Lacking Direction for Pre Med - Need MAJOR Help

[mb021498]

Hello everyone,

As of this summer I am a sophomore at a public high school here in New Jersey. My goal is to become an Orthopedic Surgeon after med school/residency. However, I only know the basics of how exactly to become a doctor yet still lack direction.

I have a few questions:
1: What can I be doing now in high school that may benefit me in the future? I have a 3.8 GPA with many honors classes and I expect to take several AP's in the future.

2: I understand that I should go to pre med schools that will help me get into the best med schools, as opposed to hard pre med schools that may weigh me down when it comes to admissions. My question is, what kinds of schools should I be looking to apply to? (names)

3: Is there anything else I should know about that may benefit me down the road?

Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks,
Micahel

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[I'm No Superman]

Hello everyone,

As of this summer I am a sophomore at a public high school here in New Jersey. My goal is to become an Orthopedic Surgeon after med school/residency. However, I only know the basics of how exactly to become a doctor yet still lack direction.

I have a few questions:
1: What can I be doing now in high school that may benefit me in the future? I have a 3.8 GPA with many honors classes and I expect to take several AP's in the future.

2: I understand that I should go to pre med schools that will help me get into the best med schools, as opposed to hard pre med schools that may weigh me down when it comes to admissions. My question is, what kinds of schools should I be looking to apply to? (names)

3: Is there anything else I should know about that may benefit me down the road?

Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks,
Micahel

1. Clubs/EC's/student government/getting good grades/forming good study habits.

2.Who said that? You can get into virtually any medical school from virtually any four year college.

3. Keep your options open and don't forget your ID when you go to take the ACT/SAT

 

[mb021498]

Thanks for the reply!
That is what I am saying (#2). I still want to go to a decent pre med school, but nothing so crazy where I will get a poor cGPA.

 

[I'm No Superman]

Thanks for the reply!
That is what I am saying (#2). I still want to go to a decent pre med school, but nothing so crazy where I will get a poor cGPA.

Any relatively large college will have a decent pre medical pathway that won't hinder you. Even if the advisors suck, you've always got this place for advice.

 

[CHCOOH]

You should start researching and visiting colleges, then focus on getting into the one YOU like the best.

It doesn't have to have the strongest program, or most prestigious school. Take into account the atmosphere and campus life you're looking for.

 

[mb021498]

I was thinking Fordham for early application.

How do research opportunities work in pre med? Does most research take place at my school? Are research opportunities (such as a year off from school) readily available?

Forgive me for being a novice...

 

[Nite]

You can't really do research in high school. It take some years in college to establish a reputation with the professors and research leads to get into a program.

Also your GPA and MCAT scores only do as much as get you an interview at a medical school, from there they judge your character and community service/research. High school doesn't matter at all here, although i did hear that they might ask you for your SAT scores that you counted towards college credit.

The most important thing in high school is to set up a work habit that works for you, it takes a lot of work and dedication to reach any big goal in life, especially a surgeon which is at the top of the medical field. Once you are in a descent college you are fine. Eve if you get into a cc you can transfer to a university for your junior/ senior year which is actually not a bad idea. Also (lol sorry for so may "Alsos") I wouldn't pick a specialty just yet, it will probably change while you are in med school.

 

[drmarkgreene]

You're on the right track so just keep your head on straight. Distractions are going to multiply in the next few years. I know this seems cliche but I can not tell you how many pre-meds I've known that started out with stellar stats but just did not have the focus in the end, including myself. Stay focused on what you want.

And I second, Superman - this place will help you in the long run.

 

[RuralPhysician8]

Check your local state university, sometimes they off research programs for HS seniors. Your state school, in my opinion, is also the best as they will generally give you the best financial aid. I am incoming freshman and I can tell you my state school is extremely generous.

Also take some dual enrollment courses if you feel confident, I used them in HS and I am entering undergrad with 3 classes under my belt already.

 

[mb021498]

Check your local state university, sometimes they off research programs for HS seniors. Your state school, in my opinion, is also the best as they will generally give you the best financial aid. I am incoming freshman and I can tell you my state school is extremely generous.

Also take some dual enrollment courses if you feel confident, I used them in HS and I am entering undergrad with 3 classes under my belt already.

