how competitive is the army hpsp?

[aspiring20]

i have a 3.6/3.3 c/s GPA and a 35 MCAT, and I am strongly thinking about applying for the army hpsp scholarship. i've heard that if you have a 3.5 cGPA and a 29 MCAT, you are automatically accepted? is this still true? do you have to have an acceptance in hand in order to get accepted for hpsp?

i do have a minor institutional action that i have to report (not related to alcohol, drugs, cheating, or any moral deficiency), and i expect delays in my medical school applications.

i also know that the early you apply for hpsp the better. so if i get an acceptance by a DO school in january, will the hpsp scholarship run out by then? is hpsp acceptance directly dependent on medical school acceptance?

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[deleted407021]

There are MAJOR(lol) things to consider when making plans around the military. I have considered this route myself in part because my family has a vast military heritage. I may do it after all but I am leaning heavily to no. If you have not already, please look in the Military Medicine forum for lots of detailed information regarding the scholarship and various other military options for debt forgiveness. I'm no expert so I won't be of any further help.

To address your question, the competitiveness varies depending upon the needs of the government, but on average it is not supposed to be super competitive.
Godspeed.

 

[Ace-Co-A]

It's as competitive as getting into medical school is. I'm applying for the Navy's HPSP. Check out the Military Medicine Forum. Lots of helpful information there from more experienced people than me.

 

[aspiring20]

It's as competitive as getting into medical school is. I'm applying for the Navy's HPSP. Check out the Military Medicine Forum. Lots of helpful information there from more experienced people than me.

thanks

so the whole 3.5 GPA/ 29 MCAT = automatic acceptance is pretty much gone?

 

[Ace-Co-A]

so the whole 3.5 GPA/ 29 MCAT = automatic acceptance is pretty much gone?

Recruiters from all three branches mentioned that qualifying rule. What I meant by "It's as competitive as getting into medical school" is that to be awarded a full tuition HPSP position, one has to present an acceptance letter from an accredited US medical school. Therefore, one must get into medical school to be eligible for the HPSP. You also have to fulfill other criteria. For example, an extensive background check is required due to the security clearance you are being issued as an officer in the US Armed Forces. Medical evaluation and subsequent clearance are also required steps in being accepted for the HPSP. I myself await news about my medical clearance.

Thus, eligibility (i.e., the 3.5 GPA / 29 MCAT benchmark) is not sufficient for acceptance into the HPSP, so make sure you get into medical school!

Decisions about offers are made by a national committee and several hundred scholarships are available through each of the three branches, with the Army's program being the largest, I believe.

 

[aspiring20]

Recruiters from all three branches mentioned that qualifying rule. What I meant by "It's as competitive as getting into medical school" is that to be awarded a full tuition HPSP position, one has to present an acceptance letter from an accredited US medical school. Therefore, one must get into medical school to be eligible for the HPSP. You also have to fulfill other criteria. For example, an extensive background check is required due to the security clearance you are being issued as an officer in the US Armed Forces. Medical evaluation and subsequent clearance are also required steps in being accepted for the HPSP. I myself await news about my medical clearance.

Thus, eligibility (i.e., the 3.5 GPA / 29 MCAT benchmark) is not sufficient for acceptance into the HPSP, so make sure you get into medical school!

Decisions about offers are made by a national committee and several hundred scholarships are available through each of the three branches, with the Army's program being the largest, I believe.

so you cannot apply for the scholarship until you have an acceptance letter?

i've heard that its two separate processes. that you can qualify for a scholarship but if you dont end up getting into med school, you'll simply lose your scholarship to someone else.

 

[Ace-Co-A]

so you cannot apply for the scholarship until you have an acceptance letter?

i've heard that its two separate processes. that you can qualify for a scholarship but if you dont end up getting into med school, you'll simply lose your scholarship to someone else.

Yea, I applied just after I submitted AMCAS basically. You might qualify for the scholarship, but that does nobody any good if you haven't been accepted anywhere, so therefore an acceptance letter is required to be awarded a position in the HPSP and the HPSP application process is as competitive as getting into medical school.

I'm not sure if I've answered your question. I'll return to this in the morning.

