It is possible to take time off after GMO and residency

[Aegis]

I just wanted to share my story here real briefly, mainly because I took a big risk doing something and couldn't find a lot of information about if it was possible before I did it.

I did HPSP, did my intern year and then did my pay back (4 years of flight surgery). THEN I took a whole year off to travel the world before starting residency again. I separated in July 0f 14 from the AF with a plan to start residency in July of 2015. I came home in December and stacked all my interviews for FM back to back so as not to waste time.

Before my interviews I was sweating rocks not knowing if civilian programs would be overly concerned about what I've been up to over the last several months, or the rest of the year and if that would look poorly or not.

Turns out, nobody cared! They were too focused on my military service, and that seemed to overshadow the fact that I had just snuck in a year off. Or they thought it was great, and I was met with envy not concern when the question came up. Now I'm going into the match fully confident that I will have my choice of residency, and there are several programs that have expressed their interest in me.

Yes, I think being an intern again will suck, and starting residency after time off will be rough. I've been studying as I go to keep up, and even tried volunteering a couple of times just to keep my brain halfway in the game, so I know the challenge I'm facing in a few months. But, I'm sitting on a beach right now in the Maldives going scuba diving...so it's worth it in my mind.

I write this not to show off, or put everyones face in the mud, but just to show that it's an option and it's possible if you want it to be. I was out there a year ago and couldn't find anyone who did this. People typically take time off to do research, pursue another job, etc. I just wanted to vagabond and not really think too hard about medicine and expand other horizons. Anyway, it's possible, especially if your a GMO type with enough experience to buffer a hole in your CV.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[notdeadyet]

Yes, I think being an intern again will suck, and starting residency after time off will be rough....

I'm glad you're happy with your progress and hope you are happy with where you match. But the Key point in your post that sticks out for me is that you had to repeat your intern year and after going into family, a non-competitive specialty (I say this with zero snark, having gone in to one of the very few even less competitive specialties). Again, I'm glad you're enjoying your time off...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[pgg]

How competitive were you?

I suspect someone with a Step 1 of 260 taking a year off is less worrying to programs than someone with a 185 ...

 

[sonofva]

Also what was your intern year in. For an fp residency I think you'd be less likely to have to redo a Ty internship than a surgical one, for exampld

 

[BigNavyPedsGuy]

Good for you. Hope it all works out.

 

[Dodadoctah]

Awesome! I've flirted with this idea myself. I am a GMO/flight surgeon in the Army and end my service in 2017 and will likely start residency that summer. But a year off is tempting!

 

[j4pac]

I suspect that this strategy is probably not a good one for someone either either mediocre scores and/or entering a more competitive residency. Military service is a plus when applying to residency...but if I was a PD I would have significant concerns about someone being out of medicine for a year after a GMO tour likely void in complex medical cases.

 

[turkish]

I interviewed residents for years and sat on the selection committee for a competitive field, albeit within the military, but would only have seen it as a problem if it were for glaringly crazy reasons (wanted to live in Amsterdam for a year, mon). If it were made to sound like a sabbatical to recharge one's desire to learn and practice medicine, I'd be jealous if anything. It would be my job to teach you what you need to know as a resident, so unless there was some reason to believe that wouldn't happen, I wouldn't hold it against the applicant.

 

[j4pac]

I interviewed residents for years and sat on the selection committee for a competitive field, albeit within the military, but would only have seen it as a problem if it were for glaringly crazy reasons (wanted to live in Amsterdam for a year, mon). If it were made to sound like a sabbatical to recharge one's desire to learn and practice medicine, I'd be jealous if anything. It would be my job to teach you what you need to know as a resident, so unless there was some reason to believe that wouldn't happen, I wouldn't hold it against the applicant.

What specialty though? If I was expecting to get a PGY-2 who is working at the level of a PGY-2...then I would say it could be a pretty big deal. I had a few PGY-2 while I was an intern that struggled coming off of a GMO tour. I also had a few who were incredibly self-motivated who were very good...but even they had an adjustment period.

I'm all for people re-charging. I wish more of us had the opportunity to do so. But a Gen Surg or IM PGY-2 with significant skills atrophy would be a risk in my book.

Shoot...I'm about to enter a PM&R residency and I'm concerned about my IM skill atrophy...and PM&R is probably one of the few residencies that attendings are expecting to get almost a blank slate. I'm hitting the books pretty hard to re-learn what I forgot...but I highly doubt that there are too many GMOs out there doing that.

 

[Ziehl-Neelsen]

Explaining a "gap year" in medical practice to a residency program is just the tip of the iceberg.

