Rejected from PsyD's, should I do MS?

[thebigem]

Hello. I have realized that I need to beef up my application a bit. Here are my stats:
GPA: 3.49
Psych GPA: 3.83
GRE: 162 V (89th percentile)/ 155 Q (60th percentile)/ 4.0 A (50th percentile)
Psych GRE: 750
Letters were good, maybe great?
2 years RA experience, one paper in manuscript (but I'm only 3rd author) It is very likely to be published because we are submitting it to a journal that is edited by one of the authors.
2.5 years clinical experience as a case manager and counselor.
I applied to pretty good PsyD programs (Widener, U of Indianapolis, PGSP, IUP, some others)
I didn't think my interviews went too terribly :/ Also, I'm interested in neuropsychology.
I don't see myself doing better on the GRE, even the analytical section. I was happy with my 4... I don't write well under pressure.
Would obtaining a masters in clinical psych help me get in to a PsyD program? I'd rather NOT do a masters to save time and money, but it's a better option than getting rejected from PsyD programs again next year. I'd rather just keep on with my current job as a counselor and RA and try again next year.

Thank you, SDN.

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[WisNeuro]

If you're interested in neuropsychology, you need to be going somewhere with a solid research background as well.

 

[futurepsydoc]

Is there any reason your are not applying to PhD programs? They might be a better for fit for your goal of being a Neuropsychologist. I would research this a bit more. Also, I think you should consider applying to PhD programs whose professors have lines of research related to your RA experiences. Goodness of FIT is important in terms of acceptance. Have you discussed this with your mentor at all? They might be able to help you w/ getting interviews at schools that have labs doing similar/related research. I think this would give you a leg up in the interview process.

In terms of stats, your overall GPA and Psych GPA are in the right range. The Psych GRE is high. Your verbal GRE is excellent. I don't know about the Analytical Section on the GRE, but do you think you could do better on the Quantitative Section? I found that I improved most on this section w/ studying. If that manuscript is published it will definitely be a help. Do you have any poster presentations? If not, I would try to bolster this area of your CV.

Is this your first time applying to doctoral programs? If so, I might wait a year and see if the additional time and experience help out. Also, did anyone help you with applications/essays? Garnering additional help with these could strengthen your application --> I realize your probably did this, I am just trying to come up with every idea I can off the top of my head.

In terms of MA/MS programs, I would look at those that which provide funding to help reduce the financial burden. I would not just consider clinical MA/MS programs, but also general-experimental programs. Getting an MA/MS can be helpful for some people: increased research experience, thesis, graduate level work, additional education, further development of CV. Having said that, I would probably apply next year to MA/MS programs at the same time as PhD/PsyD programs, using them as a back up plan.

 

[thebigem]

I applied to places that offer neuropsych practicum placements, electives and research opportunities. I'm much more interested in clinical work than research, which is why I applied to PsyD programs. I also didn't have much faith that I'd get into a PhD program. This is my first time applying. I did have some help on my SOP and I heard it was great. I'll work on getting a poster presentation and more pubs.

On my interviews, some schools commented that I had enough research experience. This led me to believe I just need more clinical experience.

Should I be applying to PhD programs? I felt like I didn't even have a chance for most.

Thank you so much

 

[CheetahGirl]

Yes. I agree with others, stick it out another year and apply to both PhD/PsyD. IMO Avoid the MS/MA route if you can (only b/c it is more time/money that you could put towards PhD/PsyD program). Plus you'll be doing a dissertation regardless in a PsyD program (hopefully...but depends on what PsyD programs you chose to apply to) and whilst you'll be trained in both clinical and research areas, you can place the emphasis on your clinical training and the research exposure will only make you a better clinician.

Try to get some original ideas/first-authorship out of soon-to-be published manuscript data. That'll make your more competitive for both types of programs and show interviewers that you know how to further/deepen ideas, which is what you'll doing ad nauseam in grad school. Good luck!

 

[soccercat]

I would avoid the M.S. Many programs will not take credits and even with those that do, you will be stuck repeating some of the classes. It will end up being a waste of time and money and probably will not increase your changes of getting into school. Continue building your research and when the time comes to apply to programs again next year reach out to faculty you'd like to work with (especially if you add Ph.D.s to your application list). Often times this is what can make or break you depending on the size of the program as faculty will vouch for students they want. If there are any schools you'd like to reapply to next year, talking with admissions directors also cannot hurt as they may be able to give you tips on your applications that will make them stronger.

 

[crazypsychstudent]

I applied and got accepted to some of those PsyD programs and got in with way lower stats and less experience... I think it may have been the interview. I was told that my passion and drive got me in because I was VERY express, detailed, and knew exactly what I wanted to do. Try again next year, I think you'll have a shot!

 

[thebigem]

Congrats! and thanks for the info, I'll do some practice interviews. I actually have one more interview at La Salle but after getting all of these rejections, I've been feeling totally hopeless about the process.

 

[crazypsychstudent]

Congrats! and thanks for the info, I'll do some practice interviews. I actually have one more interview at La Salle but after getting all of these rejections, I've been feeling totally hopeless about the process.

Don't! Go in there confident and tell them how passionate you are.

 

[smalltownpsych]

It only takes one "Yes" to get in. The number of No's is meaningless. I only had one interview for doctoral programs and it was a "Yes".

 

[jade1234]

I agree with those who say that you should work on interviewing. Your stats look strong. I would also make it more clear why you are a good fit for certain professor's work, if you have not already.

