Hey guys so I recently graduated with a 2.9 science gpa (I know it's bad) from a public university. I'm just so lost right now. Note that I have this low gpa due to family issues (passing away of close family members) not because I didn't want to try. Fortunately however I had my depression treated and Im ready. Also I was a History major so I only took around 58-60 science units. I have also been studying a good amount of MCAT because I plan to start my diy post bacc in the spring. (I have also taken all my pre reqs beside physics) I am also not from a well off family so cost is a issue. Is it okay for me to take my post bacc at a CC for DO assuming I take difficult classes? (i.e. Microbio, anatomy, physio, cell bio, etc.?) I plan to take around 30 units of post bacc work with hopefully all A's going forward. Please give me advice! Thank you!
I want to reinvent myself
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Goro's advice for pre-meds who need reinvention
So you want to be a doctor, but your GPA is terrible. Is that the end? Rule #1: Take a deep breath, and stop fussing. The sky is not falling. But you are going to need to reinvent yourself. This will take both time and money. And always remember that you’re in a marathon now, not a sprint...
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would taking my post bacc DIY at a CC be acceptable tho?Goro's advice for pre-meds who need reinvention
So you want to be a doctor, but your GPA is terrible. Is that the end? Rule #1: Take a deep breath, and stop fussing. The sky is not falling. But you are going to need to reinvent yourself. This will take both time and money. And always remember that you’re in a marathon now, not a sprint...
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As referenced in gordo's post, yes.
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Yes
okay thank you! I'm also working but only around 19 hours a week from early evening to 8 so I think it's doable. I was thinking of starting off taking two science courses to test the waters (Physics and an upper div bio) and then doing the other courses during the summer quarter and the following fall. So I plan on taking cell bio, microbio, anatomy. What other courses would you suggest Goro? and how about extracurricular and clinical? would volunteering at a hospital and doing a community service org suffice? I already know some docs I can shadow.
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I suggest immunology, developmental biology, genetics, biochemistry (with lab component if possible), cancer biology, endocrinology, neurobiology, pharmacology. Anything that is similar to what is offered in medical school.
Most applicants apply with:
1. Clinical volunteering - it is absolutely crucial. I suggest getting at least 150 hours. Hospitals always need volunteers in their ER, and it provides insight into a DO-friendly field.
2. Research - the field that you join doesn't matter as long as you stick with it. Don't worry so much about being published.
3. Non-clinical EC's - volunteer at a homeless shelter, soup kitchen, etc. Join something you're passionate about.
4. Shadowing - try to shadow at least 2 physicians. Aim for at least 50 hours in a primary care setting. I recommend shadowing another physician in a subspecialty. Extra points for your application if you can obtain a DO letter. Extra-extra points if you witness a DO performing OMM.
5. Paid clinical experience - most popular jobs include medical assistant, medical scribing, phlebotomist, EMT.
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Agree 100%!
Thank you! I already have volunteered at a hospital over the years and I plan on doing a Community Service org that I like and some other EC's. Do I need research? And I will def try my hardest to get a DO shadowing LOR in a primary care setting. I volunteered at the VA for over 100 hours in the past. Should I continue this and do my previous hours spent volunteering at the VA hospital count over the past years toward my future application?
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The importance of research experience heavily depends on the schools you apply to. There are certainly some DO schools that emphasize it, and some that do not.
Lack of research isn't a deal breaker if the rest of your ECs are stellar.
I would argue, with the increasing competitiveness of DO school apps, that it would be wise to have some research experience under your belt.
My undergrad is in nursing and I did not want to spend the $$ at a four year college. My post bacc is almost entirely from a CC except for human physiology and genetics and I have 3 acceptances so far. I don't think CC credits will hurt you as long as you do well in them. As far as research, I did a "SURF" summer undergraduate research fellowship at one of the medical schools and it did come up positively in one of my interviews. I don't think it's required, but it helps. I knew TCOM placed importance on research so I did it solely for that reason.
Did you mess up in undergrad at all? My gpa was pretty much low after freshman year due to family passing
I had a downward trend in senior year to a B average due to work/clinicals, but many schools have a section for you to explain low MCAT/GPA, etc and that would be a good place for you to formulate a well thought out response.
