med school name and rank important?

[synapse]

besides for one's own sense of personal satisfaction and pride, is med school name and rank important? or is residency name more important?

is there a difference between a primary care physician from a lower tier school versus a higher tier school?

for those who want to specialize, what's better? there's more "opportunity" at higher tier schools?

some people say a US med school is a US med school and that it doesn't matter, but the feeling i get, especially after going on SDN, makes me feel less proud of my accomplishments because i didn't get into a top ten school.

someone please enlighten me

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[greets fr. nyc]

dude or dudette!

as a 3rd year who has done clinical rotations at all types of hospitals peopled with residents/attendings from different backgrounds.
look, here are the ground facts:

1) med schools

top tier = bragging rights: like wearing Armani or something (oooh-ah), or driving a high-end BMW (makes a difference in some circles? i.e. may be "easier" to get an interview at equally foo-foo programs) ; may or may not have high student happiness : misery ratio

middle tier = they are s-t-r-o-n-g(!) and well respected; may or may not have high student happiness : misery ratio

bottom tier = i don't know what a bottom tier US school is. Maybe someone can suggest one.

2) med students / residents / attendings
team player = smart / humble / makes people at all levels feel comfortable / hard worker / follows-up on things / teaches with joy

lazy = doesn't show up on time / doesn't show up at all / slacker / doesn't teach

jerk = maybe smart / arrogant to anyone under him or her / treats patients like junk / teaches in between snickering


I guess, one must sit down and reflect upon these questions:

Which institution makes the biggest positive impact in your education?
Which type of EXPERIENCE makes you the best doctor you can be?

Where do you stand? What do you want out of your career as a
doctor and (potential) healer?


look if you come from a great school, then slack & do really poorly on the boards, don't do well in your basic science years or clinical rotations, and don't know how to work up someone with chest pain... how do you think you'll end up as a physician?

 

[ny skindoc]

some people say a US med school is a US med school and that it doesn't matter, but the feeling i get, especially after going on SDN, makes me feel less proud of my accomplishments because i didn't get into a top ten school.

someone please enlighten me

For the most part this is no doubt true.Most docs in practice for a while will tell you how little difference it makes where you go to school.Pre meds seem to be highly focused on such things.Having said this there is no doubt that going to a small group of highly prestigious med schools will help you gain entry to top academic hospitals and make you more competitive for some specialties.So yes going to Columbia,Yale,Penn etc will help you make contacts but in no way detracts from the accomplishment in getting into any US med school.Once you get past the "top 20" or so med schools -if that.. it wont matter much.The residency match lists from most US med schools are more alike than different.The majority of people who match into even the most competitive specialties are from a cross section of US med schools.

 

[njbmd]

Hi there,
If you are graduating in the bottom half of your class, then maybe your medical school rankings might open some doors. If you are a top student at a low ranked US school, you are going to get a better residency than a bottom half student from a top ranked school. If you are a US graduate, a high score on USMLE Step I will also open doors no matter what the ranking of your school.
njbmd

 

[King Arthur]

it's obviously worth something. How much is debatable, but probably not answerable since it probably varies highly from hospital to hospital, specialty to specialty and PD to PD. trying to guess is probably just an excersize in futility.

 

[Realest]

As someone who has spent the last few months trying to extricate the prestige factor from the decision making process, I can tell you, as most doctors will, that in the end, it does not matter. I went to an Ivy undergrad and puff my chest out everytime someone asks about it. I feel superior - for about 2 seconds. Then it's back to normal. They probably think I'm hot **** - for about 2 seconds, and then I continue talking and they face turns sour

Kidding, kind of. I've was waitlisted at all the top schools I interviewed at - UMich, Columbia, Cornell, Sinai, U.Roch. (And the fact that I just listed them by rank is a complete coincidence - I honestly had no intention of doing that). I wrote a letter of interest to Cornell and Columbia. Now that it's almost May and the waitlist is about to move, I thought I should up the ante by writing a letter of intent to one of these schools. But you know what - I don't really want to go to any of them. Yeah, I think NYC is the best place on Earth. These schools will DEFINITELY give me a leg up in matching. If I wanted to go into research, it would be better to pick a Prestigious U. But I'm just going to do the clinical thing, so my State School, which will save me $100,000 and keep me out of trouble (trouble being NYC, *sigh*), seemed to be the best choice. The gloating privileges certainly aren't worth giving that up. Besides, I can redeem my right to boast when I land that neurosurgery residency at Columbia

One last point, which is easy to miss when your head is a mile up your ass (believe me, I've been there), is that getting into a US medical school is a feat in itself. Yeah, there's a lot of people on SDN that love to post things like, "Should I choose Johns Hopkins, Harvard, or Stanford? Oh, woe is me." But there's also people that post how f--ked they are because they didn't get a single interview, let alone acceptance. I know somebody who's been through the process twice with no success. Not to say you should reference these individuals to pump yourself up, but take pride in your acheivement. My dad grew up in a village and managed to earn a seat at medical school in India. The competition there is ten times worse, especially when all odds are against you. But here, his success is barely recognized because foreign medical schools do not carry the same weight. In fact, as soon as people note he's an FMG, they don't even bother asking what medical school he attended. Anyway, my point is, he's the chief of his department and manager of his group practice in one of the most difficult specialties (anesthesiology). If he can make it without the backing of a prestigious US medical school, so can you.

Sorry I got carried away, but I'm still high on inspiration since I decided on attending my state school just yesterday I hope this helps.