 

[aspiring20]

Yea, I applied just after I submitted AMCAS basically. You might qualify for the scholarship, but that does nobody any good if you haven't been accepted anywhere, so therefore an acceptance letter is required to be awarded a position in the HPSP and the HPSP application process is as competitive as getting into medical school.

I'm not sure if I've answered your question. I'll return to this in the morning.

see if this is correct.

since i have >3.5 and >30, i'll automatically qualify for army hpsp, which means they'll save a spot for me. when i get my first acceptance, i will be granted the scholarship. if i dont get into med school, i lose my qualification and my spot goes to someone else.

am i right?

 

[aspiring20]

basically, since i have a 3.5+ (thank god it is cumulative and not science!) and a 30+, i am guaranteed a scholarship IF i can get into a medical school?

the military uses the term "automatic acceptance", so this is what i am getting at.

thanks again!

 

[Ace-Co-A]

see if this is correct.

since i have >3.5 and >30, i'll automatically qualify for army hpsp, which means they'll save a spot for me. when i get my first acceptance, i will be granted the scholarship. if i dont get into med school, i lose my qualification and my spot goes to someone else.

am i right?

I see what you mean. Sorry I misunderstood. As long as you're qualified and you get accepted into medical school, you have a very good chance of being selected for the HPSP (assuming no criminal record, no serious medical problems, desire to serve, etc.).

I know folks who apply late in the spring and are still accepted for the HPSP. You should invest your time in making sure that you really want to do it before applying because the application process is sort of a pain. Apply after submitting AMCAS and don't let it come before any secondaries. As far as I know, the HPSP is not itself as competitive as getting into medical school (i.e., there are not 50x as many applications as spots in the HPSP class).

It is competitive because medical school is competitive. In general, if you are good enough for US MD/DO schools, you are good enough for the HPSP. On the other hand, there is a strong negative opinion about military medicine here on SDN. I warn you to think long and hard before committing yourself to the HPSP. I have cooled on the idea of military medicine since I applied, and I remain undecided.

 

[Eremba]

I applied for and received the HPSP scholarship this year. 3.6GPA and 25 MCAT. You cannot have any sub score below 8 to qualify.

You have to have a full medical clearance, background check and letter of acceptance before they will SUBMIT your application for review. You can get everything filled out and ready to go (which I highly recommend because it's a lot of stuff) but you must have the letter for it to go to the review committee.

 

[aspiring20]

I applied for and received the HPSP scholarship this year. 3.6GPA and 25 MCAT. You cannot have any sub score below 8 to qualify.

You have to have a full medical clearance, background check and letter of acceptance before they will SUBMIT your application for review. You can get everything filled out and ready to go (which I highly recommend because it's a lot of stuff) but you must have the letter for it to go to the review committee.

congrats on your acceptance!

when did you get your medical school acceptance, if you dont mind my asking. and i have zero criminal background (no arrests or citations) and zero medical problems. i do need to get into better shape though!

 

[Eremba]

congrats on your acceptance!

when did you get your medical school acceptance, if you dont mind my asking. and i have zero criminal background (no arrests or citations) and zero medical problems. i do need to get into better shape though!

I received my school acceptance in October.
And got my HPSP acceptance in December.

 

[aspiring20]

I received my school acceptance in October.
And got my HPSP acceptance in December.

I assume you got an acceptance to a DO medical school?

and does the HPSP evaluate your ECs as well? do they even have access to your medical school application? or do they just give you the scholarship after you pass their background checks and have decent stats?

with a 3.6 cGPA and a 35 MCAT, i am counting on a swift DO acceptance followed by hpsp acceptance. am i realistic in expecting both?

 

[Eremba]

I assume you got an acceptance to a DO medical school?

and does the HPSP evaluate your ECs as well? do they even have access to your medical school application? or do they just give you the scholarship after you pass their background checks and have decent stats?

with a 3.6 cGPA and a 35 MCAT, i am counting on a swift DO acceptance followed by hpsp acceptance. am i realistic in expecting both?

Yes, DO school.

I would say yes to having a realistic expectation of acceptances. No, they do not have access to your application but you do need all official transcripts submitted, 3 LORs and a personal statement. They do ask for ECs but those aren't high on the list of things they look at for the scholarship.

