There need to be a change in US system

[ppa93]

Dont you guys think it takes too long to be a medical doctor? 8 years man. in most countries including UK, Australia, New Zealand, etc, it takes about 5 to 6 years max.

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[sunUCB]

isn't that because they skip the whole "going to college" thing in those countries? by college i mean undergrad. personally, i like college and feel that it gives people time to grow/mature before making a career decision. many people are not sure what they want to do upon entering college.

Dont you guys think it takes too long to be a medical doctor? 8 years man. in most countries including UK, Australia, New Zealand, etc, it takes about 5 to 6 years max.

 

[KiKat37]

It takes more than time in the US because high school here is a joke. In Europe, med school takes less time because high school is much more difficult and a lot of the basic science classes are covered in high school.

For ex, I went to high school in Europe and I can tell you that I had already taken all the pre-med reqs (including orgo) before I started college in the US. Every bio/math/phys/chem class that I took my first and second year of college, I had already taken in high school in Europe.

But, I personally think that the US system is better. High school was a nightmare for me because of all the studying I had to do. I didn't enjoy it at all... Seems like people here enjoy it more.

 

[KiKat37]

isn't that because they skip the whole "going to college" thing in those countries? by college i mean undergrad. personally, i like college and feel that it gives people time to grow/mature before making a career decision. many people are not sure what they want to do upon entering college.

Yep, that's true too. In europe, you go to med school right after high school. There is no college or undergraduate years. And, we all know these are the best years! A lot of fun and, yes, it gives people more time to mature and think about what they really want to do with their lives.

 

[Medikit]

It takes more than time in the US because high school here is a joke. In Europe, med school takes less time because high school is much more difficult and a lot of the basic science classes are covered in high school.

For ex, I went to high school in Europe and I can tell you that I had already taken all the pre-med reqs (including orgo) before I started college in the US. Every bio/math/phys/chem class that I took my first and second year of college, I had already taken in high school in Europe.

But, I personally think that the US system is better. High school was a nightmare for me because of all the studying I had to do. I didn't enjoy it at all... Seems like people here enjoy it more.

Where are you from?

 

[tacrum43]

Dont you guys think it takes too long to be a medical doctor? 8 years man. in most countries including UK, Australia, New Zealand, etc, it takes about 5 to 6 years max.

Well, some schools (like Northwestern) offer accelerated programs to highly qualified students, but it does still take longer on average. You know, I like our system. Being a doctor requires that you have a lot of knowledge, and college allows students to mature intellectually (with non-science classes too, such as Philosophy and Literature). I know that I wasn't ready for medical school when I was 18. I have heard that doctors in other countries, such as Australia, don't know as much about the underlying science to many patient treatments, so the extra time is definitely important.

The U.S. has the best educated doctors for a reason, and I believe it is worth the time commitment. Anyone who doesn't can choose something else. For quick money, there are certainly easier options.

 

[riceman04]

Dont you guys think it takes too long to be a medical doctor? 8 years man. in most countries including UK, Australia, New Zealand, etc, it takes about 5 to 6 years max.

No not really! Yeah I know it seems like that since they start in college. However, they have to complete several years afterwards in the form of interships, and are not officially given the title of MD until after a specifc period of time!

 

[LabMonster]

I wasn't ready for college after high school. Some people reach maturity before others. Me, I like to muddy the waters for myself, then sort out the mess.

I always thought I wanted to be a doctor, but it took those developmental years between high school and today to realize I want, need to become a physician.

 

[Law2Doc]

Dont you guys think it takes too long to be a medical doctor? 8 years man. in most countries including UK, Australia, New Zealand, etc, it takes about 5 to 6 years max.

Actually, with the move toward acceptance of more and more non-science majors to med schools in the US over the last few decades, it seems clear that the consensus of US med schools is that a well rounded and well read doctor sometimes makes a better doctor. You lose this in those other countries and thus probably lose a lot of pretty good potential doctors to other fields. Additionally, a few extra years of maturity never hurts when you are talking about working with life and death issues.

