MBA or Retrain?

[deleted941485]

I am nearing the completion of my current residency. I had my doubts about the field overall, but ultimately decided to stick it out and finish. Needless to say, I am still concerned with the employment prospects which have been mediocre to poor even in unsaturated areas. I am not interested in a fellowship as they do not appear to confer any advantages. My choices have been narrowed to stay put, pursue MBA, or retrain in a new field with better prospects. Staying put is tempting but I think long term this might be problematic. The MBA has opportunity costs and would likely lead to more debt unless I found an employer willing to pay for it (not great odds on that). My goal is to use the MBA as leverage and eventually become a leader in the department. I have some ideas but it may take years to develop the credibility and trust to advance into such a role. I think an MBA is pretty versatile as it allows you to pursue other avenues outside of hospital admin like venture capital and consulting but again these things take time to build as well. The final option is to retrain in a field with better employment prospects and geographic flexibility seems like an attractive option. The draw back is the opportunity costs of more training. I feel like if I go down one path there really is no going back. Any advice?

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[bizdr]

There are advantages of have an active medical license that you don't want to lose. So I would try to work and get an executive MBA, unless you are dedicated to leaving medicine completely. Without more details, I can't really believe that the job prospects can be poor for anyone who has completed their residency (assuming you will pass your boards too). Also, there are so many health based startups which offer options of practicing from your home, so look into those as well.

 

[deleted941485]

Thanks for responding. A little more detail about me. I am a patho Resident at a small program and about 2 years away from graduation. I am not thrilled with the job prospects and where our grads are ending up. Being in path, we have very limited clinical skills so not much else for us to do in medicine. My first thought was to retrain and acquire clinical skills that were more in demand (Ophthalmology or Derm come to mind). Switching residencies can be an uphill battle and comes with opportunity costs. The MBA has upfront costs of tuition and some opportunity costs but I think is bit more versatile and opens up different non clinical opportunities. It is tough to figure out which way to turn but I think some action should be done to salvage the situation. I am in great need of some perspective. Thanks!

 

[bizdr]

Thanks for responding. A little more detail about me. I am a patho Resident at a small program and about 2 years away from graduation. I am not thrilled with the job prospects and where our grads are ending up. Being in path, we have very limited clinical skills so not much else for us to do in medicine. My first thought was to retrain and acquire clinical skills that were more in demand (Ophthalmology or Derm come to mind). Switching residencies can be an uphill battle and comes with opportunity costs. The MBA has upfront costs of tuition and some opportunity costs but I think is bit more versatile and opens up different non clinical opportunities. It is tough to figure out which way to turn but I think some action should be done to salvage the situation. I am in great need of some perspective. Thanks!

Yes Pathology is more limited than most specialties, but I think keeping your license active is important. Unless you just don't like medicine, I would try to switch. Optho/Derm are pretty competitive. But just your MD opens up more non-clinical opportunities than an MBA would. So many people have an MBA. It's just an added bonus, but your MD is what will make you valuable in the non-clinical setting.

 

[deleted941485]

Yes Pathology is more limited than most specialties, but I think keeping your license active is important. Unless you just don't like medicine, I would try to switch. Optho/Derm are pretty competitive. But just your MD opens up more non-clinical opportunities than an MBA would. So many people have an MBA. It's just an added bonus, but your MD is what will make you valuable in the non-clinical setting.

At this point in my training, I'm a bit vested and would likely just finish the residency. Retraining seemed like a good plan but has its hang ups. Additional clinical training might help. I had sometime to rethink my options over the weekend. Honestly, I think long term value of the MD/MBA stems from the fact that its a ticket out of clinical work which after some additional consideration is something desirable for me going forward. The career options are much more open ended which is a benefit and a challenge. Silly question, how do people go about finding jobs that require both degrees? Its probably not as straightforward as going onto a recruiting website and sending out CVs. I'm guessing that its mostly networking which gets me to my next question: If you already have an MD does it matter where you get the MBA?

 

[bizdr]

There are plenty of non-clinical jobs out there for people with an MD, but you are right - they are not always easy to find. Think about the healthcare branch of any field - finance, advertising, marketing, biotech, pharma, insurance, consulting, medical writing. They always are looking for people with a medical background, and really don't care about the MBA. So unless you are getting an MBA from a top end school where you can make amazing connections, I wouldn't worry as much about the MBA. The MD is much harder to find for these companies, and they can teach you the MBA part. Do a little research into non-clinical jobs for physicians. Maybe while doing your residency, you can do a little something on the side?

