Retaking a 521 (expiration)

[voxveritatisetlucis]

My MCAT score will expire at a large portion of allopathic schools this cycle. Since, I have already decided to reapply one more time, I was wondering how to go about retaking the MCAT. Not sure if there would be enough schools where it doesn’t expire to apply broadly enough.

I know that a golden rule on here is not to retake a 516+ but would there be an exception in this case due to expiry. I’m also not too confident in my abilities to score higher than my original. How bad would it be to get a drop in score.Need to start studying early because I can only do it on weekends.

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[Bot Puppet]

While considering retaking your MCAT, have you also reconsidered what about your app didn’t get you accepted the first few rounds? A 521 scorer should be major competitive for every MD school. What kind of other factors are affecting your app? Say you take the MCAT and do well again; are these limiting factors still affecting your future app or are they solved?

 

[KnightDoc]

Expiration is absolutely, always, an exception to that rule! No need to apologize for a retake here, even if it's for only one school.

Yeah, you're in a bit of pickle because your score is so high there is almost nowhere for it to go but down, especially since you are now several years away from the material. A drop will definitely suck.

Dropping two points, which is the confidence band, will bring you below the magic 520. It won't kill you or anything, especially with everything else going on, but going from a 521 to a 517 won't help you, while the difference between a 519 and a 521 is really only optics (and 1 point on the percentile).

I know you embody super high anxiety, but my advice to you, as with so many other things, is to try really hard to relax and let things play out. There is a very decent chance you will turn one of your several IIs into an A, and this will be a non-issue.

Personally, I'm not sure studying only two days per week over an extended period of time is the best way to go. I wouldn't be able to either sustain the pace or to retain the material over so many months at the level necessary to achieve such a high score.

While I also know you don't want to lose any more time, and are anxious and impatient in general, I don't think applying immediately after an unsuccessful cycle will achieve a different result for you. The only good news with that, if you buy in, is that would mean there is no rush to start studying now on weekends before you know what's going to happen this cycle.

I really think you are going to need to find a few hours a few days a week, in addition to the weekends, if you expect to hit 520+, especially being out of school for several years. If it were me, I wouldn't even be thinking about this until next summer, with a view towards beginning preparation in the fall-winter of 2022-23 for a March 2023 retake. JMHO.

 

[deleted1025488]

I'm confused, you previously said you are in the current cycle and are active in many school threads and are sitting at 3 or 4 IIs right now if I remember correctly? What exactly is this post?

 

[KnightDoc]

I'm confused, you previously said you are in the current cycle and are active in many school threads and are sitting at 3 or 4 IIs right now if I remember correctly? What exactly is this post?

He's taking the SDN adcom advice that you're rejected until you are accepted, so you always need to be preparing for a reapplication, to an extreme.

 

[candbgirl]

While considering retaking your MCAT, have you also reconsidered what about your app didn’t get you accepted the first few rounds? A 521 scorer should be major competitive for every MD school. What kind of other factors are affecting your app? Say you take the MCAT and do well again; are these limiting factors still affecting your future app or are they solved?

If you want to know do a search.

 

[Adrenaline Junky]

Expiration is absolutely, always, an exception to that rule! No need to apologize for a retake here, even if it's for only one school.

Yeah, you're in a bit of pickle because your score is so high there is almost nowhere for it to go but down, especially since you are now several years away from the material. A drop will definitely suck.

Dropping two points, which is the confidence band, will bring you below the magic 520. It won't kill you or anything, especially with everything else going on, but going from a 521 to a 517 won't help you, while the difference between a 519 and a 521 is really only optics (and 1 point on the percentile).

I know you embody super high anxiety, but my advice to you, as with so many other things, is to try really hard to relax and let things play out. There is a very decent chance you will turn one of your several IIs into an A, and this will be a non-issue.

Personally, I'm not sure studying only two days per week over an extended period of time is the best way to go. I wouldn't be able to either sustain the pace or to retain the material over so many months at the level necessary to achieve such a high score.

While I also know you don't want to lose any more time, and are anxious and impatient in general, I don't think applying immediately after an unsuccessful cycle will achieve a different result for you. The only good news with that, if you buy in, is that would mean there is no rush to start studying now on weekends before you know what's going to happen this cycle.

