How to Move Forward...

[CognitiveSci]

So...

Basically, the first 3 years of my undergrad career have been a disaster, seriously... My family has fallen on hard times over the past years, with my parents almost divorcing and losing the family business (and a major source of income). I've even had to move back home because my parents (meaning my mom, she's the only one who contributes towards tuition) can't afford to pay so much for tuition anymore. In fact, for the last 1.5 years, I've had to pay all or most of tuition on my own through my part-time job. I've spent so much time dealing with those issues plus issues of immaturity on my part, which has resulted in my cGPA being a 2.6...AND I'M A SENIOR (this is my last semester!) I even switched majors because I didn't think I was smart enough to handle medical school; I really thought this may not be the path for me. However, in researching other careers, nothing has been able to pique my interest like medicine has; I honestly don't want to be anything besides a doctor. But obviously with a 2.6 GPA, my grades, especially my science grades are abysmal (I've got 3 F's). I'm already applying for post-baccs in my state (TX), but even after a full year of pure science courses (meaning 18 creds each semesters), my GPA will only be a 3.0 (this is assuming I maintain a 4.0); my science GPA will only be lower. I haven't taken the MCAT because I have not taken most of the pre-reqs yet. I'm also trying to build other parts of my profile, such as research, but it's really hard to get into a lab with a sub 3.0 gpa.

My question is, how should I proceed after the post-bacc? Should I take a gamble and sit for the MCAT, then apply basically as soon as apps open or should I try to do another year of post-bacc? I don't know if I'll be able to afford 2 years of post-bacc, but I'll try if I have to. Realistically, I may not be able to afford an SMP either.


Here are a sum of my stats thus far:

• TX Resident
• URM (Black)
• 2.6 cGPA (sGPA is sitting right at a 2.0 right now) ---> may be a 3.0 after 1 year informal post-bacc
• Haven't taken the MCAT yet
• 150+ hours of hospital volunteering
• Shadowed 3 doctors thus far...
• Member of pre-med club (if that even counts)
• Work part-time (22-24 hrs/wk) during school, full time (40 hrs/wk) during holidays
• Trying to get into a research lab...

Any suggestions for other extracurricular activities I should look into?

Thanks for any advice you guys can supply me with!

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[medic86]

So...

Basically, the first 3 years of my undergrad career have been a disaster, seriously... My family has fallen on hard times over the past years, with my parents almost divorcing and losing the family business (and a major source of income). I've even had to move back home because my parents (meaning my mom, she's the only one who contributes towards tuition) can't afford to pay so much for tuition anymore. In fact, for the last 1.5 years, I've had to pay all or most of tuition on my own through my part-time job. I've spent so much time dealing with those issues plus issues of immaturity on my part, which has resulted in my cGPA being a 2.6...AND I'M A SENIOR (this is my last semester!) I even switched majors because I didn't think I was smart enough to handle medical school; I really thought this may not be the path for me. However, in researching other careers, nothing has been able to pique my interest like medicine has; I honestly don't want to be anything besides a doctor. But obviously with a 2.6 GPA, my grades, especially my science grades are abysmal (I've got 3 F's). I'm already applying for post-baccs in my state (TX), but even after a full year of pure science courses (meaning 18 creds each semesters), my GPA will only be a 3.0 (this is assuming I maintain a 4.0); my science GPA will only be lower. I haven't taken the MCAT because I have not taken most of the pre-reqs yet. I'm also trying to build other parts of my profile, such as research, but it's really hard to get into a lab with a sub 3.0 gpa.

My question is, how should I proceed after the post-bacc? Should I take a gamble and sit for the MCAT, then apply basically as soon as apps open or should I try to do another year of post-bacc? I don't know if I'll be able to afford 2 years of post-bacc, but I'll try if I have to. Realistically, I may not be able to afford an SMP either.


Here are a sum of my stats thus far:

• TX Resident
• URM (Black)
• 2.6 cGPA (sGPA is sitting right at a 2.0 right now) ---> may be a 3.0 after 1 year informal post-bacc
• Haven't taken the MCAT yet
• 150+ hours of hospital volunteering
• Shadowed 3 doctors thus far...
• Member of pre-med club (if that even counts)
• Work part-time (22-24 hrs/wk) during school, full time (40 hrs/wk) during holidays
• Trying to get into a research lab...

Any suggestions for other extracurricular activities I should look into?

Thanks for any advice you guys can supply me with!

I would highly suggest retaking all of your Cs and lower, (and maybe some of the Bs) and apply DO. First, I'd figure out why you're not performing where you should be, and make absolutely sure that you can obtain As with your retakes.