You have to have the army physical before the app is submitted. It's just a bunch of hoops.

There are 250 scholarships given each year (I think that's all branches but I could be wrong on that) and I believe about 50 have been given out so far this cycle.

 

[aspiring20]

Yes, DO school.

I would say yes to having a realistic expectation of acceptances. No, they do not have access to your application but you do need all official transcripts submitted, 3 LORs and a personal statement. They do ask for ECs but those aren't high on the list of things they look at for the scholarship.

You have to have the army physical before the app is submitted. It's just a bunch of hoops.

There are 250 scholarships given each year (I think that's all branches but I could be wrong on that) and I believe about 50 have been given out so far this cycle.

thanks

3 LORs as well? do i need to submit LORs if i meet their automatic acceptance cutoff?

and what kind of ECs do they want to see? do they want leadership activities?

my ECs look good for med schools, but not sure if they will satisfy the military.

thanks again

 

[Eremba]

thanks

3 LORs as well? do i need to submit LORs if i meet their automatic acceptance cutoff?

and what kind of ECs do they want to see? do they want leadership activities?

my ECs look good for med schools, but not sure if they will satisfy the military.

thanks again

I used the same ECs for my med school app. They're fine.

The LORs are required no matter what. I had to have 2 from professors and 1 from a supervisor. There is a list of required items regardless of meeting the qualification stats.

 

[aspiring20]

I used the same ECs for my med school app. They're fine.

The LORs are required no matter what. I had to have 2 from professors and 1 from a supervisor. There is a list of required items regardless of meeting the qualification stats.

thanks. can the supervisor be a volunteer supervisor?

also, why would the army want med school ECs? if we already got accepted to med schools, why do these ECs still matter?

i'll jump through the hoops, but iam just confused. it's like being evaluated twice for the same thing.

 

[EMDO2018]

There was a girl who was an Air Force captain in our interview group today, she wore her dress blues, she was cute.





Just realized I didn't contribute anything to this thread.

 

[aspiring20]

There was a girl who was an Air Force captain in our interview group today, she wore her dress blues, she was cute.





Just realized I didn't contribute anything to this thread.

no matter, but thanks for sharing

 

[aspiring20]

also, does the name of your undergrad have any baring on your competitiveness for the scholarship? i've heard somewhere that if you went to a"prestigious" school, then it is more likely that you'll get the scholarship?

i REALLY REALLY REALLY do not want any loans/debt.

 

[EMDO2018]

also, does the name of your undergrad have any baring on your competitiveness for the scholarship? i've heard somewhere that if you went to a"prestigious" school, then it is more likely that you'll get the scholarship?

REALLY REALLY REALLY do not want any loans/debt.

I would rather have debt, than to have little control over where and what I match in and where or how I practice for 4 years after med school.

 

[aspiring20]

I would rather have debt, than to have little control over where and what I match in and where or how I practice for 4 years after med school.

fair enough, and i respect that.

but man, i want the scholarship so bad! thank god my stats are rock solid for it. i am hoping that my 35 pulls some serious weight.

 

[Oo Cipher oO]

I would rather have debt, than to have little control over where and what I match in and where or how I practice for 5-12 years after med school.

Fixed that for you to reflect varying residency lengths. It is a long commitment that need to be thoroughly thought through. Don't just do it because you are debt adverse.

 

[Eremba]

thanks. can the supervisor be a volunteer supervisor?

also, why would the army want med school ECs? if we already got accepted to med schools, why do these ECs still matter?

i'll jump through the hoops, but iam just confused. it's like being evaluated twice for the same thing.

About the letter requirements I would ask a medical professions recruiter what they accept.

I don't think they really care so much what type of ECs you have as I think that was only one page of the application.

The application is more around school stuff, backgrounds and travel destinations etc. it's the government! What can I say?! Lol.

 

[aspiring20]

About the letter requirements I would ask a medical professions recruiter what they accept.

I don't think they really care so much what type of ECs you have as I think that was only one page of the application.

The application is more around school stuff, backgrounds and travel destinations etc. it's the government! What can I say?! Lol.

thanks. did you have to fill out the SF-86 security clearance form as part of the process?