I really think you are going to need to find a few hours a few days a week, in addition to the weekends, if you expect to hit 520+, especially being out of school for several years. If it were me, I wouldn't even be thinking about this until next summer, with a view towards beginning preparation in the fall-winter of 2022-23 for a March 2023 retake. JMHO.

Is there really that much of a difference between a 519 and 521

 

[gyngyn]

Is there really that much of a difference between a 519 and 521

Nope.

 

[DoctorFate]

Nope.

What about at schools where a 520 is a 25th percentile but a 518 is 10th percentile (Penn, NYU, WashU). I feel like a 520 would give you relatively normal consideration there while a 519 would put you at a disadvantage, as they probably have some internal cutoffs for candidates below their 25th percentile.

 

[KnightDoc]

Is there really that much of a difference between a 519 and 521

Not at all. They are within the AAMC confidence band of each other. It's just an optics thing, since one is above the magical 520 and the other is below it.

 

[KnightDoc]

What about at schools where a 520 is a 25th percentile but a 518 is 10th percentile (Penn, NYU, WashU). I feel like a 520 would give you relatively normal consideration there while a 519 would put you at a disadvantage, as they probably have some internal cutoffs for candidates below their 25th percentile.

???? You're splitting hairs at a tiny fraction of top schools, and, even there, the MCAT is not the be all and end all. If it were, 524s would be auto-As and 518s wouldn't even have a shot!

It just so happens that the vast majority of their accepted applicants are bunched at the top, but 519 is nationally the 97%-ile and 521 is 98%-ile. There is no way that there is actually an internal cutoff at 519, when 10% of their class is below 518.

At any score in that range (518-52x), it's the rest of the application that determines your fate. Again, if this were not the case, the cutoff you imagine would be even higher, since these schools do not need to dip all the way down to 519 (please note the sarcasm, which is difficult to convey in writing ) to fill their classes if they cared about the statistically insignificant difference between a 519 and a 521.

 

[Goro]

What about at schools where a 520 is a 25th percentile but a 518 is 10th percentile (Penn, NYU, WashU). I feel like a 520 would give you relatively normal consideration there while a 519 would put you at a disadvantage, as they probably have some internal cutoffs for candidates below their 25th percentile.

Nope

 

[DoctorFate]

Nope

@WedgeDawg used to be quite active on here, and he made a relatively popular WARS calculator, where a 518-520 was shown as being 1 tier below 521-528. He cited several methods he used as to how he built those parameters (albeit not the MCAT one specifically to my knowledge). He is, however, pretty respected on this site, especially in the past. This isn't to say that he's some god who's always right, but his experience has led me to believe his ideas have some merit.

In this case, would you and @KnightDoc disagree then, and say his distinction there was completely unnecessary?

 

[KnightDoc]

@WedgeDawg used to be quite active on here, and he made a relatively popular WARS calculator, where a 518-520 was shown as being 1 tier below 521-528. He cited several methods he used as to how he built those parameters (albeit not the MCAT one specifically to my knowledge). He is, however, pretty respected on this site, especially in the past. This isn't to say that he's some god who's always right, but his experience has led me to believe his ideas have some merit.

In this case, would you and @KnightDoc disagree then, and say his distinction there was completely unnecessary?

I would never presume to speak for the great @Goro, but, speaking for myself, you are misconstruing what @WedgeDawg did with the calculator. He assigned a value to a MCAT range that is subsequently weighted and combined with 9 other variables to calculate an index that is then meant to be used to suggest a mix of schools to apply to. To extrapolate that to assume that the arbitrary MCAT range cutoffs he used for that purpose implies that adcoms at any particular school use the same cutoffs to evaluate candidates is to misunderstand what WARS is all about.

Aren't you the one who posted on the Duke thread that the admissions dean told you that 510+ is all treated the same? Trust us -- 519/521 is not a distinction that drives admissions decisions, anywhere. Too many other things go into how a file is scored for MCAT differences within the test's margin of error to mean life or death for anyone, anywhere, arbitrary break points in clever school selection tools notwithstanding.

 

[deleted555445]

@WedgeDawg used to be quite active on here, and he made a relatively popular WARS calculator, where a 518-520 was shown as being 1 tier below 521-528. He cited several methods he used as to how he built those parameters (albeit not the MCAT one specifically to my knowledge). He is, however, pretty respected on this site, especially in the past. This isn't to say that he's some god who's always right, but his experience has led me to believe his ideas have some merit.

