Last 60 units + "prestigiousness" of school determing GPA?

[washbasin]

I read somewhere that some schools add on additional points to your GPA if you had a bachelors.

I also read that some schools give you more points for being from a prestigious undergrad school.

Also, is it true that the last 60 units that youve taken are weighed more heavily?

Are any of these true?

Please let me know.

Thanks in advance

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[AbsoluteEthanol]

excellent question, i too, am very interested in that! does anyone know the answer to these questions?

i mean, to equate someone who has a BS from a prestigious school to someone who has spent 2 years in community college would be downright ludicrous! I probably care because i went to a prestigious school, have a BS and a crappy GPA LOL

 

[eelo]

excellent question, i too, am very interested in that! does anyone know the answer to these questions?

i mean, to equate someone who has a BS from a prestigious school to someone who has spent 2 years in community college would be downright ludicrous! I probably care because i went to a prestigious school, have a BS and a crappy GPA LOL

On the other hand, the person who went to a community college may have been working full-time, raising a family or caring for elderly parents, been on active military duty, or doing any number of other things that demonstrate their ability to take on a difficult set of challenges successfully without requiring the closed atmosphere and hand-holding that may have been offered at a "prestigious school."

In other words, there are lots of ways for adcoms to look at things.

 

[AbsoluteEthanol]

On the other hand, the person who went to a community college may have been working full-time, raising a family or caring for elderly parents, been on active military duty, or doing any number of other things that demonstrate their ability to take on a difficult set of challenges successfully without requiring the closed atmosphere and hand-holding that may have been offered at a "prestigious school."

In other words, there are lots of ways for adcoms to look at things.

no, don't get me wrong, I'm not belittling community college students or people without BS; I'm merely saying that people with similar/identical GPA's, PCAT's and EC's, but one is from community college and the other from a prestigious university with a BS. hope that clears it up

 

[confettiflyer]

Some schools award "points" for having a BS/BA. Western University adds on 5 basis points during their evaluations if you have completed one. Other schools don't explicitly award evaluation points, but it does have a halo effect on your application.

Prestigiousness is mostly halo effect, few schools explicitly say they give preference to classes taken at a 4 year university. If they do, they simply say they will not take any prerequisites from a CC. It does effect your application though, comparatively speaking.

But I do agree if you have extenuating circumstances in light of academic achievement, you will be looked upon favorably. In the end, you have to prove that you are academically capable of completing a 4 year doctor of pharmacy degree.

 

[mustang sally]

On the other hand, the person who went to a community college may have been working full-time, raising a family or caring for elderly parents, been on active military duty, or doing any number of other things that demonstrate their ability to take on a difficult set of challenges successfully without requiring the closed atmosphere and hand-holding that may have been offered at a "prestigious school."

In other words, there are lots of ways for adcoms to look at things.

I don't know that there's a lot of hand-holding that goes on at some prestigious schools. I have been to two community colleges, a "prestigious" school, and a public university. There was a lot of hand-holding at the community college level as compared to the prestigious school. That school was prepping people to go to med school and law school, so they really expected a lot more out of the students and didn't take a lot of bs (unlike the community colleges). But anyway, this thread is getting off track.

 

[steveysmith54]

I read somewhere that some schools add on additional points to your GPA if you had a bachelors.

I also read that some schools give you more points for being from a prestigious undergrad school.

Also, is it true that the last 60 units that youve taken are weighed more heavily?

Are any of these true?

Please let me know.

Thanks in advance

I think it depends on the school. Some schools state that they want science prereqs taken at a 4 year schools, like USC. I heard UCSF and UCSD Are the same way. However, many schools do not care. I talked to Western U and they told me many times that they don;t care.

 

[washbasin]

On the other hand, the person who went to a community college may have been working full-time, raising a family or caring for elderly parents, been on active military duty, or doing any number of other things that demonstrate their ability to take on a difficult set of challenges successfully without requiring the closed atmosphere and hand-holding that may have been offered at a "prestigious school."

In other words, there are lots of ways for adcoms to look at things.

There is way more "hand holding" at a junior college when compared to a public school such as Cal.

