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I hate Neuroscience

Discussion in 'Allopathic' started by rodmichael82, Apr 28, 2013.

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  1. Kaustikos

    Kaustikos Klassy Gentleman

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    Yeah,
    Get comfortable with using books to study. I don't know if you're a first or second year, but the days of relying on what the professor says in class are gone for me. I had to force myself to move away from that and study via books...tough learning experience.

    I'd also like to add Clinical Neuro Made Simple... and Fundamental Neuroscience. Read Clinical made simple beforehand and then use the fundamental neuroscience with the notes in class. The nice part was my prof was pretty much an expert on this subject. The bad part was the prof was an expert on the subject... and would just go off tangent or just get really worked up on the tracts. We'd be on one slide showing the cerebellospinal tract and she'd talk about the entire thing using that slide and not miss anything. :eek: And then we'd realize the next 5 slides say just that. She just really loves it.
  2. notbobtrustme

    notbobtrustme Crux Terminatus

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    everything is gray and white and stupid and confusing and nothing makes sense and it's all stupid arbitrary pieces of ****.

    **** this class.
  3. Anastomoses

    Anastomoses secretly an end artery Gold Donor

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    Uh oh. Can neuroscience do that? :p
  4. Kaustikos

    Kaustikos Klassy Gentleman

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    Neuro isn't arbitrary...

    It's not easy man. But here's some help - http://headneckbrainspine.com/

    That's how I aced the first exam/identification. Now I feel really comfortable navigating the brain on MRI's. I can tell what's what. Can I tell lesions? Hell no. But that comes w/ practice...and I've never seen mri lesions regularly.
  5. Planes2Doc

    Planes2Doc I am one happy Chinese girl!

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    It's a little too academic for my taste.
  6. Kaustikos

    Kaustikos Klassy Gentleman

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    Some, yes... but if you seem to think that neuro isn't clinical for the most part... I guess they didn't teach you the correlation. The only issue I've had dealt with the cerebellar signaling/pathways, but there's a lot of clinical associations to what you learn in Neuro. Especially in emergency situations when you test for pupillary response, doll's eye reflex, decorticate/cerebrate rigidity, etc etc.
  7. BlaseFaire

    BlaseFaire

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  8. notbobtrustme

    notbobtrustme Crux Terminatus

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    Neuro is completely arbitrary in that you can't follow anything. It's pure memorization.

    Why does the caudate nucleus project to the substania nigra and globus pallidus external? Why does it use several different NTs? Why do pyrimadal neurons decussate while motor outputs from the trigeminal don't? Why are C fibers unmyelinated while alpha and beta fibers are?

    Nothing in neuro is straightforward or deduciable. At least in physiology you can the 10 or so rules for each organ system and then deduce your way out from there. In neuro, there's nothing like that. You just have to know the circuits, the NTs, etc etc. That's what I mean by arbitrary.
  9. Salinas

    Salinas

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    I see what you are saying, but that arbitrary information is just the groundwork for the important stuff. Even in physio/biochem you have to memorize certain pathways, molecules, and structures in order to have to tools to deduce your way to answers (esp. board type questions). I found that spending a lot of time up front in neuro, making sure I understood the anatomy and structures really helped me when we got to the tricky stuff about lesions, and neural pathways.
  10. Kaustikos

    Kaustikos Klassy Gentleman

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    That's why you think it's arbitrary? These are pathways setup to best deliver information between different parts of the brain. It's about processing and efficacy. The names are arbitrary, sure, I'll give you that. But every organ name is like that. But the whole pathways aren't. Relay points are important when you're trying to decipher the type of information being sent and where to send it to. You can't just have the dorsal column pathway go straight to the cortex without relaying at different sites/neurons. That makes sense to me...

    Decussation has been shown to significantly reduce errors in wiring/signal transduction. It's a highly efficacious way of sending information without screwing things up.