In this case, would you and @KnightDoc disagree then, and say his distinction there was completely unnecessary?

I think those bins were chosen based on how the data available at the time from the AAMC was binned. I don't believe they correlate to specially recognized "categories". Every school deals with it differently, WashU might always consider a higher MCAT to be better, while another school might consider all MCATs above a certain percentile to be identical. I don't think its worth trying to figure it out, I would just always try to do the best you can on the MCAT and then work out a school list based of the score you get.

 

[Goro]

@WedgeDawg used to be quite active on here, and he made a relatively popular WARS calculator, where a 518-520 was shown as being 1 tier below 521-528. He cited several methods he used as to how he built those parameters (albeit not the MCAT one specifically to my knowledge). He is, however, pretty respected on this site, especially in the past. This isn't to say that he's some god who's always right, but his experience has led me to believe his ideas have some merit.

In this case, would you and @KnightDoc disagree then, and say his distinction there was completely unnecessary?

The WARS criteria, as well as the LizzyM score, are rules of thumb, not laws of physics.

 

[DoctorFate]

I would never presume to speak for the great @Goro, but, speaking for myself, you are misconstruing what @WedgeDawg did with the calculator. He assigned a value to a MCAT range that is subsequently weighted and combined with 9 other variables to calculate an index that is then meant to be used to suggest a mix of schools to apply to. To extrapolate that to assume that the arbitrary MCAT range cutoffs he used for that purpose implies that adcoms at any particular school use the same cutoffs to evaluate candidates is to misunderstand what WARS is all about.

Aren't you the one who posted on the Duke thread that the admissions dean told you that 510+ is all treated the same? Trust us -- 519/521 is not a distinction that drives admissions decisions, anywhere. Too many other things go into how a file is scored for MCAT differences within the test's margin of error to mean life or death for anyone, anywhere, arbitrary break points in clever school selection tools notwithstanding.

I mean, I think that generalized point was pretty much exactly what I understood. He felt that enough schools used that to include that breakdown in the general calculator.
And tbh, my question isn't really if 520 vs 528 matters to most schools, but rather if that distinction matters to any schools at all (such as the three I mentioned). Duke is rather clear that it doesn't but Duke's leniency towards the MCAT (relative to schools of its caliber anyway) definitely isn't universal.

 

[KnightDoc]

I mean, I think that generalized point was pretty much exactly what I understood. He felt that enough schools used that to include that breakdown in the general calculator.
And tbh, my question isn't really if 520 vs 528 matters to most schools, but rather if that distinction matters to any schools at all (such as the three I mentioned). Duke is rather clear that it doesn't but Duke's leniency towards the MCAT (relative to schools of its caliber anyway) definitely isn't universal.

Aaaaand, the answer is a resounding "no." As @iHawk_MD suggested, those break points in the WARS model very likely have no meaning beyond corresponding to the break points in the AAMC Table A-23 that was published back when the tool was created. In any event, as I said before, that is one of 10 inputs that go into a model to suggest distribution of tiers for applications. It does not purport in any way, shape or form to suggest schools use arbitrary 1 percentile cutoffs to accept or reject applicants.

For the record, you are putting the cart before the horse, or the chicken before the egg, or vice versa. No school uses that table to decide what to do with any particular applicant. The break points are arbitrary, the grid is segmented by ranges, and it reflects the aggregate of what all schools actually do. It does not dictate what any individual school does.

Nowadays, 510-13 has a different acceptance rate from 514-17. That does NOT mean there is a meaningful difference, or a cutoff at any school, between 513 and 514. That's just the way the table is formatted. You need to remember that the 513 grid includes candidates down to 510, while the 514 grid includes candidates up to 517. And no one is denying there is a material difference in outcomes between 510 and 517. Resist the urge to confuse that with a difference between 513 and 514, or between 519 and 520, or 521.

 

[DoctorFate]

Aaaaand, the answer is a resounding "no." As @iHawk_MD suggested, those break points in the WARS model very likely have no meaning beyond corresponding to the break points in the AAMC Table A-23 that was published back when the tool was created. In any event, as I said before, that is one of 10 inputs that go into a model to suggest distribution of tiers for applications. It does not purport in any way, shape or form to suggest schools use arbitrary 1 percentile cutoffs to accept or reject applicants.

