New pharmacists getting a dose of reality

[SlaveRPH]

So do you pay the over time because of a union or to keep a union out? The readers here will find out the truth about retail comparedd to hospital. The truth is it has always paid more in retail than in hospital. Now it MIGHT be different in California. I don't know. California is different from almost everyother state. So it really doesn't matter if we take different positions the truth will get to them when they apply for jobs. And the truth will be hospitals pay less than retail. The work environmnet is less stressful than retail. So lets ask the folks whatr they have seen. Does hospital pay the same as retail?

Don't let the common belief of "retail pays more" fool ya. Year and half ago, chain grocery stores were paying $48.50 per hour. I started our hospital pharmacists @ $52 per hour and $60 per hour for per diem. I had the staff work 8 hours and paid them for 10 hours. Last 2 hours, they received 1.5X due to over time. Couple that with 10% differential for evening and 10% differential for the weekend...and 1 weekend every 5 to 6 weeks, this hospital staff job rocked....

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[ZpackSux]

So do you pay the over time because of a union or to keep a union out? The readers here will find out the truth about retail comparedd to hospital. The truth is it has always paid more in retail than in hospital. Now it MIGHT be different in California. I don't know. California is different from almost everyother state. So it really doesn't matter if we take different positions the truth will get to them when they apply for jobs. And the truth will be hospitals pay less than retail. The work environmnet is less stressful than retail. So lets ask the folks whatr they have seen. Does hospital pay the same as retail?

I'm no longer in CA. I pay my clinical coordinator more than retail pharmacists in the area. My staff pharmacists make $1 less to $1 more than the retail pharmacists in the area. We all work 1 weekend out of 6 including myself.

Union came to the hospital when I was in CA. Technicians joined. Pharmacists told the union to go screw off. Then again, the pharmacist crew including myself were all Neo-Cons and anti-union.

Technicians joined the union year and half ago. They have yet to receive a raise because of inefficient union reps. Pharmacists base wage during that period went from $48 per hour to $58 per hour. I tried to give raises to technicians...but couldn't because of the union.

 

[SlaveRPH]

I have always said a union is only as strong as the solidarity of the members. Many people think a union is some entity that comes in and helps them. A union is a legal entity that allows employees to bargin as one unit. Unless the members of the union will strike they will have no bargining ability. For example, a one day walk out of all pharmacists to protest a lack of holidays off, lunch breaks sufficient staff etc in my opinion is all it would take to improve retail conditions. Whats sad is that a chain or slave shop cannot even open the doors without a pharmacists license. Yet pharmacists don't use that leverage to get improved working conditions.

I'm no longer in CA. I pay my clinical coordinator more than retail pharmacists in the area. My staff pharmacists make $1 less to $1 more than the retail pharmacists in the area. We all work 1 weekend out of 6 including myself.

Union came to the hospital when I was in CA. Technicians joined. Pharmacists told the union to go screw off. Then again, the pharmacist crew including myself were all Neo-Cons and anti-union.

Technicians joined the union year and half ago. They have yet to receive a raise because of inefficient union reps. Pharmacists base wage during that period went from $48 per hour to $58 per hour. I tried to give raises to technicians...but couldn't because of the union.

 

[ZpackSux]

I have always said a union is only as strong as the solidarity of the members. Many people think a union is some entity that comes in and helps them. A union is a legal entity that allows employees to bargin as one unit. Unless the members of the union will strike they will have no bargining ability. For example, a one day walk out of all pharmacists to protest a lack of holidays off, lunch breaks sufficient staff etc in my opinion is all it would take to improve retail conditions. Whats sad is that a chain or slave shop cannot even open the doors without a pharmacists license. Yet pharmacists don't use that leverage to get improved working conditions.

Strike and compromising patient care isn't my thing. I ensure our pharmacists are working in a productive and positive environment.

Pharmacists strike which jeopardizes patient care will only result in government and regulatory body looking for alternative route of drug distribution. We sure won't receive any public support...

No one likes a group of 6 figure income erners whining...

 

[Sosumi]

I really don't see retail pharmacy being as bad as Slaver is making it out to be. Sure the environment can be quite hectic, and there's a lot more pressure to fill more prescriptions quickly while providing decent pharmaceutical care (really just glorified customer service). A lot of the knowledge we get from 4 years of pharmacy school do feel wasted since we have to deal so much with insurance and non-pharmacy related issues, but it's really what you make of it. For what we do, I wouldn't mind bagging groceries if we're getting paid $50/hr to do so I've only been an intern for a year so I'm not as jaded yet.

It also depends on the pharmacist to stop being so snobby and step up to the plate. At Maryland, they really emphasize student involvement in state legislative processes that would affect all pharmacists statewide. If you're going to complain, best to organize and complain to the legislators.

