Restarting on Rocky Ground

[Dominion]

Yes, there are tons of theses posts, yes I actually made the decision to make a new one. More to the point a post that has my exact situation so that I may possibly get a better assortment of replies. Also, this is a long post and it's fairly late so I apologize if I start to ramble a bit, I will do my best to prevent that.

I joined this forum awhile back, at the time I was returning to college after a break from a horrible horrible freshman year. Basically I wasn't paying for it, I slacked, my grades suffered and I just generally screwed up. I actually returned to college with the intentions of medical school, returned to the same school and fell into the exact same trap. I was very immature and truthfully didn't know what the hell I wanted to do.

Initially I became and EMT thinking it would help me out later on down the road and discovered that I actually REALLY REALLY enjoyed the career. So much so that when I fell into that rut again after returning to school I did some soul searching, lived abroad in Germany for a year or so, and returned to the states with a clear head.

Since that time I've not been back to school since 2007 (in an official accredited capacity), I became a Paramedic after 2 years of school in early 2010 and have been working in EMS full time since 2006 (sans time in Germany). During that time I had the opportunity (ok ok it was required) to shadow in a broad range of specialties, which was different in that I was actually performing skills with the doctors. I intubated in the OR, did patient exams and presented cases to the attendings in peds ER, etc. Not that I find that all that impressive, I'm far from being the only person to perform those tasks and shadow a doctor somewhere.

I fell that I'm finally matured enough and ready to start working towards medical school and was hoping to seek some advice for the next several years.

A bit about me: 25 years old, married, 2 dogs, no kids, paramedic full time at a moderately busy 911 service.

Major: One thing I see listed as a pitfall is majoring in biology, which I am doing. However it's not so much as a need/want to follow in any sort of pre-med biology path, but more of a love of nature, animals, and the science behind all of it. Specifically my major is Biology with the sub-specialties of aquatic ecology and marine biology. These are fields that I absolutely love and am extremely interested in. How could one go about conveying that I'm in biology not for the application but for the love of biology and marine life?

Volunteering: I've heard it mentioned that hobbies are great but it's one thing to just list hobbies and another to actually excel and become recognized in those hobbies. As for the latter, I have yet to accomplish that goal. Currently I volunteer my time at a local animal shelter, I work with adult dogs and puppies in socialization, basic training, pet care, and work with adoption specialists in finding matches for new people coming in to adopt. That's my only volunteer experience currently.

Hobbies: As for things I enjoy doing, my wife and I have a small business making/sculpting various trinkets, statues, jewelry, and custom work from clay. We have our own firing studio and sell at local events and art festivals but have no established business or website. Leather is another medium I like to work with as well, but have yet to get good enough that I would consider selling pieces. I also have the standard assortment of other things I enjoy doing such as hiking, biking, cooking, etc.

This is mostly it, due to the massive amount of hours I've been working the last year and a half I hardly have time to do the things above let alone anything else. However with school starting up this fall I'm working on reducing my work load to focus on classes and to open my schedule up to finding things I enjoy doing. I currently plan on contacting the nearby aquarium to setup volunteer hours there working with biologists on site. I'm just not sure what more I should be doing and what kind of applicant I'd look like with what I've done so far. I tend to try and focus on doing things I love and avoid doing things because it's the "right thing to do" or is perceived as the right thing.

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[cge0]

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[Astarael]

I think you're in a pretty decent place to start as pre-med. Your grades will follow you, to some extent, but the fact that they were farther in the past should allow your new grades to be looked at as being more indicative of your actual ability. The fact that you are a paramedic means that you know a pretty good amount about what goes on in the hospital. If you wanted to take that to the next level, you might see about getting a job as an ED paramedic (it would allow you to develop a very good idea of what ED docs do, although I'm sure you're already pretty well on board with that).

The other things that you should be thinking about are sort of the staples of a good application: MCAT (aim for above a 30), GPA (aim for above a 3.6), and continue on with your hobbies and volunteering. The stuff that you've got right now will be a good basis (and I'm sure leatherworking would be an interesting tidbit about you), but you may want to consider doing some volunteer work with a human population.

As for your major, if you love animals, why not do a zoology major? It's not a typical pre-medical major, but it would probably be more interesting than straight biology.

Well, that's all I've got for now, but feel free to ask any other questions you might have. I'm sure other people will pop in with their own advice, as well. Good luck!

 

[Evergrey]

You may also want to try the Nontraditional Students forum. They are all nice there Mod might move it there in fact. They can help you with advice specific to your situation (as alluded by cge0).

 

[Astarael]

You may also want to try the Nontraditional Students forum. They are all nice there Mod might move it there in fact. They can help you with advice specific to your situation (as alluded by cge0).

Totally agree with this.

 

[NightGod]

Basically the above: get some human-oriented volunteering, study your arse off and get amazing grades and MCAT scores. Being a Biology major is NOT so much a pitfall, it's just that so many people think it's the ONLY way to be a pre-med. The important thing is to major in something you enjoy rather than filling in check boxes on your application. If you truly love it, let that shine through in your personal statement and you'll be fine. I went through the same thing in my first run at college. It's a burden, but the only thing we can do is throw it on our shoulder and power on. Start dropping As on your transcript instead of D/Fs or UW/Ws (and tailor your PS to explain how you've grown) and AdComs will notice. If it's truly horrible, you can always go the DO route and use their grade replacement policy to fix things you screwed up in the past.

And avoid the Non-trad forums. We bite.