For the record, you are putting the cart before the horse, or the chicken before the egg, or vice versa. No school uses that table to decide what to do with any particular applicant. The break points are arbitrary, the grid is segmented by ranges, and it reflects the aggregate of what all schools actually do. It does not dictate what any individual school does.

Nowadays, 510-13 has a different acceptance rate from 514-17. That does NOT mean there is a meaningful difference, or a cutoff at any school, between 513 and 514. That's just the way the table is formatted. You need to remember that the 513 grid includes candidates down to 510, while the 514 grid includes candidates up to 517. And no one is denying there is a material difference in outcomes between 510 and 517. Resist the urge to confuse that with a difference between 513 and 514, or between 519 and 520, or 521.

Haha true enough. Time to stop wishing I scored higher. N=1 (or n=2? idk), but both my friend with a 527 and me, 520, have gotten the exact same interviews this cycle, with me just receiving them a week or so later (I submit my secondaries a week later). So seems true enough.

 

[A_Knowbody]

I too faced a similar challenge (albeit with a 514). I took my MCAT in Sept. 2016 and was facing a retake. Having it in Sept. vs. July or January opened up several schools. I still found that ~60 schools (MD and DO) accepted my score for the 2020 cycle, so I applied to those and was fortunate enough to be accepted.

Of those 60, I narrowed it down to about 35 that seemed more realistic for my scores, residence, etc.

Not retaking ultimately was a good decision for me and I’m happy where I ended up. Your situation may be different though!

 

[deleted1025488]

???? You're splitting hairs at a tiny fraction of top schools, and, even there, the MCAT is not the be all and end all. If it were, 524s would be auto-As and 518s wouldn't even have a shot!

It just so happens that the vast majority of their accepted applicants are bunched at the top, but 519 is nationally the 97%-ile and 521 is 98%-ile. There is no way that there is actually an internal cutoff at 519, when 10% of their class is below 518.

At any score in that range (518-52x), it's the rest of the application that determines your fate. Again, if this were not the case, the cutoff you imagine would be even higher, since these schools do not need to dip all the way down to 519 (please note the sarcasm, which is difficult to convey in writing ) to fill their classes if they cared about the statistically insignificant difference between a 519 and a 521.

What about at schools where a 520 is a 25th percentile but a 518 is 10th percentile (Penn, NYU, WashU). I feel like a 520 would give you relatively normal consideration there while a 519 would put you at a disadvantage, as they probably have some internal cutoffs for candidates below their 25th percentile.

LizzyM claiming to be an "AO at a stat-loving school" explicitly said that 524+ are essentially auto-II and borderline auto-A at their school. I'm not going to find the post but some user put a screenshot of that post in another thread where ya'll were rioting about MCAT scores. I mean considering the amount of people that score 524+ and the fact that some schools have 75th or 90th percentiles above 524, the acceptance rate has to be high for them...

 

[KnightDoc]

LizzyM claiming to be an "AO at a stat-loving school" explicitly said that 524+ are essentially auto-II and borderline auto-A at their school. I'm not going to find the post but some user put a screenshot of that post in another thread where ya'll were rioting about MCAT scores. I mean considering the amount of people that score 524+ and the fact that some schools have 75th or 90th percentiles above 524, the acceptance rate has to be high for them...

Auto-II at some schools, which is what she was talking about, probably. Beyond that, it just isn't true, based on anecdotal reports.

Sure, most of them are going to have the total package, and all the reported numbers suggest their A rates are going to be very high. Certainly much higher than 40%. So, if that's what you mean by "borderline auto-A," sure.

But nothing about it is auto. They get the As because they are great applicants, not because they are mediocre applicants with great MCATs. The fact remains that every year, there are several applicants to T10-20 programs who rely on what you are posting and find themselves becoming reapplicants.

As long as we are talking about posts we are not going to bother to search for, there was more than one on last year's WL support thread from 3.9x/52x people with several IIs and zero As. It happens.

My only point here is that @gyngyn as well as @LizzyM, and I think just about all the other adcoms have said that the difference between 520 (98%-ile) and 524 (100%-ile) is meaningless to them in constructing their classes. Hopefully, they will pop in to confirm or deny.