Just looking at the top 10 paid professions, they all have their major negatives -- doctors with long hours, crazy patients, tough med school entrance requirements; airline pilots with long hours, good eye vision, so many lives at stake; lawyers with long hours with only some of them billable; and so on. At least with retail pharmacy, once you leave work, it stays there. So what if

 

[SlaveRPH]

I doubt a one day walk out is compromising patient care ...especially in retail and especially if its announced in the news and the reason why. In fact, I believe if people knew the treatment of pharmacists in retail they would support the effort. If they want all this patient care from pharmacists like you say they want its only logical they would help the effort. If it leads to improved conditions, which would translate into more time for patient care its worth it in the long run.

Strike and compromising patient care isn't my thing. I ensure our pharmacists are working in a productive and positive environment.

Pharmacists strike which jeopardizes patient care will only result in government and regulatory body looking for alternative route of drug distribution. We sure won't receive any public support...

No one likes a group of 6 figure income erners whining...

 

[Julio Gomez]

I think SlaveRPH is trying to say that people who will accept the unprofessional conditions, and have no problem "bagging Doritos", etc. to make the big dollars is contributing to the problem. Also think about doing this 40-50 hrs a week for the next 30 something years, answering that non-stop ringing telephone, dealing with the insurance hassels and rude customers. Then you have a family, and financial responsibilities and with rotating shifts have no time to retrain after you get burned out. This is what he calls pharmacy prison. Most students think only in the short term, and this is the mistake they make.

I really don't see retail pharmacy being as bad as Slaver is making it out to be. Sure the environment can be quite hectic, and there's a lot more pressure to fill more prescriptions quickly while providing decent pharmaceutical care (really just glorified customer service). A lot of the knowledge we get from 4 years of pharmacy school do feel wasted since we have to deal so much with insurance and non-pharmacy related issues, but it's really what you make of it. For what we do, I wouldn't mind bagging groceries if we're getting paid $50/hr to do so I've only been an intern for a year so I'm not as jaded yet.

It also depends on the pharmacist to stop being so snobby and step up to the plate. At Maryland, they really emphasize student involvement in state legislative processes that would affect all pharmacists statewide. If you're going to complain, best to organize and complain to the legislators.

Just looking at the top 10 paid professions, they all have their major negatives -- doctors with long hours, crazy patients, tough med school entrance requirements; airline pilots with long hours, good eye vision, so many lives at stake; lawyers with long hours with only some of them billable; and so on. At least with retail pharmacy, once you leave work, it stays there. So what if

 

[PharmDr.]

I have to say after 2 yrs of working as a tech at CVS....retail sucks. Every day..the pharmacy was like a circus with people running around stressed to the limit. All customers want is their Rx now abd that is it. Yes, very few do want a pharmacists knowledge but that was few and far between. It is not like I am not friendly or customer oriented b/c I am, its just that I could not dream of spending my time in pharm school to get paid a lot and be as low as a grocery bagger. I wanted more out of my hard work to not get treated like crap by customers and managers. I am not a troll as I do like pharmacy but not retail one bit. I just started working in a local hospital and have seen a clinical pharmacist who is happy with his job. I would love to be in his position but those jobs are very very few and far between. Every pharmacist I have worked with (probally around 20) is burnt out over the yrs. from retail and steer me away from pharmacy. I have opened my eyes to other health professions and am soo glad I have done so. Please look into other professions as I did as it has made the world to me. Working in the hospital has been fun to me but it would not pacify me in a career.

 

[jdpharmd?]

I have to say after 2 yrs of working as a tech at CVS....retail sucks. Every day..the pharmacy was like a circus with people running around stressed to the limit. All customers want is their Rx now abd that is it. Yes, very few do want a pharmacists knowledge but that was few and far between. It is not like I am not friendly or customer oriented b/c I am, its just that I could not dream of spending my time in pharm school to get paid a lot and be as low as a grocery bagger. I wanted more out of my hard work to not get treated like crap by customers and managers.

I'm not in pharmacy school because of the 3 days per week spent helping customers in retail (although most patients actually really enjoy my help.), but more for the 4-5 days/week spent not in retail; time spent in my new house, with family, playing with my boat, sportscar, photograhpy, etc. A pharmacist can take an entire week off and only use 1 or 2 "vacation days". How many other jobs offer that type of flexability? Also, how many other jobs are reaching $50/hr (100,000k+) with OT possible, and 20k sign on? Some patients give me a hard time, but I try not to think of them when I'm on vacation, playing golf, playing with my dogs, etc. It's just a job...