 

[YzIa]

Actually, with the move toward acceptance of more and more non-science majors to med schools in the US over the last few decades, it seems clear that the consensus of US med schools is that a well rounded and well read doctor sometimes makes a better doctor. You lose this in those other countries and thus probably lose a lot of pretty good potential doctors to other fields. Additionally, a few extra years of maturity never hurts when you are talking about working with life and death issues.

Thats exactly right. Plus, the US isn't the world leader in medicine because it produces lousy doctors, or takes to long to educate them.

 

[ppa93]

Thats exactly right. Plus, the US isn't the world leader in medicine because it produces lousy doctors, or takes to long to educate them.

Well, my point is that you have to spend more money and more time in USA for about three years. Do u think it is worth it? Well, guess what, when u get the degree, they all are the same. MD, BM? equilvalent. The government should either make it shorter or make it cheaper. That is my point. Med school is really expensive as u know.

 

[fullefect1]

If pre-med class are covered in high school in those countries... i would have failed high school. Because I didn't have anymotivation to do anything...

 

[Ross434]

It takes more than time in the US because high school here is a joke. In Europe, med school takes less time because high school is much more difficult and a lot of the basic science classes are covered in high school.

For ex, I went to high school in Europe and I can tell you that I had already taken all the pre-med reqs (including orgo) before I started college in the US. Every bio/math/phys/chem class that I took my first and second year of college, I had already taken in high school in Europe.

But, I personally think that the US system is better. High school was a nightmare for me because of all the studying I had to do. I didn't enjoy it at all... Seems like people here enjoy it more.

I went to school in the US for high school, and i've already had all my prereqs (except physics) in high school. Not all hs's here are that easy.

 

[Slowmo214]

I can tell high school is A LOT harder in Europe, just like the other poster said. I spent one year as an exchange student in the US and the school was a joke. Then again, I'm sure some American high schools are top notch, even by European standards.

 

[YzIa]

Well, my point is that you have to spend more money and more time in USA for about three years. Do u think it is worth it? Well, guess what, when u get the degree, they all are the same. MD, BM? equilvalent. The government should either make it shorter or make it cheaper. That is my point. Med school is really expensive as u know.

A MD and a BM are for the most part equivalent. There are some cases where certain BM degrees from certain education systems are not qualified to sit for the boards in the US (ie BM in preventative medicine - China). If you want to practice medicine in America, there is no question that a MD is going to make that easier for you. Financing a medical education is expensive in the US, but US doctors are highly paid once training is complete. Maybe you should pursue a medical education in a foreign country since you have issues with the American set up, and then (try to) come back for residency so you can see how equivalent the degrees are first hand.

 

[msting22]

A MD and a BM are for the most part equivalent. There are some cases where certain BM degrees from certain education systems are not qualified to sit for the boards in the US (ie BM in preventative medicine - China). If you want to practice medicine in America, there is no question that a MD is going to make that easier for you. Financing a medical education is expensive in the US, but US doctors are highly paid once training is complete. Maybe you should pursue a medical education in a foreign country since you have issues with the American set up, and then (try to) come back for residency so you can see how equivalent the degrees are first hand.

Perhaps for some this might be the best way to go but isn't it true that you don't require a college degree to go to medical school...so if you are sure beyond the shadow of a doubt that going to med school is what you want to do take your classes for the MCATs in your first two years then apply that would take about two years off the process especially if you take AP classes senior year in High School.

 

[seev99]

man it would be cool if we changed the system here in the U.S. cuz then we wouldn't have all those old kids who are already married with kids and stuff in med skool...it would be like everyone is 18 when they start, so it would be pymped out! people are too serious bout med skool and medicine here; in other countries you're either in if u get the cut-off score on ur standard test or u do sumthin else...none of this soul-searching and ethical stuff...plus it's free in a lot of those other countries so u dont have to feel like med skool is such a big investment, holla!

 

[SitraAchra]

I went to school in the US for high school, and i've already had all my prereqs (except physics) in high school. Not all hs's here are that easy.

Your highschool offered General Chem 1, 2, Lab - Organic Chem 1, 2, Lab - Intro Bio - Genetics - and Calculus??

