Pharmacist's applying to Medical School?

[GravyRPH]

Also, from what I've heard, most admission's committee will question why someone with a professional degree is choosing to go to medical school. You better have a damn good reason why after completing what is supposed to be a career choice school that you now want to go down a different career path. They will wonder what will prevent you from changing again, and med school's look even less kindly on someone taking spaces away from applicants who will follow it to completion. Some will give you grief for the same reasons the above posters are, in that, a pharmacy school should not be a pre-planned stepping stone.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Caverject]

I think it's pretty funny when an individual, in this case South2006, attempts to be a smart-ass and points out that I spelled pharmacist wrong once in my post; especially from someone who spells apparent, "apperent." Before criticizing another person on their spelling, South, perhaps you should take a look at yours first.

I guess I'm going to have to start spell-checking all the posts I make on this forum.

I've never admitted to being a good speller because I know I am not, but to screw up pharmacist with pharmacyist?? Give me a break. I feel bad for Midwestern for the possibility of you besmirching their reputation

 

[BenU29]

I've never admitted to being a good speller because I know I am not, but to screw up pharmacist with pharmacyist?? Give me a break. I feel bad for Midwestern for the possibility of you besmirching their reputation

I must admit that I'm pretty amused by your contention that I'm going to "besmirch" Midwestern's reputation because I misspelled pharmacist. Funny how you ignore the other couple times that I spelled pharmacist correctly in my post.

Congratulations for starting a dispute over one letter! I look forward to hearing your response.

 

[Caverject]

I must admit that I'm pretty amused by your contention that I'm going to "besmirch" Midwestern's reputation because I misspelled pharmacist. Funny how you ignore the other couple times that I spelled pharmacist correctly in my post.

Congratulations for starting a dispute over one letter! I look forward to hearing your response.

I said it because it's obvious you don't really give a rats a$$ about our profession

 

[ultracet]

I do think its awfully presumptious to call pharmacy school a "stepping stone." I mean pharmacy school is not easy and it is a lot of work and i am burned out after 2 years of it and looking forward to this summer.

On the flip side, if you can make it through pharm school and then STILL want to go on to med school (and be 200 when you finally finish everything) then good luck to you.
There are some MDs who go back to pharmacy school as well as some PharmDs who go to med school.
I think that a doctor with a pharm d degree would not be a bad idea and if they remember everything, they would make a good doctor. If you were to pursue an MBA to go along with it, I would love to have you as my hospital administrator.
Can you imagine, someone sensitive to pharmacist needs, that doctors respect???????

The reason people are so upset about this is probably b/c they are either trying to get in and they really want to be a pharmacist and you took their spot, or they are already in pharmacy school or a pharmacist and think that you are a "punk" degrading the professon of pharmacy and proclaiming how being a doctor is waaaaaaaaaaaay better than being a pharmacist.
I'm sure there are other reason people are upset but i don't know what they are those are just my guesses.

When i started (before I entered pharmacy school) I planned on going to one of the programs that offered a PharmD/Phd and then I was going to law school and getting my JD/MBA
I planned on practicing law, perhaps corporate law for a pharmaceutical company or a hospital...

Not everyone who goes to pharmacy school plans on being a pharmacist when they get out. But plans change, especially after you get rolling with it.

 

[UT-Frank]

Whoa there, we're becoming like the Pre-Med forum already....can't we all just get along?

 

[UT-Frank]

Just think about it this way, a person wanting to persue a MD after a PharmD just wants to enhance their own knowledge and skills to become a better professional to serve the public. Nothing is wrong with being a Physician with exceptional knowledge in drugs - they're the one prescribing them!

It's just like double majoring in undergraduate school....If a person has the time and money to do that, I look up to them. Please, these are my own opinions and thoughts! Don't attack me

 

[jdpharmd?]

It's just like double majoring in undergraduate school....If a person has the time and money to do that, I look up to them. Please, these are my own opinions and thoughts! Don't attack me

Although I don't see a problem with it myself, I can understand why others do. It's not like double majoring in undergrad because there are a set number of seats available in pharmacy school. They are quite literally taking a seat away from somebody who would use it.