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Med school wants to see you be able to take a full load of classes (15 credits) and do well in them.
Anyone can get a 4.0 with 6 credits.
You need GPA at a 3.4, MCAT above a 500, + shadowing / letters / EC like volunteering and clinical work does lots of on an app.
Any hobbies? clubs? sports? Need to show you are a person outside of med field and school as well.
Doing all this in a year's time is doable, esp at a CC, make sure you take your shot.
Good luck.
yes i understand. But im going to start with just two courses so I can get an idea and kind of test the waters. Then I'll take more. Any advice on getting LOR? Should I get some from profs at a CC?
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Do well in their course and actively participate in class (but don't go overboard and become "that guy/girl"). Show up in office hours with genuine questions about class itself and about their research interests (it may even lead to a research position). Towards the end, set up a meeting and tell your professor about your desire to go to med school. Don't be afraid to ask for a STRONG LOR. The last thing you want is a wishy-washy cookie cutter template LOR that will destroy your application. If they seem reluctant then steer clear. Be very clear about your application timeframe. Send them a detailed email a few months ahead of time with LOR requirements (letterhead & signature), instructions on how to upload (AMCAS/AACOMAS/interfolio/etc.) and a due date. Your goal is to make it as easy as possible for them.
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Yeah I would email teachers I got a 4.0 in and tell them my deal and ask them to write one for me. I think I even got one from a class I got a 3.0 in (genetics ugh). Also, obvi get letters from DO/MD you shadow as well.
Thanks for all the input guys! I was thinking of doing a big brother big sister volunteer program and I currently tutor (paid private center for mostly younger kids) so maybe connect all the dots and point to pediatrics when I apply? And do you think July 2021 (1.64 years from now) is a reasonable time to apply? I still need to do more EC's, LOR, shadowing, MCAT, and courses. I've also already started studying for the MCAT but started a few months after graduation due to personal reasons.
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It is certainly reasonable to apply in 2021 but remember it's not a race. Apply when you're ready, even if that means sending your app in 2022 or beyond.
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Just curious: Is clinical volunteering necessary if I have thousands of hours of paid healthcare experience ranging from Hospital Phlebotomist(6-7000), in home patient care tech(4000), and oncology MA(~500)?
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Nope. The actual requirement is clinical exposure, whether paid or not
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This is more or less what I did. Current M3. Definitely a viable strategy, but you need to get A's.
The rules change a bit for nontrads. Anyone can get a 4.0 with 6 credits, if that is all they are doing. Getting a 4.0 with 6-8 credits and working a full time job with a family? Much harder than a 4.0 with 15 credits when that's the only thing in your life.
First off, big brother big sister is great. As goro already said, just pick something you like and do it consistently. I talked about volunteering at most of my intervies.
It sounds like your schedule is reasonable. Just remember to reassess as you get closer and don't rush the MCAT if you aren't ready. Good luck. You can do this.
Thank you guys again! One more question. So I checked my CC course schedule and I can only take one science course rn to avoid conflict with my other life. So I'm volunteering at the hospital, big brother big sister, working, taking care of family, etc. I was wondering if only taking one course would be fine rn? after this semester I'm gonna quit work and all my other obligations will be more manageable. The next two semesters I will take 3 courses each so 6/7 in total. (1 this semester, 2/3 the next semester, and 3 the final fall semester). Do you guys think this is fine? thx
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Sounds fine imo.
Hey guys so I register today. Do you think an integrated medical science course would be a good course to take? It is one of the only ones it seems I can take this semester. It covers fundamental anatomy/physio as well as physical/chemical principles. It's a course under Biology.
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I don't see why not
Hi guys. I just wanted to ask for advice during this pandemic. So I've been taking Integrated Medical Science since I made this post and I'm 99% sure I'm going to get an A. Next semester I'm going to take Physics 1(to finish pre req) and General Anatomy to boost science gpa. My last semester (fall) I plan on taking General Physio, Microbio, and Physics 2. Does this seem like a good schedule? All together I would have taken 24 units in science courses since I graduated undergrad. Is this enough to show I reinvented myself assuming I get a 3.6+ overall in these 24 units? Also any advice on how to get volunteering and shadowing done during this pandemic? I was thinking maybe driving food to nursing homes and delivering food for people who cannot go out due to the covid 19? P.S. I'm studying for the MCAT right now as well and I plan on taking it sometime this year when the Covid 19 situation blows over.
