Salary Survey

[415kid]

I would greatly appreciate it if people would share their salaries and work schedule. I noticed the most recent salary survey was a few years back. I'm trying to gain some insight into the job market.

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[Postictal Raiden]

350k for week on week off. During my week on I don’t have a set schedule. I go in do the work and leave but I remain on call 24/7. I don’t need to go back in, but I’m expected to offer recs over the phone.

Having undergone job hunt recently, my pay and schedule is very common, at least in the Western region.

 

[Captain_Falcon]

350k for week on week off. During my week on I don’t have a set schedule. I go in do the work and leave but I remain on call 24/7. I don’t need to go back in, but I’m expected to offer recs over the phone.

Having undergone job hunt recently, my pay and schedule is very common, at least in the Western region.

For those weeks on, how many hours do you think you log on average? And is there a typical day such as show up at 8am and leave at 6pm? And shorter on weekends?

 

[415kid]

350k for week on week off. During my week on I don’t have a set schedule. I go in do the work and leave but I remain on call 24/7. I don’t need to go back in, but I’m expected to offer recs over the phone.

Having undergone job hunt recently, my pay and schedule is very common, at least in the Western region.

Thank you for sharing! How often are you getting calls at night? Do you have PTO built into your contract? How hard would it be if you wanted to take extended time off (> 1 week)?

 

[Postictal Raiden]

Varies. Some nights 0 some nights 10. I’d say average 5, 2 of which are after midnight

No PTO unfortunately

You can arrange with your partners to do 10/10 or 14/14 occasionally to allow for traveling and stuff. Very common

 

[Telamir]

When I was employed in a more typical job: 370k/yr week on/week off. Busy as ****, malignant.

Now as locums:

Depends on the job, how much you want to work, but more or less 400k for ~21 weeks of work, ish. You could make it to 500k if you're willing to travel and work yourself to death, honestly not worth it. Probably will cut back a bit next year.

 

[scoopdaboop]

350k for week on week off. During my week on I don’t have a set schedule. I go in do the work and leave but I remain on call 24/7. I don’t need to go back in, but I’m expected to offer recs over the phone.

Having undergone job hunt recently, my pay and schedule is very common, at least in the Western region.

region?
if you wanted to work in the middle of nowhere can this work schedule demand 450?

 

[Postictal Raiden]

West

Based on the salaries I’m seeing, I’m mildly underpaid for my work. 400k is very doable even in most desirable locations. Gotta work for it tho

Got a job offer in Indiana paying high 500s for 7/7

 

[415kid]

When I was employed in a more typical job: 370k/yr week on/week off. Busy as ****, malignant.

Now as locums:

Depends on the job, how much you want to work, but more or less 400k for ~21 weeks of work, ish. You could make it to 500k if you're willing to travel and work yourself to death, honestly not worth it. Probably will cut back a bit next year.

Wow, that's great pay. This might be a silly question but do you get to pick your schedule for locums? Also, what region are you in?

 

[ProReduction]

270k-ish a year to do 16 hours of clinical work per week, all as an independent contractor doing TeleNeuro without benefits. I pick all my own hours. No nights/weekends/holidays unless I choose to work them. The rest of my time is completely protected for research. No admin. No clinical teaching. Just research. This is a big reduction from the 600k I was making when I did more clinical work, but I am happy as a clam with reduced clinical time and will be cutting clinical work to zero when I move to the next phase of my research career soon.

 

[Telamir]

Wow, that's great pay. This might be a silly question but do you get to pick your schedule for locums? Also, what region are you in?

I'm in the west of the U.S. but I work with a company that mostly does midwest and east coast. I could have some jobs closer to where I'm located but this company has treated me well so I've stuck with them for now.

As far as making your own hours it depends on the gig. Typically if a hospital has locums needs they want to credential as few docs as they can in order to fulfill them. Sometimes this means they want people to be able to cover 1 or 2 weeks a month firm. If you can't fulfill that then you obviously don't work there. Also some jobs might want you to read EEGs and if you're not comfortable then same thing. Both you and the hospital have ~30 days to cancel on each other if it's a bad match. I've been canceled once due to the hospital canceling locums completely. I won't work again with a place that cancels on me (this particular place tried), and I don't cancel on hospitals once I've made a schedule. This allows me to have relatively stable jobs (1 week/mo for 6 mo, for example).

Typically once you've accepted a job and you're credentialed your locums agent will give you a list of open dates. It's usually first come first served regarding dates among the locums that work there. If the company likes you you might get first dibs on dates or first refusal on a job, particularly if you're a good fit for the place based on your work history.

This year I'm working ~21 weeks between a cushy per-diem job and locums. Granted the schedule isn't always sweet. I worked 5 weeks in a row at one point and sometimes I'm traveling 5-6 hours across time zones every other week for a job. That being said, from the 2nd week of Aug to the end of the year I work 4 more weeks clustered in October/November and then I'm done. Off for Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Year's.

