My Completely Insane Idea---Military After School

[Taven7755]

Hello all....first of all, I thank everyone on here for the advice I have been given in the past. For as crummy as some on here can be, the majority really do make an effort, so I figured I would get opinions on here as well. I have run this idea by everyone I can find...

I graduate in 2013 from Nova, and I do not want the massive student loan debt to be a factor at all. I work currently, but it looks as if I will still graduate with a pretty good amount of debt, due to the fact that I will have to cut hours and eventually leave my job in the 4th year to do rotations....I have looked into the military scholarships to be an OD for them, but it simply does not appeal to me for reasons too long to post here. I want more of a challenge...

My family has a big military tradition. My father, 2 cousins, and 1 brother are all either retired or active Army Rangers. The loan repayment program that the Army has will pay 65k for 3 years of service, and I am thinking about going into the Rangers after I graduate here. My questions are these:

1) Am I wrong in thinking that there is NO WAY I could pay 65k of my loans down in my first 3 years out? I know docs that are 15 years out and still paying. That is financial insanity to me....
2) Licensure is a big issue here. I understand that I will be NBEO certified before I graduate, but what about state licensure? I want to practice in Vermont eventually, though I have a lined-up job here in Florida....would I be able to take my state exams, then deploy, to return in 3 years to start up? Are there statutes of limitations on that kind of thing?

Please do not do the "why would you want to do that?" (I.E. go through all of that, make 30k a year, not be in an A/C office every day) because I have some reasons that would be a novel if I tried....but any technical help on the above would be great. I thank you in advance for your help....

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[KHE]

Hello all....first of all, I thank everyone on here for the advice I have been given in the past. For as crummy as some on here can be, the majority really do make an effort, so I figured I would get opinions on here as well. I have run this idea by everyone I can find...

I graduate in 2013 from Nova, and I do not want the massive student loan debt to be a factor at all. I work currently, but it looks as if I will still graduate with a pretty good amount of debt, due to the fact that I will have to cut hours and eventually leave my job in the 4th year to do rotations....I have looked into the military scholarships to be an OD for them, but it simply does not appeal to me for reasons too long to post here. I want more of a challenge...

My family has a big military tradition. My father, 2 cousins, and 1 brother are all either retired or active Army Rangers. The loan repayment program that the Army has will pay 65k for 3 years of service, and I am thinking about going into the Rangers after I graduate here. My questions are these:

1) Am I wrong in thinking that there is NO WAY I could pay 65k of my loans down in my first 3 years out? I know docs that are 15 years out and still paying. That is financial insanity to me....
2) Licensure is a big issue here. I understand that I will be NBEO certified before I graduate, but what about state licensure? I want to practice in Vermont eventually, though I have a lined-up job here in Florida....would I be able to take my state exams, then deploy, to return in 3 years to start up? Are there statutes of limitations on that kind of thing?

Please do not do the "why would you want to do that?" (I.E. go through all of that, make 30k a year, not be in an A/C office every day) because I have some reasons that would be a novel if I tried....but any technical help on the above would be great. I thank you in advance for your help....

Are you saying you want to enter the armed forces but NOT be an OD in the service?

If that's the case, I would probably go through the service first and then go to optometry school. You'll likely be eligible for good scholarships for veterans.

 

[Taven7755]

I am currently in my 3rd year of school, and would like to have a way to pay down my loans, as well as to fulfill a lot of "bigger" stuff. The Army will repay 75k of loans for 3 years of service, plus 33% of principal for every year after that. (This is for going in as an E-4, not an officer)

So here would be the time-line:
May 2013--Graduate, hopefully with all NBEO stuff squared away
June 2013--Get state licensure in FL or VT
July 2013--Begin Army training, begin to pay down loans.
3/4 years in the Army, completely eliminating student loan debt
2016-17 -- Start job search as an O.D.

I realize that this is REALLY unconventional, but that is why I am trying to find out as much as I can about it. I just can't imagine paying 100k in loans down in my first 3 years out as an O.D., and that would be easy with my plan. Of course, I will have taken 3-4 years off of "being a doctor", but one doesn't really seem to "forget" these kinds of things. (I.E. A friend is a lawyer, took 3 years off for family reasons after passing the Bar, and had no issues) I would have experiences that I cannot imagine someone else in position could match, at 30-31 with an O.D. degree, likely a Captain the military, having spent years in a position of leadership, etc.

I just imagine getting out with 100k in debt (half of what others I know will have), and taking whatever I can get to start making those payments. For me, knocking out a lot of that debt doing something other than working in a lens mill 6 days a week sounds awesome. (Not bashing the profession -- you gotta start small is all I am saying, like that in anything). Let me know what you think....thanks in advance.

