House supports offering residency positions to US med school grads first

[DocEspana]

Nowhere does that article say anything about guaranteed residency spots in NYC.

Here is the link to the program; http://www.citydoctors.com/ny/hhc/eligibility.php. They have to pay back their time as attending physicians. Says nothing about even doing residency in NYC. They are buying student slots. Much like DO schools are doing and pushing out MD schools and residents in some places.

Nowhere does that article say anything about guaranteed residency spots in NYC.

Here is the link to the program; http://www.citydoctors.com/ny/hhc/eligibility.php. They have to pay back their time as attending physicians. Says nothing about even doing residency in NYC. They are buying student slots. Much like DO schools are doing and pushing out MD schools and residents in some places.

I should add that while the website does indeed say attending spot, it's not what their contracts in 2012, 2013, and 2014 said. So either its a new change (the original contracts do include options for paying back as an attending, but they are a footnote of an option) or the website is over accentuating the less controversial route of fulfilling your duty.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[dozitgetchahi]

These 'foreign grads' pay the same taxes during residency (I think?) and when they stay and become citizens or skilled workers. And what about IMGs who chose Carib over DO? I hear you on debt but dont see how that justifies taking poorer domestic students over more competitive foreign ones. If anything, taking a FMG student who trained abroad spares us the cost of subsidizing their medical school aspects of training. Yes, if all docs defaulted on their loans the economy would be in trouble but I fail to see how the status quo, where we do take foreign grads w/o anticompetitive policies giving them the 'leftovers', has led to mass default.

And have them pay for residency!! How would we attract competitive applicants or even enough applicants. We've been profting off the brain drain of docs from foreign countries for decades inflating our workforce by a not insignificant amount. Why throw away all this talent by forcing them to pay for residency, if they like the leftover ones, so a few less competitive domestic students can get a position they wouldnt otherwise get. This is protectionist madness imo.

This 'protectionist madness' is the same thing that practically every other country in the world practices. Try to go to, say, Germany and become a physician. There are a bazillion hoops to jump through and it's clear that the intent is to discourage foreign applicants and imporve the chances of domestic ones. And it doesn't matter if you're god's gift to medicine.

By your reasoning, we should just shut down all US med schools and import every doctor from abroad because it's cheaper and they're 'better'. I'm not even going to get into why both parts of that reasoning are wrong. FMGs were let in originally because the AMA feared 'saturation' of the profession and campaigned against increasing medical school enrollments in the 1970s and 80s, leaving a large number of extra Medicare-funded residency slots that had to be filled somehow. If supply had been allowed to properly meet demand in that situation, we wouldn't even be taking about the whole 'FMG/IMG' story today.

In other words, educate yourself before you run your mouth.

 

[Kevin Baker]

This 'protectionist madness' is the same thing that practically every other country in the world practices. Try to go to, say, Germany and become a physician. There are a bazillion hoops to jump through and it's clear that the intent is to discourage foreign applicants and imporve the chances of domestic ones. And it doesn't matter if you're god's gift to medicine.

By your reasoning, we should just shut down all US med schools and import every doctor from abroad because it's cheaper and they're 'better'. I'm not even going to get into why both parts of that reasoning are wrong. FMGs were let in originally because the AMA feared 'saturation' of the profession and campaigned against increasing medical school enrollments in the 1970s and 80s, leaving a large number of extra Medicare-funded residency slots that had to be filled somehow. If supply had been allowed to properly meet demand in that situation, we wouldn't even be taking about the whole 'FMG/IMG' story today.

In other words, educate yourself before you run your mouth.

If all your friends jumped off a cliff would you follow? If all your friend's businesses discriminate against better qualified people does that mean you should? I say take that excess human capital and put it to use for yourself. Profit off the protectionist madness of others.

Thank you for the straw man though. Never did I say we should shut down all medical schools. Importing qualified FMGs is and should be a goal of the match. We are taking human capital from others and using it for ourselves. Sucks for other countries. Awesome for our system.

Related to the straw man, if you do take my argument to the extremes, and if we could fill the match entirely with qualified FMGs who don't rely on state or federal funding for their med school education we as patient advocates, tax payers, and as healthcare consumers should be all for it. Why prop up worse doctors and why pay for training that we don't need to?

As oligopolistic members of the medical cartel, we should be against importing docs. And we have been against it, as you state, with the AMA fear of saturation, limiting school expansion, and putting up hurdles for foreign trained grad licensure. If you're arguing about supply and demand, I agree there has been a restriction on the supply of American trained doctors, but regardless of domestic supply issues, why discriminate against better qualified applicants? The demand is there and the foreign supply is there for the taking, (to a degree, not to 100% of the match). We should be taking the best human capital and harnessing it, not taking the best 'Murican' human capital and complaining about immigrants and IMGs taking our jobs.

 

[DocEspana]

I like my protectionist madness

 

[GUH]

Related to the straw man, if you do take my argument to the extremes, and if we could fill the match entirely with qualified FMGs who don't rely on state or federal funding for their med school education we as patient advocates, tax payers, and as healthcare consumers should be all for it. Why prop up worse doctors and why pay for training that we don't need to?

English language skills, for starters

 

[hallowmann]

English language skills, for starters

Yeah, but in his scenario there are qualified FMGs for all positions. An utter lack of language skills is usually an eliminating factor for FMGs gaining residency. You also kind of need it to pass CS, so its already a limiting factor.

Now there certainly are FMGs with language issues in reality, but there are plenty of FMGs that are proficient. The easiest examples would probably be Brits.

 

[GUH]

Yeah, but in his scenario there are qualified FMGs for all positions. An utter lack of language skills is usually an eliminating factor for FMGs gaining residency. You also kind of need it to pass CS, so its already a limiting factor.

Now there certainly are FMGs with language issues in reality, but there are plenty of FMGs that are proficient. The easiest examples would probably be Brits.

There are cultural reasons as well. A US-trained male OB might be surprised if he moves to Saudi Arabia to practice, and vice versa. Language and cultural competency could be tested but are currently not.

 

[jakeislove]

Additional entitlements will definitively solve the problems created by excessive entitlements.