 

[deleted1025488]

Auto-II at some schools, which is what she was talking about, probably. Beyond that, it just isn't true, based on anecdotal reports.

Sure, most of them are going to have the total package, and all the reported numbers suggest their A rates are going to be very high. Certainly much higher than 40%. So, if that's what you mean by "borderline auto-A," sure.

But nothing about it is auto. They get the As because they are great applicants, not because they are mediocre applicants with great MCATs. The fact remains that every year, there are several applicants to T10-20 programs who rely on what you are posting and find themselves becoming reapplicants.

As long as we are talking about posts we are not going to bother to search for, there was more than one on last year's WL support thread from 3.9x/52x people with several IIs and zero As. It happens.

My only point here is that @gyngyn as well as @LizzyM, and I think just about all the other adcoms have said that the difference between 520 (98%-ile) and 524 (100%-ile) is meaningless to them in constructing their classes. Hopefully, they will pop in to confirm or deny.

I mean one adcom is not representative of the whole (and school matters more), so it really doesn't matter. I'm not suggesting anything though....it is a known fact that a number of schools/deans care way too much about ranking, and since MCAT is directly counted in that, the difference does indeed matter. If your median is 522 and you want to keep that/go higher then you absolutely care about a 520 vs. 524.

On the other hand if you are at a school with a 510 median or something then obviously 520 vs 524 or any permutation of high scores will not matter to an adcom at least in regards to ranking or whatever, and also those students probably won't even attend so it's completely meaningless.

 

[deleted555445]

LizzyM claiming to be an "AO at a stat-loving school" explicitly said that 524+ are essentially auto-II and borderline auto-A at their school. I'm not going to find the post but some user put a screenshot of that post in another thread where ya'll were rioting about MCAT scores. I mean considering the amount of people that score 524+ and the fact that some schools have 75th or 90th percentiles above 524, the acceptance rate has to be high for them...

lol if 524+ is an auto-II at stat-loving school I'm gonna have to talk to WashU's manager, where's my II?

 

[deleted1025488]

lol if 524+ is an auto-II at stat-loving school I'm gonna have to talk to WashU's manager, where's my II?

No idea my friend, those weren't my words though, go talk to the ao lol

 

[deleted555445]

No idea my friend, those weren't my words though, go talk to the ao lol

oh dont worry, they'll be hearing from me!

 

[StressedBiClown]

I agree with @KnightDoc about needing to study more often than just the weekends. I think you'll be disappointed if you try this. I know it wouldn't work for me, but I don't know how much you've retained from before, how much will come back in a snap, and whether or not you're a really good test-taker, so maybe you'd be fine and everything will work out. I don't think the odds will be in your favor, though.

 

[YCAGA]

I refuse to believe OP is a real person. 521, 3.99 GPA, HYPSM valedictorian but charged with resisting arrest, assault of a police officer, and distribution of drugs (that weren't marijuana). Now they are applying to medical school...suuuuuure.

Is there some kind of SDN rule/policy to verify if someone is not trolling? I mean if it walks like a duck...and talks like a duck...

 

[YCAGA]

Also fluent in 5 languages including ancient Greek

 

[DoctorFate]

I refuse to believe OP is a real person. 521, 3.99 GPA, HYPSM valedictorian but charged with resisting arrest, assault of a police officer, and distribution of drugs (that weren't marijuana). Now they are applying to medical school...suuuuuure.

Is there some kind of SDN rule/policy to verify if someone is not trolling? I mean if it walks like a duck...and talks like a duck...

OP has spent quite some time here. The only way this is trolling is if OP has an absolutely ridiculously high amount of free time to spend, and for some reason chose to dedicate it to learning as much about the pre-med process as possible and got a laugh out of stressing out pre-meds. Also, not sure where you got resisting arrest and assault of a police officer from.

 

[Goro]

I refuse to believe OP is a real person. 521, 3.99 GPA, HYPSM valedictorian but charged with resisting arrest, assault of a police officer, and distribution of drugs (that weren't marijuana). Now they are applying to medical school...suuuuuure.

Is there some kind of SDN rule/policy to verify if someone is not trolling? I mean if it walks like a duck...and talks like a duck...

He's definitely a real person.

