Sidney Kimmel Medical College vs Georgetown?

[coffeelover10]

Which would you choose and why?

They both will cost about the same, so the finances are not an issue.

I suppose I would like a holistic perspective of each school, i.e prestige, match, community, lifestyle.

Thanks!

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[Goro]

Washington DC or Philly?????

Which would you choose and why?

They both will cost about the same, so the finances are not an issue.

I suppose I would like a holistic perspective of each school, i.e prestige, match, community, lifestyle.

Thanks!

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

I say Jefferson.
@Doctor Strange can certainly provide you with info about the school.

 

[Doctor Strange]

Which would you choose and why?

They both will cost about the same, so the finances are not an issue.

I suppose I would like a holistic perspective of each school, i.e prestige, match, community, lifestyle.

Thanks!

Tuition may be comparable, but DC is significantly more expensive to live in than Philadelphia.

In any case, I think the one thing that people who interview/visit Jefferson agree on is that Jefferson students are some of the happiest med students out there. It's a nice combination of location (Center City Philadelphia is amazing), community (large class size with amazing students), and curriculum (non-curved H/P/F with block scheduling). I interviewed at Georgetown when I was applying, and, while it is a fine institution, I did not feel anywhere near as at home as I felt when I interviewed at Jefferson. Jeff honestly went from the bottom to the top of my list when I came here, and the community and its vibe were what sealed the deal for me.

Let me know if you have any specific questions.

EDIT: In terms of match, you can see the list here - http://www.jefferson.edu/content/dam/tju/jmc/files/Admissions/2014Match.pdf
tl;dr: we matched 14/14 ortho and 11/11 ophtho. I think that says a little something about the competitiveness and quality of Jefferson grads.

 

[WingedOx]

God, seeing the school described as "Kimmel" just seems wrong. (plus I kind of hate it when people refer to their school by its benefactor... it sounds douchey)

Both are fine schools with maybe a slight edge to Jefferson in reputation. Philly is cheaper, and I honestly think a better city than DC. Jeff students are generally a happy bunch, but I feel like that starts to break down after the second year once the stress of clinical rotations kicks in. There were some awesome clinical sites (Reading, DuPont), and some ones that were miserable (Lankenau).


EDIT: oh and I know this gets said on SDN all the time, but STOP LOOKING AT MATCH LISTS!. The results are essentially unreadable if you aren't in the know (in my specialty, the most prestigious and selective medical school in my state has a really unimpressive residency, for example), and places like Penn are obviously going to have more Radiology etc, than a place like Commonwealth.

 

[halfwaycrooks]

God, seeing the school described as "Kimmel" just seems wrong. (plus I kind of hate it when people refer to their school by its benefactor... it sounds douchey)

Both are fine schools with maybe a slight edge to Jefferson in reputation. Philly is cheaper, and I honestly think a better city than DC. Jeff students are generally a happy bunch, but I feel like that starts to break down after the second year once the stress of clinical rotations kicks in. There were some awesome clinical sites (Reading, DuPont), and some ones that were miserable (Lankenau).


EDIT: oh and I know this gets said on SDN all the time, but STOP LOOKING AT MATCH LISTS!. The results are essentially unreadable if you aren't in the know (in my specialty, the most prestigious and selective medical school in my state has a really unimpressive residency, for example), and places like Penn are obviously going to have more Radiology etc, than a place like Commonwealth.

Would you say it's appropriate for someone deciding between schools to pick based on the number of students matching in more competitive specialties rather than where students matched then or should match lists just be ignored all together?

 

[notbobtrustme]

only school you should reference by founder/donor is Pritzker. And only if you want to hammer in the fact you are a douche.

 

[ridethecliche]

Tuition may be comparable, but DC is significantly more expensive to live in than Philadelphia.

In any case, I think the one thing that people who interview/visit Jefferson agree on is that Jefferson students are some of the happiest med students out there. It's a nice combination of location (Center City Philadelphia is amazing), community (large class size with amazing students), and curriculum (non-curved H/P/F with block scheduling). I interviewed at Georgetown when I was applying, and, while it is a fine institution, I did not feel anywhere near as at home as I felt when I interviewed at Jefferson. Jeff honestly went from the bottom to the top of my list when I came here, and the community and its vibe were what sealed the deal for me.

Let me know if you have any specific questions.

EDIT: In terms of match, you can see the list here - http://www.jefferson.edu/content/dam/tju/jmc/files/Admissions/2014Match.pdf
tl;dr: we matched 14/14 ortho and 11/11 ophtho. I think that says a little something about the competitiveness and quality of Jefferson grads.