Save physics, those are quite a few classes. Did you go to one of those health magnet schools where they groom you for medical school? I can't see that palate of classes at any normal highschool in the US.

 

[masterMood]

my school (in america) offered ap chem (general chem 1 and 2), ap physics (i and ii), calculus (i and ii), ap bio (i and ii)

but no organic chem

 

[YzIa]

Your highschool offered General Chem 1, 2, Lab - Organic Chem 1, 2, Lab - Intro Bio - Genetics - and Calculus??

Save physics, those are quite a few classes. Did you go to one of those health magnet schools where they groom you for medical school? I can't see that palate of classes at any normal highschool in the US.

I agree that I find it hard to swallow that high schools offer Organic AP courses, but to correct your post, Genetics and Calculus are not requirements.

 

[YzIa]

man it would be cool if we changed the system here in the U.S. cuz then we wouldn't have all those old kids who are already married with kids and stuff in med skool...it would be like everyone is 18 when they start, so it would be pymped out! people are too serious bout med skool and medicine here; in other countries you're either in if u get the cut-off score on ur standard test or u do sumthin else...none of this soul-searching and ethical stuff...plus it's free in a lot of those other countries so u dont have to feel like med skool is such a big investment, holla!

I think your post is a great example of why maturity is required for medical school.

 

[SitraAchra]

my school (in america) offered ap chem (general chem 1 and 2), ap physics (i and ii), calculus (i and ii), ap bio (i and ii)

but no organic chem

thanks - next time i want to hear about YOUR highschool, I will ask.

 

[Ross434]

I agree that I find it hard to swallow that high schools offer Organic AP courses, but to correct your post, Genetics and Calculus are not requirements.

To clarify, I learned the same material, content wise, although i assume my organic labs were definitely not up to speed compared to the number and length of college orgo. And no, there is no AP organic or AP genetics under an official college board program, but we still had the classes. It was rigorous, to say the least.

 

[alexPDX]

It is interesting that in some European countries you have to choose a major in high school. I remember that especially science related majors were quite competitive to get into at many schools.

 

[ppa93]

I think your post is a great example of why maturity is required for medical school.

Let me ask u something. How do u measure maturity? by age? or by experience?
Guess what? there are lots of young people who are more mature than old people.
Or even some people that have less experience are more mature than some people with more experience.
I hate it when people say u arent mature because u are young. Bull****

 

[ppa93]

my school (in america) offered ap chem (general chem 1 and 2), ap physics (i and ii), calculus (i and ii), ap bio (i and ii)

but no organic chem

Do you know that more than half of the US med school dont accept AP credit, and I dont know why?
if u are taking those classes in High school, u must be nuts because u will be taking seven classes at least a semester.

As you know, they arent the only requirements for US med schools.
Where is the GE requirements?
I just feel like it isnt right

 

[ppa93]

It takes more than time in the US because high school here is a joke. In Europe, med school takes less time because high school is much more difficult and a lot of the basic science classes are covered in high school.

For ex, I went to high school in Europe and I can tell you that I had already taken all the pre-med reqs (including orgo) before I started college in the US. Every bio/math/phys/chem class that I took my first and second year of college, I had already taken in high school in Europe.

But, I personally think that the US system is better. High school was a nightmare for me because of all the studying I had to do. I didn't enjoy it at all... Seems like people here enjoy it more.

I agree. For people who are less smart, it might be too fast. How about for people who are very smart and who can handle it? Do you think they should also go the easy way out just because it is hard for some less smart people.

 

[ppa93]

To clarify, I learned the same material, content wise, although i assume my organic labs were definitely not up to speed compared to the number and length of college orgo. And no, there is no AP organic or AP genetics under an official college board program, but we still had the classes. It was rigorous, to say the least.

regardless, u still need to take it again in College.

 

[ppa93]

isn't that because they skip the whole "going to college" thing in those countries? by college i mean undergrad. personally, i like college and feel that it gives people time to grow/mature before making a career decision. many people are not sure what they want to do upon entering college.