Typical pay depending on call, hours worked, and volume at most inpatient gigs is ~2500-3000/day, with some days making 3200-3500, and 1.5X multiplier for federal holidays.

Hope that helps.

 

[Neurogeneral]

About $350k in a medium sized midwestern city. I do a mix of daily inpatient and outpatient along with EEG/EMG. It’s a Monday to Friday job along with every other weekend of inpatient coverage (q 2).

 

[415kid]

270k-ish a year to do 16 hours of clinical work per week, all as an independent contractor doing TeleNeuro without benefits. I pick all my own hours. No nights/weekends/holidays unless I choose to work them. The rest of my time is completely protected for research. No admin. No clinical teaching. Just research. This is a big reduction from the 600k I was making when I did more clinical work, but I am happy as a clam with reduced clinical time and will be cutting clinical work to zero when I move to the next phase of my research career soon.

That's a great set-up. Are these TeleNeuro shifts Telestroke? Outpatient? And is your research affiliated with an academic institution or private? I'm wondering how you were able to make this work.

 

[415kid]

I'm in the west of the U.S. but I work with a company that mostly does midwest and east coast. I could have some jobs closer to where I'm located but this company has treated me well so I've stuck with them for now.

As far as making your own hours it depends on the gig. Typically if a hospital has locums needs they want to credential as few docs as they can in order to fulfill them. Sometimes this means they want people to be able to cover 1 or 2 weeks a month firm. If you can't fulfill that then you obviously don't work there. Also some jobs might want you to read EEGs and if you're not comfortable then same thing. Both you and the hospital have ~30 days to cancel on each other if it's a bad match. I've been canceled once due to the hospital canceling locums completely. I won't work again with a place that cancels on me (this particular place tried), and I don't cancel on hospitals once I've made a schedule. This allows me to have relatively stable jobs (1 week/mo for 6 mo, for example).

Typically once you've accepted a job and you're credentialed your locums agent will give you a list of open dates. It's usually first come first served regarding dates among the locums that work there. If the company likes you you might get first dibs on dates or first refusal on a job, particularly if you're a good fit for the place based on your work history.

This year I'm working ~21 weeks between a cushy per-diem job and locums. Granted the schedule isn't always sweet. I worked 5 weeks in a row at one point and sometimes I'm traveling 5-6 hours across time zones every other week for a job. That being said, from the 2nd week of Aug to the end of the year I work 4 more weeks clustered in October/November and then I'm done. Off for Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Year's.

Typical pay depending on call, hours worked, and volume at most inpatient gigs is ~2500-3000/day, with some days making 3200-3500, and 1.5X multiplier for federal holidays.

Hope that helps.

Thank you so much for this thoughtful and insightful reply. Navigating the job market is not something we are taught enough of in our training and reading posts such as this provides invaluable insight into locums (I'm sure others would agree). A few questions:
-How much leverage do you have in negotiating pay?
-I have read from previous posts about the value of being able to read EEGs. Is this something you took it upon yourself to have ample experience with during residency or did you do a formal electrophys fellowship? Any advice for those early in residency?

 

[Telamir]

1) Some. If a place's rate is too low then I'll either suggest a higher one or turn it down. Typically the offers I get from my agent are fair and I typically will just take them. If there's a particularly shift/they need coverage RIGHT NOW, or if they're asking you to cover something unexpectedly you can usually ask for 1.5x pay for a day or two.

2) I did a fellowship and I'm boarded in epilepsy.

 

[ProReduction]

That's a great set-up. Are these TeleNeuro shifts Telestroke? Outpatient? And is your research affiliated with an academic institution or private? I'm wondering how you were able to make this work.

All "Emergency TeleNeuro", no scheduled patients / outpatient. My research is at a major academic institution.

 

[415kid]

About $350k in a medium sized midwestern city. I do a mix of daily inpatient and outpatient along with EEG/EMG. It’s a Monday to Friday job along with every other weekend of inpatient coverage (q 2).

Interesting that you have a mix of inpatient and outpatient with an M-F schedule. Is that q2 weekend call common? Has that been sustainable for you?

 

[415kid]

Would be great to hear from more people! I find other's experiences to be really insightful

 

[Aldertonghen]

All "Emergency TeleNeuro", no scheduled patients / outpatient. My research is at a major academic institution.

I asked if this was possible a while ago on here, and the response I got back then was that it wasn’t possible to do research at an academic institution while doing telestroke as an independent contractor because the academic institution would put a non compete. Did you have a similar experience, and if so how did you circumvent it? Because this honestly sounds like a dream in terms of % of time in research and pay.