 

[Moko]

I refuse to believe OP is a real person. 521, 3.99 GPA, HYPSM valedictorian but charged with resisting arrest, assault of a police officer, and distribution of drugs (that weren't marijuana). Now they are applying to medical school...suuuuuure.

Perhaps the OP is trolling, but academic excellence and common sense do not always go hand in hand... There are many stories of physicians who do some really stupid things that cause them to lose their medical license: sexual misconduct, Medicare fraud, over-prescription/cash-for-prescription of controlled substances, other criminal convictions, etc. More recently, a physician in Oregon had their license suspended for refusing to follow COVID-19 mask guidelines (and promoting misinformation) in their clinic. All of these people had much more to lose and still proceeded willfully with their actions.

 

[YCAGA]

OP has spent quite some time here. The only way this is trolling is if OP has an absolutely ridiculously high amount of free time to spend, and for some reason chose to dedicate it to learning as much about the pre-med process as possible and got a laugh out of stressing out pre-meds. Also, not sure where you got resisting arrest and assault of a police officer from.

Hahahaha what? That’s a weird assumption to make that an SDN troll is automatically not a premed and someone who just picked a premed forum and then studied up on the process. Much more likely is a premed who has normal scores and went to a normal school and wanted to see what people would say about a “perfect stats” applicant from a top 5 school with felony charges.

He's definitely a real person.

Gotcha. Good to know lol

Perhaps the OP is trolling, but academic excellence and common sense do not always go hand in hand... There are many stories of physicians who do some really stupid things that cause them to lose their medical license: sexual misconduct, Medicare fraud, over-prescription/cash-for-prescription of controlled substances, other criminal convictions, etc. More recently, a physician in Oregon had their license suspended for refusing to follow COVID-19 mask guidelines (and promoting misinformation) in their clinic. All of these people had much more to lose and still proceeded willfully with their actions.

Oh I definitely wasn’t implying that academic excellence and common sense have any correlation at all, and definitely not a strong one. Nor was I suggesting that premeds, medical students, and physicians never make very bad decisions even though they have a lot to lose.

I was just saying that HPYSM is only 5 schools with single digit valedictorians per year, so the chances of OP being one of those few people, plus a varsity athlete, plus their criminal history and still thinking they have a chance at top 20 MD schools is a very small chance. I leave out the MCAT because a 521 is not surprising if someone actually got a 3.9 at those schools.

I guess they are a unicorn, but I’m not crazy for being suspicious of that story.

 

[YCAGA]

OP has spent quite some time here. The only way this is trolling is if OP has an absolutely ridiculously high amount of free time to spend, and for some reason chose to dedicate it to learning as much about the pre-med process as possible and got a laugh out of stressing out pre-meds. Also, not sure where you got resisting arrest and assault of a police officer from.

Resisting arrest and assault of LEO was an edit to their original what are my chances post.

 

[DoctorFate]

Hahahaha what? That’s a weird assumption to make that an SDN troll is automatically not a premed and someone who just picked a premed forum and then studied up on the process. Much more likely is a premed who has normal scores and went to a normal school and wanted to see what people would say about a “perfect stats” applicant from a top 5 school with felony charges.

Gotcha. Good to know lol

Oh I definitely wasn’t implying that academic excellence and common sense have any correlation at all, and definitely not a strong one. Nor was I suggesting that premeds, medical students, and physicians never make very bad decisions even though they have a lot to lose.

I was just saying that HPYSM is only 5 schools with single digit valedictorians per year, so the chances of OP being one of those few people, plus a varsity athlete, plus their criminal history and still thinking they have a chance at top 20 MD schools is a very small chance. I leave out the MCAT because a 521 is not surprising if someone actually got a 3.9 at those schools.

I guess they are a unicorn, but I’m not crazy for being suspicious of that story.

OP got interviews at UVA and Yale so far as well as 2 more... so T20 is a very real possibility.
And trust me, we would all be suspicious too, if OP didn't constantly post about his problems on here, as well as very frequent updates. I'm near certain hes legit too.

 

[KnightDoc]

OP got interviews at UVA and Yale so far as well as 2 more... so T20 is a very real possibility.
And trust me, we would all be suspicious too, if OP didn't constantly post about his problems on here, as well as very frequent updates. I'm near certain hes legit too.