    But I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree
  11. notbobtrustme

    notbobtrustme Crux Terminatus

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    Does it really make sense to process the visual field in the occipital lobe as opposed to the frontal? Given how important visual information is (eg something running at you), shouldn't the shortest distance for information travel make the most sense? Why flip and invert the visual field? Of course, there may be some underlying reason why this is most efficient. Most of it is probably due to evolutionary accidents, not some grand design.

    That's just one example. Sure you can talk about information processing and ****, but at the same time, every pathway is arbitrary in the brain. Contrast that with the heart, where there are specific and fairly straightforward demands to be met. If you know the rules behind the heart, just about everything makes sense. There's arbitrary BS in each organ system (eg norepi vs epi, there's no real reason why norepi constricts while epi dilates, the system could work perfectly fine if the roles of epi and norepi were reversed), but the sheer number of arbitrary garbage in neuro is unparalleled.
    Last edited: May 13, 2013
  12. Kaushik

    Kaushik I'm on a horse. Moderator Emeritus

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    I can see both sides of the argument. There is a decent amount of memorization (more so than physio, at least).

    However, my personal opinion is that once you do lay down that foundation (by memorizing tracts and pathways), problem-solving in neuro becomes much more thinking-intensive (and fun!). It's sort of how the immune system works -- in the beginning, there's a fair bit of memorization but, once you've got the vocabulary down, the immune response is incredibly conceptual and predictable.

    Anyways, that's just my opinion on it. Oh, if you guys are having difficulty with the brainstem and brainstem syndromes, google "rule of 4 brainstem" for an excellent article (by Gates, I think) on a simplified way of recognizing these syndromes.
  13. BlaseFaire

    BlaseFaire

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    I already linked the article, homie.
  14. Kaushik

    Kaushik I'm on a horse. Moderator Emeritus

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    Ah, my bad! I'm on my phone, so I didn't look through the entirety of the thread before posting.
  15. BlaseFaire

    BlaseFaire

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  16. Planes2Doc

    Planes2Doc I am one happy Chinese girl!

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    Speaking of vision... Blobs.
  17. rodmichael82

    rodmichael82

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    Amen!
  18. ronnicus

    ronnicus

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    Do you guys think taking 2 quarters of neurobiology in college would have helped much?
  19. DermViser

    DermViser Probationary Status

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    Well it's been a year since that thread started with the last post, but I'll try to answer you. I think an undergraduate Neurobiology course will help with getting the lingo down, but it also depends on what is covered in the course. I would say the hardest part of Neurosci is Neuroanatomy.
    dadaddadaBATMAN and xffan624 like this.
  20. ronnicus

    ronnicus

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    Thanks for responding- these are the course descriptions:
    MCDB 151. Neurobiology I: Cellular Organization and Biophysics of the Nervous System
    Properties of the nervous system ranging from single cells to the whole organism, using examples from vertebrates and invertebrates studied in terms of morphology, physiology, and behavior.
    MCDB 152. Neurobiology II: Molecular and Cellular Neurobiology
    This second course of a three quarter neurobiology course sequence (151/152/153) covers both top down systems level approaches and bottom up molecular approaches to major topics in neurobiology. These topics include mechanisms of sensory transduction in at least two selected sensory systems, processing of sensory information within the brain, mechanisms of muscle control, cell signaling, neuronal plasticity, neuronal polarity, and the mapping of neural information to the brain.

    What do you think? Is it worth working harder senior year just to take these classes?
  21. DermViser

    DermViser Probationary Status

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    Doesn't sound like they'd be too useful based on the lack of emphasis on Human Neuroanatomy and gross neuroanatomical structures/tracts.
  22. NeuroSpeed

    NeuroSpeed Capt. Obvious

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    I was a neuroscience major in undergrad. Those courses would help. Vertebrate neuroanatomy isn't all that different from human (the shape of the brains is different, but all the structures/functions are pretty much the same). That said, having those courses will not make your med school neuroscience easy. Also, lots of people go into med school barely knowing where the brain is, and still do fine. So you just need to decide if you want the extra work now or later.

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