Only take the MCAT after adequate preparation (should go without saying).

I wish you luck, OP! It'll be a long road.

 

[CognitiveSci]

I would highly suggest retaking all of your Cs (and maybe some of the Bs) and apply DO. First, I'd figure out why you're not performing where you should be, and make absolutely sure that you can obtain As with your retakes.

Only take the MCAT after adequate preparation (should go without saying).

I wish you luck, OP! It'll be a long road.

So what would suggest I do after I finish the post-bacc? Just keep taking as many classes as I can? I'm going to apply DO also, but do you think I'd have any remote chance at MD?

Honestly, my under performance was a combo of 5 things: Ignorance, immaturity, laziness, low self-esteem, and stress

 

[Lucca]

Do you have to graduate? You could take the pre-reqs+more science while you are a 5th/6th year. Undergrad tuition is probably cheaper than a post-bacc. The big question is: Would you be able to succeed? Have the problems that were holding you back before been fixed? If you are tackling more coursework and the underlying problems have not been fixed then there is not much you could do at that point. The result will be the same.

You should retake your C-F grades and apply DO if your goal is to go to Ms as quickly as possible, which may not be the best option. Have you fixed your maturity issues? Plenty of people work during undergrad to pay for it and survive. Everyone takes loans eventually and that is an avenue available for you, albeit an unattractive one. If you really want to be a doctor then you are going to have to fight a very steep uphill battle to prove that you can handle the coursework. Taking some years off of school might also be beneficial.

Your shot at MD is essentially Zero unless you take some years off of school, do a ton of impressive things, and then do well on the MCAT and on a post-bacc. I am very hesitant to suggest gap years to people because it is a very personal decision and when finances are a big concern it can almost certainly not be an option.

 

[medic86]

So what would suggest I do after I finish the post-bacc? Just keep taking as many classes as I can? I'm going to apply DO also, but do you think I'd have any remote chance at MD?

Honestly, my under performance was a combo of 5 things: Ignorance, immaturity, laziness, low self-esteem, and stress

I'm no expert, but with a decent MCAT and GPAs above 3.0 may get you into an HBCU medical school.

I would make DO school your priority, however.

 

[CognitiveSci]

Do you have to graduate? You could take the pre-reqs+more science while you are a 5th/6th year. Undergrad tuition is probably cheaper than a post-bacc. The big question is: Would you be able to succeed? Have the problems that were holding you back before been fixed? If you are tackling more coursework and the underlying problems have not been fixed then there is not much you could do at that point. The result will be the same.

You should retake your C-F grades and apply DO if your goal is to go to Ms as quickly as possible, which may not be the best option. Have you fixed your maturity issues? Plenty of people work during undergrad to pay for it and survive. Everyone takes loans eventually and that is an avenue available for you, albeit an unattractive one. If you really want to be a doctor then you are going to have to fight a very steep uphill battle to prove that you can handle the coursework. Taking some years off of school might also be beneficial.

Your shot at MD is essentially Zero unless you take some years off of school, do a ton of impressive things, and then do well on the MCAT and on a post-bacc. I am very hesitant to suggest gap years to people because it is a very personal decision and when finances are a big concern it can almost certainly not be an option.

I may just suck it up and take loans for an SMP after my post-bacc, so you think that would help my chances?

Really, I just had to grow up. I've never been a dependent person, but I realized that it's getting down to the wire here and I'm going to be very much on my own soon. Then what? I'm just so disappointed in my self really, I just let every little thing deter me, and now look where I am. And to quote the greatest man that ever lived, Kanye West, "[I'm] not perfect, but [I'm] not my mistakes." I don't know how I'll be able to convey that to Adcoms though.

 

[FutureOncologist]

I may just suck it up and take loans for an SMP after my post-bacc, so you think that would help my chances?

SMP is the "last resort" option when a DIY post bacc nor retaking classes for AACOMAS grade replacement aren't an option. You need an MCAT score for most programs (good ones that have a great history of putting you into their med school, anyway) and you need at least a 3.0 undergrad cGPA to be competitive. If you don't make at least a 3.7 GPA in the SMP program, you will most likely have to switch careers from physician to something else.

I highly suggest that you retake the classes you got a C or below in for a 5th/6th year and ace them. Then apply broadly to DO schools (including the new one in your state.) Also apply to all Texas schools.

 

[StudentDoctor#1000]

I think being a URM helps you the most out of your entire application. If you do well on the MCAT (Equivalent to a 32+), I can see you getting acceptances from some MD schools, and probably a lot of DO schools.

But that is contingent upon you getting your cGPA above a 3.0. There's no place, regardless of race, that's going to take you with a sub 3.0 GPA.