Can I take dual enrollment courses at my CC? How does that work as a high school senior, as far as schedule? (I assume night classes)

Much appreciated everyone, thanks

 

[RuralPhysician8]

Can I take dual enrollment courses at my CC? How does that work as a high school senior, as far as schedule? (I assume night classes)

Much appreciated everyone, thanks

Most CCs offer it. At my school, you had to have scored a 21 or higher on a practice ACT and then the professor would come to your school two or three days a week. A college class in your highschool to put it short. You received both a college and high school credit for the course. Talk to your guidance counselor, it can vary by school.

 

[Tolbert]

Most CCs offer it. At my school, you had to have scored a 21 or higher on a practice ACT and then the professor would come to your school two or three days a week. A college class in your highschool to put it short. You received both a college and high school credit for the course. Talk to your guidance counselor, it can vary by school.

so much yes. dual enrollment is absolutely amazing (provided you make sure you stay committed and get good grades, or else you'd just be shooting yourself in the foot)

 

[Hillo]

They're called concurrent enrollment classes in Arizona (dual enrollment is at your high school and gives you high school credit too).

I mean, if it's free and you have the transportation to the community college, go for it.

Start registering for classes ASAP (because the sections at the times you want may be closed).

 

[Tolbert]

yeah i've heard a couple names for it; once someone called it joint enrollment..

 

[Hillo]

By the way, I regret taking some of my concurrent enrollment classes because they ended up not transferring :/

 

[Tolbert]

really? i don't regret any of them, some of which didn't transfer.. I mean of course I wish they did but they boosted my high school GPA anyway and got rated like AP classes which also helped.

 

[Hillo]

Well, they didn't do anything to my HS GPA, and it took money to take the bus and buy the textbooks :x

And I freaking have to sit through those classes in uni again!

 

[loltopsy]

Nothing you can do will matter, realistically, for getting into med school. Just get into the best and cheapest college you can, and at the point, GPA and MCAT are king.

I started doing research fall freshman year in organic chemistry. It was mostly a grad student teaching me how to do things, but it was fun. I loved organic, so it came naturally. It's not necessary in the slightest to start that early. Anything that sacrifices your GPA should be avoided if possible in college. Shadowing/volunteering can always be done over the summer.

 

[Tolbert]

Well, they didn't do anything to my HS GPA, and it took money to take the bus and buy the textbooks :x

And I freaking have to sit through those classes in uni again!

oh for us it did, and it was also free feel sorry for you

 

[RuralPhysician8]

oh for us it did, and it was also free feel sorry for you

I did not pay for textbooks and the professor came to my high school during the regular school day. Before enrolling, definitely make sure those credits will transfer, all of mine did no problem. Personally I started with General Psychology 1st semester of my junior year and loved it. Statistics, Psychology, and English were the three most popular at my school but we also had a Calculus one.

 

[Instatewaiter]

1. Clubs/EC's/student government/getting good grades/forming good study habits.

2.Who said that? You can get into virtually any medical school from virtually any four year college.

3. Keep your options open and don't forget your ID when you go to take the ACT/SAT

Going to a strong university will help you. There is no wonder that most medical schools are full of students from strong universities and only have a few from small schools. You don't have to go to an Ivy but strong public schools are quite helpful (UVA, UNC, Michigan, UC Berkley, UCLA and the like).

That said, if you go to the best school and crap the bed with your grades, it won't matter you went to Harvard when your GPA is a 2.3.

Also, have some fun in college. Med school, residency, fellowship are all much larger time commitments. If you don't live a little in the moment then what is the point?

 

[JPodel]

Yea I'm not using ANY AP credits in unvi. And I just realized that the title of this thread is a complete PUN! Well done OP!

 

[mb021498]

yea i'm not using any ap credits in unvi. And i just realized that the title of this thread is a complete pun! Well done op!

pun? How so?

 

[Tolbert]

two meanings: need major help - need help picking major.

at least that's what I am assuming he meant.

 

[mb021498]

Ah yes now I see it... Good observation Jpatel

 

[JPodel]

Ah yes now I see it... Good observation Jpatel

To give you some actual advice, follow this:

 

[mb021498]

Thanks everyone. I appreciate the advice.

Along with that, I have a couple of other questions that have been confusing me:

1- Say I wanted to be an Orthopedic Surgeon (eventually). What difference in training would be required to go from an Orthopedist to a Surgeon? When in my career would this training take place? Despite finances/time, is this process relatively feasible?

2- Are Orthopedists DO's or MD's? And also, when do I make the "final decision" to actually train in Orthopedics? PreMed, Med School, etc?

Again, forgive me for being so novice to this subject. I understand that switching professions in health care is quite likely (I may not be a Surgeon), but please just assume that it is definite.

Thanks guys!