Many state medical boards and hospital credentialing/privileging departments require physicians to account for all of their time since high school graduation. For "location" do you write in "earth"? For "occupation" do you enter "vagabond"?

I would like to think that state medical boards and hospitals would be open-minded about a physician having an On the Road or Travels with Charley interlude, but that's a big chance to take when it only takes a couple of fuddy-duddies who don't like your "long-hair" or "McGovern for President sticker" to deny a medical license or hospital privileges and effectively end your medical career.

Like it or not, we are members of the most staid, bourgeois profession in America. I've met corporate vice presidents, bankers, attorneys, and all sorts of other professionals who were on their way to Black Rock City, Nevada or Sturgis, South Dakota, but I've never met another physician. I did, however, meet another physician on his way to the Gathering of the Juggalos (I'm not sure what that says about the American Profession of Medicine).

 

[j4pac]

Explaining a "gap year" in medical practice to a residency program is just the tip of the iceberg.

Many state medical boards and hospital credentialing/privileging departments require physicians to account for all of their time since high school graduation. For "location" do you write in "earth"? For "occupation" do you enter "vagabond"?

I would like to think that state medical boards and hospitals would be open-minded about a physician having an On the Road or Travels with Charley interlude, but that's a big chance to take when it only takes a couple of fuddy-duddies who don't like your "long-hair" or "McGovern for President sticker" to deny a medical license or hospital privileges and effectively end your medical career.

Like it or not, we are members of the most staid, bourgeois profession in America. I've met corporate vice presidents, bankers, attorneys, and all sorts of other professionals who were on their way to Black Rock City, Nevada or Sturgis, South Dakota, but I've never met another physician. I did, however, meet another physician on his way to the Gathering of the Juggalos (I'm not sure what that says about the American Profession of Medicine).

Brilliant

 

[turkish]

Explaining a "gap year" in medical practice to a residency program is just the tip of the iceberg.

Many state medical boards and hospital credentialing/privileging departments require physicians to account for all of their time since high school graduation. For "location" do you write in "earth"? For "occupation" do you enter "vagabond"?

I would like to think that state medical boards and hospitals would be open-minded about a physician having an On the Road or Travels with Charley interlude, but that's a big chance to take when it only takes a couple of fuddy-duddies who don't like your "long-hair" or "McGovern for President sticker" to deny a medical license or hospital privileges and effectively end your medical career.

Like it or not, we are members of the most staid, bourgeois profession in America. I've met corporate vice presidents, bankers, attorneys, and all sorts of other professionals who were on their way to Black Rock City, Nevada or Sturgis, South Dakota, but I've never met another physician. I did, however, meet another physician on his way to the Gathering of the Juggalos (I'm not sure what that says about the American Profession of Medicine).

Good point. If I were to do it at this point in my career, I would probably stay ostensibly employed with something medical-ish sounding on paper as a chart reviewer or telemedicine specialist, which are pretty easy jobs to come by. There are ways of making things at least sound passably legitimate, rather than just putting "year long vacation" on you license application. You might have to do a little explaining, but people with negative actions in the history (privilege curtailments, academic punishment, substance abusers, etc) get licensed all the time. Fact is, bourgeois or not, we hold a valuable, rare skill set that generates good tax income for states, and they need us working.

 

[Ziehl-Neelsen]

people with negative actions in the history (privilege curtailments, academic punishment, substance abusers, etc) get licensed all the time. Fact is, bourgeois or not, we hold a valuable, rare skill set that generates good tax income for states, and they need us working

State medical boards are totally inscrutable to me. I was at Walter Reed when LTC Lakin refused to deploy. And while I thought he was stupid for letting the "birthers" manipulate him and I knew the situation would end badly, his refusal was at least somewhat based on political conviction.

Fast forward 2 years and the Kansas state medical board denies him a license.
http://www.kctv5.com/story/16666365/the-doctor-willwont-see-you

He didn't commit malpractice or commit any acts of moral turpitude (sleep with patients, abuse drugs, kill anybody, etc.). He made an ill-advised political stand that he later admitted was a mistake and for which he accepted punishment, yet a license to practice medicine was denied (and in Kansas of all places--not exactly Massachusetts). It's clear to me that he was denied a license because some people didn't like his politics.

Just like I don't put bumper stickers on my car that advertise my political beliefs so my car won't get keyed. I don't want anything remotely controversial on a medical license application that some petty bureaucrat could use to deny me a license.