 

[clairephillips]

OP, I know this is your dream, so I'll try to tread lightly, but you have some major work to do. To get into the SMP at UNT requires a 3.0 gpa, if I'm not mistaken. Therefore, you really have two options.

1) Retake all the coursework you got below a B in, get A's and then apply DO. The drawback is that it is all DO, but your gpa will go up more quickly.
2) Take other coursework, pull your gpa up to a 3.0, then do an SMP and rock it, then apply MD.

Either way, I would encourage you to stop trying to pay your way through college and take out the loans the rest of us are battling. These are federal loans with reasonable repayment options, not private loans, mind you. Also, you'll want to apply to the HBCs, DO programs and SMPs either way you go. An acceptance in any of the above is another foot up a pretty high mountain. Good luck.

 

[deleted480308]

the odds are you just aren't an MD anymore, just take the retakes and apply DO

 

[StudentDoctor#1000]

Also FYI, I just looked up the MSAR details, and the HBCU Medical Schools people have been mentioning (Meharry, Morehouse, & Howard) have a 10th percentile accepted GPA of around 3.2 (Except howard which has a 2.94). So, it would be prudent to raise your cGPA to at least a 3.2 before applying.

I could see a DIY post-bacc doing that (and being a whole lot cheaper than a SMP). Also, you have to remember that this is ALL dependent on your attitude from where on in. Kill those classes. Make becoming an MD your main focus in life. There is absolutely no room to slack from here on in.

The median MCAT is a low (in the 20's), so if you got something like a 30+, that would really catch their eye.

Best of luck!

 

[xffan624]

I may just suck it up and take loans for an SMP after my post-bacc, so you think that would help my chances?

Really, I just had to grow up. I've never been a dependent person, but I realized that it's getting down to the wire here and I'm going to be very much on my own soon. Then what? I'm just so disappointed in my self really, I just let every little thing deter me, and now look where I am. And to quote the greatest man that ever lived, Kanye West, "[I'm] not perfect, but [I'm] not my mistakes." I don't know how I'll be able to convey that to Adcoms though.

Ok. I definitely would discourage you from calling Kanye West the greatest man that ever lived to anyone, ever on an ADCOM or even associated with a medical school. It doesn't help on the maturity front.

How do you convey to ADCOM's that you are not your mistakes? Show, don't tell. Recover from your previous bad grades. Get straight A's, rock the MCAT, get some additional leadership responsibilities under your belt, etc.

I agree with the previous poster that said you have a chance at the HBCU's if you can get the GPA above 3.0 and get a decent MCAT. I would also look into some EC's that fit their mission (inner city clinics, underserved populations, etc.), if you're really set on the MD.

 

[EvenStevens]

Ok. I definitely would discourage you from calling Kanye West the greatest man that ever lived to anyone, ever on an ADCOM or even associated with a medical school. It doesn't help on the maturity front.

I would agree that saying anyone is the greatest man that ever lived is far fetched. but 1) He was kidding , 2) You don't know why he could think that

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

OP, I was in a similar predicament (I'm a Hispanic male, although I'm pretty sure I'm not a URM). I got an F in calc my freshman year (retook it and got an A). I also dealt with significant hardships (poverty, domestic violence, misdiagnosed illness, and more) and I was naive enough to continue attempting science as an undergrad. After that F and a couple of Cs, my science grades were usually in the B+/ A- range. Unfortunately, I took a no-credit grade twice (couldn't officially withdraw because that would have gotten me kicked out of college housing). So that means I also have 3 Fs on my transcript...I wasn't informed that those NC grades would nuke my AMCAS gpa (they didn't impact my school gpa ).

Miraculously, my overall AMCAS GPA is now ~3.3 (my all other GPA was always above a 3.7). My sGPA is ~2.9.
However, this has been like building a freaking skyscraper. Let me quantify this for you: I currently have ~21 As and 12 A-s on my transcript. I have at least an A- in 9 BCPM courses (I'm currently reconstructing my gpa in a post bacc program). A few As from now, I will achieve my goal of breaking the 3.0 mark for my sGPA. As others have mentioned, you should only take your science courses (and everything else for that matter) when you're absolutely sure that you can get As. It is possible to bring your AMCAS GPA up to a respectable value, but again, you have to be certain that you can rack up those As. With a significant GPA improvement, a strong MCAT, and solid ECs, your prospects will improve substantially. Anyway, good luck, and feel free to pm me if you have any questions.

 

[chasm-e-baddoor]

If you really want to be a doctor, you can do it.

There are options like DO and Caribbean. The fact of the matter, however, is that your URM status gives you a good shot for MD schools and a great shot if you kill the MCAT.

