Oxford University 4 Undergrad

[Pre-Med Psycho]

hi, I'm going to be a senior in h.s. here in USA, and i've been weighing my options..etc.etc....now..Oxford is supposed to be if not the best...one of the best universities in the world... last time i heard it was number one...but i dont know anymore....anyway....if i were to do a pre-med program at Oxford...would it be hard to get into an American med school? im a citizen...went to h.s. here...etc.etc...but i just went to Oxford for undergrad....would i be treated as an international applicant...or what? what would i have to go through to get into a USA med school coming out of Oxford...

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[joseph-arveson]

[

No..not quite...you must remember a few things....

1. Students at Oxford (and many universities in the world) come from having a very good, VERY broad eduaction... they already have a working knowledge of the history of the world and all the poets and philosophy and chemistry et c et c...so you enter Oxford to study ONE thing..and that is all you study..if you enter there to study Anthropology for instance..you study anthropology and only other subjects as they apply to that....undergraduate is 3 years long (sometimes 4) and you leave with a master's level understanding of your subject matter...

2.) Medicine is an UNDERGRADUATE feild of study in the real sence of the word...you enter a university to study medicine from the start... In the case of Oxford you would get a BA in Physiology (or something similar, but mostly physioloigy--this gets more complicated than you may care to know) anyways..you get a BA in Physiology halfway thru the program and a MB (Bachelor of Medicine) at the completeion of the program (equivalent to a US MD)...

3. It would be all but IMPOSSIBLE for an American to enter as a school lever (18 year old "freshman") to study medicine....

4. You could attend an american school..and study abroad at oxford your Jr year if you want that experience...

5. When you have a BA from an American University you can apply to also attend ofxford for a BA there too....this will be a 2 year program most likely, since you get 1 year off for having a BA when you enter...

6. You COULD apply with an American BA to study medicine there...the rules on this have changed in the last year and I could discribe the system in more detail (Dr Peace could do better than I...) but the only way you would ever study MEDICINE there would be as a person with a BA from an American school first...

7. It is Technically possible for an Oxford BA in Physio or Biochem to enter an American Med school (I asked the Admission dean at my state univ med school once..) but you would almost surely have to spend some time doing liberal arts work at a US school first...

8. BOTTOM LINE..start at a US School...you can always go to England later...but your BEST bet is to find a place that suits you here to get a start on things..

Good Luck,,....JA

 

[DrPeace]

Hm... your situation is quite complicated. In answer to your question, I think you should just email various US medical schools and ask them instead. I know they have certain requirements you have to fulfill before applying. Joseph is right that you can apply to Oxford for medicine with an American BA BUT they rarely take them seriously. There is an unwritten policy amony British schools that Americans are at the bottom of the lists when it comes to medical school admissions. British schools love to have medical students coming from a country without medical schools. Since you are from America, it is virtually impossible to gain admission.
You can apply to either the pre-clinical course or clinical course(with a pre-clinical degree). I did my pre-clinical at the University of Hong Kong before entering the clinical course at Oxford. Hong Kong is a different story because it is still recognised under british educational system.

But trust me, all the negative "IMG" things people have been talking about wouldn't apply to you with a degree from Oxford. Contrary to what most people think, you will get TONS of respect from your colleagues, more so than you deserve.

Kato

 

[mela]

There is no doubt that Oxford is a very recognized name. I think the suggestions that have been made to you all have merit. Oxford's name is recognized throughout the world. Its academics have fallen slightly over the past 10 years, but it is still respected. I don't know much about Oxford's pre-med program, but there humanities program is top notch.

I am not sure of an entire undergraduate degree from Oxford. But there are great one-year study abroad programs that can be done at Oxford, Cambridge, or the London School of Economics--all of which are in England. The one thing that going to one of these schools for a time is: it is an unique experience that could set you apart from other students. Anyway, good luck in your decisions.

 

[joseph-arveson]

I have to agree with both Mela and Dr. Peace...