 

[notdeadyet]

Fast forward 2 years and the Kansas state medical board denies him a license.
http://www.kctv5.com/story/16666365/the-doctor-willwont-see-you

He didn't commit malpractice or commit any acts of moral turpitude (sleep with patients, abuse drugs, kill anybody, etc.). He made an ill-advised political stand that he later admitted was a mistake and for which he accepted punishment, yet a license to practice medicine was denied (and in Kansas of all places--not exactly Massachusetts). It's clear to me that he was denied a license because some people didn't like his politics.

It's not that clear to me.

You have a doctor that was dishonorably discharged, convicted of a crime, and given a prison sentence. That's like saying a doc denied a medical license because he did 6 months In prison for Earth First activities was denied for "political reasons."

He knew the consequences of his actions when he took them. He continues to face these consequences. Personally, this is low on my list of injustices that I can be concerned with.

 

[narcusprince]

I have an issue with this man not being able to practice medicine. How many women get pregnant in order to shirk deployments? Why dont they get labeled? This is an argument why the military is different for men and women. A male actively refuses an order and gets his career tanked while a woman can passivly get pregnant refuse to deploy and everythink is peachy kind.

 

[notdeadyet]

I have an issue with this man not being able to practice medicine. How many women get pregnant in order to shirk deployments? Why dont they get labeled?

Oh, they get labeled all the time. On SDN and elsewhere. Any pregnant woman in uniform during OEF/OIF seemed to be assumed to shirking deployment.

I
This is an argument why the military is different for men and women. A male actively refuses an order and gets his career tanked while a woman can passivly get pregnant refuse to deploy and everythink is peachy kind.

Getting pregnant isn't refusing an order. Pregnancy excludes you from deploying. These are not analogous.

 

[Slevin]

Oh, they get labeled all the time. On SDN and elsewhere. Any pregnant woman in uniform during OEF/OIF seemed to be assumed to shirking deployment.

Getting pregnant isn't refusing an order. Pregnancy excludes you from deploying. These are not analogous.

Depends on how you view it. If a woman intentionally gets pregnant in order to avoid deploying I would consider that an indirect refusal of orders. The woman knows she's deploying and she knows she cannot directly refuse but she can get pregnant in order to avoid the deployment. Even if she isn't vocally refusing to deploy she still found a way to refuse the order to deploy.

 

[Shikima]

Passive-aggressive resistance to deployment.

 

[pgg]

I have an issue with this man not being able to practice medicine.

Not me. Screw that guy.

How many women get pregnant in order to shirk deployments? Why dont they get labeled?

Oh, they get labeled. But no more so than the guys who suddenly need that hernia repaired before deploying. I've seen at LEAST as many males malinger their ways out of deployment as I have seen women who might have deliberately gotten pregnant to avoid deployment.

This is an argument why the military is different for men and women.

I can't agree that it's a good argument.

A male actively refuses an order and gets his career tanked while a woman can passivly get pregnant refuse to deploy and everythink is peachy kind.

Well, in unhappier times, an active duty member of the military refusing an order to deploy would be rewarded with a front row seat to a firing squad demonstration.

In these kinder, gentler days, a dishonorable discharge and 6 month prison term at Leavenworth is more or less equivalent to a felony. Felonies and prison terms have a way of complicating medical licensure, which is NOT based solely on technical competence, but also on things like professionalism and moral character.

Even so, I'm a little surprised the medical board denied him a license. But I can't muster any sympathy. That turd got off easy. Screw him.

 

[d2305]

Officers get dismissed not dishonorable d/c.

 

[pgg]

Officers get dismissed not dishonorable d/c.

That is true. Though in this context, the semantic distinction doesn't matter.

Out of curiosity, I looked up the Kansas state medical license application:

20. Yes No Have you ever been arrested? Do not include minor traffic or parking violations or citations except those related to a DUI, DWI or a similar charge. You must include all arrests including those that have been set aside, dismissed or expunged or where a stay of execution has been issued.

21 Yes No Have you ever been charged with a crime, indicted, convicted of a crime, imprisoned, or placed on probation (a crime includes both Class A misdemeanors and felonies)? You must include all convictions including those that have been set aside, dismissed or expunged or where a stay of execution has been issued.

22. Yes No Have you ever been court-martialed or discharged dishonorably from the armed services?

Every state license I've ever applied for has asked the same basic set of questions.

I'm not the least bit surprised that a medical board took a dim view of conviction of multiple felonies at a general court martial and a prison sentence at Leavenworth.

Life's hard. It's harder when you're stupid. It's even harder when you're stupid and a convicted felon. It's worlds harder when you're stupid, a convicted felon, and a member of a profession that's held to higher moral and ethical standards.

 

[Kilgoretrout 65]

Luckily my McGovern for President bumper sticker fell off my VW microbus just before I got my medical license.