At a JC, you have MANY chances at extra credit. While it can be open to debate, your competition at a "prestigious" school is usually far more superior than the one at JC.

Think about it this way:
At a prestigious school, you are competing against high school valedictorians while at a JC, you are competing against non-valedictorians.

 

[AbsoluteEthanol]

i don't think the questions is whether or not it's easier in community college than in a prestigious 4 year university. You have to be from Mars to say anything to the contrary. The questions is, do pharmacy schools have some kind of a system that adjusts GPA's or perhaps gives some kind of a preference to those from established, well known 4 year unversities...

 

[jspwinter]

I'm sure they prefer you take the prereqs at a univ but cc would be just as sufficient.

 

[confettiflyer]

Halo effect example:

If you have a 4.0 CC GPA and another has a 3.7 GPA at Stanfurd (haha)...they'll probably take the Stanfurd grad.

If you have a 4.0 CC GPA and another has a 2.5 GPA at Stanfurd, they'll probably take the CC student.

At what point they "equal" each other is up for debate, depends on the institution, and other things (all other aspects of an app being equal). I personally think it'd be fair to adjust it 0.5 GPA points from top tier schools (top 50), 0.3-0.4 for a top 50-100 school, no adjustments for anything below that.

So a 3.2 from Cal would equal a 3.7 from a CC. This is my opinion, certainly not a hard and fast rule.

 

[Knickerbocker]

How many points do you give them for walking in with a Macbook?

Elitism

 

[eelo]

There is way more "hand holding" at a junior college when compared to a public school such as Cal.

At a JC, you have MANY chances at extra credit. While it can be open to debate, your competition at a "prestigious" school is usually far more superior than the one at JC.

Think about it this way:
At a prestigious school, you are competing against high school valedictorians while at a JC, you are competing against non-valedictorians.

No, you're not. Most community colleges are geared toward two things: prepping under-achievers for college-level work, or serving the needs of working adults. In the case of the underachievers, they're probably not going to be in the more difficult sciencebased classes that are among the pre-reqs for professional school (they're too busy gaining academic eligibility for transfer to a Div I school with a good football team). The overachievers tend to be the ones I described above: those raising families, holding down a job (or jobs), active duty military, adult retrning to the workforce, or tings like that. Those people who are on track to get into professional programs are definitely NOT slackers and frankly, on paper before the adcoms, they're going to be your toughest competition.

How do I know this? I have taught at two junior colleges and two four-year schools in three different states. I have sat on professional development boards and adcoms for over 15 years. My experience in this area is both broad and deep, but of course, you are free to believe what you wish with your own experience. My point is that it's dangerous to assume that someone from a "prestigious school" will have an advantage over a community college graduate. While tat may help, it's important to remember that it may not help, and other applicants may have stronger applications overall. There is much, much more to the application than the name of one's alma mater.

 

[AntiviralsRule]

I don't know that there's a lot of hand-holding that goes on at some prestigious schools. I have been to two community colleges, a "prestigious" school, and a public university. There was a lot of hand-holding at the community college level as compared to the prestigious school. That school was prepping people to go to med school and law school, so they really expected a lot more out of the students and didn't take a lot of bs (unlike the community colleges). But anyway, this thread is getting off track.

I agree. I have encountered A LOT more hand-holding at CC and at the CSU school I'm attending for post-bac work than I ever did at the "prestigious" school I went to for my B.A.

"Prestigious" schools may give you more counseling or fewer lines to stand in or whatever, but they definitely require more of you academically (speaking from my own experience).

 

[mattc_85]

I don't think you can really make a blanket statement about "hand-holding" at CC's. The science pre-reqs I took at CC were by no means easy courses. All the professors had previously taught at 4 year universities. In my organic chem class there were a couple students that failed it at a 4 year and took it at the CC and actually got a lower grade than they did before. So, I really think you have to look at each institution individually.

 

[Farmercyst]

I'd say I'm getting as much hand-holding at USC as I did at my CC where I took most of my science courses. I don't require that much, but if I need it, it's there. Some instructors grade on a curve, give occassional extra credit, and are available during office hours when needed for advice. That's all I got from my CC. I wouldn't worry about whether or not you went to a "prestigious" (whatever that is) undergrad or a CC. If it makes a difference, I was a salutatorian in my HS class. For me it was simple economics driving my school choice. $26 a unit was cheaper than what I'd have to pay anywhere else. It's kinda funny, I spent more for my first semseter at USC than my entire undergrad.

