IMG/FMG Union?

[Hirurg]

So here is an idea!
Why not all IMG/FMG's unite under some organization, that will serve as an evaluation/certification body as well as support group. Since US MD's and DO's have their own, IMG/FMG's should have one too. IMG/FMG's are treated differently anyway, so why not unite and be able to lobby in DC for FMG/IMG's rights. I think such move will provide needed support to those who have decided to go international for their medical education, whether pre or post grad. I know some of you will say that such move will deepen the separation between US grads and FMG/IMG's, but I say forget about it...This gap is already there, so why not build a tower in the side of FMG/IMG's that will serve as a lighthouse for those who are trying to swim to happy profession life in USand an amplifier for voices of those who are in the danger of drowning.
What are your thoughts on that idea?

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[Devdas]

It is a great idea.
In the United Kingdom, FMGs have united and formed a body called "Overseas Doctors Association" some 20 years ago.It is a powerful association with thousands of FMGs.It fights for the cause of Overseas doctors.It plays role in policy making and works in close association with General Medical Council of UK.
I have wondered why something like that does not exist in this free country?

 

[leorl]

That's a wonderful idea! Heck, I'd support it even if I stayed in the US for med. school. The gap between FMG/IMGs is already rather large, although that perception is starting to change, especially in favor of FMGs. I don't think starting a "union" will deepen or sever ties, it would serve to strengthen bonds between FMGs and among the US medical community. Such a union would actually be quite helpful...in helping all the confused FMGs/IMGs-to-be like us right now and be a link for the future (frat-ish?) hehe! Hmm, v. interesting!

 

[Hirurg]

Look! I found a page that reminds me very much of the idea above. Though, the union would serve better to the interests of IMG's in the areas of political and social approval.
Check it out! If with G-d's blessing We are to finnish our education in Medical school, we should concider it as an option until the union is formed.
www.imgi.org

 

[Devdas]

Hi leorl,

I am not sure what you mean by saying that FMG/IMGs are "confused"? and "like us"?

Who said IMGs are confused? Who said that IMGs want to be like you?
According to your recent posts you are looking to join some D.O course.You cannot make that statement without having any first hand experience with IMGs/FMGs?
How many IMGs have you met and known personally?

I appreciate your comments that FMG union can bridge IMGs and AMGs.
Let me know about your understanding about IMGs.I am ready to clear any doubts if you have about IMGs.
For your information,IMGs have crystal clear ideas about themselves and they just want to be IMGs not like anyone.
I am just clearing your wrong opinion.

 

[leorl]

Whoa bud, you need to chill. Maybe you don't fit the bill, but there are plenty of people who visit these boards for clarification and research of foreign or internal schools with multiple postings just to gather ALL information possible and make informed decisions about the rest of their lives. That process, and deciding how to spend 4+ years possibly dealing with not-so-favorable issues such as reception back in the US is stressful and yes, confusing. No need to get spastic about it.

I'm not looking into being a DO currently. I posted on those boards and here to see what it was all about, and although I agree with DO philosophy, have chosen the allopathic route. I've made many more posts concerning non-DO issues. I have many FMG friends who've been very helpful, whom I met on my previous year abroad. You don't have your facts straight, so before you go jumping to insulting conclusions about my lack of support or knowlegde about IMGs, stuff it. You couldn't possibly know anything about me or my motivations.

SO WHY DON'T WE FOCUS ON THE TOPIC AT HAND? IS ANYONE INTERESTED IN GETTING AN FMG/IMG ORG. STARTED? I think it would be tremendously beneficial!

 

[Dreamer]

I am for it, however I can see problem, which potentially can rip the union apart. That means we have two categories of FMG: those who were born in the US and are citizens and those who immigrated here. Since these two categories are treated somehow different, I am afraid of , ahh some misunderstanding.

 

[Hirurg]

Hey Dreamer!
Why would you be concerned with that!??
FMG's and IMG's are only different in the eyes of immigration questionares!!!
The union could be the tool of lobbying for the rights of both. The underseved areas in US could benefit from both groups equaly. As well as both groups would benefit from the union. The union could, however, have a clause that would engage both groups since the primary concern of the union would be medical/professional issues and not political/immigration problems. Maybe the membership of the union would be split in to two groups with each receiving specific services based on the immigration status. Or maybe all members would have equal access to all services available, but the issues of FMG's would be addressed especially, since they are the most under-priveledged.
The membership fees would possibly cover the expences tied with specific needs of FMG's and/or IMG's.
The main thing is that we all would be unified under the professional cap rather than under political stigma-mask.
How about that???
And how do we proceed?

 

[Devdas]

Hirurg,

You are wrong.IMGs and FMGs are not different only in the eyes of Immigration dept.
They are looked different and treated different at all levels right from Residency selection to Hospital day to day life.FMGs have an edge over IMGs because of their American nationality.They are certainly not same.

I do not know the real reason for discrimination.I think, it is just because they were born in different countries,they look different and they do not have original American accent.They also have struggle in blending with American medical main stream.

It takes years for an IMG to be accepted to American medical mainstream.It depends on Individual IMG's qualities and skills to get that recognition.

Coming to the formation of IMG/FMG Union,the union will not survive without scores of Foriegn medical graduates who can really add REAL POWER to the union.

I hate the classification of AMGs,IMGs,FMGs etc....there should be only two...Good Physician and Bad Physician.