 

[JackD]

I do agree with the people here who are basically saying "don't give up on your dreams" and that you are a strong candidate for a doctoral program. However, I do want to say, if you can do what you love but its with a masters, instead of a psyd or phd, its not the worst thing in the world. Having a career that you love is the most important thing; how you get there is just some of the minor details. Second, if it is about the fancy title of "doctor" trust me when i say, its not all its cracked up to be. For me, it was fun for the first week and after that, being able to call myself "doctor" barely registers as anything important. Helping people and practicing medicine is what I enjoy and if i ended up as a medical doctor, a physicians assistant, or nurse practitioner, I would be in the exact same place. Whether i am a doctor or not, makes no difference to me. If i could do the same job with a different title, i would be fine with it. My point is, if the only career you want to end up in absolutely involves getting a doctorate, then find a way to make it happen. I'm guessing your worst care scenario has already happened, I say embrace that. Use the new found freedom to explore new options and possibilities. If you find that the doctorate is truly the direction you need to go in, great, you will enjoy that path. But, if you have opportunities to do something you will love but its with a masters instead of the psyd or phd, don't dismiss it outright. Whats important is that you are happy, not that you were able to translate your excellent undergrad states into the flashiest title possible.

 

[deleted343839]

I didn't think my interviews went too terribly :/ Also, I'm interested in neuropsychology.

Take a look around your community at the neuropsychologists in clinical practice and where they trained. You will find a preponderence of PhDs. I've actually never met a neuropsychologist with a PsyD, though I'm sure they exist.

Neuropsychology is a well organized subspecialty and it would be to your benefit to identify the training programs (whether PsyD or PhD) that are consistently graduating people who go on to do neuropsych fellowships and become practicing neuropsych clinicians and/or faculty. Some programs have dedicated neuropsychology tracks, not just external practica. If you have a strong interest in or are pretty sure about pursuing neuropsych as a career, then that would be a good place to aim.

(I'm assuming that you have a good understanding of what neuropsychologists do. If not, and that came across in your interview, that alone would cost you.)

Finally, don't rule out re-taking your GRE to improve your shot at admission to a better program. "Not writing well under pressure" is something you will eventually have to overcome, so there's no reason not to tackle that problem now.

 

[Chalupacabra]

I've actually never met a neuropsychologist with a PsyD, though I'm sure they exist.

Probably the best/most useful outside report I've read during my school-based internship was by a PsyD npsych from UAlbany. There are a few excellent PsyD neuropsychs in my area, actually (and, to be fair, a few not so excellent ones).

I would second to look for programs with a neuro track. While I interviewed at some programs that had a good history of finding students neuro internships and practica and profs that conducted a lot of neuro research, many of them still only offered only one or two classes in neuro. Programs with a neuro track should have three or four times that (mine requires 15-24 credits in neuro), and I for one wanted the advantage of more neuro coursework on my CV (in addition to clinical and research experiences) when the time came to apply for internships and postdocs/fellowships. Of course, I've got my MS (on my way to start my Ph.D. come August), so I imagine some of the practicing clinicians could weigh in more on how heavily coursework v. clinical experience and research is weighed- but I imagine having more formal coursework can't hurt.

 

[WisNeuro]

There are only a small handful of neuro tracks that are actually neuro tracks and respected within the community, it's mostly a vanity thing that doesn't mean much practically. For those clinical things, we look more at practicums done, where were they, and who were they with? The coursework does help, but pretty much only up to a point, you have some diminishing returns after you take several requisite classes. These courses are not equivalent across site, you'd be surprised how many people have taken a "neuroanatomy" course and couldn't point out the corpus callosum on a mid-saggital T1.

Obviously, showing that you have done and understand research in the neuro area is key. Make sure you have some presentations at places like INS or AACN.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

1. "Tracks" are 95% marketing…whether it is at a state university or FSPS.
2. Access to mentorship in a given area, classes, and practica….those are the things that really matter.
3. Only consider programs that have a clear track record of training people who do what you want to do. If it is neuropsych, then you should only consider programs that consistent graduate students who contribute to the literature, have a high match rate for internship, and most importantly (at least in my opinion)…match graduates to quality fellowship programs.
4. It matters where you trained and who you know because you will be reliant on those people to help you get a quality fellowship and your first position out of training. You don't want to be the unique snowflake from a program no one knows. Instead, you want to have a strong lineage of training and a network of people to help you get established.

 

[deleted343839]

There are only a small handful of neuro tracks that are actually neuro tracks and respected within the community, it's mostly a vanity thing that doesn't mean much practically.

Fair point! Most of the neuropsychologists I know trained at institutions that presumably fall into that "small handful" (eg, University of Houston). I wasn't aware that there were so many neuropsych "tracks" that exist in name only. The more you know...

 

[thebigem]

Thanks for the advice everyone. Next time I'll apply to PsyD and PhD programs. PGSP rejected me but set me up with a phone interview for the Palo Alto PhD program, which has a neuropsych track. I've heard bad things about the program though. I'm off to research what their neuropsych grads are doing now...

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

"Tracks" are 95% marketing…so keep that in mind.

PAU's APA-acred. internship match rate is iffy…60-70%. The cost is astronomical at ~$48,000/yr (tuition + uni fees). Definitely check on their funding too, as Palo Alto has obscene cost of living. The avg. house cost is $2.2m+ and rent is $2k+/mon. I was being recruited for a position out there and declined because of the cost of living…and that was with a 6-figure job. I have no idea how people afford those prices…rich parents?