 

[genesis09]

At UIC, if you have a bachelors, you get extra points. They do look down upon CC only students, and try and limit the number they admit.

 

[eelo]

At UIC, if you have a bachelors, you get extra points. They do look down upon CC only students, and try and limit the number they admit.

Do they look down on CC-only students, or do they look down on applicants who have only completed two years of school? CC-only students aren't going to have a bachelor's degree, but do you know for sure that a CC-only student would be looked at differently from someone who did two years of undergrad at, say, North Park or at NEIU (is it still called that, off Pulaski/Peterson Ave?)? Information on the UIC Pharmacy website leads me to believe they'd give more consideration to someone who did their prepharm work there at UIC, but I didn't see anything that indicated the 60 ours were preferred from, say, Wheaton College vice Truman College.

I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm only asking How do you know?

 

[genesis09]

Officially, UIC COP only gives preference to Illinois residents. They do say they do know the UIC prepharm curriculum the best and understand which classes are hard. They do use the UIC classes as the base assumption for your prepharm knowledge. About a third or so of UIC COP students come from UIC, another third from UIUC, and the last third from other schools.
However, unofficially, it is different. They want to make the BS a requirement in the coming few years. They give BS degree holders a big point boost. Talking to the admissions committee, you'll realize they are biased against CC only students. They have a de-facto rule limiting CC only admissions to less than 5 per year. They've also have had some problems with individual CCs. Their classes are not equivalent to the UIC prepharm classes.
Of the students in the P-1 class, 75% of them have bachelors.

 

[eelo]

Officially, UIC COP only gives preference to Illinois residents. They do say they do know the UIC prepharm curriculum the best and understand which classes are hard. They do use the UIC classes as the base assumption for your prepharm knowledge. About a third or so of UIC COP students come from UIC, another third from UIUC, and the last third from other schools.
However, unofficially, it is different. They want to make the BS a requirement in the coming few years. They give BS degree holders a big point boost. Talking to the admissions committee, you'll realize they are biased against CC only students. They have a de-facto rule limiting CC only admissions to less than 5 per year. They've also have had some problems with individual CCs. Their classes are not equivalent to the UIC prepharm classes.
Of the students in the P-1 class, 75% of them have bachelors.

Once again, I wonder if their bias is against CC students, or against all students who have completed only lower-level courses? This is a rhetorical question because I'm not sure you're on the UIC adcom, but would a student who completed 2 years of undergrad at North Park or Wheaton or Northeastern IL or NIU have an advantage over a student who completed 2 years of undergrad at Truman?

I understand them giving their own undergrads an edge; that's pretty typical of institutions that have pre-prof programs that lead into their own prof program (for example, something like 75% of Va Tech Vet School acceptees came from VT undergrad; they're one of the few prof schools that actually list this stat).

Not that it really matters; I'm just curious.

 

[genesis09]

The school is neutral towards two year prepharms. They don't give them help, but they don't have an active bias against them. In their mind, from common consensus, they prefer students who have advanced degrees over bachelors over two/three year UG at four year schools over CC only. They do not hold a bias against people who took a couple courses unless they were chemistry courses at a CC.

 

[eelo]

Well, it all comes down to: it's their school, they can set their priorities any way they wish. I could argue against their method as strongly as they could argue for their method, but at the end of the day, it's their decision.

I grew up in Chicago during the 60s and 70s. The old junior colleges (Wright, City Colleges of Chicago, etc used to be horrible, just horrible. Even back then, many classes taken there wouldn't transfer to 4-year schools. I imagine that many of the people sitting on the adcom are of the same "certain age" that I am (or at least darn close to it) and may have very strong feelings about the 2-year colleges in Chicago and the surrounding area. Not having lived there for about 30 years now I couldn't possibly make a statement for the current efficacy of the Chicago area 2-year schools.