 

[pharmer]

Again, they are not taking a seat away from anyone. They earned that seat. Also, just because s/he is not going to be practicing pharmacy in the traditional sense of the prof. does not mean s/he is not using that education they got at pharm school. Getting a pharmD and going to get an MD is the same as anyone who gets a PharmD and then a JD or MBA as that person is probably not going to be practicing pharmacy in the traditional sense either, but they are still probably using the eduction from pharm school to a certain extent. In the end, anyone who keeps pursing more education is probably serving the better interests of the public as well.

 

[loo]

More power to ya, BenU29. It takes a lot of discipline and focus to get where you want to go. I wish you luck in your endeavors.

 

[ucdbiochem]

yeah, it's really up to the person to decide what to do for his/her life. if s/he has the time, energy, and money to do both degrees, by all means do it. just make sure this is the path you wanna go into.

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

Always get a good laugh when people post to a public forum asking for opinions and when they are given, they say, "Who really cares what you think?" If you don't care what people think because they disagree with you, then don't ask!

I have a classmate who has a PharmD but he hasn't really figured out how that will do much for him once he gets cracking. Obviously within certain fields in medicine it could be very advantageous, but among others it's not all that helpful. What a long haul too. 2 year pre-pharm, 4 years Rx school, 4 years med school, and minimum 3 years residency. Have at it!


One final point, no need to make fun of med school pharmacology classes, we don't take time to laugh at your physical diagnosis classes. Just realize that everyone has their own unique role within the healthcare realm and leave it at that. We are trained to do what we do and vice versa.

 

[IDPHARM]

For what its worth, this has been my experience. I graduated with a PharmD 10 years ago & I'm starting med school this this summer. (I would have started much early but I had personal issues that prevented me from applying) I had always had a desire to become a physician yet I knew that nothing was guaranteed. I got accepted to pharmacy school but under my father's advice (who is also a pharmacist) he said go to pharmacy school and you could always apply to medical school. The thought here was that pharmacy was something I could fall back on if I wasn't successful at medicine. Since I am going a PharmD/MD, there is no way that I see pharmacy as a "lesser" profession. In fact, pharmacy gave me the opportunity to see how medicine was practiced and the experience of patient care. I just became more interested diagnosing and dictating therapy. I like the challenges that faced medicine. As I look back at pharmacy school, I think some schools of pharmacy oversell the clinical pharmacy aspect of practice and portray the pharmacist as "physician-like". Look the bottom line is that sometimes your view changes on things and you never know, pharmacy may be for you but then again it may not. BenU29, until you have gone through the process, you may not know if you like what you are doing. Take advantage of your clinical rotations by talking to med students, residents and take difficult clinical rotations such as SICU, ID, GI, etc. Then you will get a good idea what medicine is like. Good luck in your future plans BenU29. PM if you have any questions.

 

[merlin17]

IDPHARM...congrats on starting your new career! How exciting =)

If I were on the admissions committee of a medical school I would jump at the chance to accept someone who has practiced pharmacy for ten years. Your experience will be an invaluable asset to your fellow students and your future teams.

I do not agree, however, that the pharmd will help the OP get into medical school other than showing that you are capable of taking upper level science courses. We expect people who enter into professional degree programs to have a pretty darn good idea that they want to enter that profession. It seems pretty indecisive to immediately (or soon there after) apply to medical school. I would have a hard time believing that you eat/sleep/dream medicine the same way. At every interview you attend, the first question (or close to it) that you are asked is why medicine? You will also be asked, why pharmacy? and why the switch? You need to have a good reason! If I were the interviewer I might think to myself that four years earlier, you sat and convinced a pharmacy school that you were as dedicated to pharmacy as you now say you are to medicine. You likely had plenty of time to explore both options during your undergrad experience.

 

[ucdbiochem]

merlin17 is right. if you wanna do both degrees, you'd better come up with a damn good answer to back yourself up. or you'll be kicked out of the interview in no time and worst yet wasting your own time.

 

[Samoa]

One final point, no need to make fun of med school pharmacology classes, we don't take time to laugh at your physical diagnosis classes.

Most pharmacy schools don't have a physical diagnosis class. And usually they'll have either that or gross anatomy, but not both. I wish they'd just bite the bullet and admit that a watered-down version of both is better than attempting a hard core version of either one by itself, because all you really need as a clinical pharmacist is an understanding of "what the hell are they talking about?" on rounds and in the chart.