 

[Eyes Only]

So here would be the time-line:
May 2013--Graduate, hopefully with all NBEO stuff squared away
June 2013--Get state licensure in FL or VT
July 2013--Begin Army training, begin to pay down loans.
3/4 years in the Army, completely eliminating student loan debt
2016-17 -- Start job search as an O.D.

.

I don't know about Vermont, but you won't be licensed in Florida in June. The board is usually late in July and the results aren't released until September.

 

[xmattODx]

Of course, I will have taken 3-4 years off of "being a doctor", but one doesn't really seem to "forget" these kinds of things. (I.E. A friend is a lawyer, took 3 years off for family reasons after passing the Bar, and had no issues)

You will forget and you will lose skills. I've been out of direct clinical care for almost three years BUT have still been around eye care and I have forgotten a surprising amount. It is going to take a significant amount of work to get back up to speed. So don't discount the time away from optometry.

 

[Shnurek]

I think when you get out you should take as many state licensing exams as you can. FL and VT def. I heard board scores are only valid for 5 years and plus you won't remember stuff as well later.

 

[KHE]

I still don't understand whether you want to be an OD in the service or not.

Either way, you should join the service because you want to serve your country, not because you want to get loans repaid.

Obviously there's no reason why getting loans repaid can't be a check mark in the plus column but that can't be the primary reason you join.

From a purely financial perspective, there's no reason to pay down loans in three years. Again, don't do this just to "pay loans."

From a military perspective, understand that as an enlisted man, we've got two wars going on, three if you count Libya. And none of those places are nice. So if you enlist, you can be pretty confident that you're going to be shipped off to some dump. There's no enlisting to get college paid for and then kicking back in Okinawa or Honolulu these days. You're going and you're going some place crappy.

So if you do this, make sure the primary reason is that you want to serve your country. Not loans.

 

[Taven7755]

KHE....I have very little interest in serving as an OD in the military. I have done a lot of research into it, and I just don't think it is for me. The scholarships are short, very competitive, and the commitment is still a 3 year minimum. All told, I would be getting one year of school paid for in return for 3 years of service I am not that enthusiastic about.

I would say that 99% of this is that I WANT to serve my country. The fact that I don't worsen my financial situation is really just an add-on. The short of it is that most of my family has served in a combat capacity in the Army, and I would like to add to that. The problem is that I would of course be taking 3-4 years off of optometry, and I am not sure of the ramifications of this and how high they would be. I am a very strong student, have a lot of networking done, and feel pretty good about finding a good job in this profession, whenever that time comes.

The question is whether I can join the Army for 3-4 years after I graduate without doing huge harm to my future career in optometry? My GOAL is to go to a crummy place, because that is where I can make the biggest difference. (My real goal is to become an Army Ranger, the Special Forces of that branch) I am wondering whether I have to scrap this dream in order to live this one, as a doctor, in the future....Thank you again.

 

[KHE]

KHE....I have very little interest in serving as an OD in the military. I have done a lot of research into it, and I just don't think it is for me. The scholarships are short, very competitive, and the commitment is still a 3 year minimum. All told, I would be getting one year of school paid for in return for 3 years of service I am not that enthusiastic about.

I would say that 99% of this is that I WANT to serve my country. The fact that I don't worsen my financial situation is really just an add-on. The short of it is that most of my family has served in a combat capacity in the Army, and I would like to add to that. The problem is that I would of course be taking 3-4 years off of optometry, and I am not sure of the ramifications of this and how high they would be. I am a very strong student, have a lot of networking done, and feel pretty good about finding a good job in this profession, whenever that time comes.

The question is whether I can join the Army for 3-4 years after I graduate without doing huge harm to my future career in optometry? My GOAL is to go to a crummy place, because that is where I can make the biggest difference. (My real goal is to become an Army Ranger, the Special Forces of that branch) I am wondering whether I have to scrap this dream in order to live this one, as a doctor, in the future....Thank you again.

Well if that's the case then you should do it. As far as taking 4 years off from practicing, yes your clinical skills will fade some but you should be able to get them back fairly quickly. WHo knows? Maybe you WILL end up being an OD in the army after your enlisted service.

But if you're 99% sure, then I would say do it.

 

[IandI]

better hurry

 

[optsuker]

Not sure if I'm totally getting what you're trying to do, but it your goals are to serve as a Ranger and then later practice as a civilian OD, you're really doing it bass-ackwards!