However, here in Virginia, the community college system is alive, well, and thriving. There are, of course, 'bonehead' classes that will not transfer to 4-year schools (and never have), but our community colleges run several very strong programs which are designed for direct transfer and even for guaranteed admission into our statewide institutions including UVa, Va Tech, William & Mary, JMU and VCU, none of which are easy to get into by any means.

Anyhow, thanks for your patience describing the UIC admissions policies (official and unofficial). It's been an education. ;-)

 

[LuvCaramelFraps]

I'm sure they prefer you take the prereqs at a univ but cc would be just as sufficient.

Does it look bad to pharmacy school adcoms if you graduated from a university and then went to cc to finish some of the prerequisites? I recently graduated with a bio and chem degree but returned to school to finish micro lab and physio lab. While I was an undergrad I only took development cell bio lab, neuroscience lab, and molec bio lab because as bio major I could choose whatever labs I wanted to take. I didn't intend on going to pharmacy school until last summer while interning at a pharmaceutical company. THanks!

 

[confettiflyer]

Does it look bad to pharmacy school adcoms if you graduated from a university and then went to cc to finish some of the prerequisites? I recently graduated with a bio and chem degree but returned to school to finish micro lab and physio lab. While I was an undergrad I only took development cell bio lab, neuroscience lab, and molec bio lab because as bio major I could choose whatever labs I wanted to take. I didn't intend on going to pharmacy school until last summer while interning at a pharmaceutical company. THanks!

A few classes at a CC should be fine. My school lacked an active cadaver lab so I had to take that course at the local CC (so my class was full of university students who needed access to it).

 

[Farmer83]

At UIC, if you have a bachelors, you get extra points. They do look down upon CC only students, and try and limit the number they admit.

So if you earned a bachelors at UIC, is there a better chance of admission into UIC?

 

[labrat024]

Well, it all comes down to: it's their school, they can set their priorities any way they wish. I could argue against their method as strongly as they could argue for their method, but at the end of the day, it's their decision.

I grew up in Chicago during the 60s and 70s. The old junior colleges (Wright, City Colleges of Chicago, etc used to be horrible, just horrible. Even back then, many classes taken there wouldn't transfer to 4-year schools. I imagine that many of the people sitting on the adcom are of the same "certain age" that I am (or at least darn close to it) and may have very strong feelings about the 2-year colleges in Chicago and the surrounding area. Not having lived there for about 30 years now I couldn't possibly make a statement for the current efficacy of the Chicago area 2-year schools.

However, here in Virginia, the community college system is alive, well, and thriving. There are, of course, 'bonehead' classes that will not transfer to 4-year schools (and never have), but our community colleges run several very strong programs which are designed for direct transfer and even for guaranteed admission into our statewide institutions including UVa, Va Tech, William & Mary, JMU and VCU, none of which are easy to get into by any means.

Anyhow, thanks for your patience describing the UIC admissions policies (official and unofficial). It's been an education. ;-)

The CC's (Harper, College of DuPage, etc) in the Chicago area are decent and almost all of their courses transfer to 4 year universities. I will have to say that the same amount of material is presented, but the exams are quite a bit easier at CC's (Almost all multiple choice).

Does it look bad to pharmacy school adcoms if you graduated from a university and then went to cc to finish some of the prerequisites? I recently graduated with a bio and chem degree but returned to school to finish micro lab and physio lab. While I was an undergrad I only took development cell bio lab, neuroscience lab, and molec bio lab because as bio major I could choose whatever labs I wanted to take. I didn't intend on going to pharmacy school until last summer while interning at a pharmaceutical company. THanks!

I guess it may depend on the school. However, I took my last two prereqs at a CC after graduating from a 4 year school. My pharmacy school didn't have a problem with that.

Officially, UIC COP only gives preference to Illinois residents. They do say they do know the UIC prepharm curriculum the best and understand which classes are hard. They do use the UIC classes as the base assumption for your prepharm knowledge. About a third or so of UIC COP students come from UIC, another third from UIUC, and the last third from other schools.
However, unofficially, it is different. They want to make the BS a requirement in the coming few years. They give BS degree holders a big point boost. Talking to the admissions committee, you'll realize they are biased against CC only students. They have a de-facto rule limiting CC only admissions to less than 5 per year. They've also have had some problems with individual CCs. Their classes are not equivalent to the UIC prepharm classes.
Of the students in the P-1 class, 75% of them have bachelors.

