Note on "Ivy" vs State school

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

Meganfox

New Member
10+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2007
Messages
9
Reaction score
0
Many have said there's a clear distinction between Harvard and a CC, while there's no clear distinction in quality between an Ivy and a regular state school. If the distinction between Harvard and a CC is "clear" (top 1 or 2 vs. unranked), why is there no general gradation of quality? (the higher the ranking, the general increase in quality) Granted the difference between a 15th ranked school and a 20th ranked school may be blurry, but what if we're comparing a 30th ranked school and an 80th ranked school? Is there a difference there?

Of course, all this discussion is moot. To all those who've argued that it doesn't matter which college you went to and to all those who've argued it does matter which college you went to, I have one question for you. Why should anyone of us care what you think?

Everyone's so caught up in their own narcicisism and making arguments that promote their self-image. Students from top schools want to confirm their decision to go to that top school, while state school students refuse to their self-worth attacked and support the view that it doesn't matter where you go to school. Everyone's so wrapped up in themselves that they make absolutist statements like it matters, or it doesn't matter. They fail to see the most obvious answer: there will be cases where it does matter where you go to school, and there will be cases where it doesn't.

In the bigger scheme of things, all expressed opinions may be irrelevant, because we are all applicants. As applicants, we have no say in whether it matters which school we attended. We are not the ones making the decisions. The only people whose opionion matters are employers and admissions committee members. It is their viewpoint that dictates. Not yours. So instead of endless bickering about why your viewpoint is better, you'd we wiser to try to determine which schools deem the school attended important. There's already confirmation that SUNY at Buffalo weights the undergrad into consideration.

Members don't see this ad.
 
I think there's a scale that d schools use from 0 to 5, with 0 being unranked, 1 being the easiest, and 5 being the toughest. I think most state schools fall into the 3 category, and the ivies are all 5's. So, if that's true, and I'm pretty sure it is, there is a gradation.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
I thought it was 1-4....
How can a school be unranked (0)?





I think there's a scale that d schools use from 0 to 5, with 0 being unranked, 1 being the easiest, and 5 being the toughest. I think most state schools fall into the 3 category, and the ivies are all 5's. So, if that's true, and I'm pretty sure it is, there is a gradation.
 
I don't think all adcoms normalize the schools. I think some dental schools take into consideration where you graduated from, but not all. Its a numbers game overall.
 
The purpose of this thread is not dispute who's better, Ivy or State. It's to carefully assess the admissions behaviors of schools so that applicants are well-informed in their choice to apply to certain schools. They may also better plan out their academic calendar: when it's beneficial to transfer to a different school if necessary. Or when to take A-friendly classes at their current school.

I mentioned two scenarios already. 1) no preference is given to a particular school, and all candidates are weighted equally. A 3.4 from Yale is comparable to a 3.4 from Agnes Scott College. 2) Candidates from a top school are weighted differently based on the competitive nature of their school. For example, a 3.4 from Yale may have points added to the GPA so that it's more comparable to a 3.6 or 3.8 from Agnes Scott.

I'll complicate the matters even more and suggest a third case scenario: sometimes, going to a highly ranked school could hurt your chances of admissions. I noticed that the out-of-state admissions of UCLA and UT San Antonio are very GPA focused. Students who were invited to interview there have chiefly good (20-21AA) but not exceptional (23-25AA) scores. However, nearly all have 3.9-4.0 GPA's. These two schools are passing on 3.5's/23+ from Brown, UCLA, etc in exchange for 21AA/3.9 from lower-ranked schools.

If this is true, then any given student who can get a 3.4 at a top school may fare better if he went to a state school and received a 3.9-4.0. In this particular scenario, going to a top school would hurt him.
 
My note on Ivy vs. State Schools

 
I think those of who attended a good school and had a good grade already had a leg up in the dental admission process versus who went to community college and had a good grade. There is a strong correlation where the name brand education programs yielding elites. Why so? I don't know, but they are more than evident in this society.

What I am saying is.. Didn't any of the competitive processes that you were involved in, in your life, asked for your qualification and education background?? I'd be inclined to choose an Ivy graduate as my employee.

If I were to simply choose which program I can attend, then I would not hesitate to go to an Ivy program. Some people just can't afford or don't qualify. It is that simple. Other than that, it is only a matter of preference.
 
UPENN, an "Ivy" dental school that should be as snobby as any about pedigrees, enrolled 117 students last year from the following 84 schools:

Albright College
Arizona State University
Asbury College
Boston College
Bowdoin College
Brandeis University
Brigham Young University
Case Western Reserve University
Central Washington University
Centre College of Kentucky
College of the Holy Cross
Cornell University
CUNY Lehman College
Dartmouth College
Emory University
Florida Southern College
Florida State University
George Washington University
Georgia State University
Hamilton College
Illinois Institute of Technology
Johns Hopkins University
Lehigh University
Lewis and Clark College
Loyola College
Marquette University
McGill University
Messiah College
Michigan State University
Mills College
Montana State University
Montclair State University
Morgan State University
Muhlenberg College
New Mexico State University
New York University
Northwestern University
Pennsylvania State University
Rutgers University
Smith College
Syracuse University
Thomas Edison State College
Union College
University of Michigan Ann Arbor
University of California Berkeley
University of California Irvine
University of California Los Angeles
University of Florida
University of Illinois Urbana
Champaign
University of Miami
University of Pennsylvania
University of Pittsburgh
University of Richmond
University of Rochester
University of Scranton
University of Texas at Dallas
University of Texas Austin
University of Toronto
University of Utah
University of Virginia
University of Washington
University of Wisconsin Madison
Virginia Polytechnic Institute
Washington & Jefferson College
Washington University
Wellesley College
Wesleyan University
Yeshiva University

While there are some good schools in this mix, there are more average schools.

PS: While I realize it's anecdotal, I feel I should mention that I attend a very unimpressive state school, have numbers that are pretty average for this board, and have an interview with Buffalo coming up. I have every intention of getting in.
 
So those who attended "big name" schools thinks their education is superior, and those who attended an average state school don't think there is a difference... Therefore it probably depends on who is on the adcom. If its all a bunch of people from Ivy's, then it probably matters to some extent.

On a side note, do you guys think adcoms have a grading type scale for major too? Like bioengineering or something would get more points than a psych major or something? It seems to me that your major should have a larger influence on your GPA than what school you went to.
 
So those who attended "big name" schools thinks their education is superior, and those who attended an average state school don't think there is a difference... Therefore it probably depends on who is on the adcom. If its all a bunch of people from Ivy's, then it probably matters to some extent.

On a side note, do you guys think adcoms have a grading type scale for major too? Like bioengineering or something would get more points than a psych major or something? It seems to me that your major should have a larger influence on your GPA than what school you went to.

If adcoms don't use a grading type scale based on school attended and major, they should. Many programs, such as Wharton use a sliding scale and not a flat score system. You can earn a 95 on an exam, and still wind up with a B, because final grades are all based upon the class average and comparative performance. To avoid stratification of clustered scores, some professors jack the difficulty of exams to ridiculous proportions just to separate the pack. Many hiring managers know how to work with these discrepancies, so I would imagine that adcoms would know as well.
 
Top