 

[BioBeaver]

Thanks everyone. I appreciate the advice.

Along with that, I have a couple of other questions that have been confusing me:

1- Say I wanted to be an Orthopedic Surgeon (eventually). What difference in training would be required to go from an Orthopedist to a Surgeon? When in my career would this training take place? Despite finances/time, is this process relatively feasible?

2- Are Orthopedists DO's or MD's? And also, when do I make the "final decision" to actually train in Orthopedics? PreMed, Med School, etc?

Again, forgive me for being so novice to this subject. I understand that switching professions in health care is quite likely (I may not be a Surgeon), but please just assume that it is definite.

Thanks guys!

Hello everyone, Im backkkkkkk

1. You just apply for an Orthopedic Surgeon residency after med school. They'll teach you everything.

2. DO's or MD's can be any specialty. They simply apply/interview for a residency in a specialty they want. A DO can be a neurosurgeon and an MD can be family practice. A lot depends on your grades in med school and your test scores.

You make the decision to be an Orthopedist when you do clinical rotations in Med School. You shadow every specialty and then have a better idea of what you want to do. I wouldn't get too committed to Ortho yet, because there's still a LONG road ahead of you before you can even start thinking about specialities. Take it one thing at a time: Getting into college and good undergrad grades are your goals for now.

 

[mb021498]

Hello everyone, Im backkkkkkk

1. You just apply for an Orthopedic Surgeon residency after med school. They'll teach you everything.

2. DO's or MD's can be any specialty. They simply apply/interview for a residency in a specialty they want. A DO can be a neurosurgeon and an MD can be family practice. A lot depends on your grades in med school and your test scores.

You make the decision to be an Orthopedist when you do clinical rotations in Med School. You shadow every specialty and then have a better idea of what you want to do. I wouldn't get too committed to Ortho yet, because there's still a LONG road ahead of you before you can even start thinking about specialities. Take it one thing at a time: Getting into college and good undergrad grades are your goals for now.

Understood BioBeaver, and thank you!

In residency, is the application process for a certain specialty competitive or rather simple? I assume it varies from profession to profession though...

 

[BioBeaver]

Understood BioBeaver, and thank you!

In residency, is the application process for a certain specialty competitive or rather simple? I assume it varies from profession to profession though...

As you've already assumed, some are more competitive than others. Basically all of the surgery specialties (neuro being the top) are more competitive, because everybody it seems wants to be a surgeon. Emergency Medicine is also quite competitive.

You'll apply for the residency, and they will see your GPA, Step testing scores, and your research in that particular field. For example, people that get a Neuro residency probably have great grades and testing scores, as well as research experience with the brain. But again, don't worry too much about it for now. Odds a your plans will change in the next 8 years.

 

[mb021498]

As you've already assumed, some are more competitive than others. Basically all of the surgery specialties (neuro being the top) are more competitive, because everybody it seems wants to be a surgeon. Emergency Medicine is also quite competitive.

You'll apply for the residency, and they will see your GPA, Step testing scores, and your research in that particular field. For example, people that get a Neuro residency probably have great grades and testing scores, as well as research experience with the brain. But again, don't worry too much about it for now. Odds a your plans will change in the next 8 years.

If I go to a top medical school, will this facilitate entry into residency? And in comparison to say medical school admission, how difficult is the surgery residency admissions? (In other words, is it more or less difficult than med school entry and by about how much?)

Thanks!

 

[BioBeaver]

If I go to a top medical school, will this facilitate entry into residency? And in comparison to say medical school admission, how difficult is the surgery residency admissions? (In other words, is it more or less difficult than med school entry and by about how much?)

Thanks!

Yes, top medical school grads often get first picks on the residencies of their choice, but that's often because they also have great stats to go along with their school. If a Harvard MS is lazy and does terrible, they'll get thrown into family practice just as fast as anyone else. But usually an alumni network can help out.

I'd say it depends on the school, but the residency is probably harder. Especially for Ortho surgery. You'll know if you have a shot when the time comes.

 

[mb021498]

Yes, top medical school grads often get first picks on the residencies of their choice, but that's often because they also have great stats to go along with their school. If a Harvard MS is lazy and does terrible, they'll get thrown into family practice just as fast as anyone else. But usually an alumni network can help out.

I'd say it depends on the school, but the residency is probably harder. Especially for Ortho surgery. You'll know if you have a shot when the time comes.

That makes sense, thank you very much!

Also, in Pre Med and Med School are research opportunities readily available or are the also competitive to get into? For instanse, I have heard of Pre Med studets taking time off from school (or spending the summer) researching Stem Cells at other universities. How does this work? Is it another application process?