 

[scoopdaboop]

How much would a consult only neurohospitalist make? The schedule I worked with one showed up at 1030 and left by 2-3 depending on how many day consults they got…

I assume it would just work out to be the same salaried 7 on 7 off unless wrvu setup where it’ll be less

 

[Postictal Raiden]

How much would a consult only neurohospitalist make? The schedule I worked with one showed up at 1030 and left by 2-3 depending on how many day consults they got…

I assume it would just work out to be the same salaried 7 on 7 off unless wrvu setup where it’ll be less

I show up to work at 9-930 and leave before 3 most days. I do a lot of charting and note writing from home tho. Still put in about 10 hours a day including time spent on answering phone calls from the ED

 

[ProReduction]

I asked if this was possible a while ago on here, and the response I got back then was that it wasn’t possible to do research at an academic institution while doing telestroke as an independent contractor because the academic institution would put a non compete. Did you have a similar experience, and if so how did you circumvent it? Because this honestly sounds like a dream in terms of % of time in research and pay.

Negotiate everything up-front. Many centers have strict non-competes, many do not. I am appointed in a non-clinical, basic science academic department, which means they could care less about how their people do independent contracting work, as long as it does not interfere with research. My department is concerned with which researcher is doing IC work that will lead to a billion-dollar device, not with a doctor doing some clinical work to keep her credentials active.
Also, many of the doctors that do part-time independent contractor TeleNeuro have their primary job at major academic medical centers. The same non-compete issues would apply to them too. At one of the Tele companies I worked at, roughly 25% of the TeleNeuro doctors all worked full-time at "Best Medical School", where the pay is notoriously bad so they all do TeleNeuro on the side.

 

[Neurogeneral]

Interesting that you have a mix of inpatient and outpatient with an M-F schedule. Is that q2 weekend call common? Has that been sustainable for you?

On a daily basis, my volume is not super high. And we have tele stroke set up, so the hospital/ER doesn’t page me much in the late evenings/overnight.

So its not a job that typically overwhelms or drowns you with volume all at once and that’s why I probably have lasted 4 years thus far. BUT getting only four days or even less off per month and having to do both inpatient and outpatient daily - does very slowly wear you down. At least that’s how I feel.

 

[JohnnyDoc]

Need to stop with these posts until I graduate. I dont want oversaturation to happen to this field.

 

[deathmerchant]

Low 300s; small town, not a typically desirable location. 50 min to nearest dom airport, 2 hours to int airport. Very cush. Was mostly doing 7/7 with 2-3 consults and 1-2 eegs/day. 24/7 call- 0-2 calls overnight. Go in around 10, work done by 12.30. Eat lunch and hang in the lounge another 30min/hr and usually home before 2. Somedays round in the evenings.

Recently started to add 2 half days of clinic in my ON week and will likely start some Teleneuro work in a few months. Likely will get to >400k with these.

 

[deathmerchant]

region?
if you wanted to work in the middle of nowhere can this work schedule demand 450?

450k starting off just as a neurohospitalist is rare but possible. One of my friend pulls 450, but has a census over 20 daily. Another friend does 10-12 patients in the morning as inpatient and other 8-10 in the afternoon in clinic. Also reads few EEGs/Sleep studies weekly. Did close to 9000 wRVUs. He got paid around 500k. But 350k +/- 50k are the typical offerings for new grads.

 

[deathmerchant]

How much would a consult only neurohospitalist make? The schedule I worked with one showed up at 1030 and left by 2-3 depending on how many day consults they got…

I assume it would just work out to be the same salaried 7 on 7 off unless wrvu setup where it’ll be less

I wonder if that was me lol.

 

[Dantes]

How's the outpatient outlook? Not trying to do any overnight call after residency if I can help it

 

[Postictal Raiden]

How's the outpatient outlook? Not trying to do any overnight call after residency if I can help it

Got two offers straight out of residency for gen neurology outpatient in SoCal without nights or weekends. 300-350k plus benefits and a generous PTO time

 

[415kid]

Need to stop with these posts until I graduate. I dont want oversaturation to happen to this field.

Low 300s; small town, not a typically desirable location. 50 min to nearest dom airport, 2 hours to int airport. Very cush. Was mostly doing 7/7 with 2-3 consults and 1-2 eegs/day. 24/7 call- 0-2 calls overnight. Go in around 10, work done by 12.30. Eat lunch and hang in the lounge another 30min/hr and usually home before 2. Somedays round in the evenings.

Recently started to add 2 half days of clinic in my ON week and will likely start some Teleneuro work in a few months. Likely will get to >400k with these.

That is cush!

 

[415kid]

Need to stop with these posts until I graduate. I dont want oversaturation to happen to this field.

Haha sorry! These posts provide some glimmer of light at the end of the tunnel for me.