 

[Mad Jack]

Didn't realize selling your soul to Uncle Sam was a competition sort of thing.

 

[aspiring20]

Didn't realize selling your soul to Uncle Sam was a competition sort of thing.

i dont want to go to a DO medical school and have 300k in debt.

 

[The Buff OP]

what specialty are you trying to go for? I know I want to get into a surgical field and after researching more about HPSP, I deicded it wasn't for me, even though I always wanted to serve my country.

 

[Mad Jack]

i dont want to go to a DO medical school and have 300k in debt.

The economics of joining the military for loan forgiveness are not worth it unless you go into primary care. 300k sounds unfathomable to you now, but on a 30 year plan that is less than a 2k a month payment, a paltry sum in comparison to the salary of most physicians. People who have 70k salaries take out mortgages on 300k homes. You'll make three to four times as much as they do, trust me, you can swing it.

Plus there are much better programs for debt forgiveness out there. If you work for a nonprofit for 10 years, you can have your loans forgiven. Residency counts toward this, so if you work for a nonprofit hospital for 4-6 years post residency (less than the amount of time the military would own you for) your loans will disappear.

Debt aversion can make people do some dumb things. If you are not currently ex military and do not know what you are getting into, I would look at the milmed forum and get an understanding of just how miserable it makes most civilians that sign those papers. The only ones who seem to end up happy are the ex-military ones that knew the deal going in.

 

[aspiring20]

what specialty are you trying to go for? I know I want to get into a surgical field and after researching more about HPSP, I deicded it wasn't for me, even though I always wanted to serve my country.

i dont know much at this point, but i am leaning towards either emergency medicine or anethesiology. i'll be direct; these two specialities pay more than primary care, and they are very DO friendly. but i am fine with primary care as well.

if the army pays me through school and offers a roughly 100k salary both during and after residency, then i am fine doing whatever they ask me to do.

 

[aspiring20]

The economics of joining the military for loan forgiveness are not worth it unless you go into primary care. 300k sounds unfathomable to you now, but on a 30 year plan that is less than a 2k a month payment, a paltry sum in comparison to the salary of most physicians. People who have 70k salaries take out mortgages on 300k homes. You'll make three to four times as much as they do, trust me, you can swing it.

Plus there are much better programs for debt forgiveness out there. If you work for a nonprofit for 10 years, you can have your loans forgiven. Residency counts toward this, so if you work for a nonprofit hospital for 4-6 years post residency (less than the amount of time the military would own you for) your loans will disappear.

Debt aversion can make people do some dumb things. If you are not currently ex military and do not know what you are getting into, I would look at the milmed forum and get an understanding of just how miserable it makes most civilians that sign those papers. The only ones who seem to end up happy are the ex-military ones that knew the deal going in.

can a DO graduate make 210,000 - 280,000? what about the uncertain future of healthcare?

and because i will likely going to a DO medical school, the chance of me going into primary care is quite high.

 

[The Buff OP]

i dont know much at this point, but i am leaning towards either emergency medicine or anethesiology. i'll be direct; these two specialities pay more than primary care, and they are very DO friendly. but i am fine with primary care as well.

if the army pays me through school and offers a roughly 100k salary both during and after residency, then i am fine doing whatever they ask me to do.

I think you need to research more about HPSP and FAP. I thought it was a sweet deal getting medical school paid and plus the monthly stipend while in medical school, but after calculating how long I would have to be in the military, I decided against it. Anesthesiology is 5 years long and who know's when you will actually start your residency after medical school because of the GMO tour.

 

[The Buff OP]

According to salary.com an anesthesiologist makes about 340k a year and a EM doc makes around 250k a year. I think with this salary rate you can manage to payback your debt in a short period of time. You will not be the first one that has to payback loans out of their own pocket.

 

[Mad Jack]

can a DO graduate make 210,000 - 280,000? what about the uncertain future of healthcare?

and because i will likely going to a DO medical school, the chance of me going into primary care is quite high.

If you go IM, 210k is easily doable as a hospitalist. DO does NOT mean you are limited to primary care. Your board scores will largely determine your specialty competitiveness. Given that you got a 35 on the MCAT, you are probably decent at standardized tests. This innate ability, combined with good study habits and working your butt off in school, can easily combine into a decent score on the Steps and COMLEX. What the ACA will do to salaries over the long term is completely unknown, but in the short term, salaries should remain stable.