Thanks

 

[BioBeaver]

That makes sense, thank you very much!

Also, in Pre Med and Med School are research opportunities readily available or are the also competitive to get into? For instanse, I have heard of Pre Med studets taking time off from school (or spending the summer) researching Stem Cells at other universities. How does this work? Is it another application process?

Thanks

Yes, you usually have to apply and interview with the professor doing the research. Some of these research jobs you get paid, others you don't (don't expect pay). Most medical schools like to see some research, but if you have great academics and shadowing experience it can make up for a lack of research.

Generally the larger the school, the more research opportunities available (but also more people that want them)!

 

[mb021498]

Yes, you usually have to apply and interview with the professor doing the research. Some of these research jobs you get paid, others you don't (don't expect pay). Most medical schools like to see some research, but if you have great academics and shadowing experience it can make up for a lack of research.

Generally the larger the school, the more research opportunities available (but also more people that want them)!

In your opinion, what is the most logical thing to major in while in Pre Med? What would prepare me best for the MCAT, help my sGPA, etc? Im guessing that my chosen major dictates the classes that are offered to me, correct?

 

[BioBeaver]

In your opinion, what is the most logical thing to major in while in Pre Med? What would prepare me best for the MCAT, help my sGPA, etc? Im guessing that my chosen major dictates the classes that are offered to me, correct?

Ahh, the major question! Major in whatever you're interested in and gets you the highest GPA. The thing is, a "normal pre-med major" (biology, chemistry) knocks out almost all the med school prerequisites in one major.

For example, a BS in Biology gives you every class you need and more for medical school admission. A business major would have to take their business classes, as well as science classes for med school. The MCAT is just based on the pre-requisites, so again, any major is fine. Most do Biology or Chem though, just because of the killing two birds with one stone.

 

[mb021498]

Ahh, the major question! Major in whatever you're interested in and gets you the highest GPA. The thing is, a "normal pre-med major" (biology, chemistry) knocks out almost all the med school prerequisites in one major.

For example, a BS in Biology gives you every class you need and more for medical school admission. A business major would have to take their business classes, as well as science classes for med school. The MCAT is just based on the pre-requisites, so again, any major is fine. Most do Biology or Chem though, just because of the killing two birds with one stone.

Now about shadowing, how do I get to shadow doctors in practice? Do I apply similar to research? If so, is it competitive?

 

[BioBeaver]

Now about shadowing, how do I get to shadow doctors in practice? Do I apply similar to research? If so, is it competitive?

Mostly you just send emails to doctors asking them to shadow. Some may not respond, others might turn you down, but usually they have been there and done that so they're willing to help. It just takes some persistence.

Shadowing actually helps you as well, because you'll need letters of recommendation from an MD or DO for med school.

 

[docwei88]

Sorry to barge in, but in terms of shadowing...as a freshman in high school, should I start shadowing too? To gain experience and stuff. I originally was planning to volunteer at the hospital...but should I email doctors I know to see if I can shadow them too? What is recommended? Thanks!

 

[mb021498]

Sorry to barge in, but in terms of shadowing...as a freshman in high school, should I start shadowing too? To gain experience and stuff. I originally was planning to volunteer at the hospital...but should I email doctors I know to see if I can shadow them too? What is recommended? Thanks!

Yes, I have that same question too! Except that I am a sophomore. Also, could these hours be counted with the hours spent shadowing while in Pre Med? (More total hours for med school admission)

Thanks!

 

[sonofva]

My advice for your stage is to do something productive that you find fun. Play an instrument, volunteer at an organization you like, develop your "brand." Yes maybe shadow a few times. But focus on diverse things that you will actually enjoy doing. You will get a lot more mileage out of this and it will make u look better on college apps, which is more important at this point.

And before everyone jumps on me because they "love to shadow", shadowing will often times be boring. As a high schooler you really won't understand what's going on much of the time. Often times the doc won't have time to explain and you'll end up just standing around.

So why not enjoy your youth, relax, and do something that's REAL fun!

 

[sonofva]

And in response to another above post, no admissions committee will care what you did in high school...

 

[JPodel]

Yes, I have that same question too! Except that I am a sophomore. Also, could these hours be counted with the hours spent shadowing while in Pre Med? (More total hours for med school admission)

Thanks!