 

[mommy2three]

And avoid the Non-trad forums. We bite.

only when warranted

but seriously, you may want to consider asking to have this moved to the non trad forum, i think you will get a better idea of where to go there than here

 

[Dominion]

I think you're in a pretty decent place to start as pre-med. Your grades will follow you, to some extent, but the fact that they were farther in the past should allow your new grades to be looked at as being more indicative of your actual ability. The fact that you are a paramedic means that you know a pretty good amount about what goes on in the hospital. If you wanted to take that to the next level, you might see about getting a job as an ED paramedic (it would allow you to develop a very good idea of what ED docs do, although I'm sure you're already pretty well on board with that).

The other things that you should be thinking about are sort of the staples of a good application: MCAT (aim for above a 30), GPA (aim for above a 3.6), and continue on with your hobbies and volunteering. The stuff that you've got right now will be a good basis (and I'm sure leatherworking would be an interesting tidbit about you), but you may want to consider doing some volunteer work with a human population.

As for your major, if you love animals, why not do a zoology major? It's not a typical pre-medical major, but it would probably be more interesting than straight biology.

Well, that's all I've got for now, but feel free to ask any other questions you might have. I'm sure other people will pop in with their own advice, as well. Good luck!

If we had a major like that it's what I would pick it. The way our biology department works is you have the main biology and it's split into three different tracks, cellular/physiology, genetics/subcellular, and ecology/organismal. Each track has it's own sub-specialties to focus into but when you finally get your degree it's not a BS in Genetics or Ecology, it's a general degree in biology and gives you a base for a more specific graduate program.

As for moving this topic, I completely forgot about the non-trad forum and a topic move would be great if someone wants to do it

 

[Dominion]

Also how much do LOR's from physicians weigh in on the applications process? Currently I have several physicians willing to write LORS:

3 from Attendings at area hospitals (2 are associate professors with the school of medicine and attendings at local L1 Trauma). I worked with each of them during paramedic school, one was our medical officer, one is in peds ER and the other is L1 trauma.

1 From my wifes boss, cardiothoracic surgeon and his PA associate. I did some shadowing work with each of them just because I was interested in things they did.

1 from a friends mom, she does something with the board of admissions for local hospital. This is the only one that I probably won't take, she offered it up to me.

 

[vc7777]

Not as much as you are probably hoping. Sorry. Letters tend to be valued if they are from school/academic settings, to be brief.

Also, really consider what Everygrey said. check out the nontrad forum. I think you will find people in (more) similar situations to your own who can help you sort some of your questions out.

 

[Dominion]

Not as much as you are probably hoping. Sorry. Letters tend to be valued if they are from school/academic settings, to be brief.

Also, really consider what Everygrey said. check out the nontrad forum. I think you will find people in (more) similar situations to your own who can help you sort some of your questions out.

Yea I asked to have this moved over there. Hoping they see that PM and can get it moved. As for academic LOR's, two of the docs are I think academic. I shadowed them as part of my paramedic internship and performed patient exams, presented the case to the attending, and made orders for whatever I felt the patient needed workup wise. Was supposed to help us with our differentials as medics, was actually an amazing experience.

 

[Evergrey]

Yea I asked to have this moved over there. Hoping they see that PM and can get it moved. As for academic LOR's, two of the docs are I think academic. I shadowed them as part of my paramedic internship and performed patient exams, presented the case to the attending, and made orders for whatever I felt the patient needed workup wise. Was supposed to help us with our differentials as medics, was actually an amazing experience.

Really I think adcoms are looking for LORs that address two main things -- does this person have the academic aptitude to make it through med school, and do they have qualities that lend themselves to becoming a successful physician (intelligence, research skills, leadership, humanistic qualities, etc.). Those two physicians may be able to speak about your interest in medicine, but they can't speak effectively toward either of the aforementioned points. It's best to have most of your LORs come from people who are in a position to really evaluate you, and by this I mean to say your professors, particularly those holding terminal degrees in their field and teaching at a 4-year undergraduate institution. It might be worth including a LOR from one of those physicians, but I wouldn't count it toward the 3 main LORs. You could include a LOR from one of those docs talking about your interest and intelligence in a clinical setting.

For example, I chose to include 5 LORs in my application. One was from my Intro Bio class, where I got to know the professor through bio lab staying late during dissection, another was from Organic Chemistry (same deal got to know the professor well in lab and office hours). My non-science LOR came from my thesis advisor whom I worked closely with on my senior thesis (for my humanities major). I also included a LOR from a chemistry professor that I did research with, and a physician that I shadowed and got to know particularly well. It should go without saying that I chose people that believed in me and were willing to give me a strong endorsement. There were quite a few grades on my transcript that weren't As, but I definitely got As in the classes for the professors whom I asked to write letters. I come from a fairly traditional application perspective however. I decided midway through college that I was interested, starting taking classes and kept on with a few more science courses after I graduated with my BA. As an example, someone who had a career before deciding to apply would probably want to include a LOR or two from supervisors or colleagues at work.

Don't forget that there's no such thing as an ideal applicant! Everyone has weaknesses. As you continue through school you'll be able to develop relationships with people who will be able to strongly recommend you for a career as a physician. I don't know that I would suggest you include those LORs in your application. But, it seems that you'll need some time to get ready before you apply anyway. This is a good thing and will give you the opportunity to explore your motivations to become a physician!

 

[QofQuimica]

Yea I asked to have this moved over there. Hoping they see that PM and can get it moved.

Your wish is my command. Welcome.

(FYI, I'm a she.)