

British food is not good (mayo and ketchup on everything...), but there really are great kebabs and Indian. Also, I feel like it's a stereotype that there is really good beer here - it's much weaker than it is in the US, and while fine, general consensus amongst my friends is it has nothing on a good US microbrew

LOL <3 <3

And...lol.... truuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

Indian food is da'bomb. I've been considering staying with an Indian family, if I end up studying abroad over there. I've heard that Indian people are known for their hospitality and welcoming guests to stay in their homes. But, that remains to be seeeeeeeeeeeeeeen....

As for some differences in higher ed, I tried to list some of them in my other post. It's just much less hand-holding; most things are left up to the student. As such, a student that is pestering a professor (note professors in the UK are different that professors in the US - professors are the big wigs and most others would be called lecturers or something like that) can be a bit of a turn off because professors expect, especially for people only there temporarily, that the student is going to learn on his/her own and not really involve the prof too much. That being said, if you don't make the effort to get involved (like be persistent about networking) you can see how you might never even speak to a professor in your time at the uni. It can be done, don't get me wrong

Aw mayn. Bummer, pestering the proff is what I'm known for....but I'm pretty good at doing it all on my own, after all.

Networking/persistent involvement is not a problem at all, for me....I get depressed if I don't socialize enough with people, so I try to do it as much as I can.

, and the NHS is strapped for cash, so if you'll work for free they may be happy to provide you projects, but it isn't always as institutionalized a process.

Cool. I'll keep this in mind. I really hope the situation with the NHS doesn't get worse for Brits who largely depend on it.

 

[seeinghowitgoes]

But, it's still enough for me to be nervous about going to Ox...thinking I wont be ready.

I can only speak to my experience and provide a bit of hearsay from my friends, but as long as you make the effort (like I've mentioned) and adapt to a different grading scheme, I don't think you have anything to worry about but a ton to gain from being in a place like the UK.

Good luck and have fun! Be sure to get out of Oxford - London is London, the peak district up north is beautiful, Liverpool is crazy at night, and there are some great medically-related sites around the country (for example, where they used to quarantine people during the black plague, etc) so you can get your public health nerd on

 

[Chipster.]

Good afternoon, sunshines.

Here's the scene:

I will be going to a Chicago University College**. And, it only offers study abroad programs in Oxford. There are not any other study abroad options, just at Oxford Uni***.

Now, I'm all down and good with studying abroad, especially at Ox. I'd probs takes tutorials related to medicine, etc. and get involved in medical research at Ox, wherever possible; and a whole bunch of extra-curricular stuff.

But, what I'm wondering is will med schools look at this as something negative? I've noticed that most pre-med students complete study abroad programs in under developed or developing nations; i.e.: Sudan or Argentina. I wont have that option, Ox only.

... ... ...

FOOT NOTES:
**I will neither disclose the uni nor the constituent college I'll be going to, in Chicago, because I feel like I'll be found out. >.< PM me, and I'll tell you. I'll give you a clue; it's in Bronzeville, Northern part of the South side.

***Most of the students, from the uni college I'll be going to, seem to do their tutorials at Wadham College, Ox. I think it's because Wadham has a history of being very liberal, and my uni coll has some strong partisans of liberalism, but not very many.

Further Notes/Thoughts:

-Financing my education wont be a problem, I got a full-tuition scholarship. Also, I'm a very disciplined individual and have a good work ethic. So, I could easily pull a full time job on weekends (12/16 hour shifts) to pay off other stuff, like room and board.

-For Med School, I'm leaning towards the following schools (in order of preference):
1. MD/PhD program at the Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences
2. MD/PhD program at the University of Vermont, College of Medicine (on HPSP scholarship, hopefully)
3. MD/PhD program at the University of Colorado - Denver/Aurora, Anschutz Medical Campus & Hospital Complex (on HPSP scholarship, hopefully)
4. MD program at the University of Chicago, Pritzker School of Medicine (on HPSP scholarship, hopefully)
5. MD/PhD program at the University of Washington - Seattle (on HPSP scholarship, hopefully)
6. MD/PhD program at the Oregon Health & Science University (on HPSP scholarship, hopefully)

Just a question...why would you need an HPSP scholarship if you're in an MD/PhD program?

 

[derpie_sk8r_boy]

Just a question...why would you need an HPSP scholarship if you're in an MD/PhD program?

That's a good point. :3

Chipster, I'm new to this whole HPSP/MD-PhD/med school/<insert dilemma here> thing. When I was initially composing this post, I was not aware that an HPSP scholarship wouldn't be required on an MD/PhD program. :3

Thanks for noticing this and questioning it, though.

Me will edit that out now.

 

[LizzyM]

If you want to do a MD/PhD, then the highest priorities have to be:
GPA
MCAT
Research, ideally including funding for yourself (e.g. a grant to cover your summer stipend), presentation and publication.

distant on the priority list:
Some exposure to health care delivery (volunteering or shadowing)
service to your community (to show that you care about people)
something you do for fun -- ideally with other people.
leadership (which can come into play in your service or recreational activities)

I'm trying to figure out what it is about the schools you've listed that would make them desirable places to do a PhD. Keep in mind that schools will be sizing you up to determine if your interests and skills will be a good fit with a lab at their school. Your PhD will be under the supervision of a specific investigator at a specific lab and while you'll get to try out a bunch of labs during your first 2 years of med school (and often the summer before & after the first year of medical school), showing before you are even admitted that you are a good fit with some of the research endeavors at that school is a good approach to take.