You sound like me. Constantly underestimating myself and fearing the worst. I'm very risk averse. The worst case scenario for me is ending up in IM with no specialty, then becoming a hospitalist, as this is easily doable even if I somehow bombed the boards. Median hospitalist salary was 240k this year and rising, which is really not so bad. This would lead to an after-tax montly salary in my state of $12,290 per Paycheck City's salary paycheck calculator, while on a 30 year payment plan I would have a payment of $1955 per month per FinAid.org's student loan repayment calculator. How I will manage to survive on a worst case average scenario of $10,345 a month after taxes is beyond me. I mean, those are practically slave wages. That's like, barely enough to pay my current rent, food, and utilities and buy a brand new motorcycle every single month.

http://thehappyhospitalist.blogspot.com/2010/09/hospitalist-salary-compensation-survey.html
http://www.finaid.org/calculators/loanpayments.phtml
http://www.paycheckcity.com/calculator/salary/

Run the numbers yourself using starting salaries in different specialties and different estimated loan amounts. All of this, by the way, neglects the various programs that exist to help you pay off student loans like the 10 year Public Service Loan Forgiveness I mentioned earlier.

http://studentaid.ed.gov/repay-loans/forgiveness-cancellation/charts/public-service

Also DO graduates make the same amount as MD graduates in the same specialty. There's no difference between the two once you're residency trained.

 

[aspiring20]

If you go IM, 210k is easily doable as a hospitalist. DO does NOT mean you are limited to primary care. Your board scores will largely determine your specialty competitiveness. Given that you got a 35 on the MCAT, you are probably decent at standardized tests. This innate ability, combined with good study habits and working your butt off in school, can easily combine into a decent score on the Steps and COMLEX. What the ACA will do to salaries over the long term is completely unknown, but in the short term, salaries should remain stable.

You sound like me. Constantly underestimating myself and fearing the worst. I'm very risk averse. The worst case scenario for me is ending up in IM with no specialty, then becoming a hospitalist, as this is easily doable even if I somehow bombed the boards. Median hospitalist salary was 240k this year and rising, which is really not so bad. This would lead to an after-tax montly salary in my state of $12,290 per Paycheck City's salary paycheck calculator, while on a 30 year payment plan I would have a payment of $1955 per month per FinAid.org's student loan repayment calculator. How I will manage to survive on a worst case average scenario of $10,345 a month after taxes is beyond me. I mean, those are practically slave wages. That's like, barely enough to pay my current rent, food, and utilities and buy a brand new motorcycle every single month.

http://thehappyhospitalist.blogspot.com/2010/09/hospitalist-salary-compensation-survey.html
http://www.finaid.org/calculators/loanpayments.phtml
http://www.paycheckcity.com/calculator/salary/

Run the numbers yourself using starting salaries in different specialties and different estimated loan amounts. All of this, by the way, neglects the various programs that exist to help you pay off student loans like the 10 year Public Service Loan Forgiveness I mentioned earlier.

http://studentaid.ed.gov/repay-loans/forgiveness-cancellation/charts/public-service

Also DO graduates make the same amount as MD graduates in the same specialty. There's no difference between the two once you're residency trained.

this is very reassuring, and thanks for sharing with me.

i will do more research regarding HPSP.

in the meantime, i have to find a DO to shadow in order to qualify for DO schools.

 

[Mad Jack]

this is very reassuring, and thanks for sharing with me.

i will do more research regarding HPSP.

in the meantime, i have to find a DO to shadow in order to qualify for DO schools.

Definitely do your research. Don't sell your soul if you don't have to. Because once your in, there's no way out. Uncle Sam won't take your money if you change your mind- he wants your blood, and he wants your freedom.

 

[aspiring20]

i just looked at what a hospitalist does, and it seems to be a pretty good specialty.

is it competitive to become a hospitalist? do you need anything more than an IM residency which lasts 3 years?

what if I can only match into a low/mid tier IM residency as a DO?

 

[csx]

Anesthesiology, IM, and various other specialities are "DO friendly"...however, is this point not void as you are slave to whatever many different residencies the military offers? Is the military bias against DO's (vs MD's)?