Or the fact that Jeff pulls tremendously from its own residents and has really really good programs in those departments. Rothman et other ortho groups at jeff are freaking boss so that's definitely a huge plus.

 

[WingedOx]

only school you should reference by founder/donor is Pritzker. And only if you want to hammer in the fact you are a douche.

Why anyone would want to attach their name to that narcissistic family I have no f-cking idea.

 

[Feelgood Inc]

Wow it took me a long time for me to realize that Sidney Kimmel Medical College is Jefferson. Will "Jefferson" be dropped completely from its name or would its name become something like "Thomas Jefferson University Sidney Kimmel Medical College" just like for UChicago?

 

[Willy38]

Why anyone would want to attach their name to that narcissistic family I have no f-cking idea.

I've heard it referred to as Pritzker more commonly than anything else. Is it really that egregious to refer to a school by its name? I was unaware of the implied douchery. (Granted, I really never hear Penn referred to as Perelman though)

 

[Shams al Deen]

Georgetown has bigger name recognition among those who are not intimately involved with this stuff. I think the name benefits from the great law school and basketball program. But objectively, pretty similar in terms of reputation with residency programs. Go with what feels better, curriculum you like, location, etc.

 

[TREDWISE]

I've heard it referred to as Pritzker more commonly than anything else. Is it really that egregious to refer to a school by its name? I was unaware of the implied douchery. (Granted, I really never hear Penn referred to as Perelman though)

I don't think so. It might depend on the school? I hear people refer to Northwestern's medical school as Feinberg all the time. Schools need money to exist, people. I don't see it as a big deal that some donors want things named after them for their trouble. Just be happy when they don't place weird stipulations on their donations or pressure the school to do certain things.

 

[alpinism]

I've heard it referred to as Pritzker more commonly than anything else. Is it really that egregious to refer to a school by its name? I was unaware of the implied douchery. (Granted, I really never hear Penn referred to as Perelman though)

Its just plain douchy and narcissistic.

Not to mention it creates an inherent conflict of interest with the school's mission and research priorities and gives off the impression that your medical education is up for sale to the highest bidder.

True story: Wake Forest SOM used to be named The Bowman Gray SOM after the former president of the RJ Reynolds Tobacco company which makes Camel, Kool, Winston, Salem, etc... A good portion of the school is funded by Tobacco money.

Just another example of how professionalism in medical school is often a one way street.

NYT article on the subject:
http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/01/15/welcome-to-your-name-here-medical-school/?_r=0

 

[Willy38]

Its just plain douchy and narcissistic.

Not to mention it creates an inherent conflict of interest with the school's mission and research priorities and gives off the impression that your medical education is up for sale to the highest bidder.

True story: Wake Forest SOM used to be named The Bowman Gray SOM after the former president of the RJ Reynolds Tobacco company which makes Camel, Kool, Winston, Salem, etc... A good portion of the school is funded by Tobacco money.

Just another example of how professionalism in medical school is often a one way street.

NYT article on the subject:
http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/01/15/welcome-to-your-name-here-medical-school/?_r=0

Whether or not you agree with the practice of rebranding a school's name, I would still say referencing it by its name isn't douchey.

 

[altblue]

Its just plain douchy and narcissistic.

Not to mention it creates an inherent conflict of interest with the school's mission and research priorities and gives off the impression that your medical education is up for sale to the highest bidder.

True story: Wake Forest SOM used to be named The Bowman Gray SOM after the former president of the RJ Reynolds Tobacco company which makes Camel, Kool, Winston, Salem, etc... A good portion of the school is funded by Tobacco money.

Just another example of how professionalism in medical school is often a one way street.

NYT article on the subject:
http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/01/15/welcome-to-your-name-here-medical-school/?_r=0

I think it's even worse when the benefactors are in the medical field.

WMich's namesake Stryker (or its namesake corporation) is causing a **** ton of problems in the midwest according to a surgeon I've talked to... Then again, medicine = $$$$

But hey, hospitals need the donations, I guess.

 

[WingedOx]

Whether or not you agree with the practice of rebranding a school's name, I would still say referencing it by its name isn't douchey.

Renaming schools for benefactors isn't going away.

Saying "I go to Pritzger/Feinberg/Stritch" instead of "I go to UofC/Northwestern/Loyola" will make you look like a tool regardless of your level of self-awareness of it. Then again, how often are people who come across as pretentious tools really aware of it?

 

[TREDWISE]

Renaming schools for benefactors isn't going away.