 

[deleted941485]

There are plenty of non-clinical jobs out there for people with an MD, but you are right - they are not always easy to find. Think about the healthcare branch of any field - finance, advertising, marketing, biotech, pharma, insurance, consulting, medical writing. They always are looking for people with a medical background, and really don't care about the MBA. So unless you are getting an MBA from a top end school where you can make amazing connections, I wouldn't worry as much about the MBA. The MD is much harder to find for these companies, and they can teach you the MBA part. Do a little research into non-clinical jobs for physicians. Maybe while doing your residency, you can do a little something on the side?

A list of things I have tried so far

1. Freelance Consulting - I got in with a group of friends to look for part time health care consulting work we could do from home. Had a few leads even submitted a proposal. Tried this for a few months. No one ever called us back.
2. Insurance Physicals - I thought this might have been promising but it turns out they really only use nurses to perform these and there is quite a bit of driving involved as well. I connected with a guy who arranges these physicals but unfortunately he had little use for me.
3. Market research surveys - Limited Success overall. I would say about 80% of the surveys I did not qualify for after going through a lengthy screening process. The money on the back end was usually not enough to justify this effort. I think the most I ever made was 100 bucks.
4. Start-up - Tried to design a healthcare app with my friends. Pitched it to a group of people at a tech company. Got good feedback and then never heard from them again. Thought they just took the idea and ran with it themselves but haven't seen it pop up anywhere yet.
5. Moonlighting - Immediately shot down by PD - then threatened to sanction anybody in the program that might attempt this.

I guess the MBA might add some credibility to a would be employer but if they are willing to teach you then maybe not.

 

[bizdr]

Try looking for Medical Education, Medical Writer, Medical Communications, Medical Advertising, Medical Marketing & Healthcare PR. This site has a bunch of jobs too: DOC - Innovative healthcare careers for doctors and scientists

There is a whole group of companies that produces material for CME's, for pharma reps to show Dr's,... they are always looking for MD's

I have an MBA as well, but don't think it added much. But if you can get one from a top tier school, you will make some great connections.

 

[deleted941485]

Try looking for Medical Education, Medical Writer, Medical Communications, Medical Advertising, Medical Marketing & Healthcare PR. This site has a bunch of jobs too

There is a whole group of companies that produces material for CME's, for pharma reps to show Dr's,... they are always looking for MD's

I have an MBA as well, but don't think it added much. But if you can get one from a top tier school, you will make some great connections.

In retrospect, would you even get the MBA again? If I ended up getting one, then it will certainly not be from a top tier program. I have neither the scores nor the resume. I took a look at that website. Some interesting stuff. Thanks

 

[bizdr]

Having an MD does make you more desirable to an MBA program. I was able to get scholarships, primarily because of my MD (I had a decent GMAT score too). I probably wouldn't get the MBA again. But if you are good at networking and can make a connection during the program, that can really help. I didn't really try networking much. Take a look at this list of companies for jobs:
MM&M's top 100 healthcare agencies of 2017

 

[deleted941485]

So being an MD makes you more desirable for B Schools, BUT doesn't really make you much more desirable for a non-clinical job than MD alone. You'll definitely save me a good chunk of change if that is the case. I will check out those companies as well.

 

[bizdr]

Yes, the MBA really doesn't help - unless it's from a top tier school. With an MD, if you do well on the GMAT you may be able to get scholarships though. And if you are a good net-worker, you surely can make connections in school that will help you. But once you are out of school, the MBA doesn't add nearly as much as the MD. I have even seen some training programs with top consulting firms where they are looking for people with MD's & PhD's - but if you have an MBA, you are not eligible for them!

 

[deleted941485]

Other than networking opportunities, can you point to any specific skill(s) that an MBA provides that may be useful in any setting that the MD could not?

 

[bizdr]

Think of it like your first 2 years of medical school. You learn a lot of stuff - but until you have applied it in the real world, it doesn't mean all that much. Unless maybe you are concentrating on accounting, and want to be an accountant.

 

[Osteoth]

What about MD/MBA for clinical jobs like hospital administration?

 

[Sunna12]

Yes, the MBA really doesn't help - unless it's from a top tier school. With an MD, if you do well on the GMAT you may be able to get scholarships though. And if you are a good net-worker, you surely can make connections in school that will help you. But once you are out of school, the MBA doesn't add nearly as much as the MD. I have even seen some training programs with top consulting firms where they are looking for people with MD's & PhD's - but if you have an MBA, you are not eligible for them!

About to enter residency and interested in ultimately pursuing MBA- just to clarify, even as an MD you still need to take the GMAT to be accepted into a program?

 

[bizdr]

About to enter residency and interested in ultimately pursuing MBA- just to clarify, even as an MD you still need to take the GMAT to be accepted into a program?

It depends on the program. There are many executive MBA programs that don't require it.