I care, okay? But I'm not stupid. So here's the short version:
If you want to stay in Minnesota, want strong big-name surg path training and are willing to work WAAAY harder than you will work at UMN, then I would go to Mayo. I think med students often end up staying at UMN for residency because the hours are much more family-friendly (Mayo sounds like it has amazing support for family members though) or because the Twin Cities metro area is – to sufficient numbers of people who don't mind the winters – just so freaking awesome. (Srsly!) And then some go to Mayo for fellowship. In the grand scheme of things, UMN is a mid-tier program. Check out my previous posts on the subject.
The long version:
To the OP –
I know, I know, the Saturday mass interview. Recent change. We tried, but they said it was the best solution in terms of scheduling faculty from 4 different sites.
The surg path fellowship was one of the few (if any) remaining PGY-4 fellowships (internal residents basically forfeited a year's worth of elective months). It was cancelled for two reasons: After the last ACGME site visit, more mandatory rotations (e.g. derm and renal/EM if I'm not mistaken) were introduced, and time-wise it was no longer possible to cram in a fellowship "year". Also, the ACGME decided not to allow double-dipping any more i.e. calling a PGY-4 resident a fellow. So not really any legal action there.
The two residents who left during my time there, went into family med and internal med.
I think the med students don't necessarily get the best experience on surg path at the U – I don't know where the scheduling occurs in the medical school administration, but sometimes there are too many of them on at once and they mostly seemed not to be aware that they could do a rotation at HCMC (Hennepin County Med Ctr), which is much more hands-on. I usually recommend people go to the HCME for autopsy experience, and HCMC for surg path (usually includes some hospital autopsies).
EDIT: Or do hemepath. That's a good move if you want hands-on learning and if you want to get into the program.
Dr. Crosson interviewed me, retired the year I started, and came back on to help as program director because of Dr. Rose's illness. I believe he (Dr. Crosson) is still active within the CAP. He has good grasp of PP/community pathology – he "gets" the challenges affecting community pathologists more than any other pathologist of his seniority that I've met (the vast majority seem blissfully unaware).
As for "the program is not good in teaching", like I've said before, it's a mid-tier program. Comparing notes with a fellow at a different mid-tier program who graduated from UMN, I was told that UMN had spottier teaching, but more knowledgeable faculty.
I usually try to avoid subjective descriptors like "pimping". I can think of a few Socratic method-type senior faculty, which you will probably run into anywhere if you're into learning anything. The best way to handle these situations no matter where you end up, is simply to say something. Give the question your best shot, or say you don't know. I still use this. Prolonging the silence just makes it painful for everybody in the room, and makes you seem slow as opposed to thinking on your feet. Some may disagree saying 1st year residents don't know anything, but I counter by saying attendings' expectations of 1st year residents are pretty low in general.
Overall I felt my AP/CP training was adequate: I passed boards on my first try, I'm at a BEEEEEEEEEEEEEEG-Name medical center
doing a surg path fellowship (for which my Abbott-Northwestern private practice rotations most prepared me for – internally regarded for various reasons as the most difficult surg path rotation, which also motivates some residents to try to avoid it), and I have a subspecialty fellowship lined up for the following year without having to pick up my every freaking thing and move AGAIN. I think those things count.
Would I have done it again? Reviewing my rank-order list of 7 mid-tier programs, I think I made the right choice for me (I'm a plain-MD IMG).
I wasn't the best resident in my class though I was probably above average. (Lake Wobegon effect?). Of my class, the most savvy and hardworking AMG went straight out of AP/CP into a small group a few hours away from the Cities. Three are in fellowships, another two are off-cycle from babies. The 6-months maternity thing has to be seen to be believed. I think that is a pretty strong indicator of non-malignancy.
Of all the UMN fellowships, the strongest is hemepath because of Dr. McKenna and because UMN has traditionally had relatively strong CP training. So if you're dead-sure you want to do hemepath, going to UMN will give you a leg up in terms of getting that fellowship. Dr. McKenna instituted MUCH more hemepath scope conference and lecture time after he arrived from UTSW, so I am at a loss to explain why the resident(s) you spoke to would say they hardly see him, apart from that he recently inherited both the positions of director of hemepath, as well as I think hemepath fellowship director. When I did a lymph node elective rotation last January, he let me borrow his study set and see some of his personal consults. Rawr.
I think I came out of the program fairly competent in heme, cyto, GI, GU and Gyn, which are the areas I actually see myself practicing in. I paid attention during slide conferences. I made unknown conferences a priority, and complained when they were getting cancelled too often (that always makes you friends) – there's a more rigorous conference schedule now. I looked up cases after attendings signed them out to see how they actually worded the reports (tedious, but rewarding especially as you progress through residency). I published a paper and a half. Oh, and I learnt to ask. Ask questions, and ask for things.
It may be hard to see, but there are strengths.
(The four rotation sites that they talk about I simply regard as a neutral characteristic of the program – the advantages and disadvantages pretty much cancel each other out.)
Because of the fairly generous UMN book fund, I own more free books than any other fellow in my current program. I went to USCAP every year except for the year that I went to Paris (paid for up to $1500). There are some good support staff who will keep you out of trouble. There are plenty of resources for those who are motivated (you will have to make your own connections though – versus at some other mid-tier programs where faculty seem to put a great deal of effort into getting grads fellowships and jobs).
~
So there you have it.
If I put the time that I spent posting about UMN into writing papers, my name would be all over teh PubMed.
