HPSP payback and GMOs

[johnsonamj]

I know questions about the scholarship have probably been beaten to death, but here are a few in which I really need the anwer to be spelled out....

I'm considering applying for the 4-year HPSP Navy scholarship. If I am offered the scholarship and I choose to accept it, what exactly are my commitments to the Navy? From what I can gather, after graduation, I would need to do a transitional or surgical internship for a year. Then, I would need to do a GMO. Is it required that a GMO be done before residency? How long are the GMOs? If I have a 4-year scholarship, is it paid back after 4 years of active duty?

Also, what are some of the coolest places people have been stationed to practice medicine? How does your training compare to that in the civilian world? Are you ready to run for the hills as soon as your commitment is complete, or do you think the Navy has the answers when it comes to practicing medicine?

Thanks for your answers in advance.

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[bobbyseal]

I should really be reading in Sabiston's right now, but instead I'm helping out other hpsper's.

"I'm considering applying for the 4-year HPSP Navy scholarship. If I am offered the scholarship and I choose to accept it, what exactly are my commitments to the Navy?"

You have a year commitment for each year of scholarship you take.

"From what I can gather, after graduation, I would need to do a transitional or surgical internship for a year. "

First year of residency, internship year, can be done with the navy. This does not add or reduce any commitment time.

"Then, I would need to do a GMO."

Most likely. Unless you matched in Neurosurgery or were one of the lucky ones who got selected to train straight through. I guess the Navy needs to pump out Neurosurgeons in particular because Neurosurgery has always trained straight through for the past3 years or so.

"Is it required that a GMO be done before residency?"

A GMO is not required, but more than likely.

"How long are the GMOs?"

1 year for hardship tour...Okinawa with the Marines. 3-4 years for dive medical officer or flight surgery.

"If I have a 4-year scholarship, is it paid back after 4 years of active duty?"

Commitment is paid back during your GMO tour and after residency. However, your residency will accrue commitment depending on how long your residency is and how much commitment you have left. For example, you owe 4 years upon getting an MD. You intern and still owe 4 years. You do a GMO, say 2 years, and now you owe 2. You come back for that awesome Ortho residency which is 4 years. Since 4 year residency is > than your 2 year commitment, you now owe 4 years again.

"Also, what are some of the coolest places people have been stationed to practice medicine? How does your training compare to that in the civilian world? Are you ready to run for the hills as soon as your commitment is complete, or do you think the Navy has the answers when it comes to practicing medicine?"

I haven't practiced med in the fleet yet. I'm still a little school boy.

"Thanks for your answers in advance."

Your welcome.

 

[Homunculus]

Originally posted by johnsonamj


I'm considering applying for the 4-year HPSP Navy scholarship.

save yourself the trouble of GMO's and apply to the Army

 

[militarymd]

Also, what are some of the coolest places people have been stationed to practice medicine? How does your training compare to that in the civilian world? Are you ready to run for the hills as soon as your commitment is complete, or do you think the Navy has the answers when it comes to practicing medicine?

Depends on what you call "cool"? Think about where the Navy and Marine Corp have personnel. Lots of ships, marine corp bases, and other deployed areas (like Iraq right now). I suppose if you get to go to Antarctica, that would be pretty cool.

Training is OK. I trained in the military. Most get Board Certified, but there are no world-class training intitutions in the military like Mass General or Mayo, but you make the best of it, and you do become a competent physician.

I've got 11 years, and I was ready for the hills almost from the beginning.

The military definitely doesn't get it when it comes to practicing medicine....at least not the way the civilian world does it, but then again the military is unique in its needs and wants....it is very schizophrenic....it says one thing then does another...you'll find out if you sign up.

 

[johnsonamj]

Originally posted by bobbyseal
You come back for that awesome Ortho residency which is 4 years. Since 4 year residency is > than your 2 year commitment, you now owe 4 years again.

Why is your commitment extended after residency? Why wouldn't it be just the rest of your two years? I haven't found anywhere in the literature that I have received that comments on this.

How does it work if you are thinking about going into family practice?

-Ann Marie

 

[idq1i]

Originally posted by Homonculus
save yourself the trouble of GMO's and apply to the Army

I still don't get how the navy continues to ignore congressional orders to stop the gmo insanity.

