Pre-match VS Match

[wannabie]

I searched extensively to see if someone addressed my question earlier, but I couldn't find anything.

I'm an a US- IMG with nine interviews in psychiatry: six university or high end community (as mentioned by a psych program director elsewhere) programs that participate in the match and three at IMG factories that participate in pre-match. I have a connection that can get me a guaranteed pre-match at one of the IMG factories, but when I interviewed at the program I despised everything about it.

My question: how do I weigh the risks of rolling the dice with the match? I'm not guaranteed to match. NMRP Charting outcomes says i have about a 63% chance (based on contiguous rankings). That's slightly better than a coin flip. I'm obsessing over taking the guaranteed match with a malignant program or possibly wasting a year.

Thanks for any input.

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[IMPD]

Very difficult question to answer without knowing how well you interview. Your interview numbers are on the border, as you can see. However, interview quality makes a huge difference here. How are you on dates? Seriously. If you find social encounters generally awkward (or people who will tell you the truth describe you as such), you might take a chance on a malignant pre-match. Otherwise I would say, roll the dice.

 

[SoyMilk]

I thought pre-matching has been eliminated

 

[gutonc]

I thought pre-matching has been eliminated

Mostly but not completely. Programs need to be "all in" or "all out" at the institutional level. If they're "all in" (like most reputable programs), then there are no pre-matches. If they're outside of the Match they can sign whoever they want, whenever they want. Most of these programs are crappy IMG mills in the NE.

 

[jakeislove]

IMO, there's no downside to accepting a pre-match position at a place you'd love to receive training.

 

[mvenus929]

IMO, there's no downside to accepting a pre-match position at a place you'd love to receive training.

But the OP doesn't love the program (s)he has a pre-match guarantee at, so this advice is essentially worthless. The OP is talking about rolling the dice for a program that would be a good fit vs a guaranteed spot at a place that is hated.

 

[jakeislove]

But the OP doesn't love the program (s)he has a pre-match guarantee at, so this advice is essentially worthless. The OP is talking about rolling the dice for a program that would be a good fit vs a guaranteed spot at a place that is hated.

That's why I wrote "love".

There's no real reason for taking a hated place if better options are available.

 

[choc_mint]

However, interview quality makes a huge difference here.

Hello IMPD, how can we know the quality of our interview?

 

[IMPD]

Hello IMPD, how can we know the quality of our interview?

Knowledge of ourselves is usually the least reliable. This is where you have to trust someone to give you feedback. I was only sort of joking about asking how you are on dates. Have you worked other jobs? Ever interviewed for anything else? Do you have any friends? These are places to start either making an assessment for yourself or asking for some insight.

 

[choc_mint]

Thank you for responding @IMPD..

 

[Winged Scapula]

. If older grad and recent grad both perform well on IV, will the recent be preferred over older grad?

Yes in almost all cases. Many programs have limits on YOG, usually 3-5 years max.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

There is no way to answer your original question. You're faced with taking a pre-match spot which is guaranteed but where you might be unhappy, with taking your chances in the match for something better. If you truly despise the prematch option, then the decision is (perhaps) somewhat easier as you have to wonder whether you'll really be able to perform well in a miserable program for 3 years -- residency is hard work, and you should at least like something about your job.

Whether YOG will be used in ranking decisions will be program specific. I would tend to think that it would not have much bearing once you get an interview. Some programs will use it as a cutoff for offering interviews, but once you get interviewed it may not matter as much. But it also depends upon what you've done since 2009, as the further you are from clinical work the more concern programs might have.

Good luck, as it's not an easy decision.

 

[choc_mint]

Whether YOG will be used in ranking decisions will be program specific. I would tend to think that it would not have much bearing once you get an interview. Some programs will use it as a cutoff for offering interviews, but once you get interviewed it may not matter as much. But it also depends upon what you've done since 2009, as the further you are from clinical work the more concern programs might have.