As for pharmacology, I actually think it's quite a feat to try and teach 90% of the undergrad pharmacy curriculum in a one-year-long class--which is what med schools try to do. My annoyance actually has nothing to do with that.

 

[pharmer]

Pharm in one year? My school does it in one semester. I couldn't imagine trying to learn everything I did in four years during a 4 month go at it. At least one year sounds more reasonable.

 

[Pilot]

We covered Beta Blockers, Calcium Channel Blockers, and ACE inhibitors in one 40 minute lecture. One of my classmates commented to me after class that all she got out of the lecture was beta blockers end in "olol" and ACE inhibitors end in "pril".

 

[Caverject]

For what its worth, this has been my experience. I graduated with a PharmD 10 years ago & I'm starting med school this this summer. (I would have started much early but I had personal issues that prevented me from applying) I had always had a desire to become a physician yet I knew that nothing was guaranteed. I got accepted to pharmacy school but under my father's advice (who is also a pharmacist) he said go to pharmacy school and you could always apply to medical school. The thought here was that pharmacy was something I could fall back on if I wasn't successful at medicine. Since I am going a PharmD/MD, there is no way that I see pharmacy as a "lesser" profession. In fact, pharmacy gave me the opportunity to see how medicine was practiced and the experience of patient care. I just became more interested diagnosing and dictating therapy. I like the challenges that faced medicine. As I look back at pharmacy school, I think some schools of pharmacy oversell the clinical pharmacy aspect of practice and portray the pharmacist as "physician-like". Look the bottom line is that sometimes your view changes on things and you never know, pharmacy may be for you but then again it may not. BenU29, until you have gone through the process, you may not know if you like what you are doing. Take advantage of your clinical rotations by talking to med students, residents and take difficult clinical rotations such as SICU, ID, GI, etc. Then you will get a good idea what medicine is like. Good luck in your future plans BenU29. PM if you have any questions.

Congrats on med school. I don't have a problem with people like this because they have served in the pharmacy profession, in this case 10 years. That's wonderful that you have the oppertunity to persue medicine. This is a case where being a pharmacist will help you get in. If you just graduated out of pharmacy school, and tried to apply to medicine, that is the root of my problem.

 

[Samoa]

We covered Beta Blockers, Calcium Channel Blockers, and ACE inhibitors in one 40 minute lecture. One of my classmates commented to me after class that all she got out of the lecture was beta blockers end in "olol" and ACE inhibitors end in "pril".

But I bet you spent a disproportionate amount of time on drugs like reserpine and the MAO inhibitors. The fact that we know exactly how it works doesn't necessarily make it a worthwhile subject on which to spend class time. But everybody teaches it, because everybody learned it, even though nobody uses those drugs except as an utterly last resort.

 

[pharmer]

South2006, you sound like you will make a great pharmacist as you seem to be very passionate about the prof. I have a question for you though. Do you feel that people who get into pharmacy school with the full intention of pursuing an MBA, JD, or PhD as well are "taking" seats away from those who plan to practice pharmacy in the more traditional sense? These people very well may be using their PharmD as a stepping stone to get to where they want to be whether it is in industry, administration, or behind a bench. What about those who go to pharmacy school and never have the intention of working for Walgreens or clinically as a pharmacist, nor do they desire to get a different degree, but find jobs doing something else like a drug rep. Are these people "stealing" seats too, or do you just feel this way about those who get a PharmD and immediately pursue an MD? Hopefully these questions don't make me sound like an a-hole, I would really like to hear your opinion.

 

[LVPharm]

Do you feel that people who get into pharmacy school with the full intention of pursuing an MBA, JD, or PhD as well are "taking" seats away from those who plan to practice pharmacy in the more traditional sense? These people very well may be using their PharmD as a stepping stone to get to where they want to be whether it is in industry, administration, or behind a bench. What about those who go to pharmacy school and never have the intention of working for Walgreens or clinically as a pharmacist, nor do they desire to get a different degree, but find jobs doing something else like a drug rep. Are these people "stealing" seats too, or do you just feel this way about those who get a PharmD and immediately pursue an MD? Hopefully these questions don't make me sound like an a-hole, I would really like to hear your opinion.