 

[doc05]

As someone who has spent the last few months trying to extricate the prestige factor from the decision making process, I can tell you, as most doctors will, that in the end, it does not matter. I went to an Ivy undergrad and puff my chest out everytime someone asks about it. I feel superior - for about 2 seconds. Then it's back to normal. They probably think I'm hot **** - for about 2 seconds, and then I continue talking and they face turns sour

Kidding, kind of. I've was waitlisted at all the top schools I interviewed at - UMich, Columbia, Cornell, Sinai, U.Roch. (And the fact that I just listed them by rank is a complete coincidence - I honestly had no intention of doing that). I wrote a letter of interest to Cornell and Columbia. Now that it's almost May and the waitlist is about to move, I thought I should up the ante by writing a letter of intent to one of these schools. But you know what - I don't really want to go to any of them. Yeah, I think NYC is the best place on Earth. These schools will DEFINITELY give me a leg up in matching. If I wanted to go into research, it would be better to pick a Prestigious U. But I'm just going to do the clinical thing, so my State School, which will save me $100,000 and keep me out of trouble (trouble being NYC, *sigh*), seemed to be the best choice. The gloating privileges certainly aren't worth giving that up. Besides, I can redeem my right to boast when I land that neurosurgery residency at Columbia

One last point, which is easy to miss when your head is a mile up your ass (believe me, I've been there), is that getting into a US medical school is a feat in itself. Yeah, there's a lot of people on SDN that love to post things like, "Should I choose Johns Hopkins, Harvard, or Stanford? Oh, woe is me." But there's also people that post how f--ked they are because they didn't get a single interview, let alone acceptance. I know somebody who's been through the process twice with no success. Not to say you should reference these individuals to pump yourself up, but take pride in your acheivement. My dad grew up in a village and managed to earn a seat at medical school in India. The competition there is ten times worse, especially when all odds are against you. But here, his success is barely recognized because foreign medical schools do not carry the same weight. In fact, as soon as people note he's an FMG, they don't even bother asking what medical school he attended. Anyway, my point is, he's the chief of his department and manager of his group practice in one of the most difficult specialties (anesthesiology). If he can make it without the backing of a prestigious US medical school, so can you.

Sorry I got carried away, but I'm still high on inspiration since I decided on attending my state school just yesterday I hope this helps.

funny that you mention a neurosurgery residency at Columbia. That's unlikely to happen if you attend your state school. High-prestige programs like to take from high-prestige schools. Columbia NS in particular likes P&S and JHU graduates. Keep that in mind if you really are thinking about neurosurgery....

 

[Realest]

funny that you mention a neurosurgery residency at Columbia. That's unlikely to happen if you attend your state school. High-prestige programs like to take from high-prestige schools. Columbia NS in particular likes P&S and JHU graduates. Keep that in mind if you really are thinking about neurosurgery....

Aiy, yeah it worries me a little, but it also motivates me to work hard in medical school. I realize Columbia is big on names, but I have also seen the match list from my state school and it's not bad

 

[bodhisattva]

funny that you mention a neurosurgery residency at Columbia. That's unlikely to happen if you attend your state school. High-prestige programs like to take from high-prestige schools. Columbia NS in particular likes P&S and JHU graduates. Keep that in mind if you really are thinking about neurosurgery....

My brother went to a DO school and did a neurosurgery residency. My brother-in-law also went to a DO school and is currently doing an ENT residency. Three students from UT-Houston's class of 2004 matched into neurosurgery, which is quite a feat for any school. Maybe these cases are anomalies. While brand name schools may help you establish connections, that's all they do. Other factors come into play during residency matching.

 

[Realest]

Thanks bod

It's true, a fancy name will give you a leg up when it comes to the match, but anything less certainly does not preclude you from a good shot at a competitive residency, especially if you've done the work and have the numbers/research/recs/stunningly gorgeous looks

 

[xadmin]

Thanks bod

It's true, a fancy name will give you a leg up when it comes to the match, but anything less certainly does not preclude you from a good shot at a competitive residency, especially if you've done the work and have the numbers/research/recs/stunningly gorgeous looks

If you have gorgeous looks like me, then you can match into any residencies you wanted to. But then again, not everybody look as good as me.

 

[premed]

My brother went to a DO school and did a neurosurgery residency.

How long ago was this? I think this is very rare these days. I am not saying your brother will not make a good neurosurgeon, it's just that volunteering at UCLA Department of Neurosurgery has shown how picky these residencies can be. I remember the Department Chief told me that DO's and IMG's cannot get in anywhere for neurosurgery these days. I am not trying to flame, just curious when he was accepted and if you don't mind sharing where.

 

[tigress]

I know this is a tired topic, but I do want to add something/ask a question. I get the impression that where you do your residency is more important in the long run than where you go to medical school. Do y'all think this is true? So of course where you go to med school can affect where you get into residencies, but you can get into pretty much any residency from pretty much any US med school with the right stats, it seems. So in the long run, it's mostly important to go to a school where you are happy and not in too much debt.

This wouldn't necessarily apply if you're interested in research or academic medicine. But in general, this is the impression I get.

 

[Furrball2]

funny that you mention a neurosurgery residency at Columbia. That's unlikely to happen if you attend your state school. High-prestige programs like to take from high-prestige schools. Columbia NS in particular likes P&S and JHU graduates. Keep that in mind if you really are thinking about neurosurgery....

There are places other than Columbia that teach a person how to cut open a head.

 

[Furrball2]

I interviewed at several top 10 programs for IM. The only place where I was looked at funny coming from a state school was JHU. I did a rotation there and liked it. I ended up matching at Michigan which had no problem with an applicant from a solid state school known for IM. In the end it really is the applicant not the school. Although some programs like to take applicants from the same schools.