 

[johnsonamj]

What exactly are your duties while on a GMO? Do you get to practice medicine?

 

[Homunculus]

Originally posted by johnsonamj
What exactly are your duties while on a GMO? Do you get to practice medicine?

while i'm not sure *exactly* what GMO's do, generally they function as a PCP for relatively healthy populations, or in the case of flight surgeons or dive officers, populations with unique medical aspects to account for.

 

[haujun]

GMO stands for General Medical Officer. I know one O-6 Army medical physician recall very fond memory of leading a company of soldiers as a GMO.... It is not bad as most people think. You will learn quickly learn to develop the crucial military skills to take command in the company level. You will need to know how the personnel (S1), security (S2), training (S3) and maintenance (S4) play apart in running military smallest organization--company. Most if not all generals have extensive level of command experience... Just having and maintaining the excellent clinical skills will get you to O-6 with some difficulties.

 

[bobbyseal]

"Why is your commitment extended after residency? Why wouldn't it be just the rest of your two years?"

Your residency is considered part of your training. I'm not sure if this is just a Navy thing or a DOD wide thing. So, if you want to do a radiology residency or surgery, you're probably going to do a GMO and then owe 4 years still after residency.

You could still do internal or family med. Do a 2 year GMO, the rest of your residency is 2 years. Since 2 year residency = the 2 years of commitment left (assuming a 4 year original commitment) you wouldn't accrue any more commitment.

"I haven't found anywhere in the literature that I have received that comments on this."

Welcome to the military. Nothing is ever explained clearly until they have you stuck. Just listen to the militarymd. He's probably a Navy surgeon considering he said he's been in for 11 years

Intern year + 2 year GMO + 4 year surgery + 4 years left on commitment = 11 years.

just my hunch...

 

[GMO_52]

you could save yourself the trouble and take an Army scholarship or...you could recognize that the number of operational billets hasn't changed, just who goes. In the Navy, the expectation is that you take your turn as a GMO and then are much less likely to deploy thereafter. Ask Army primary care types if they like the current system as there is no such pool to suck up the operational billets. I like the GMO system because it shares the burden evenly.
Congress did NOT outlaw the GMO tour (despite what many a recruiter says); they outlawed unlicensed providers in operational billets. The Navy really pushes GMO's to get licensed and the day is probably not far off that they hold people at the hospital until that happens (it only took 4 weeks after I finished internship to get an Indiana license).

 

[denali]

Quick question regarding licensure and GMO ala GMO_52's post:

It is my intention to get my license in the state of Alaska, but they require 2 years of post-graduate education. If I were in the Navy, would they force me to get a license in a different state so I could do a GMO tour?

TIA,

 

[militarymd]

Originally posted by denali
Quick question regarding licensure and GMO ala GMO_52's post:

It is my intention to get my license in the state of Alaska, but they require 2 years of post-graduate education. If I were in the Navy, would they force me to get a license in a different state so I could do a GMO tour?

TIA,

yes

 

[johnsonamj]

So are there any HPSP'ers out there who are planning to be career military? What would be the benefits and/or drawbacks of staying in versus entering private practice as soon as your gig is up?

 

[idq1i]

Originally posted by GMO_52
Congress did NOT outlaw the GMO tour (despite what many a recruiter says); they outlawed unlicensed providers in operational billets. The Navy really pushes GMO's to get licensed and the day is probably not far off that they hold people at the hospital until that happens (it only took 4 weeks after I finished internship to get an Indiana license).

Outlaw, no. Strongly discourage, yes. I'll take Army's push to get everyone board-certified over Navy's push to get everyone licensed.

To the OP: The army is now in the process of assigning a pgy2 spot to every prelim position. If you get a prelim spot, you are pretty much guaranteed a transition to PGY2 (barring any mega-screwup on your part).

Can someone explain the Navy's need to get untrained physicians? This isn't meant to insult anyone doing a GMO tour. I really don't get the philosophy.

 

[bobbyseal]

From what I gather...

The Navy doesn't need people who are board certified in internal medicine to do testicular exams and give std advice to Marines who are 18-30 years old and stationed in a forward unit.

They might as well use junior physicians for that.

Frankly, how may CHF'ers do you see out in Iraq?