I'll take a stab at it PharmDs who pursue a JD may go into pharmacy malpractice law, or patent law, students who pursue an MBA may pursue a pharmacy administration position at the hospital, a PhD for drug discovery...in one way or another they are using their PharmD in combination with another degree to work in one of the many fields affiliated with pharmacy practice. I can't see how they are stealing seats, since the PharmD is an indispensable part of their education and career. You get an MD after your PharmD to become a physician. Period. There is one local physician here with a PharmD who operates a pain management clinic, and in that respect, having previously worked in pharmacy may give him added expertise in that practice...but he worked for awhile before getting his PharmD. As I've said before, I really have no problems with people who work in the field of pharmacy for some time, and decide it's not for them, or that they have more to contribute by getting an MD/DO...but to go to pharm school with the full intent of going immediately to med school thereafter is another story.

 

[Caverject]

South2006, you sound like you will make a great pharmacist as you seem to be very passionate about the prof. I have a question for you though. Do you feel that people who get into pharmacy school with the full intention of pursuing an MBA, JD, or PhD as well are "taking" seats away from those who plan to practice pharmacy in the more traditional sense? These people very well may be using their PharmD as a stepping stone to get to where they want to be whether it is in industry, administration, or behind a bench. What about those who go to pharmacy school and never have the intention of working for Walgreens or clinically as a pharmacist, nor do they desire to get a different degree, but find jobs doing something else like a drug rep. Are these people "stealing" seats too, or do you just feel this way about those who get a PharmD and immediately pursue an MD? Hopefully these questions don't make me sound like an a-hole, I would really like to hear your opinion.

First of all, no you don't sound like an @$$hole. I only feel that way towards premeds that do not have what it takes to get into med school and decide to use pharmacy as a stepping stone. My best friend here at the school I am going to is wanting a degree for pharmacy law. Being a pharmacist that holds a lawyer's degree would make a lot of sense to be based on the fact they are wanting to defend pharmacists and pharmacy organizations. There is nothing wrong with the MBA either. If you want to become an independent pharmacist, it would be worthwhile to hold that degree. This will give you a better business sense for pharmacy rather than the one class on Pharmacoeconomics. I'm not sure what a JD is. As far as becoming a drug rep, I don't have a problem with that either. I love it when a pharmacist comes in that is a drug rep. They are usually 25 times smarter than joe blow drug rep because they have vast knowledge of drugs and can talk competently about drugs. Joe blow rep on the other hand is just a cheerleader of whatever medication he/she is pitching and does not really have any sense at all about medicine. There are exceptions to that by the way! Pharmacy is not a stepping stone for medicine because they are so totally different forms of care. This is why I am so ardently against students promoting this route to medical school. And of course, there is exceptions to that like IDPHARM who served in the pharmacy profession for 10 years and decided he wanted to persue his true dream of becoming a doctor. I can't hold anyone for that. I admire that if anything because to become a student after 10 years must be hard to do! Does this help?

 

[Caverject]

South2006, you sound like you will make a great pharmacist as you seem to be very passionate about the prof. I have a question for you though.

Thank you for the compliment!

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

Most pharmacy schools don't have a physical diagnosis class. And usually they'll have either that or gross anatomy, but not both. I wish they'd just bite the bullet and admit that a watered-down version of both is better than attempting a hard core version of either one by itself, because all you really need as a clinical pharmacist is an understanding of "what the hell are they talking about?" on rounds and in the chart.

As for pharmacology, I actually think it's quite a feat to try and teach 90% of the undergrad pharmacy curriculum in a one-year-long class--which is what med schools try to do. My annoyance actually has nothing to do with that.

Fair enough.. I agree with you that a watered down version of both would be more helpful for the Rx student. It is vital to communication on the wards to udnerstand diagnostic tests related to physical diagnosis; why they are used, when they are used, and what type of results to expect. Not to mention at least a general understanding of anatomy.

You are correct that most medical schools do spend 2 semesters on pharmacology. Just keep in mind that although that is the end of our formal drug training, there is lots that is still learned during 3rd and 4th year clinical rotations and defintely during residency which is the first time we can write scripts. Hopefully when my time comes I won't be a loose cannon with the script pad! Half of my family are pharmacists and would kick my butt if I was

 

[Glycerin]

I'm not sure what a JD is.

A judicial doctor, as in law.

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

or Juris Doctorate as the case might be.