Saying "I go to Pritzger/Feinberg/Stritch" instead of "I go to UofC/Northwestern/Loyola" will make you look like a tool regardless of your level of self-awareness of it. Then again, how often are people who come across as pretentious tools really aware of it?

Hmm... I wonder who has a problem here. The people who are referring to something by its official name and think nothing of it or the person who secretly thinks they're all tools and douchebags.

 

[WingedOx]

Hmm... I wonder who has a problem here. The people who are referring to something by its official name and think nothing of it or the person who secretly thinks they're all tools and douchebags.

secretly?

Look, using the more pretentious sounding name for your school doesn't make you a douchebag. it does however mean you have a douchey habit... kind of like using the word "Bro" every third sentence, or cheering for the Cowboys when you're from Maryland, or insisting the use of definite article before the name of a public university in Ohio, or walking around in flannel and skinny jeans whining about gentrification in the neighborhood you just moved into...

 

[Willy38]

Renaming schools for benefactors isn't going away.

Saying "I go to Pritzger/Feinberg/Stritch" instead of "I go to UofC/Northwestern/Loyola" will make you look like a tool regardless of your level of self-awareness of it. Then again, how often are people who come across as pretentious tools really aware of it?

dang, you really feel strongly about this.

 

[TREDWISE]

secretly?

I am assuming that in the real world you don't tell people that they're referring to their own school by the wrong name.

 

[WingedOx]

no, usually it involves something like this....

really? you're calling the school "Kimmel" now?

 

[WingedOx]

btw, this thread was rather necrobumped...

 

[Willy38]

no, usually it involves something like this....

really? you're calling the school "Kimmel" now?

I only raise issue because almost everyone I know has referred to UChicago as Pritzker, including the admissions office and I didn't get the douche vibe at all. Just saying it may be a broad brush to paint with.

Btw, I had no idea what Kimmel was either. Definitely heard of Jefferson though.

 

[WingedOx]

I only raise issue because almost everyone I know has referred to UChicago as Pritzker, including the admissions office and I didn't get the douche vibe at all. Just saying it may be a broad brush to paint with.

Btw, I had no idea what Kimmel was either. Definitely heard of Jefferson though.

The Kimmel thing is brand new... All alumni got letters about how to correct for the name change on CVs, etc. I think they also offered to print a new diploma which would be nice for a spare except I'd have to frame the damn thing again*.

BTW, if the OP is still out there... major downside of Jefferson: They give you a 2x3.5 ft diploma rolled up with a rubber band into a tube and inch thick. Good luck getting that thing flat into a frame.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Is it ok to refer to Vanderbilt as Vanderbilt?!! Commodore only had to shell out a million bucks for the school to be named after him

 

[TREDWISE]

The Kimmel thing is brand new... All alumni got letters about how to correct for the name change on CVs, etc. I think they also offered to print a new diploma which would be nice for a spare except I'd have to frame the damn thing again*.

BTW, if the OP is still out there... major downside of Jefferson: They give you a 2x3.5 ft diploma rolled up with a rubber band into a tube and inch thick. Good luck getting that thing flat into a frame.

So Jefferson actually puts his name on the diploma? To my knowledge Pritzker/Feinberg don't put those names on their diplomas.

Is it ok to refer to Vanderbilt as Vanderbilt?!! Commodore only had to shell out a million bucks for the school to be named after him

??? He provided the initial funding to start the school and then they decided to name it after him. But maybe you knew that

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

So Jefferson actually puts his name on the diploma? To my knowledge Pritzker/Feinberg don't put those names on their diplomas.


??? He provided the initial funding to start the school and then they decided to name it after him. But maybe you knew that

Yeah, I was trying to be funny. Swing and a miss for me lol.

 

[Slack3r]

Georgetown has more layperson recognition. I'd say its a toss up as to the medical reputation of both, although USNWR ranks GT #42 vs. #60 for Jeff.

I'd say the most important thing is to look at 3rd year scheduling. Do you get time for electives? How much time? Where do you rotate? Will you have to commute? Nothing worse than working a 14 hour gen surg shift and then having to drive 45 mins home.

Then I'd look at cost, because neither of these schools is better than the other. Might as well go with the cheapest.

 

[pandahunter]

Would you say it's appropriate for someone deciding between schools to pick based on the number of students matching in more competitive specialties rather than where students matched then or should match lists just be ignored all together?

never ever look at match lists to determine which school to go to. People used to tell me that when I was a pre-med and I couldn't help myself. Now that I'm awaiting the match, I realize how stupid it is to judge a school by where their students go. Ignore the list altogether. It is only good as a reflection of what a particular class was interested in.