How do you know? Oh, because he said so on an anonymous internet forum? Gotcha!

I go back and forth on his legitimacy, but keep responding because the issues he raises tend to wind other people up and really should not just be left hanging out here. I agree that the sustained consistency of the posts indicate he is either for real or very, very good at this, but don't discount the latter.

Many of our peers are quite brilliant, and if someone chose to jerk around the forum like this, it is far from impossible to do. I have no way to know for sure he, or anyone else for that matter, is not legit. OTOH, you have no way to know he is. I take pretty much anything anyone other than well known adcoms here say with a huge grain of salt. You should too.

 

[KnightDoc]

Yeah-- I mean I feel like if OP is a consistent poster with genuine questions, why would he be a troll?

Not saying he is, but, if he was a troll, the posts wouldn't be to receive answers to the questions, it would be to raise the anxiety level of everyone else merely by asking them.

 

[treeclimbingmonkey]

How do you know? Oh, because he said so on an anonymous internet forum? Gotcha!

I go back and forth on his legitimacy, but keep responding because the issues he raises tend to wind other people up and really should not just be left hanging out here. I agree that the sustained consistency of the posts indicate he is either for real or very, very good at this, but don't discount the latter.

Many of our peers are quite brilliant, and if someone chose to jerk around the forum like this, it is far from impossible to do. I have no way to know for sure he, or anyone else for that matter, is not legit. OTOH, you have no way to know he is. I take pretty much anything anyone other than well known adcoms here say with a huge grain of salt. You should too.

His consistent posts would certainly seem like a lengthy investment if OP was a troll.

 

[KnightDoc]

His consistent posts would certainly seem like a lengthy investment if OP was a troll.

Yup! That's why I go back and forth. But, if he is committed and has the time .....

 

[DoctorFate]

Not saying he is, but, if he was a troll, the posts wouldn't be to receive answers to the questions, it would be to raise the anxiety level of everyone else merely by asking them.

Yes, but OP actually responds to feedback, and even recently deleted a thread where people commented was needlessly raising anxiety.

I also DM'd OP a few times and his story was even more consistent there and he gave me some helpful details for a school he interviewed at and was accepted to in his first cycle. He seems like a genuine guy, just one that's stressed out himself and unintentionally stressing us out too.

Idk, just my personal opinion, much like Goro, that he's legit.

 

[KnightDoc]

see above post

Here's the thing -- as you probably know by now, there is a lot of hate on the internet towards this forum, and, in particular, towards the neuroticism displayed here. If you don't believe me, spend a few minutes on the premed subreddit.

So, he is either one of the most neurotic over performers ever, or, he is a caricature of one, trolling us while making the neurotic among us crazy. @YCAGA's point was that some elements of his story are so out there that they defy credulity, and he's right. OTOH, anything really is possible. If it weren't possible, trolling wouldn't be either. Bottom line, this is one of the most elaborate, sustained trolls in quite a while, or, by virtue of all the questions, he is one of the most brilliant and simultaneously clueless premeds in existence.

 

[KnightDoc]

Yes, but OP actually responds to feedback, and even recently deleted a thread where people commented was needlessly raising anxiety.

I also DM'd OP a few times and his story was even more consistent there and he gave me some helpful details for a school he interviewed at and was accepted to in his first cycle. He seems like a genuine guy, just one that's stressed out himself and unintentionally stressing us out too.

Idk, just my personal opinion, much like Goro, that he's legit.

It's definitely possible. I'm not saying he's not legit, and, in any event, his posts don't bother me at all. I was just supporting @YCAGA's observations and explaining how he could be right.

If he's not legit, he's one of the best ever. I still don't get how someone so talented, who has been through this before, has so many questions and is so needlessly pessimistic, especially after tasting success after being assured by the experts here that he had no shot. That's what makes me think it could be an elaborate troll, much more so than a brilliant HYPSMer making a terrible choice and having it haunt him forever.

 

[DoctorFate]

It's definitely possible. I'm not saying he's not legit, and, in any event, his posts don't bother me at all. I was just supporting @YCAGA's observations and explaining how he could be right.

If he's not legit, he's one of the best ever. I still don't get how someone so talented, who has been through this before, has so many questions and is so needlessly pessimistic, especially after tasting success after being assured by the experts here that he had no shot. That's what makes me think it could be an elaborate troll, much more so than a brilliant HYPSMer making a terrible choice and having it haunt him forever.