 

[Devdas]

Hirurg,

I am bit confused about the IMG/FMG Nomenclature after reading your message again.

I am a Physician who graduated from a Foriegn Med school.I am not an American citizen.What is my Medical ID?

IMG or FMG?. Please clarify.

 

[leorl]

Technically you are an FMG (just any foreign medical graduate, regardless of nationality). However, I've recently been told that everyone is lumped into the IMG category, which I'm a bit confused about, but would adhere more to your view that nationality should have no play in the reception received in the US. I haven't checked it out yet, but this same person also told me that the ecfmg site refers to everyone who trained outside the continental US as img's.

As far as I understand, here's how it goes: FMGs have two categories - those who are US citizens and those who aren't (emigrees, possibly naturalized citizens, etc.)who've studied anywhere not within the US sphere. IMGs probably have those two categories too, but most likely are US citizens who chose to study in the caribbeans, grenada, cuba, etc. where the US still has a bit of control.

Unfortunately, you're probably right about the reception for those who "do not have the American accent" for various reasons besides subtle discrimination and closed mindss. But you know, I think you probably will find that anywhere in the world besides your country of origin. I don't think the differences in the way FMGs born in the US vs. those from other countries are treated really has as much to do with the medical profession as it does with whole societal perceptions, although I could be having a naive view. It'll be a bit hard to change any way, the best is to just earn respect by the quality of your work - easier said than done.

 

[ckent]

FMG=IMG. FMG: Foreign medical graduate, IMG: International medical graduate. FMG is the old term used to describe IMGs, a lot of people still use it, but it's not as politically correct as IMG. The terminology was changed because FMG makes all FMGs sound foreign even though a lot have been practicing in this country a long time and a good number are US citizens or become US citizens.

 

[Devdas]

Thanks for the clarification leorl

I prefer to be called IMG...it is cool and sounds stylish like BMW brand!
FMG sounds outdated.

I am sorry, if I had sounded little bit rude in my first message.It is just misunderstanding.

 

[Hirurg]

Why are discussing IMG vs. FMG???
The question of the day is would all foreign trained physicians no matter US cit. or not benefit from a union that could fight for the recognition of skills and rights of members.
!!!
Maybe the union should have a standard USMLE and CSA pass score???
!!!
Img, Fmg...who cares....there always will be some group of a**holes that will scream that we are taking their jobs....So forget about the differences, cncentrate on the union and what rules and functions it could have.
So far I do not see people coming up with ideas...only arguments on the differences between IMG's and FMG's.
Go past IT!
Make some practical remarks. The union can not function on the definitions of differences between individuals.
I guess the bitter feeling of FMG's and IMG's and stockup AMG's opinions are there to stay for a while, but please lets not get entangled in that net.
Think union...Think better recognition...Think positevely.
Peace to all!

 

[Hirurg]

Why are discussing IMG vs. FMG???
The question of the day is would all foreign trained physicians no matter US cit. or not benefit from a union that could fight for the recognition of skills and rights of members.
!!!
Maybe the union should have a standard USMLE and CSA pass score???
!!!
Img, Fmg...who cares....there always will be some group of a**holes that will scream that we are taking their jobs....So forget about the differences, cncentrate on the union and what rules and functions it could have.
So far I do not see people coming up with ideas...only arguments on the differences between IMG's and FMG's.
Go past IT!
Make some practical remarks. The union can not function on the definitions of differences between individuals.
I guess the bitter feeling of FMG's and IMG's and stockup AMG's opinions are there to stay for a while, but please lets not get entangled in that net.
Think union...Think better recognition...Think positevely.
Peace to all!


Oh and by the way I would prefer be called Just Dr. so-and-so. rather than be concerned with being IMG or FMG.

 

[leorl]

Hmm,

That's an idea - USLME and CSA scores for entrance into the Union - it would certainly clear up queries about legitimacy and ability, and prove further standardization to US expectations.

On the other hand, it could be a little counterproductive b/c the purpose of a union is to help all IMGs, is it not? I'm afraid having a cut-off score or something might be elitist. Residency admissions/doctors concentrate on your scores anyway which prove your capabilities, so a union which reinforces that you got good scores or whatever, might be unnecessary.

Still looking for further models

 

[Devdas]

What would you name the union?

American Association of IMGs?
American Association of FMGs?
American Association of Overseas Medical Graduates?

AMA has IMG division of the Association.
It is not a bad idea for the union to be affliated to the bigger bodies like AMA or something else like that to get instant recognition.

There are many smaller Associations all over the US representing IMGs of different countries.As I know India,Pakistan,China etc like countries having their separate association helping out their country MDs.Those smaller associations should unite to form a big representative body.

There should not be any borders separating IMGs.There should not be any USMLE scores or CSA which limits the membership.
Any IMG who is residing in the US before Residency or after Residency should be able to get help from the proposed union.

The senior IMGs in this country could be the advisors.
The main objective of the union must be only to guide the IMGs and represent them if they need help.

I think the union first needs Official registration.

 

[Hirurg]

How about World Physician Union???

May be charters of the union will open in different countries, hence comes support from a particular country medical community.

There has to be some sort of standard to be used for admission to the union.
What would it be?

We need more people to participate in the discussion!!!
Brainstorming such complicated issue should done with more than 3 people.

 

[Hirurg]

No more thoughts on that matter?
Just wondering....
I thought that such topic would produce big response. But I guess everyone is studying their brains out
Oh well!
If time is necessary...we have tons of it!