 

[TheLionheart]

Personally, it was a big turn off when I saw Georgetown's curriculum was H/HP/P/etc. I've heard great things about SKMC.

 

[itsthat1guy]

Renaming schools for benefactors isn't going away.

Saying "I go to Pritzger/Feinberg/Stritch" instead of "I go to UofC/Northwestern/Loyola" will make you look like a tool regardless of your level of self-awareness of it. Then again, how often are people who come across as pretentious tools really aware of it?

i fail to see how this is "douchey"

 

[ZymurgySurfer]

Which would you choose and why?

They both will cost about the same, so the finances are not an issue.

I suppose I would like a holistic perspective of each school, i.e prestige, match, community, lifestyle.

Thanks!

What do you think you're interested in an how committed to that are you? I'm pretty set on Ortho so this wouldn't be a question for me. Jefferson is in a great location, with a ton of things to do, and Philly is definitely cheaper than DC. As far as prestige I think that most laypeople would consider Georgetown the more prestigious school, but they're realistically on par.

 

[halfwaycrooks]

never ever look at match lists to determine which school to go to. People used to tell me that when I was a pre-med and I couldn't help myself. Now that I'm awaiting the match, I realize how stupid it is to judge a school by where their students go. Ignore the list altogether. It is only good as a reflection of what a particular class was interested in.

I'm not suggesting where they go matters so much as what they go into. But im guessing this should be ignored as well?

 

[13132]

Tuition may be comparable, but DC is significantly more expensive to live in than Philadelphia.

In any case, I think the one thing that people who interview/visit Jefferson agree on is that Jefferson students are some of the happiest med students out there. It's a nice combination of location (Center City Philadelphia is amazing), community (large class size with amazing students), and curriculum (non-curved H/P/F with block scheduling). I interviewed at Georgetown when I was applying, and, while it is a fine institution, I did not feel anywhere near as at home as I felt when I interviewed at Jefferson. Jeff honestly went from the bottom to the top of my list when I came here, and the community and its vibe were what sealed the deal for me.

Let me know if you have any specific questions.

EDIT: In terms of match, you can see the list here - http://www.jefferson.edu/content/dam/tju/jmc/files/Admissions/2014Match.pdf
tl;dr: we matched 14/14 ortho and 11/11 ophtho. I think that says a little something about the competitiveness and quality of Jefferson grads.

I interviewed there and can validate that bolded sentiment as an outsider. Its pretty incredible. I also loved Center City.

I interviewed at Georgetown as well, and I was slightly bothered by the dingy/older facilities. I also didn't like that to live affordably you would need to either rent someone's basement room or live really far away in Virginia or something.

I would have absolutely picked SKMC.

 

[IamLeTired]

Which would you choose and why?

They both will cost about the same, so the finances are not an issue.

I suppose I would like a holistic perspective of each school, i.e prestige, match, community, lifestyle.

Thanks!

Just wanted to chime in and say Jeff hands down. The students seemed much happier when I was there, and center-city Philly is one of the best (and most exciting) places in the US to study medicine. On the flip-side, students at GT seemed much more stressed. In my opinion, it had a lot to do with the class size combined with the grading system they have. Unless you see yourself trying to work in politics, I think SKMC is the obvious winner here.

 

[Psai]

I call Cornell "Weill" and I don't even go there. Does that make me a douche too? I think of U Chicago as Pritzker. I think of Loyola as Loyola and Northwestern as Northwestern.

Personally, it was a big turn off when I saw Georgetown's curriculum was H/HP/P/etc. I've heard great things about SKMC.

This is incredibly unimportant

 

[Omppu27]

God, seeing the school described as "Kimmel" just seems wrong. (plus I kind of hate it when people refer to their school by its benefactor...

Lol idk why but I don't like it either...

 

[WingedOx]

I honestly put the student happiness metric down where I put match lists... pretty low. I loved my first two years at Jeff, loved Washington Square West, and Bella Vista, where I lived, but found dealing with clinicals to be kind of an inexcusable bureaucratic mess when I needed the help of a couple senior deans with some things (one of whom should have retired years ago).

No one is going to have the exact same experience, especially in a school as large as Jeff is. For the person who mentioned the long surgery rotation with the hour+ commute home, yup, I had one of those, and it sucked. I also had sites in Delaware and central PA that were great despite how far away they were.

I'm at an institution now with a reputation for rather unhappy students, but I have to say the guys we get who stay in house are really prepared and they all seem to want to stick around once all is said and done (at least in my program, some of the other specialties not so much).

 

[pandahunter]

I'm not suggesting where they go matters so much as what they go into. But im guessing this should be ignored as well?