 

[Glycerin]

or Juris Doctorate as the case might be.

Mine's in laymen's terms.

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

Hope you took that in good spirits.. I should have added one of these Totally just jerking your chain. Hard to tell on these message board things sometimes.

 

[Glycerin]

Hope you took that in good spirits..

Absolutely.

 

[ultracet]

One final point, no need to make fun of med school pharmacology classes, we don't take time to laugh at your physical diagnosis classes. Just realize that everyone has their own unique role within the healthcare realm and leave it at that. We are trained to do what we do and vice versa.

Alas, pharmacists don't diagnose so why should they learn how to do anything other than cholesterol screening, taking the blood pressure, etc?
Yet doctors are prescribing medicines that they don't know how they work.
I completely agree that everyone has their place in the medical field. Maybe one day pharmacists will be able to utilize their knowledge and after the doctor diagnoses the patient the pharmacist can decide what medication they should be on.

 

[UT-Frank]

Alas, pharmacists don't diagnose so why should they learn how to do anything other than cholesterol screening, taking the blood pressure, etc?
Yet doctors are prescribing medicines that they don't know how they work.
I completely agree that everyone has their place in the medical field. Maybe one day pharmacists will be able to utilize their knowledge and after the doctor diagnoses the patient the pharmacist can decide what medication they should be on.

Great idea! Lets bring that to the board of pharmacy and AMA......

 

[dgroulx]

Fair enough.. I agree with you that a watered down version of both would be more helpful for the Rx student. It is vital to communication on the wards to udnerstand diagnostic tests related to physical diagnosis; why they are used, when they are used, and what type of results to expect. Not to mention at least a general understanding of anatomy.

We did have some watered down anatomy type of courses during our first year. In fact, we don't study drugs at all until our second year.

We had one year of pathophysiology which covered most of the common disease states that we would encounter. Besides the A&P, for most major diseases we leaned etiology, pathogenesis, signs, symptoms, tests, diagnosis and treatment. Medical microbiology covered bacterial & viral diseases. Integrated case studies had two in-depth cases per semester dealing with things like asthma, diabetes, meningitis, etc. Our other classes will all build upon this foundation. Just memorizing drugs without first knowing how they work on the body would be a waste of time. I will have two more years of pharmacotherapy which just deals with treatment, in addition to pharmacology, med chem, dose optimization, etc.

Many students in my class were unhappy that we studying pathophysiology instead of learning drugs. These are students who loved chemistry and hated biology. That's why they chose pharmacy instead of medicine.

 

[Glycerin]

Maybe one day pharmacists will be able to utilize their knowledge and after the doctor diagnoses the patient the pharmacist can decide what medication they should be on.

That is exactly what one of the pharmacists with whom I work said yesterday!

 

[ultracet]

It is what they are preaching to us in school....
We learn all about pathophys our first year but our third year we have a patient assessment class where we learn immunizations, BP screening etc...

 

[Samoa]

It is what they are preaching to us in school....
We learn all about pathophys our first year but our third year we have a patient assessment class where we learn immunizations, BP screening etc...

That's actually fine with me. What I think is a little silly is teaching us how to read EKGs, and how to do the full neurological exam, the psychiatric interview, the musculoskeletal exam, the fundoscopic exam, and various other things that would completely freak out our teams if we just up and did them one day on rounds.

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

How do you plan on managing a complex cardiac patient if you don't know how to read an EKG? How will you be able to determine if your therapy is working? How will you know if you are inducing QT prolongation or ST scooping because of the digitalis effect? I don't think you'll want to grab someone and have them read it for you while you are trying to make decisions about therapy. The more you know about the physical exam and how it's done the better you can communicate with Physician/resident members of the team.

Just my .02

 

[loo]

Why isn't this thread dead already?

 

[Samoa]

How do you plan on managing a complex cardiac patient if you don't know how to read an EKG? How will you be able to determine if your therapy is working? How will you know if you are inducing QT prolongation or ST scooping because of the digitalis effect? I don't think you'll want to grab someone and have them read it for you while you are trying to make decisions about therapy. The more you know about the physical exam and how it's done the better you can communicate with Physician/resident members of the team.

Just my .02

If things worked that way in real life, you'd have a point.

 

[28657]

Why isn't this thread dead already?

I think this is actually one of the more interesting threads the pharmacy forum has seen in a while.