I was saying it was POSSIBLE to enter with a BA from an American school to study medicine there... but you would have to be a stellar candidate and I suspect already have a relationship with a medical tutor there who wanted you to even have much of a chance... My guess is that someone could spend time at Green College or somewhere equally as "new and unfun" and develop a relationship with the appropriate tutor to even have a chance, but that is just my guess...

As pointed out--other options... study abroad your Junior year at Oxford and arrange your subjects according to your major at home--my imperfect understanding is that this is mostly done on a college by college basis...some, such as St. Edmund's Hall seems to be a little more selective that others like St. Catherine's...

..also, the "Yank at Oxford" thing..obtain a BA from an American school....spend 2 years at Oxford gaining another BA (this would not be a repeat of the same material)...that BA could be in Physiology (non-medical) or Biochemistry--or anything that interests you that they offer really... then you would apply to enter an MD program in the US... You could also obtain a MSc in some diciplines with one year of study instead of the two for the BA... but the BA will be more of a "college" experience, and gives you some obscure medieval rights that having a MSc does not...

The thing about studying MEDICINE at Oxford is that this is 2000 and not 1915 when Wilder Penfeild went there...Britian has had lousy governement for some years now, and has become the bootlick of the EU regardless of it's traditional responsibilities to it's history, heritage, or Commonwealth... The EU doesn't like it that too many non-EU people are there...so there are 7 (yea SEVEN)seats for Non-EU people at any time (not per year) in Mediine in all of Oxford at any given time...

Mela is right too...the school may not actually be the strongest in many of the fields..but I would argue that being at Oxford is an experience in itself regardless of what kind of eduaction they give... I told this story some weeks ago on here when Oxford came up.. But the University of London--Imerial College (I think) had like the strongest computer science program in England...I saw an interview where the head of admissions there said that they can have the best students on the hook to go there....until they get into Oxford or cambridge...then the kids are gone...regardless of the weakness of the program there...and he said he would make the same choice if he were them...anyone can memorize the textbook--it is how you allow the whole of the expereince to change you that matters...again, before you choose any college, I HIGHLY recomment you at least scan over Dr. Allen Bloom's "Closing of the American Mind: How Higher Education has Failed Democracy and Impovrished the Soul's of Today's Students.." and watch the movie "Educating Rita"...

I agree Oxford is not what people mean by "IMG"...but then again no school in england, scandanavia, nothwest europe, autralia, et c..is...

Kato--serious question...you took only MB BCh from Oxford without prelim BA?

Best Wishes to All,,,JA

 

[DrPeace]

One minor correction, it is BM,BCh at Oxford, not MB,BCh. I didn't do my Pre-clinical BA at Oxford. In fact, most of my classmates got there BA from either Oxford or Cambridge. For the clinical course, the admission ensures that half the class had to come from Oxford pre-clinical.

 

[leorl]

Hiya,

As a high school leaver, if you want to go straight into medicine, Oxford is definitely not one of the best choices, although it has an excellent reputation. If you wanted to do it, essentially...you'd have to be one of the best and brightest of all US kids - and I'm not doubting your abilities, just saying that's what the chances are. It's even hard enough applying to Oxford med. after your Bachelor's degree at an American undergrad. college. I'm considering it, but it looks daunting.

However, why not try Australian or Irish schools? Actually, Irish schools like Royal College of Surgeons or Trinity College..or University College Dublin are more amenable to high school leavers entering their 6-year medical programs. (I'm not sure if Australian schools require an undergrad. bachelor's degree first). The Irish medical programs are very highly regarded, and I know it's not Oxford...but frankly, in the US - the UK is not hugely respected (although Oxford might be). But that's by name only. the Oxford medical school isn't that recognized, alhtough I'm sure they produce wonderful students. I've heard that American schools consider Irish, Australian, Canadian and Israel schools to be most on-par with US med. education.

hope this helps! Really, do consider Ireland. I've actually met several high school leavers at the Trinity College and it's a very decent program.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Just a note in response to the user above: the Australian medical schools which offer the 4 year medical degree DO require an undergraduate university degree.