One thing I've realized is that his questions aren't as terrible as they seem, given how unique he is (not even including his drug situation).
For example, we were all so confused why he was already considering reapplication when he had no IIs at the beginning of August and even when he had 3 IIs by August end, and seemed to believe he would not get anymore. However, on some school specific thread he and two others from HYPSM shared that they received 8-11 IIs in August (OP in his first cycle) and then 1 or 2 more the rest of the application cycle. In light of that information, his worry makes more sense.

 

[KnightDoc]

One thing I've realized is that his questions aren't as terrible as they seem, given how unique he is (not even including his drug situation).
For example, we were all so confused why he was already considering reapplication when he had no IIs at the beginning of August and even when he had 3 IIs by August end, and seemed to believe he would not get anymore. However, on some school specific thread he and two others from HYPSM shared that they received 8-11 IIs in August (OP in his first cycle) and then 1 or 2 more the rest of the application cycle. In light of that information, his worry makes more sense.

To your point, he is so unique that our experience doesn't apply to him, and he knows it based on his prior experience, so his questions are really totally pointless since no one is in a position to answer them. That includes the adcom experts, who told him not to bother applying.

He ignored them, and he was right and they were wrong. So, why does he keep coming back? One theory is to wind up the neurotic among us.

And for the record, yeah, asking whether things are winding down the day after receiving an II after a month long drought seems a little suss on its face. To me, if I just received my 4th II after hearing nothing for month, it would appear that things are picking up rather than winding down, but maybe that's just me.

 

[dramanaut9518]

OP got interviews at UVA and Yale so far as well as 2 more... so T20 is a very real possibility.
And trust me, we would all be suspicious too, if OP didn't constantly post about his problems on here, as well as very frequent updates. I'm near certain hes legit too.

I'm sure no one would ever lie on an anonymous internet forum. 521/3.99 valedictorian from a Ivy League, fluent in 5 languages, varsity athlete, and a felony background. You're all being baited.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

If an applicant previously had 4 acceptances by the end of October, having 4 interview by the end of October eels like a major fail

And according to the step model, it is unlikely that these will materialize to acceptances because my rank on schools list has taken a significant hit. So that is why I was thinking already about next time

 

[deleted1025488]

If an applicant previously had 4 acceptances by the end of October, having 4 interview by the end of October eels like a major fail

And according to the step model, it is unlikely that these will materialize to acceptances because my rank on schools list has taken a significant hit. So that is why I was thinking already about next time

You should still look at it objectively. Also if you have II's the ball's in your court, you already sound like you've given up which is not a good thing and can/will translate into the interview (self-fulfilling prophecy? ). You can still do well and secure A's.

At the end of the day people are just giving you a hard time because you keep posting absolutely worthless and neurotic posts for no reason.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

You should still look at it objectively. Also if you have II's the ball's in your court, you already sound like you've given up which is not a good thing and can/will translate into the interview (self-fulfilling prophecy? ).

At the end of the day people are just giving you a hard time because you keep posting absolutely worthless and neurotic posts for no reason.

Like, what even is this post? "Retaking a 521 due to expiry, HoW dO i ReTAKE thIS? Like lmao you go in and retake the exam and perform the best you can, you literally have no other choice than to retake it if its expiring. Honestly after actually reading this post I'm also almost convinced that you are a troll.

Some schools would probably not understand because it doesn’t expire at all schools. Goro says that anything above 515 or so shouldn’t ever be retaken. So I was more wondering how to explain it

 

[deleted555445]

If an applicant previously had 4 acceptances by the end of October, having 4 interview by the end of October eels like a major fail

And according to the step model, it is unlikely that these will materialize to acceptances because my rank on schools list has taken a significant hit. So that is why I was thinking already about next time

I mean if you had 4 acceptances previously but that didn't translate into any matriculation, I think its obvious that in any future applications you would not be the same kind of applicant... 4 interviews by now can also still turn into 4 acceptances by the end of October so idk what your issue is? all you need is 1 acceptance to succeed, everything else is gravy

 

[YCAGA]

Regardless of OP's legitimacy, I am entertained. Thanks for recommending a quick search @candbgirl