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Low Step 1 score Match help?/IM residency questions

Discussion in 'Internal Medicine and IM Subspecialties' started by jackets5, 06.16.12.

  1. jackets5

    jackets5 Senior Member

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    Here is my situation im a US citizen, Caribbean student. I have average step 1 scores 222 and if i was a US student i would be competitive ive heard for most IM programs outside of the elite programs (top 10ish). Im considering taking a 2 year research position (at a top 10 place) since my goal is train at mid-upper tier program. In you guys opinion will spending 2 years doing research make me a competitive applicant for the mid-upper tier programs (again not thinking top 10 places). Or will i most likely be stuck doing residency at a community program like most people in my situation no matter what.

    The type of programs im talking about trying to get into are programs like Emory, Vanderbilt, Miami, Cornell, NYU, MSSM, Einstein, UVA, UNC. Maybe chicago programs like U of C and Northwestern
    Last edited: 06.16.12
  2. Pecs

    Pecs

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    Hi guys,

    I have a bad step 1 score of 190/75 I have taken the step 2 cs and should get the result this week... I want to do either IM/FM/EM What score should I aim for in step 2ck in order to have the best chance of matching?

    Also what else should I be doing to improve my application? I am planning on applying to the 2014 match. I'm a US-IMG and will graduate next year June 2013.

    I plan on working in Ireland for a few months while I wait for the 2014 match in order to earn some money and pay off some student debt. Any advice would really be appreciated, as I feel a little overwhelmed and disheartened with my score in the step 1.

    Thanks.
  3. jdh71

    jdh71 si vis pacem, para bellum

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    Obviously aim to score as high as possible. Step 2 will be easier than step 1.

    Many places will screen you out based on your score, but you've still got a shot at lots and lots of places.

    Will need a visa to work in the US? Or are you a US citizen doing med school in Ireland?
  4. jdh71

    jdh71 si vis pacem, para bellum

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    research doing what?

    who will you be working with? a PhD? an MD? A well known MD researcher??
  5. johnnydrama

    johnnydrama I'm no Superman

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    A 222 from the Caribbean will not make you competitive at the NYC schools you've listed, even with research (short of multiple first author papers in Nature/Science/Cell).

    A year of research can help if you get published, but I think you're still aiming too high. With increasing numbers of US graduates each year, you may be better off without the research years.
  6. Pecs

    Pecs

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    Im a US citizen, So dont need a VISA.

    Will one month USCE be enough to have in my application as I dont think I can afford to do anymore?

    I figured as much but just wondering how I can maximize my chances of matching. By good step 2 score are we talking >230. Just curious to know when I should apply because I want my prep to be as solid as possible.

    Any other tips to having a solid application? My Clinical grades have been pretty stellar so far so I hope that will help my application.
  7. jackets5

    jackets5 Senior Member

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    it would be clinical oncology research. it would be a few different MD's (1 of them isa md/phd) im pretty sure they are fairly well known, they each publish a ton of papers and at about as high end a hospital you can get

    The research would start in July and i would apply for the 2014 match. I would just like to be able to get into a University program. I figured the NYC schools were a stretch. I mean i would be ecstatic with programs like UF-Jacksonville, U of Arizona, SUNY Downstate, Wake Forrest, Miami etc.
    Last edited: 06.16.12
  8. jdh71

    jdh71 si vis pacem, para bellum

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    USCE can help as long as you choose your site strategically. What part of the US do you want to go back to? Or will you be ok with just about anywhere as long as you match?
  9. jdh71

    jdh71 si vis pacem, para bellum

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    You may still have a shot at NYU or Einstein in the abstract, but I don't know if they have a history of taking carib grads - some PDs say no way, no how, never will.

    If you're going to be working with a well known guy who will be willing to go to bat for you (make calls, write a good letter [not all letters are created equal]) provided you do a good job, and you get a couple of publications, YES that will help your application.

    It sounds like you're being very realistic and as long as you keep that attitude, you'll probably very likely find a match at a university program somewhere. Remember to apply to places that have taken carib grads in the past.
  10. jackets5

    jackets5 Senior Member

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    Yeah, thanks. I know U of Arizona, Miami, Downstate, Emory have taken Caribbean grads in the past and currently in their programs. The NYC programs are a stretch IMO. The only reason i put them is the research will be at a program in NYC. Im open to any area in the country, just want a program that will not close my options in regards to fellowship or going into academics.

    What are some of the highly regarded community programs. I know of Hopkins-bayview, U of Chicago's program in evanston, North shore LIJ (university now i guess), Mayo-jacksonville/scottsdale.
  11. johnnydrama

    johnnydrama I'm no Superman

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    You have a shot at the SUNYs and NSLIJ.

    NYU and Einstein probably will not take a Caribbean grad, especially with average boards.

    To be honest, the research won't help much unless you're really productive. With an increasing number of US grads per spot every year, you might be better off skipping the research year.
  12. Pecs

    Pecs

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    Northeast would be my preference but I wouldn't really mind If I matched somewhere.
  13. sineapse

    sineapse

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    JDH, is there going to be another WAMC sticky for the 2013 Match? If so, when's it likely to come out? Have a billion questions but don't want to spam the forum if the stickys going to come out :)
  14. jdh71

    jdh71 si vis pacem, para bellum

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    You'll have to ask the boss, gutonc.

    I made an appeal for one about a month ago and summarily DENIED.