To be completely honest, if you are an underclassmen in high school, you shouldn't even be worried about med school. Probably the only things that should be on your mind is the SAT and keeping a good GPA/Volunteering. The best thing to do during this age is to realize who you are as a person, IMO I think that is much more important than worrying about pre-med stuff. Maybe Junior and Senior year you can start worrying about all that stuff, and no one after high school cares about what you did in high school, unfortunately. Good luck!

 

[BioBeaver]

To be completely honest, if you are an underclassmen in high school, you shouldn't even be worried about med school. Probably the only things that should be on your mind is the SAT and keeping a good GPA/Volunteering. The best thing to do during this age is to realize who you are as a person, IMO I think that is much more important than worrying about pre-med stuff. Maybe Junior and Senior year you can start worrying about all that stuff, and no one after high school cares about what you did in high school, unfortunately. Good luck!

I second this. If you're a freshman or sophomore in HIGH SCHOOL already worried about shadowing, you're going to be the worst gunner ever Only worry about shadowing if you're planning to apply to a 7 year BA/MD program right out of high school. And even then, you shouldn't worry until your junior or senior year.

 

[JPodel]

I second this. If you're a freshman or sophomore in HIGH SCHOOL already worried about shadowing, you're going to be the worst gunner ever Only worry about shadowing if you're planning to apply to a 7 year BA/MD program right out of high school. And even then, you shouldn't worry until your junior or senior year.

Dude, did you change your name? I thought it was like SteinmetzMD or something like that?! Also I am going to miss your old profile picture dood!

 

[BioBeaver]

Dude, did you change your name? I thought it was like SteinmetzMD or something like that?! Also I am going to miss your old profile picture dood!

Yeah I was SteinmetzMD back in the day! I made a new profile in May. And which one, the beaver or the surgery Jesus? Because I can get em back hahaha

 

[mb021498]

On another note...

Could you guys lead me in the right direction of finding a good college for Pre Med? I have been interested in Fordham but have heard that it is extremely demanding because of the other required classes (history, english, etc.) that are a part of Fordham's curriculum.

Essentially, all I want is a school that will best prepare me for medical school (like everyone else). Also, research opportunities are very important, as I would like to spend a good amount of time researching.

I am not too worried over the financial aspect, but only to an extent. If you guys have any colleges in mind, just throw some names at me so that I can look into them more.

Thanks

 

[docwei88]

On another note...

Could you guys lead me in the right direction of finding a good college for Pre Med? I have been interested in Fordham but have heard that it is extremely demanding because of the other required classes (history, english, etc.) that are a part of Fordham's curriculum.

Essentially, all I want is a school that will best prepare me for medical school (like everyone else). Also, research opportunities are very important, as I would like to spend a good amount of time researching.

I am not too worried over the financial aspect, but only to an extent. If you guys have any colleges in mind, just throw some names at me so that I can look into them more.

Thanks

Mmm...do not stress too much over school. When it all comes down, it is for YOUR ENJOYMENT. Enjoy your four years. Enjoy college. Enjoy life.
However, I HAVE HEARD-the key word here is HEARD-that grads from top colleges have first dibs in med school. I doubt that since it really depends on what you do, EC, volunteer, dedication, test scores, and GPA.
Some schools I am interested in right now are (some are pretty good in research):
Northwestern University
University of Chicago
Cornell
University of Michigan
University of Illinois
University of Pennsylvania
Johns Hopkins University
University of Washington
University of North Carolina
Washington University in St. Louis
University of California
Rutgers
University of Colorado

 

[docwei88]

I have a lot of others as I have several years to cross some off my list. But you could look into it. Oh, and research may help, too. But I would not be too biased by US News Report. I was-and should be-more concerned about how the school looked like and its programs.

 

[mb021498]

Mmm...do not stress too much over school. When it all comes down, it is for YOUR ENJOYMENT. Enjoy your four years. Enjoy college. Enjoy life.
However, I HAVE HEARD-the key word here is HEARD-that grads from top colleges have first dibs in med school. I doubt that since it really depends on what you do, EC, volunteer, dedication, test scores, and GPA.
Some schools I am interested in right now are (some are pretty good in research):
Northwestern University
University of Chicago
Cornell
University of Michigan
University of Illinois
University of Pennsylvania
Johns Hopkins University
University of Washington
University of North Carolina
Washington University in St. Louis
University of California
Rutgers
University of Colorado

That goes against what I had thought regarding how it may not be the best idea to aim for top pre med schools. However, Rutgers jumps out at me...

Rutgers is my state school. I havent done much research on it, but could you let me know what you think? I also had Purdue and Fordham in mind...