Yes. Pay no attention to match lists at all given it's an accredited US MD school. A school may have 10 ortho matches one year and have 1 the next. It doesn't give you any indication of how good an education you're going to get.

 

[Visible Ghost]

Kimmel reminds me of Full House

 

[Shams al Deen]

Yes. Pay no attention to match lists at all given it's an accredited US MD school. A school may have 10 ortho matches one year and have 1 the next. It doesn't give you any indication of how good an education you're going to get.

I actually think that looking at the internal medicine matches can be quite telling because there's always a large enough sample of students going into IM each year. You can clearly see that schools in the top 25 consistently match students into 'top 25' IM programs (USNews ranks IM programs, and they're all the big names you'd expect). For top 5 schools, it's nearly 100% that match into top IM programs. And you can also easily see that the less competitive med schools will only have 1 or 2 kids per year matching into top IM programs. Now I don't think this has to do with quality of education. It's a combination of program director's opinion of certain schools AND the fact that most kids going to top med schools are more driven (generally speaking) and will aim for top residencies more often.

 

[Lucca]

I call Cornell "Weill" and I don't even go there. Does that make me a douche too? I think of U Chicago as Pritzker. I think of Loyola as Loyola and Northwestern as Northwestern.




This is incredibly unimportant

If I went to UChicago I would say UChicago to lay people since that is far more recognizable than Pritzker. I would use Pritzker for people in the medical field. I don't think it's douchey. The Ohio State University School of Medicine Brought to You by Arby's sounds pretty douchey but having enormous donor's stick their name on thing's is not weird in Academia and it gives the school an air of elite "Privateness" that the people in the Northeast can't live without and the people in the south can't stand. /shrug. I like the names.

I would definitely call Cornell "Weill" if I was talking to Ivy grads though. Man those guys hate Cornell.

 

[WingedOx]

If I went to UChicago I would say UChicago to lay people since that is far more recognizable than Pritzker. I would use Pritzker for people in the medical field. I don't think it's douchey. The Ohio State University School of Medicine Brought to You by Arby's sounds pretty douchey but having enormous donor's stick their name on thing's is not weird in Academia and it gives the school an air of elite "Privateness" that the people in the Northeast can't live without and the people in the south can't stand. /shrug. I like the names.

I would definitely call Cornell "Weill" if I was talking to Ivy grads though. Man those guys hate Cornell.

Yup, Americans tend to associate schools named for people as more prestigious. There's a reason why the same slick marketers who own Ross U advertise the "Keller School of Management of DeVry University."

/I STILL have no idea why anyone would want to associate themselves with the Pritzker family though.

 

[Lucca]

Yup, Americans tend to associate schools named for people as more prestigious. There's a reason why the same slick marketers who own Ross U advertise the "Keller School of Management of DeVry University."

/I STILL have no idea why anyone would want to associate themselves with the Pritzker family though.

Ya me neither but hey their money went to a good place at least .

 

[WingedOx]

Ya me neither but hey their money went to a good place at least .

along with just about everything else in Chicago...

 

[tiedyeddog]

Georgetown has more layperson recognition. I'd say its a toss up as to the medical reputation of both, although USNWR ranks GT #42 vs. #60 for Jeff.

I'd say the most important thing is to look at 3rd year scheduling. Do you get time for electives? How much time? Where do you rotate? Will you have to commute? Nothing worse than working a 14 hour gen surg shift and then having to drive 45 mins home.

Then I'd look at cost, because neither of these schools is better than the other. Might as well go with the cheapest.

Spot on with the third year thing. I wish input more emphasis on asking about how third and fourth year were set ou when I applied. Some schools make it so easy while others make it very difficult when interviewing.

 

[Slack3r]

I actually think that looking at the internal medicine matches can be quite telling because there's always a large enough sample of students going into IM each year. You can clearly see that schools in the top 25 consistently match students into 'top 25' IM programs (USNews ranks IM programs, and they're all the big names you'd expect). For top 5 schools, it's nearly 100% that match into top IM programs. And you can also easily see that the less competitive med schools will only have 1 or 2 kids per year matching into top IM programs. Now I don't think this has to do with quality of education. It's a combination of program director's opinion of certain schools AND the fact that most kids going to top med schools are more driven (generally speaking) and will aim for top residencies more often.

A much better metric would be to look at undesignated prelims. That's a good estimate of people that didn't match and had to scramble. Motivations are just too varied to look at IM matches, or any other field. The top girl in our class is shooting for IM in a small Midwestern city because that's where her fiancé and her family live.