If you are going to go abroad for a semester, you will lose valuable research time in the States. If you can get into a lab at Oxford, then you may be able to make up for that lost time but that may be easier said than done. You might ask at your US school if prior students have done so. Keep in mind, too, that a post-doc fellowship in England or Paris is also a possibility for a MD/PhD so don't feel as if you have to do this in college or never.

 

[SouthernSurgeon]

British food is not good (mayo and ketchup on everything...), but there really are great kebabs and Indian. Also, I feel like it's a stereotype that there is really good beer here - it's much weaker than it is in the US, and while fine, general consensus amongst my friends is it has nothing on a good US microbrew

"British" food is not good. Food in Britain is quite good.

The beer there is quite good and there are a number of "younger" brewers (Hopback, e.g.) making some really good stuff outside of the traditional ESBs/Bitters. The brits just don't feel the need to choke you with hops the way most american micro-brews are currently doing. They also serve almost all cask-conditioned beers instead of the kegged beer you get in the US - which means fresher beer, a better flavor, and slightly less carbonation - and despite the reputation they don't serve it "warm" but rather at an appropriate temperature.

 

[seeinghowitgoes]

"British" food is not good. Food in Britain is quite good.

The beer there is quite good and there are a number of "younger" brewers (Hopback, e.g.) making some really good stuff outside of the traditional ESBs/Bitters. The brits just don't feel the need to choke you with hops the way most american micro-brews are currently doing. They also serve almost all cask-conditioned beers instead of the kegged beer you get in the US - which means fresher beer, a better flavor, and slightly less carbonation - and despite the reputation they don't serve it "warm" but rather at an appropriate temperature.

To each their own concerning the beer - I've found that at a pub I'll often prefer european imports to the cask-conditioned varieties they highlight (or on the rare occasion, a non-budweiser level US beer). Of course it's hyperbolic to say good beer doesn't exist here; I've absolutely found a couple breweries right around where I am that I quite like, and I've enjoyed the temp difference (which, as you point out, is actually probably more appropriate than what we're used to in the states).

As for food, agreed. I've eaten more good indian, chinese, and turkish food than I ever did in the states, but other than the occasion Sunday roast, I haven't fallen in love with the "traditional" cuisine haha

On the other hand, and the public health person in me is dying for admitting it, but I'll never get used to no free refills on soda or how expensive the stuff is when eating out in Europe in general (over 10 euro for a diet coke in a Parisian cafe was the most I've spent when I just had to get my fix…)

 

[derpie_sk8r_boy]

If you want to do a MD/PhD, then the highest priorities have to be:
GPA
MCAT
Research, ideally including funding for yourself (e.g. a grant to cover your summer stipend), presentation and publication.

On it! I will certainly begin holding these as prime priorities above everything else, when I start undergad.

distant on the priority list:
Some exposure to health care delivery (volunteering or shadowing)
service to your community (to show that you care about people)
something you do for fun -- ideally with other people.
leadership (which can come into play in your service or recreational activities)

Trust me...those will develop really well on their own, not too much to worry about that.

I'm trying to figure out what it is about the schools you've listed that would make them desirable places to do a PhD.

I'm still a kid-o in high school.

Haha.

So, these are all just speculated plans, not things set in stone. And, I'm new to all of this SDN/med school/talk. And, from my past/recent brief research, I've become interested in going to these schools for a PhD. Of course, this does mean, I will admit, that I'm not too familiar with the PhD programs offered at these schools. But, I still have all of undergrad to figure that out.

1. MD/PhD program at the Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences
2. MD/PhD program at the University of Vermont, College of Medicine
3. MD/PhD program at the University of Colorado - Denver/Aurora, Anschutz Medical Campus & Hospital Complex

These three.

I've always been interested in a career in the military. Now, one which would include being a physician and a researcher would be so cool.

Vermont is where I will definitely live in the future; LOL That's why I listed that one up there.

And, I currently work at a Children's Hospital, on the Anschuttz Medical Campus...etc. So, I'm familiar with what's going on there, the research labs etc. The new facilities and all are pretty awesome.

But, again...I'm just a teenager in high school putting these up for consideration. Nothing too serious.

If you are going to go abroad for a semester, you will lose valuable research time in the States. If you can get into a lab at Oxford, then you may be able to make up for that lost time but that may be easier said than done. You might ask at your US school if prior students have done so. Keep in mind, too, that a post-doc fellowship in England or Paris is also a possibility for a MD/PhD so don't feel as if you have to do this in college or never.

Deff will get on it, ASAP.

 

[kyamh]

I went abroad for a semester and studied in London. Best decision I made in college! I was fortunate, however, to have a research contact lined up and so could continue my work abroad. If you are considering going for a whole year, you need to think hard about your research goals. PM me if you would like to chat more, I had a very long path to deciding what to do with my future and I would love to hear your thoughts so far...and perhaps share a few things I learned along the way

 

[Ismet]

Moving to hSDN, as OP is in high school

 

[LizzyM]

Take it one step at a time. It would not hurt to buy the MSAR (Medical School Admissions Requirements) a book and online resource published by the American Association of Medical Colleges (AAMC).
Over time you will figure out if you want to be a physician, a researcher, a member of the military or some combination. Doing well in school and on the MCAT will serve you well regardless of what you choose to do.

 

[derpie_sk8r_boy]

Moving to hSDN, as OP is in high school

Thank you for your correction. :3

 

[derpie_sk8r_boy]

Take it one step at a time. It would not hurt to buy the MSAR (Medical School Admissions Requirements) a book and online resource published by the American Association of Medical Colleges (AAMC).
Over time you will figure out if you want to be a physician, a researcher, a member of the military or some combination. Doing well in school and on the MCAT will serve you well regardless of what you choose to do.

Why not a great leap forward? lol jk

Thanks for your advice, Lizzy.