    I think if enough of us riot - you know . . . tip some **** over and start some fires we can get him to pay attention!!
  15. gutonc

    gutonc No Meat, No Treat Administrator SDN Senior Moderator

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    I am paying attention. And you didn't ask that question, you asked about a FAQ. Which I think is a good idea but don't have the time to put together myself.

    Somebody else asked about a WAMC thread which I said I'd put up when, you know, the app season actually started.
  16. gutonc

    gutonc No Meat, No Treat Administrator SDN Senior Moderator

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    On a related note, aPD made a FAQ of sorts (that admittedly hasn't been updated in awhile) that answers about 80% of the questions y'all have been asking.
  17. gutonc

    gutonc No Meat, No Treat Administrator SDN Senior Moderator

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    These two (nearly identical and both useful) threads have been merged.
  18. jdh71

    jdh71 si vis pacem, para bellum

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    If you want to get "technical"
  19. Pecs

    Pecs

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    Anyone have any advice on whether or not 1 month is enough? I have a possible option of doing a one elective somewhere and then after I graduate possibly doing 2 more months observership? Do you think that is wise?
  20. johnnydrama

    johnnydrama I'm no Superman

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    More will always be better.
  21. gutonc

    gutonc No Meat, No Treat Administrator SDN Senior Moderator

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    More is always better. And keep in mind that the Carib kids have 2 years of USCE. That's your "competition."
  22. Sirita

    Sirita

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    Hello!
    I'm an IMG class 2010 from Colombia. I just took the Step 1 and had a 236. Kind of disappointed about that, but well, at least I'm done with that.

    I was wondering if I still have any chances to match for IM in Chicago for the 2014 match. I'm living here right now with my husband, and I love the programs in NU and Rush, even though they don't have any IMGs right now, I know people that have train here. Any insight would be great!

    Also, I was thinking to apply for a research position in Northwestern, would that be good for my application?

    Last but not least. Does anyone know about externships offer in Chicago? I had 1 mo of clinical experience in Canada, but that is it! I think I need to get more for making my application stronger.

    Thanks everyone in advance!
  23. surge55

    surge55

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    Being from a caribbean school I can tell you this much:

    you wont' get interviews at those places. unless you get a kickass experience and a lot of benefit out of that research as jdh alluded to, you will not even get a look from these places. I got a 219 on step 1 (Very close to yours), and a 238 on step 2, applied to over 100 programs and while I got plenty of interviews, I didn't get many from university programs. SUNY Upsate was one, U of Buffalo was another in the NY area. got nothing from chicago even though I'm from the midwest.

    maybe tell us why you want to go to these places other than that they have such good reputations. why set your sights so high? it's ok to be realistic. I ended up at a community program that's also got tons of research opportunities and I'm loving it. they were more than happy to have me (in fact I prematched) whereas programs like the ones you are hoping for only interview US grads and IMGs from other countries with huge applications filled with tons of research and work experience in their home countries. heck, my school matched plenty of residents at University programs like Minnesota and Wisconsin (where I'm from) but even I didn't get an interview due to probably getting weeded out from my step 1 (even though my step 2 was fairly competitive).

    it is what it is.
  24. Severus Snape

    Severus Snape

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    Got my score back for step 1. Devastated. 206/78

    I'm from a carribean school. Was wondering if I have any chance at internal medicien -community programs being an IMG with 206/78?

    I checked NRMP and the lowest i've seen for IM is 210 as of this year data. What are your guys opinion? Will I be competitive against other international students that have little clinical experience? I am doing my 3rd and 4th year in NY hospitals and won't need Visa sponsorship.

    Basically I'm asking if FM is my only option or are there many IM-community programs in NY that take applications int the 198-206 step 1 range.
  25. Mr hawkings

    Mr hawkings Senior Member

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    That number is an average and not a cuttoff. If you're willing to come to my neck of the woods (southeast), you have a decent shot in IM.
  26. Brachyury

    Brachyury

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    As long as you have the money, you can apply to both FM and medicine programs and see where you get interviews
  27. gutonc

    gutonc No Meat, No Treat Administrator SDN Senior Moderator

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    Fixed it for you.

    Otherwise agree...it's going to be tough with that Step 1 as a Carib grad and you should maximize your chances of matching. If you're rotating in NYC, you'll likely be at a bunch of programs where a pulse and an MD degree are the only two cutoffs for interviews...apply there. And apply very, very broadly (both geographically and in terms of program quality). This is not the time to say "I want to go back to SoCal and will only apply there" because that will likely land you unemployed come the year after graduation.

    I honestly think you're going to match somewhere, probably in IM. But you need to have a backup (like FM) and need to be stone cold solid from here on out (honors in as many of your clerkships as possible, an early Step 2 score that is 30-40 points higher than Step 1, excellent LORs).
  28. Severus Snape

    Severus Snape

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    Thanks everyone. I'm definitely going to study harder for step 2 and so far doing well in my clinicals- staying late, helping out whenever I can and etc. I really had my heart set on nyc because i know intern year is rough and wanted family around me as support group. But if it's about applying outer-state vs. unemployment.. then no question I will apply outerstate. I guess I will apply to many family medicine as a back up, not because it's any less compared to IM in terms of primary care but because IM will keep my option open if I want to specialize.

    The NRMP data from 2010 and 2012 changed so much, I didn't realize I would be in my position where 212 would be the cut off for IM from the bar graph they presented http://www.nrmp.org/data/chartingoutcomes11.jpg

    I know I'll have to work hard, I appreciate the reply guys.
  29. jackets5

    jackets5 Senior Member

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    212 isn't the cut off its likely the 25th percentile.

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