True. Unofficially, UIC will give preference to minorities, minorities with sub-par GPAs, and minorities with CC degrees just to be "diverse."

 

[Toomeke]

Unofficially, UIC will give preference to minorities, minorities with sub-par GPAs, and minorities with CC degrees just to be "diverse."[/quote]


What?! You mean I didn't get in because of my devestatingly HOT Looks? No way....I'm sure you're wrong....my Hotness helped, my wife says so!

 

[genesis09]

Having any bachelors will help you get into UIC. They don't officially give preference to UIC grads, but it is in direct because they know which are the hard courses.
In my class, there are only a handful of CC only students. The number of students who took any course at a CC is much higher. There are more hispanics in my class than African Americans, whose number is less than 10 in my class. The make-up is about 40% white, 40% Asian, and 20% everyone else.
UIC does give minorities preference for undergrad, but not so much for grad/professional. They try to stick to the numbers. If a person is borderline, than other factors might come into play.

 

[washbasin]

So in terms of last 60 units, is there an empahsis for that?

 

[confettiflyer]

So in terms of last 60 units, is there an empahsis for that?

Depends. Some schools explicitly calculate a "final 60" GPA (the one that i know of is Pacific U, OR). In general your final 60 units will be indicative of your pharmacy performance. If you screw up your first year, but your final 60 units/final year or two show an avg. of 3.6...it's a hell of a lot better than doing well 1st year and gradually sliding into a 2.7 your final year.

In other words, your general trend matters (hopefully, up).

 

[aboveliquidice]

Interesting question - the short answer is yes & no - but it will depend on each school individually. You will have to contact the school directly and ask. This is a good thing however, because it gives you an easy excuse to open a proper dialogue with the school of your choosing.

~above~

 

[pharm818]

The school is neutral towards two year prepharms. They don't give them help, but they don't have an active bias against them. In their mind, from common consensus, they prefer students who have advanced degrees over bachelors over two/three year UG at four year schools over CC only. They do not hold a bias against people who took a couple courses unless they were chemistry courses at a CC.

I graduated from a 4-year college and I'm thinking of retaking 2nd semester inorganic chemistry since I had gotten a C+ when I took it my sophomore year. Do you think that UIC will have a bias towards me taking it at a CC? The reason is because I'm currently doing a postbac fellowship in Baltimore and I can't afford out-of-state tuition.... Or I can wait to take it at a 4-year college when I move back to Illinois this summer.

 

[genesis09]

I graduated from a 4-year college and I'm thinking of retaking 2nd semester inorganic chemistry since I had gotten a C+ when I took it my sophomore year. Do you think that UIC will have a bias towards me taking it at a CC? The reason is because I'm currently doing a postbac fellowship in Baltimore and I can't afford out-of-state tuition.... Or I can wait to take it at a 4-year college when I move back to Illinois this summer.

Nope, you have a bachelors, so they don't care anymore. Make sure your Illinois residency is in take when you apply though. It's impossible to switch residencies once you start classes. UIC is only biased against CC only students. I know plenty of people who've taken a class or two at a CC. I know someone who took most of their prereqs at a CC, but they had a bachelors.

 

[pharm818]

I think I'm still an Illinois resident. I went to college in Virginia and is currently in Baltimore until June. However, my permanent address is in Illinois where my parents live. I have an Illinois drivers license, registered voter, car registration, etc. So I think I'm still a resident? Is there a way you can check for sure? UIC is my first choice for pharm school

BTW, thanks for your help Genesis. Are you a student at UIC right now?

 

[genesis09]

If you're under 24, you can always claim residency through your parents. Since your permanent address has always been Illinois, I don't think they'll get excited. The University, not the college, checks out those things. Plus, you'll be in Illinois for over a year before you start class.
I'm a P-3 at UIC. All classes have been cancelled this week due to fire. When we restart on Monday, who know will the classes will be.