How valuable is this research?

[davethewave2255]

Hey guys,

I am going to be starting MD school in the fall. I graduated a semester early. I have two options for how I spend my year:

1. Move back home to Boston and do research in a Harvard/MGH Ortho lab. I will be doing this research for free. I want to be an Ortho surgeon. Call me superstitious, but I believe the "karmic" or psychological effect of investing in an Ortho resume before medical school will keep me more committed to my dream, as Ortho is a tough specialty. Also it may help my chances of getting the specialty if I show commitment. There is a low chance of a publication as I will only be there for 8 months. For money I will be an uber driver and tutor in my area. I will probably live in Boston. Lastly, because this position is not part of some program, chances are I will be the only person my age in the lab. Though Boston is a fun city, I don't really know anyone in the city yet. I can also live with my parents in the basement and commute, but we know the problems that has.

2. Go back to my college town (Amherst). Work for pay in a research lab, cheaper rent, possibly get published (in evo bio, not medically related). All my friends and social life is there. For money I will be an uber driver and tutor in my area.

Additional info: I am a college aged male.

Which would you pick? Spending your last semester unburdened by MD trying your luck in Boston and potentially building a resume, or spending it in the college town? In other words: how valuable is this Ortho research to my chances of getting an Ortho specialty? How does it size up compared to the other factors?

Defend your positions please.

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[001100010010011]

Dude, go have fun while you're a "college-aged male." Research will always be there.

 

[davethewave2255]

How valuable would you say this research is? (Harvard/Ortho) for my dreams of being an ortho surgeon?

 

[mimelim]

Hey guys,

I am going to be starting MD school in the fall. I graduated a semester early. I have two options for how I spend my year:

1. Move back home to Boston and do research in a Harvard/MGH Ortho lab. I will be doing this research for free. I want to be an Ortho surgeon. Call me superstitious, but I believe the "karmic" or psychological effect of investing in an Ortho resume before medical school will keep me more committed to my dream, as Ortho is a tough specialty. Also it may help my chances of getting the specialty if I show commitment. There is a low chance of a publication as I will only be there for 8 months. For money I will be an uber driver and tutor in my area. I will probably live in Boston. Lastly, because this position is not part of some program, chances are I will be the only person my age in the lab. Though Boston is a fun city, I don't really know anyone in the city yet. I can also live with my parents in the basement and commute, but we know the problems that has.

2. Go back to my college town (Amherst). Work for pay in a research lab, cheaper rent, possibly get published (in evo bio, not medically related). All my friends and social life is there. For money I will be an uber driver and tutor in my area.

Additional info: I am a college aged male.

Which would you pick? Spending your last semester unburdened by MD trying your luck in Boston and potentially building a resume, or spending it in the college town? In other words: how valuable is this Ortho research to my chances of getting an Ortho specialty? How does it size up compared to the other factors?

Defend your positions please.

#1 This is an individualized question. It all depends on how YOU rank the importance of different things and how important where you do ortho is to you.
#2 Start here: http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Charting-Outcomes-2014-Final.pdf

Start on page 179. In particular pay attention to page 187.

#3 Orthopedics is competitive. Can you get into it without research, yes. Can you get into research in medical school, yes. Can you get things done while in medical school, yes. The vast majority of applicants do exactly that. However... 8 months is a long time and you can get a lot done in that time. You can develop a lot of contacts and explore the world that you are trying to get into.
#4 This isn't about demonstrating commitment to ortho prior to medical school. This is about you starting your journey into the professional world. We have MS1/2 that work with us very early. The ones that are gungho and excited are going to be some of the most sought after applicants in their cycle. It will give you a leg up.
#5 I sit on the other side of residency applications now. To me, this is a no-brainer. I would never say sacrifice your relationships/happiness for a research opportunity. But, by the same token, for me personally, being able to 'hang out' with college people is way below career advancement.
#6 How valuable research is depends on you more than where you are doing it. Harvard may be a big name, but there are a lot of students doing work there and many produce nothing and get little out of it. But with appropriate dedication, something like that along with strong scores will open a lot of doors for you.

 

[davethewave2255]

I appreciate both of your answers, but mimelim. You say it is a no brainer...am I assuming you are in support of staying around Harvard/MGH?

Let's say I work there 30+ hours a week, and that I don't get published? Still worth it?