 

[Perrotfish]

The economics of joining the military for loan forgiveness are not worth it unless you go into primary care.

This isn't true. The scholarship is valuable enough, relative to a medical education on loans, that its likely to be a financial winner for all but the top quartile of salaries. I tried to do a good breakdown of the finances here: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/the-skyrocketing-value-of-the-hpsp-scholarship.1003915/. I wouldn't join for debt alone, but you're not likely to lose money on the deal.

This would lead to an after-tax montly salary in my state of $12,290 per Paycheck City's salary paycheck calculator, while on a 30 year payment plan I would have a payment of $1955 per month per FinAid.org's student loan repayment calculator.

Also not true. You forgot that the interest accumulates on these loans in medical school and residency when you're not paying anything. Recalculate using what the balance will be when you're an attending and get a chance to pay them back, which is about 500K. 3,300/month for 30 years. Also remember those are after tax dollars. Of course, you can always bank on the federal government keeping public service loan forgiveness or IBR around.

BTW I am not saying join the military. There are lots of reasons not to. The culture. The obligation to serve in armed conflicts whether or not you agree with them. The lack of control over where you live and how you live. The very real (though historically low) possibility of being shot and killed. Oh, and when you join you are stuck applying for residencies in the military match, which has completely different odds of getting a given residency than the civilian match. I am, however, saying that 300K of high interest debt is not something to shrug off either.

 

[aspiring20]

This isn't true. The scholarship is valuable enough, relative to a medical education on loans, that its likely to be a financial winner for all but the top quartile of salaries. I tried to do a good breakdown of the finances here: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/the-skyrocketing-value-of-the-hpsp-scholarship.1003915/. I wouldn't join for debt alone, but you're not likely to lose money on the deal.



Also not true. You forgot that the interest accumulates on these loans in medical school and residency when you're not paying anything. Recalculate using what the balance will be when you're an attending and get a chance to pay them back, which is about 500K. 3,300/month for 30 years. Also remember those are after tax dollars. Of course, you can always bank on the federal government keeping public service loan forgiveness or IBR around.

BTW I am not saying join the military. There are lots of reasons not to. The culture. The obligation to serve in armed conflicts whether or not you agree with them. The lack of control over where you live and how you live. The very real possibility of being shot and killed. I am saying that 300K of high interest debt is not something to shrug off either.

thanks for this perspective as well

the other benefit i see with the scholarship is that you'll be able to have access to a decently high income right after graduation from med school without a single cent of debt. while you are serving in residency and the military, you'll be able to save up a lot of money. after your service ends, you can then find a civilian job with higher pay and enjoy your years of saving, giving you plenty of purchasing power for luxury vehicles and homes. of course this is a rather shallow view solely of the financial outcomes.

i have to think long and hard about the scholarship. but from a purely monetary perspective, it looks quite good.

 

[Mad Jack]

This isn't true. The scholarship is valuable enough, relative to a medical education on loans, that its likely to be a financial winner for all but the top quartile of salaries. I tried to do a good breakdown of the finances here: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/the-skyrocketing-value-of-the-hpsp-scholarship.1003915/. I wouldn't join for debt alone, but you're not likely to lose money on the deal

Also not true. You forgot that the interest accumulates on these loans in medical school and residency when you're not paying anything. Recalculate using what the balance will be when you're an attending and get a chance to pay them back, which is about 500K. 3,300/month for 30 years. Also remember those are after tax dollars. Of course, you can always bank on the federal government keeping public service loan forgiveness or IBR around.

BTW I am not saying join the military. There are lots of reasons not to. The culture. The obligation to serve in armed conflicts whether or not you agree with them. The lack of control over where you live and how you live. The very real possibility of being shot and killed. I am saying that 300K of high interest debt is not something to shrug off either.

I added up literally everything (books, flights, board exams, tech expenses) along with interest and I'm looking at 400k after I am done with school and residency.