If you feel like the "low man" on the totem pole at work, just smile when you walk past the irate (for no reason) store managers or customers with zero college experience, a '87 toyota and half a dozen ex-wives and screaming children. Sometimes we have it better than we think. Pharmacy is a choice.

Personally, my store is wonderful. I'd like to see a few changes, but it's not my life's crusade.

Just FYI: My store does 90 scripts/day. If I were doing 400+/day, I would quit. The pharmacsits who torture themselves with 900+/day are killing our profession. What we all need is for them to quit. There are stores around here doing less that 400/WEEK!! They are hiring too! ...This was the topic of a recent class discussion.

 

[GravyRPH]

So do you pay the over time because of a union or to keep a union out? The readers here will find out the truth about retail comparedd to hospital. The truth is it has always paid more in retail than in hospital. Now it MIGHT be different in California. I don't know. California is different from almost everyother state. So it really doesn't matter if we take different positions the truth will get to them when they apply for jobs. And the truth will be hospitals pay less than retail. The work environmnet is less stressful than retail. So lets ask the folks whatr they have seen. Does hospital pay the same as retail?

I'm in California so I guess I don't count but I get paid around 47bucks/hour. Is that the going rate for retail? I don't know, I've been out of it for awhile now.

 

[spacecowgirl]

I'm not in pharmacy school because of the 3 days per week spent helping customers in retail (although most patients actually really enjoy my help.), but more for the 4-5 days/week spent not in retail; time spent in my new house, with family, playing with my boat, sportscar, photograhpy, etc. A pharmacist can take an entire week off and only use 1 or 2 "vacation days". How many other jobs offer that type of flexability? Also, how many other jobs are reaching $50/hr (100,000k+) with OT possible, and 20k sign on? Some patients give me a hard time, but I try not to think of them when I'm on vacation, playing golf, playing with my dogs, etc. It's just a job...

If you feel like the "low man" on the totem pole at work, just smile when you walk past the irate (for no reason) store managers or customers with zero college experience, a '87 toyota and half a dozen ex-wives and screaming children. Sometimes we have it better than we think. Pharmacy is a choice.

Personally, my store is wonderful. I'd like to see a few changes, but it's not my life's crusade.

Not every retail pharmacy is a circus, nor should they have to be. I agree there are some extremely poorly-run chains that are a detriment to the profession by driving off people who might be great pharmacists. Pharmacy is something I really like, something that interests and motivates me...but it's only part of my life. It will provide me with the means to enjoy the other, more important, aspects better than other careers I have explored. I have truly enjoyed working in some pharmacies and truly dislike working in one (out of 5). I have hated every other fast-food/clerk/hotel housekeeping/teaching job I have had though.

 

[pharmerted]

i agree with some of what slaverph may be saying. I don't think that it's unreasonable to try to institute a few rules to make life a little better for the pharmacist, like 20-30 minutes for lunch, bathroom breaks, maybe slightly better conditions and respect from customers.

At the same time though, i just spent time in a retail pharmacy on Saturday, and in a low volume store, there was plenty of time for bathroom breaks, lunch (albeit at your desk) and even time to read magazines and surf the web. i've known some stores on thanksgiving to get 10-20 scripts. that makes for a lot of free time.

Think about it! $50 an hour to surf the WEB!!

But what i really think about slaverph, is that he is really really myopic. Has he never seen Pfizer's Guide to Pharmacy Careers?

Is he not aware that other jobs exist in pharmacy? the reason why you get all that clinical training in pharm school is that i honestly believe that pharmacists will become increasingly recognized as clinical health care providers with expanded duties and not just pill counters.

the profession is changing, old man. look at what has happened with PA's and NP and nursing as well. The demand for healthcare will not stop and pharmacy will continue to evolve. You've just given up too quickly. You think that pharmacy is an assembly fast food retail job, becuase you can't see beyond your own front door.

Here's just a few if you are that burnt out:

1. PharmD/JD, become a lawyer and work on pharmaceutical or health care based law. Go back for an mba, phd or a residency.
2. FDA/CDC/etc, lots of positions here
3. Pfizer/ Eli Lilly/ Astra Zeneca, etc a multitude of career options here
4. Hospital Administration
5. Insurance complanies
6. Managed care companies
7. Clinical pharmacy
8. Home based care/geriatric
9. Research
10. Teach
11. Join the army/navy/air force, and work in Germany, italy, korea, etc
12. Pack your bags and try retail in hawaii, alaska, or abroad.
13. District manager

Is that not enough options for you? Think realistically about some other health care professions like optometry or dentistry, where your options are severely limited in comparison to a pharmacist. your not limited to living in topeka, kansas and working in "pharmacy prison" at cvs for the rest of your life!!!