@Goro Any input? your feedback is very good.
I think 24 would be ok (not great), but 36 credits would definitely be better...
okay thanks. and for the record I was a non science major and I had only around 59 units of science credit when I graduated (last year) so I wasn't like a bio major who took like 200 units of science classes. Does that improve my chances? or would you still recommend taking 36 units?
Since you are ok with DO, 24+ would be ok as long as you can get a 3.6+ GPA (I am assuming your final sGPA will be ~3.2). If you want a shot a MD, I would recommend 36+ and a good MCAT score.
oh I have my eyes set on DO I don't even think I'll apply too MD. What types of DO schools would I be okay to apply for? All of them or only certain ones? And what MCAT score should I go for? (I'm going to of course try my best but what score would be acceptable)
Some DO schools (CCOM, AZCOM, the ones in CA etc...) have stats that are close or even better than some MD schools. Your chances will be low for these schools unless you have a spectacular MCAT score (512+).
Let's say at the end of your 24+ units, you have cGPA/sGPA 3.3+/3.2+, you will need a 500+ MCAT to have shot a many of the newly DO schools. The higher MCAT score, the better.
okay thank you! Would you say if I have good letters of rec, volunteer, ecs, etc. and I got a 505 would I have a good shot at the newer ones/lower tier ones? Assuming I get a 3.2/3.3 sgpa after of course and all the other areas in the application filled. And I live in CA so I'm prob not gonna apply to the high tier ones unless I kill it on the MCAT. And would you suggest private ones over public ones for the out of state schools?
505 MCAT score would definitely make you competitive for ?most DO schools... When I applied in 2013-2014 cycle, almost all DO schools (except for Michigan, Ohio, West Virginia) were private. Not sure how many are public now. WVCOM was/is out of state friendly. Find schools that your stats would be competitive for and apply accordingly.
Okay thanks so much! Sorry for all the questions! So I was thinking that when I apply I am going to show an interest in being a pediatrician. Currently I'm a private tutor (for an organization) that tutors children, I am a big brother big sister (child mentor), and I aim to shadow a pediatrician. (DO doctor) I also want to volunteer for like a homeless shelter too and I did 100+ hours of working at the veterans hospital. Should I put all those on my application when I apply to show interest in pediatry?
These are good ECs and you should definitely put them in your application... I can tell you that most people enter med school with a specialty in mind and the vast majority of them choose a different specialty by the time they are applying for residency. You can definitely show your interest in peds, but keep an open mind once you got into med school.
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Yah i just wanted to put that because it goes along a narrative. like my extracurriculars shadowing etc. all relate with each other. Do you have any other suggestions? so so far I'm doing volunteering at hospital, big brother big sister, shadowing a DO. anything else I should do? I'm hoping to get letters of rec from a DO, my professors in my DIY postbacc, and the big brother big sister coordinator/hospital volunteer director
Now go ahead and do well in the units you are going to take... Do NOT underestimate the MCAT. See if you can get 100+ hrs of shadowing (preferably 2 physicians in different specialty eg. peds and another specialty). Good luck!
Thank you! Yes I know how hard the MCAT is. I'm planning on looking at the khan academy videos and I have Kaplan and Berkeley Review. I was thinking of getting an MCAT course but I think I can handle it on my own. Did you take an MCAT course? also if you don't mind what stats did you have? and what ecs/letter of rec did you have? sorry once again for all the questions. I'm just trying to get prepared early for my application.
I don't recommend an MCAT course. I took the MCAT in 2013 and I used Berkley for almost everything and Princeton review for biology. The MCAT did not have Sociology and Psychology when I took it. My cGPA/sGPA were 3.4/3.5 MCAT was 27 (which is probably 505 in the new scale now). I was a nurse for ~7 yrs when I applied. I had over 100+ volunteer hrs for Habitat for Humanity. I had hundreds hrs tutoring nursing students. I only shadowed one DO, but I did not have to since I was a RN. I had 1 LOR from that DO, 1 from a Biology2 professor and another Letter from a Gen chem1 professor.
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