New 3/4 week BOLC addition starts next month (1OCT2016). Major consideration for reserve components.

[non-profit]

Previously discussed here: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/new-bolc-pre-requisite-4-week-program.1170674/



I am attempting to find an electronic copy of the memorandum but it says that all that have not sworn in before 1OCT2016 will have to attend a 3 weeks Pre-BOLC (it is 4 weeks for those not in medical and dental corps) in addition to completing the online RC BOLC course and the existing 26 day BOLC course.

The issue is that this all MUST be completed within 36 months of commissioning.
You will be kicked out if you do not finish inside that timeline

If you are a medical student or resident, you will have to attend 2 months (a 21 day block and later a 26 day block) of mandatory army training.
HPSP students are going to target right before med school and between 1/2 years I guess.

But for reserves/ARNG, you might join any given year of med school or residency. This will be a major choice to make as it can easily delay your graduation of either, depending on your timeline.

The only exception is the continuation of the current policy that STRAP recipients (not the greatest of incentives for payback time) will reset their requirement to complete these courses within 36 months of finishing residency.


If you are looking at the reserve component, good luck, and be aware as you make a decision on when to join. Timing is of major importance with this change.

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[Atlas Shrugged]

Ah... another 4 weeks for intelligent people to perfect throwing tire pieces at each other.

Some COL from OTSG talked about this during his visit to MAMC. Perhaps instead of wasting 6 weeks of my time they could have filled it with proper training. Everything I have learned about the military has been from prior service classmates. Adding another 4 weeks is brutal.

 

[Onefellswoop87]

Ah... another 4 weeks for intelligent people to perfect throwing tire pieces at each other.

Some COL from OTSG talked about this during his visit to MAMC. Perhaps instead of wasting 6 weeks of my time they could have filled it with proper training. Everything I have learned about the military has been from prior service classmates. Adding another 4 weeks is brutal.

Agreed.

Everything I've learned about the Navy has been actually being active duty (after medical school, not those once a year one-month periods) and talking with Chiefs/petty officers about their experiences. I also pull them aside and go over protocol or questions before doing re-enlistments, ceremonies, awards, certain meetings for the first time, aboard ship/USMC-life protocol for the first time, etc. That's served me well to not embarrass them or me.

ODS (office development school - "our BOLC") was prompty forgotten after coming back and starting 2nd year of med school. I wouldn't expect anything different from this, even if it is between medical school and internship.

 

[non-profit]

Ah... another 4 weeks for intelligent people to perfect throwing tire pieces at each other.

Some COL from OTSG talked about this during his visit to MAMC. Perhaps instead of wasting 6 weeks of my time they could have filled it with proper training. Everything I have learned about the military has been from prior service classmates. Adding another 4 weeks is brutal.

I think the biggest problem is the insanity of holding med students and residents to the 36 month deadline.

If you get sworn in MS1...

You have summer between MS1 and MS2 where you will have to skip research to go to pre-BOLC for 3 weeks.

Now where do you find BOLC time before 4th year? Or even in 4th year for most students?


Seems a great way to totall screw students and residents. HIGH chances for losing commission or forcing a delay in graduation. The timing VERY tight or impossible for most. Yet what's the benefit for the Army in delaying the fully qualified training and deployability of these individuals? This is bad for the individual and for the military that wants to sign up new physicians as cheaply as possible.

On the AD side, the incentives all seem to make sense. Sign up, go do well in school, owe time after you a doctor. Delayed pain for instant gratification of stipend makes a good incentive and easy recruiting.
The RC seem intent on being completely detached from what it takes to complete med school and residency. Incentives appear built for others and then tacked onto doctors in training. If you take STRAP, you don't have to finish the BOLC requirements until after residency. If you take MDSSP, you still have to have them complete before then. ARNG and Reserves need a physician who joined as a medical student to simply sit down in the room during these meetings. It'd be so simple. Here's your stipend, go do well in school, the moment you walk out of residency we are sending you to BOLC. And its way easier/cheaper to buy med students future obligation than an attendings.

 

[DeadCactus]

They can claim whatever timeline they want, it's not going to be enforceable. The military may not respect physicians as professionals but they understand filling billets and are not going to screw up their numbers by throwing out a widget 3 years into it's production with no realistic means of replacing it.