 

[DrStephenStrange]

Got two offers straight out of residency for gen neurology outpatient in SoCal without nights or weekends. 300-350k plus benefits and a generous PTO time

Hey bro, did you decide not to go with a fellowship? I noticed you're already on the market for jobs, and if I'm not mistaken, you just graduated residency, right? If so, what made you go that route? I know the extra year of training is daunting, and I'm also undecided whether I wanna do a fellowship or not.

 

[Postictal Raiden]

Hey bro, did you decide not to go with a fellowship? I noticed you're already on the market for jobs, and if I'm not mistaken, you just graduated residency, right? If so, what made you go that route? I know the extra year of training is daunting, and I'm also undecided whether I wanna do a fellowship or not.

I’ll PM you

 

[GuillainMollaret]

Probably going to pull around 340K this year. A couple years out of training.

100% outpatient. Desirable West Coast city. 4.5 clinic days per week. 10 to 12 patients per day. Mix of EMG and headache procedures. No nights. 4 to 5 weekends per year covering outpatient call, no ED/hospital call.

 

[Telamir]

Probably going to pull around 340K this year. A couple years out of training.

100% outpatient. Desirable West Coast city. 4.5 clinic days per week. 10 to 12 patients per day. Mix of EMG and headache procedures. No nights. 4 to 5 weekends per year covering outpatient call, no ED/hospital call.

 

[astrobean]

This thread has a bunch of examples too: Do all neurology subspecialties in academia pay equally (adjusted for location, demand, experience level etc.)?

 

[415kid]

Probably going to pull around 340K this year. A couple years out of training.

100% outpatient. Desirable West Coast city. 4.5 clinic days per week. 10 to 12 patients per day. Mix of EMG and headache procedures. No nights. 4 to 5 weekends per year covering outpatient call, no ED/hospital call.

WOW... that's a great set-up!

 

[kidthor]

I’m an anesthesiologist who wandered in…. But wow you guys have good setups and pay!

 

[sharkbaitwhohaha]

300K base. with bonus for collection goals. M-F 8-5. no call. outpatient only. 25days PTO. Love it. This is the best life and the what I dreamed my life would look like after training.

 

[Postictal Raiden]

300K base. with bonus for collection goals. M-F 8-5. no call. outpatient only. 25days PTO. Love it. This is the best life and the what I dreamed my life would look like after training.

whats the patient load? Also how many EMGs would you say you do a week?

 

[sharkbaitwhohaha]

whats the patient load? Also how many EMGs would you say you do a week?

16-24 pts a day. 2-5 EMGs a day.
And Botox and infusions, etcs

 

[Drhappyface]

16-24 pts a day. 2-5 EMGs a day.
And Botox and infusions, etcs

That seems alot. I hope you are >400k+

 

[Postictal Raiden]

16-24 pts a day. 2-5 EMGs a day.
And Botox and infusions, etcs

I’m glad you’re happy with your job

But you’re being royally screwed financially

I just got an offer from a SoCal job, 16-18 pts a day, 4.5 days a week, no procedures, and the base is 320k.

I agree you should be paid at least 400k.

 

[Telamir]

He says "bonus for collection goals", which I think means RVU bonus, which probably puts him around there I'd think.

 

[Postictal Raiden]

He says "bonus for collection goals", which I think means RVU bonus, which probably puts him around there I'd think.

I see. Missed that. Then makes sense.

I just would hate to see another fellow neurologist getting screwed. We should all know our worth

 

[sharkbaitwhohaha]

I see. Missed that. Then makes sense.

I just would hate to see another fellow neurologist getting screwed. We should all know our worth

correct. I don't feel that undervalued. Currently employed but option to move to eat-what-you-kill model later. bonuses make up the differences. Anticipate making 400-700 in a few years.

 

[Postictal Raiden]

Fantastic

 

[sharkbaitwhohaha]

The moral of the story, don't join hospital systems. Join small to large physician owns practices. If you want to "fight the man" and support your autonomy and the future of private practice, stop being employed by them.

 

[Drhappyface]

The moral of the story, don't join hospital systems. Join small to large physician owns practices. If you want to "fight the man" and support your autonomy and the future of private practice, stop being employed by them.

That's true but the trend I've been seeing is these large corps buying out the little guys. Starting your own practice comes with more stress such as the overhead and hiring/managing other employees. Even with these flaws, I believe it's worth it (especially if you can add something extra to your practice eg blocks for migraines and maybe build a niche practice?)

 

[sharkbaitwhohaha]

That's true but the trend I've been seeing is these large corps buying out the little guys. Starting your own practice comes with more stress such as the overhead and hiring/managing other employees. Even with these flaws, I believe it's worth it (especially if you can add something extra to your practice eg blocks for migraines and maybe build a niche practice?)

Starting your own is hard. But every city has some group of independent physician owns practices. Join those.