Good luck, as it's not an easy decision.

Thank you @aProgDirector!

 

[wannabie]

Very difficult question to answer without knowing how well you interview. Your interview numbers are on the border, as you can see. However, interview quality makes a huge difference here. How are you on dates? Seriously. If you find social encounters generally awkward (or people who will tell you the truth describe you as such), you might take a chance on a malignant pre-match. Otherwise I would say, roll the dice.

Thanks for the feedback. I apologize for the delay in my response.

I'm interviewing at the best of my abilities. I haven't made any obvious errors. I'm pretty good in social situations. I went on a date with one of the other interviewees after the interview. I've also never had a first date not lead to a second date--I might just select the people I ask out well though. At my last interview, I became pretty good friends with one of the other interviewees and am meeting up with him (and his wife) when I interview at a program near him.

I have a whole bunch of friends inside and outside medicine. Thank you for your insightful questions.

All my interviews usually run over the time limit because of how good the conversation is. But I can't quantify if that means I interviewed well. At my last interview, the faculty member I interviewed with said specifically: I want a resident exactly like you. So I probably did well on that one.

There is no way to answer your original question. You're faced with taking a pre-match spot which is guaranteed but where you might be unhappy, with taking your chances in the match for something better. If you truly despise the prematch option, then the decision is (perhaps) somewhat easier as you have to wonder whether you'll really be able to perform well in a miserable program for 3 years -- residency is hard work, and you should at least like something about your job.

Good luck, as it's not an easy decision.

I think you hit it on the spot: my disdain for the pre-match spot makes my decision much easier. I'm not going to learn or perform well in a miserable program. Thank you for that. I'm an IMG; so it's going to be Russian Roullette for me, but I'm going to go for it!

 

[SplenoMegastar]

redacted

Why are you interested in identifying/chastising this person (here and on the Ask the Coordinator thread)?

 

[Law2Doc]

Thanks for the feedback. I apologize for the delay in my response.

I'm interviewing at the best of my abilities. I haven't made any obvious errors. I'm pretty good in social situations. I went on a date with one of the other interviewees after the interview. I've also never had a first date not lead to a second date--I might just select the people I ask out well though. At my last interview, I became pretty good friends with one of the other interviewees and am meeting up with him (and his wife) when I interview at a program near him.

I have a whole bunch of friends inside and outside medicine. Thank you for your insightful questions.

All my interviews usually run over the time limit because of how good the conversation is. But I can't quantify if that means I interviewed well. At my last interview, the faculty member I interviewed with said specifically: I want a resident exactly like you. So I probably did well on that one.



I think you hit it on the spot: my disdain for the pre-match spot makes my decision much easier. I'm not going to learn or perform well in a miserable program. Thank you for that. I'm an IMG; so it's going to be Russian Roullette for me, but I'm going to go for it!

Just to offer a contradictory view, if we are only talking about a three year residency, it's not that hard to keep your head down and suffer through, even at some of the worst places. Three years goes by in a blink. Although there are differences in degree, intern year is bad for everyone, everywhere, unless you are at a cushy TY, so we are only likely talking two years of big difference in hurt. And your whole intern class is in the same boat, so you will have strong kinships - misery loves company. You may even look back on residency positively after its done. So in my view it's not all that different than the guys who get the army to pay for their tuition -- you will suffer through a few years in exchange for the benefit. Why give yourself a greater than 1/3 chance of not matching? Not matching is the real hell in this story.

 

[Wolf02]

Roll the dice this year. If you miss then use your connection next year.
Best of luck no matter what you decide. Hopefully you'll get a prematch from one of the other 2 places and this will all end up being moot.

 

[j4pac]

Residency is too hard, and life is too short. Don't go into a program KNOWING that it is malignant. That's insanity.

Good luck.

I hope that more prospective Caribbean students read these threads. It's a horrible situation to be in.

 

[BlueRug]

Curious, did it work out for you?