 

[dgroulx]

How do you plan on managing a complex cardiac patient if you don't know how to read an EKG?

Just my .02

We learned how to read an EKG in A & P at a community college. It is assumed knowledge before you start pharmacy school. Abnormalities, such as long Q-T syndrome were covered in pathophysiology class.

 

[28657]

We learned how to read an EKG in A & P at a community college. It is assumed knowledge before you start pharmacy school. Abnormalities, such as long Q-T syndrome were covered in pathophysiology class.

So are you telling me that you could take a look right now at an EKG and be able to diagnose or monitor treatment? I've learned "how to read" an EKG a few times, but there's no way in HELL that I would trust my limited knowledge to diagnose or monitor therapy. I'm assuming/hoping that we'll learn about EKGs in a lot more detail with respect to therapeutics later in our education.

 

[Samoa]

Well, recognizing a normal EKG and interpreting an abnormal one are two very different things. And although I've been taught the classic abnormal rhythms, and I understand about long Q-T intervals, etc., I have never been in a position where my team relied upon ME to interpret an EKG and suggest a drug therapy change based on my interpretation (Edit: except in a code situation, and that training was part of my ACLS certification, not my pharmacy coursework). Someone else always reads it, and what I need to know as a clinical pharmacist is how to use that information to tailor the patient's drug therapy.

Which is the point I'm making about ALL physical diagnosis training for pharmacists. You need to know how to USE the information, not how to generate it.

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

I'd hate to be stuck in the situation where I had to rely on someone else to tell me what I needed to know. Sure, you are right that much of the time there's a cards fellow or whatever that will tell you what's going on with an EKG. But personally I'd like to be able to look at it myself and determine any irregularities and then tailor my drug therapy accordingly. I know that Rx guys learn all the possible side effects, but how will you really know what that means unless you know how it presents diagnostically?


I should clarify that I have a dog in both fights here. I find it very interesting to learn more about just exactly what goes on in Rx education because my dad is the founding Dean of an Rx school and I am currently in medical school. I love to hear about what the learning is all about. Sorry if I'm butting in where my opinion isn't really wanted.

 

[Samoa]

Not at all. I'm happy a future physician somewhere cares about it.

The thing you may not realize at this point is that the pharmacist is really not the one making the call, and would certainly not be allowed to make a drug therapy change based solely on their own interpretation of an EKG. At most, there would be a written protocol outlining the parameters under which a pharmacist could alter drug therapy, and I have yet to see one that allowed a pharmacist to base such a decision on their own reading of ANY diagnostic test other than a lab result.

 

[dgroulx]

So are you telling me that you could take a look right now at an EKG and be able to diagnose or monitor treatment?

No, I could tell if it was abnormal. If I wanted to diagnose, I would have gone to medical school.

When I shadowed a clinical pharmacist this last fall, she was responsible for noting EKG abnormalities. The monitors were right above her desk. Since she was a recent UF graduate and I'm taking the same classes, then by the time I graduate, I feel that I will be capable of monitoring treatment.

 

[Pilot]

Maybe one day pharmacists will be able to utilize their knowledge and after the doctor diagnoses the patient the pharmacist can decide what medication they should be on.

This sounds like a great idea. The pharmacists can submit the insurance claim and immediately discover whether the insurance company has the drug on the formulary. He/she can then change to "proper" medication as dictated by the insurance company, just like physicians are forced to do currently...

 

[Samoa]

When I shadowed a clinical pharmacist this last fall, she was responsible for noting EKG abnormalities. The monitors were right above her desk. Since she was a recent UF graduate and I'm taking the same classes, then by the time I graduate, I feel that I will be capable of monitoring treatment.

So what happens when she sees something abnormal?

 

[sweetcalie08]

Many students in my class were unhappy that we studying pathophysiology instead of learning drugs. These are students who loved chemistry and hated biology. That's why they chose pharmacy instead of medicine.

So is it bad that I love biology more than chemistry, and am pursuing pharmacy? I did think about medicine at one time. Just really didn't think that was quite my thing. Hmm.

 

[Dr_Rx2003]

Just curious....why don't you become a PA or nurse practitioner if you want to diagnose and prescribe(even though you still have to be under the supervision of a physician)? Medical school seems like an overkill at this point....