• You could have done an Army stint and got your undergrad paid for (plus some $$'s towards OD school.
• As a prior-enlisted, you would have been a shoe-in for a HPSP scholarship and got all of OD school paid for plus all you equipment.
• Consider joining the Guard after grad. Nowadays, you will get deployed somewhere. You'll get you taste of military life and still be making an OD income.

Also:

• Just because you want to be a Ranger, doesn"t mean you will be.
• The Army will use you best to fit their needs. Having a BS and OD degree may dictate where you serve.
• Look closer into the loan repayment program you're describing, I think there are a few details missing that will make it less of the great deal you describe.
• You can still enlist after graduation and get some $$'s since you've missed the HPSP window.
• You could be assigned to a division slot as an OD & still participate in most of the Ranger activites (jump school, air assault, etc) and can even get a temp MOS change to be a line officer.
• Anyone in the military will call you crazy for wanting to enter the Army as a E-4 instead of an O-3!

You've already missed the route with the greatest financial reward, but you can still meet the personal/professional goals via another path.

 

[BKK]

Your idea after completing at least 8 yrs of education is entirely ludicrous. Even if you were to get the full $75K payback, you might not receive that amount towards your loans. A loan repayment is a taxable event according to the the IRS and you will have 28% withheld from the loan repayment amount. That remaining amount will not be eligible for future loan repayment awards.

You will earn significantly less as an E-4 than as an O-3 Optometrist. A quick estimate for an E-4 stationed at Ft. Bragg would be $38,772 per year. Could be a bit more if you factor in jump pay, which the calculator that I used did not have as an option. As an O-3 Optometrist, you would make about $64,920 your first year (both before taxes). Get your FAAO and you can add $2K to that figure.

Look into the Health Professions Loan Repayment program for accessions. This might be more accessible to someone with your level of education. If you could get a 1 year HPSP, then you could have 25% fewer debts from Optometry school and still be elible for 3 years of HPLR.

If you were to spend your first three years after Optometry school enlisted in the Army, you would be so behind in your clinical skill development that you would not be a good hire. Whereas if you were to spend three years developing your clinical skills in the Army, perhaps in a bit of that time in a deployed environment seeing more interesting cases, you would be much more attractive to a practice.

If you want to do the Jump school, Air Assualt school, Ranger, etc, be a Division Optometrist for a Jump/Air Assualt unit (not sure if the Ranger divisions have ODs). To be mission qualified, you would need to attend Jump/Air Assault. Again, the best of both worlds....hoo-ah stuff and developing your clinical skills.

BTW...this is from a 15 year Air Force Optometrist that received 3 yrs of HPSP and 1 yr of HLRP.

 

[montiemm]

Your idea after completing at least 8 yrs of education is entirely ludicrous. Even if you were to get the full $75K payback, you might not receive that amount towards your loans. A loan repayment is a taxable event according to the the IRS and you will have 28% withheld from the loan repayment amount. That remaining amount will not be eligible for future loan repayment awards.

You will earn significantly less as an E-4 than as an O-3 Optometrist. A quick estimate for an E-4 stationed at Ft. Bragg would be $38,772 per year. Could be a bit more if you factor in jump pay, which the calculator that I used did not have as an option. As an O-3 Optometrist, you would make about $64,920 your first year (both before taxes). Get your FAAO and you can add $2K to that figure.

Look into the Health Professions Loan Repayment program for accessions. This might be more accessible to someone with your level of education. If you could get a 1 year HPSP, then you could have 25% fewer debts from Optometry school and still be elible for 3 years of HPLR.

If you were to spend your first three years after Optometry school enlisted in the Army, you would be so behind in your clinical skill development that you would not be a good hire. Whereas if you were to spend three years developing your clinical skills in the Army, perhaps in a bit of that time in a deployed environment seeing more interesting cases, you would be much more attractive to a practice.

If you want to do the Jump school, Air Assualt school, Ranger, etc, be a Division Optometrist for a Jump/Air Assualt unit (not sure if the Ranger divisions have ODs). To be mission qualified, you would need to attend Jump/Air Assault. Again, the best of both worlds....hoo-ah stuff and developing your clinical skills.

BTW...this is from a 15 year Air Force Optometrist that received 3 yrs of HPSP and 1 yr of HLRP.

Do you mind telling us more about being an Air Force Optometrist? The Airforce website has a very general description basically make it sound like primary care. How different if the scope of practice being in the Airforce? Thank you!

 

[Shnurek]

Anyone know the sign up bonuses ODs get if they join the military right after school/residency?