How would you turn this Ortho research to your advantage?

 

[WedgeDawg]

Moving to preallo

 

[davethewave2255]

any other thoughts?

 

[Lost in Translation]

Great advice @piii but how does it affect my chances at matching into Ortho?

 

[SpartanWolverine]

1) How big is the lab/what kind of work would you be doing in Boston? Do you already have a project with your name on it, or just some vague promise of research experience? Boston is a great city, but you'll definitely chew through a lot of money if you want to live in the city. Even Brookline/Somerville/outlying areas are pricey and transportation isn't great. However, this could teach you a lot about the ortho field.

2) Realistically, what is the chance you'd be published with the gig in Amherst? I think you'd be building more of a resume with a publication than with listing experience at MGH. I see plenty of resumes listing interesting "experiences" but not all too many with publications going into medical school.

 

[PugsAndHugs]

I would chose the second option under the condition that the research at Amherst is not boring/dreadful and it actually interests you. It probably won't catch your attention like ortho does, but you should be eager to want to come in everyday.

 

[piii]

Great advice @piii but how does it affect my chances at matching into Ortho?

 

[mimelim]

I appreciate both of your answers, but mimelim. You say it is a no brainer...am I assuming you are in support of staying around Harvard/MGH?

Let's say I work there 30+ hours a week, and that I don't get published? Still worth it?

How would you turn this Ortho research to your advantage?

For me, personally, It would be a no brainer to go to Boston. Family is in Boston, no significant other pulling you toward somewhere else etc.

To be blunt, at the end of the day, this is most likely not going to make a difference. People that end up going balls the the wall in research don't have these questions and frankly any serious advantage you would gain will be lost if you have a, "I'm using you to help me match" mentality. This is not about publishing.

If you take it seriously and maximize the opportunities in Boston, it can completely change where you match and set you up for your 'dream' career. But, if you aren't really all that invested, you are not going to put in the time and the commitment, in which case it is a waste of your time.

1) How big is the lab/what kind of work would you be doing in Boston? Do you already have a project with your name on it, or just some vague promise of research experience? Boston is a great city, but you'll definitely chew through a lot of money if you want to live in the city. Even Brookline/Somerville/outlying areas are pricey and transportation isn't great. However, this could teach you a lot about the ortho field.

2) Realistically, what is the chance you'd be published with the gig in Amherst? I think you'd be building more of a resume with a publication than with listing experience at MGH. I see plenty of resumes listing interesting "experiences" but not all too many with publications going into medical school.

Research is nice, but publication in evolutionary biology is not going to really get surgical sub specialty attendings to pay attention to you. The vast majority of our applicants have general surgery or vascular surgery research experience. Many would rather see non-publication research in their field than random lab research with minor publication.

 

[URHere]

In all honesty, I wouldn't assume that your are going to get a publication out of either option. It takes most people several years of 50+ hour/week research to get their first meaningful publication. You may end up as a random middle author on something, but that's more luck than skill in most cases.

In terms of the experiences themselves, I would favor Boston simply because if you do decide to go for Ortho, you have already built connections with some strong people in the field. You may even be able to take on small clinical projects coming out of the lab, or travel back for a rotation once you're in medical school. If you keep in touch and end up applying to Ortho, a letter from that group could be very valuable.

Honestly though, what stood out to me the most from your post was that you work as an Uber driver. That's the kind of random and interesting thing people at my residency interviews love to talk about.

 

[haaaaaaaaaaveyoumetted]

I had the opportunity to stay in the city where my college was with many people from my school there, or to do more interesting research with greater networking available in a city I had never lived in. I chose the latter and it is 100% the right choice, despite being slightly scary at first.

Also I'm originally from the Boston area as well, and Boston has the highest concentration of college students than any city. I'd say don't be worried that you're "leaving" your social life behind, but enjoy what Boston has to offer! You are making a choice that can really help in your career. Additionally, you may be the only young person in your lab, but in the Longwood Medical area (MGH, DF, Children's, Beth-Israel) there are a huuuuuuge amount of recent grads working as techs and CRCs. I can guarantee there will be other people around the same age (I personally know of 10-20 recent grads from my school).

I'd say go to Boston and visit your friends in Amherst- it's not the longest bus ride in the world and this seems like a great opportunity