My calculations did not use the IBR formula. They used a 30 year extended repayment, which will probably be around basically forever and is not income based. If you DID use IBR or whatever the new one is, the payments would actually be substantially lower. I don't trust the government to keep these programs around though. All of my calculations were after tax dollars, including state and local tax. With taxes accounted for and a 30 year repayment plan on 400k, I'd end up with a pauper's wage of $9,683 a month as an average hospitalist after taxes. This is certainly not a life of hardship, unless you're the keeping up with the Joneses type, in which case no sum of money will ever be enough.

 

[Mad Jack]

thanks for this perspective as well

the other benefit i see with the scholarship is that you'll be able to have access to a decently high income right after graduation from med school without a single cent of debt. while you are serving in residency and the military, you'll be able to save up a lot of money. after your service ends, you can then find a civilian job with higher pay and enjoy your years of saving, giving you plenty of purchasing power for luxury vehicles and homes. of course this is a rather shallow view solely of the financial outcomes.

i have to think long and hard about the scholarship. but from a purely monetary perspective, it looks quite good.

But look at Public Service Loan Forgiveness. You work for a nonprofit hospital for 6-7 years post-residency, and not only will you be making more money even after the loan payments than a military doc, but your loans are forgiven at the end.

Lastly, you must consider that if you sign up for the HPSP, you have to go through the military match. You have a whole lot less say in what specialty you end up with when you're in the military match, so you might end up sacrificing not just your time, but your ability to choose what specialty to enter or avoid.

And this is not even getting into the difficulties that military life imposes on your love and family life. Think it over hard, because you can't undo it once it's done.

 

[aspiring20]

I added up literally everything (books, flights, board exams, tech expenses) along with interest and I'm looking at 400k after I am done with school and residency.

My calculations did not use the IBR formula. They used a 30 year extended repayment, which will probably be around basically forever and is not income based. If you DID use IBR or whatever the new one is, the payments would actually be substantially lower. I don't trust the government to keep these programs around though. All of my calculations were after tax dollars, including state and local tax. With taxes accounted for and a 30 year repayment plan on 400k, I'd end up with a pauper's wage of $9,683 a month as an average hospitalist after taxes. This is certainly not a life of hardship, unless you're the keeping up with the Joneses type, in which case no sum of money will ever be enough.

10,000 take home pay a month (after taxes and debt payment) is excellent. you can easily afford a lot of luxuries.

but that's counting on that 10,000 monthly paycheck.

 

[lumbricoides]

But look at Public Service Loan Forgiveness. You work for a nonprofit hospital for 6-7 years post-residency, and not only will you be making more money even after the loan payments than a military doc, but your loans are forgiven at the end.

The caveat here being that most (many) physicians at hospitals are not actually employees of said hospitals. Which means it doesn't matter whether they are non-profit or not for loan forgiveness purposes. You are likely to either be deemed an independent contractor, or an "employee" of a physicians group, and I'm not sure how many of those are non-profit. But there are still ways to play the game, for primary care a few years in an under served community will eliminate half your loan, or you can work for the VA or decide to go the military route (other during residency and pick up a stipend from uncle sam with a service commitment) or join after residency (as an attending and pick up a signing bonus), and then in either case have your loans forgiven at the 10 year mark. 300-400K is nothing to play around with, and HPSP is a great option if you are sure about what you are getting yourself into. I wouldn't take it though without a lot of deep introspection as the opportunity cost of military service might become more than you realize....

 

[Mad Jack]

The caveat here being that most (many) physicians at hospitals are not actually employees of said hospitals. Which means it doesn't matter whether they are non-profit or not for loan forgiveness purposes. You are likely to either be deemed an independent contractor, or an "employee" of a physicians group, and I'm not sure how many of those are non-profit. But there are still ways to play the game, for primary care a few years in an under served community will eliminate half your loan, or you can work for the VA or decide to go the military route (other during residency and pick up a stipend from uncle sam with a service commitment) or join after residency (as an attending and pick up a signing bonus), and then in either case have your loans forgiven at the 10 year mark. 300-400K is nothing to play around with, and HPSP is a great option if you are sure about what you are getting yourself into. I wouldn't take it though without a lot of deep introspection as the opportunity cost of military service might become more than you realize....

You can find employed positions though. It'd have to be something you look for. ER and hospitalist positions are often hospital employed, as are attendings, which you mentioned. Academic positions would also be viable if you can land one.