Your primary goal is to destroy - and i mean destroy - the MCAT. It is also important to salvage your science GPA in any way you can. Be ready to heavily explain your situation. Be ready to apply far and wide. Exhaust every option, because becoming a doctor is doable.

I'd also strongly recommend loans to pay for tuition, especially in medical school. In medical school you aint working the tuition off without shooting yourslef in the foot if not outright failing.

Research might be important, but MCAT is by far the most important, and it will truly show that you have what it takes but just had some unfortunate circumstances.

Your URM status is a huge boon. Black students who had GPAs of 3.5 and MCAT scores of 30 had a 91% chance of getting into medical school. and if you can get 37+ (or whatever the equivalent is on the new MCAT) then i dont see how you can't get in.

 

[pandadawn]

So...

Basically, the first 3 years of my undergrad career have been a disaster, seriously... My family has fallen on hard times over the past years, with my parents almost divorcing and losing the family business (and a major source of income). I've even had to move back home because my parents (meaning my mom, she's the only one who contributes towards tuition) can't afford to pay so much for tuition anymore. In fact, for the last 1.5 years, I've had to pay all or most of tuition on my own through my part-time job. I've spent so much time dealing with those issues plus issues of immaturity on my part, which has resulted in my cGPA being a 2.6...AND I'M A SENIOR (this is my last semester!) I even switched majors because I didn't think I was smart enough to handle medical school; I really thought this may not be the path for me. However, in researching other careers, nothing has been able to pique my interest like medicine has; I honestly don't want to be anything besides a doctor. But obviously with a 2.6 GPA, my grades, especially my science grades are abysmal (I've got 3 F's). I'm already applying for post-baccs in my state (TX), but even after a full year of pure science courses (meaning 18 creds each semesters), my GPA will only be a 3.0 (this is assuming I maintain a 4.0); my science GPA will only be lower. I haven't taken the MCAT because I have not taken most of the pre-reqs yet. I'm also trying to build other parts of my profile, such as research, but it's really hard to get into a lab with a sub 3.0 gpa.

My question is, how should I proceed after the post-bacc? Should I take a gamble and sit for the MCAT, then apply basically as soon as apps open or should I try to do another year of post-bacc? I don't know if I'll be able to afford 2 years of post-bacc, but I'll try if I have to. Realistically, I may not be able to afford an SMP either.


Here are a sum of my stats thus far:

• TX Resident
• URM (Black)
• 2.6 cGPA (sGPA is sitting right at a 2.0 right now) ---> may be a 3.0 after 1 year informal post-bacc
• Haven't taken the MCAT yet
• 150+ hours of hospital volunteering
• Shadowed 3 doctors thus far...
• Member of pre-med club (if that even counts)
• Work part-time (22-24 hrs/wk) during school, full time (40 hrs/wk) during holidays
• Trying to get into a research lab...

Any suggestions for other extracurricular activities I should look into?

Thanks for any advice you guys can supply me with!

I would take as many of your pre-reqs that you can afford to take, at a school that you'd be interested in doing a masters degree at. Be impressive and make friends with the faculty, and apply to the masters program. 1 or 2 year program I don't think would matter. Pursuing a masters could potentially be MUCH cheaper than pursuing a second year of non-degree-seeking coursework, because typically an MS program offers the opportunity to be a TA (and you normally aren't elibible for ANY financial aid as a non-degreee-seeking student).

Also! Study your *AHEM* off for that MCAT. And don't sign up for a test date until you've scored three practice tests in a row at or above a score you wouldn't consider a retake for (over 30, definitely).

Best of luck!

 

[FutureOncologist]

There are options like DO. The fact of the matter, however, is that your URM status gives you a good shot for MD schools and a great shot if you kill the MCAT.

Fixed that for you (and for the sake of OP.)

 

[StudentDoctor#1000]

Fixed that for you (and for the sake of OP.)

Totally agree with this. NEVER even think of going Carib. Too much of a risk these days.

 

[chasm-e-baddoor]

Thanks for the fix. I didn't mean to provide poor advice - I was just thinking about how the Carib outlook was 2-3 years ago when the general consensus was that it wasn't that bad

 

[medic86]

Thanks for the fix. I didn't mean to provide poor advice - I was just thinking about how the Carib outlook was 2-3 years ago when the general consensus was that it wasn't that bad

Nope. It was still pretty damn bad 2-3 years ago.

 

[chasm-e-baddoor]

Nope. It was still pretty damn bad 2-3 years ago.

Was it really ? I remember posts about Carib grads getting rotations and residencies provided they got through the usmle

I even remember do vs Carib debates