 

[deleted480308]

I think the biggest problem is the insanity of holding med students and residents to the 36 month deadline.

If you get sworn in MS1...

You have summer between MS1 and MS2 where you will have to skip research to go to pre-BOLC for 3 weeks.

Now where do you find BOLC time before 4th year? Or even in 4th year for most students?


Seems a great way to totall screw students and residents. HIGH chances for losing commission or forcing a delay in graduation. The timing VERY tight or impossible for most. Yet what's the benefit for the Army in delaying the fully qualified training and deployability of these individuals? This is bad for the individual and for the military that wants to sign up new physicians as cheaply as possible.

On the AD side, the incentives all seem to make sense. Sign up, go do well in school, owe time after you a doctor. Delayed pain for instant gratification of stipend makes a good incentive and easy recruiting.
The RC seem intent on being completely detached from what it takes to complete med school and residency. Incentives appear built for others and then tacked onto doctors in training. If you take STRAP, you don't have to finish the BOLC requirements until after residency. If you take MDSSP, you still have to have them complete before then. ARNG and Reserves need a physician who joined as a medical student to simply sit down in the room during these meetings. It'd be so simple. Here's your stipend, go do well in school, the moment you walk out of residency we are sending you to BOLC. And its way easier/cheaper to buy med students future obligation than an attendings.

I have discussed the problem of this timeline (for med students) with a few COLs at amedd and the current policy is "too bad"...it will take a critical mass of students not commissioning or on the verge of discharge to get an official back off of the policy

 

[DMBandFan86]

What was the previous time frame for MDSSP to go to bolc?

I'm not really sure if this is such a bad thing. The problem was some upper levels probably went to some AR drills and saw how jacked up some of the officers were with basic soldiering skills and decided this would help fix that. Can't really blame the decision. When I was enlisted I'm pretty sure at least 50% of the apmc officers couldn't pass a PT test, shoot, or do basic soldiering skills unless they had prior service.

 

[deleted480308]

What was the previous time frame for MDSSP to go to bolc?

I'm not really sure if this is such a bad thing. The problem was some upper levels probably went to some AR drills and saw how jacked up some of the officers were with basic soldiering skills and decided this would help fix that. Can't really blame the decision. When I was enlisted I'm pretty sure at least 50% of the apmc officers couldn't pass a PT test, shoot, or do basic soldiering skills unless they had prior service.

timeframe has been 3 years for awhile.....but adding a whole extra step to med students is a punch in the mouth

 

[pgg]

What was the previous time frame for MDSSP to go to bolc?

I'm not really sure if this is such a bad thing. The problem was some upper levels probably went to some AR drills and saw how jacked up some of the officers were with basic soldiering skills and decided this would help fix that. Can't really blame the decision. When I was enlisted I'm pretty sure at least 50% of the apmc officers couldn't pass a PT test, shoot, or do basic soldiering skills unless they had prior service.

What "basic soldiering skills" are you referring to here? Please be specific.

Thanks.

 

[Gastrapathy]

Ah @pgg. I'd resisted the urge to ask that question. Somehow it feels like cheating when you ask it anyway.

 

[pgg]

@DMBandFan86, please elaborate.

 

[idq1i]

What was the previous time frame for MDSSP to go to bolc?

I'm not really sure if this is such a bad thing. The problem was some upper levels probably went to some AR drills and saw how jacked up some of the officers were with basic soldiering skills and decided this would help fix that. Can't really blame the decision. When I was enlisted I'm pretty sure at least 50% of the apmc officers couldn't pass a PT test, shoot, or do basic soldiering skills unless they had prior service.

Almost every PT failure that I have witnessed in my hooah experience was on the enlisted side.

 

[deleted480308]

Almost every PT failure that I have witnessed in my hooah experience was on the enlisted side.

yeah, I get that bolc is when all the officers are at the youngest of their career but my bolc had about a 3% failure rate on apft

 

[DeadCactus]

You guys are being obtuse. Clearly 4 weeks of summer camp will make sure someone can soldier and run good 7 years later and it's obvious that our physicians need to run gooder and soldier more...

 

[pgg]

You guys are being obtuse.

What did you call me?