They didnt skip any undergrad. We have it extra. it gives people time to grow or mature? some people are already mature and willing to make commitments by the time they get to 18.
Plus, they will get mature by the time they finish Med school in those foreign countries.

 

[ppa93]

No not really! Yeah I know it seems like that since they start in college. However, they have to complete several years afterwards in the form of interships, and are not officially given the title of MD until after a specifc period of time!

Are u saying that US medical students dont have to do any residency? LOL. We do, and it is about the same. I am just comparing the length of school education and not internship or externship or residency.

 

[Obedeli]

Dont you guys think it takes too long to be a medical doctor? 8 years man. in most countries including UK, Australia, New Zealand, etc, it takes about 5 to 6 years max.

Then get out of here you lazy bum! It may take "too long" for you flight to arrive.

 

[ppa93]

Actually, with the move toward acceptance of more and more non-science majors to med schools in the US over the last few decades, it seems clear that the consensus of US med schools is that a well rounded and well read doctor sometimes makes a better doctor. You lose this in those other countries and thus probably lose a lot of pretty good potential doctors to other fields. Additionally, a few extra years of maturity never hurts when you are talking about working with life and death issues.

What is it that we have and they dont have? Better doctors? instead of just claiming it, i think u should show some evidence.

 

[ppa93]

Then get out of here you lazy bum! It may take "too long" for you flight to arrive.

it isnt about laziness. It is all about efficiency. We always talk about how we have to make things efficient. Well where does this theory apply here?

I am trying to express my own feeling about US Med School. Remember, Freedom of Speech, first amendment. The government should either make it cheaper or shorter. Or I think they can stop letting foreign born med doctors take the exam and practice in USA. Then it will be fair.

 

[SitraAchra]

regardless, u still need to take it again in College.

No. The point of taking AP exams is to place out of entry-level college courses. Not all universities will accept AP credit, but most do to some extent.

 

[SitraAchra]

it isnt about laziness. It is all about efficiency. We always talk about how we have to make things efficient. Well where does this theory apply here?

I am trying to express my own feeling about US Med School. Remember, Freedom of Speech, first amendment. The government should either make it cheaper or shorter. Or I think they can stop letting foreign born med doctors take the exam and practice in USA. Then it will be fair.

There is a lot wrong with this post. It's about quality more than quantity. I'd rather have a trustworthy doctor who spent an extra few years in training than some factory line practitioner who got churned out.

Also - government has no business telling medical schools how to produce a physician. That's one reason why the US has excellent doctors, it's not completely socialized.

 

[Pose]

I love the way it is here. I think the fact that you must go through 4
years of undergraduate let's you not only experience a social life
outside of science, but also learn other academic disciplines. I think
medicine is something someone should consider (same with all other
graduate schools) after experiencing other lines of study, and work.
The fact that only a small percentage of the population is willing to
go through such a pipeline to practice medicine leaves more room for
serious and passionate applicants, and not people that are either in
it for the job securities, or people that are going to have a change
of heart midway.

Of course there are the 'bad' doctors, and students, but if one were
to be able to apply directly after high school would there not be huge
numbers of drop outs, and/or a surplus of physicians? It seems 1 out
of 3 teens want to be doctors based on the fact that all 15 of the
medical drama's currently on TV are so exciting. Does this upset
anyone else? Is there or is there not a risk to the future of
medicine?

Really, what would the ramifications of an easier application process be?

 

[Obedeli]

it isnt about laziness. It is all about efficiency. We always talk about how we have to make things efficient. Well where does this theory apply here?

I am trying to express my own feeling about US Med School. Remember, Freedom of Speech, first amendment. The government should either make it cheaper or shorter. Or I think they can stop letting foreign born med doctors take the exam and practice in USA. Then it will be fair.

LAZY bums have great rationalization skills. YOU ARE A LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZZY *SS! Now matter what you call it. I am thankful for system that will hopefully keep bums like you out!

It KILLS me how idiots are always the first to cite freedom of speech. When pushed against a wall, *said in a whimpering voice* "um I do have the freedom of speech." Hey, Gandi, nobody is threating your freedom, I HAVE THE FREEDOM TO THINK AND SAY YOU ARE A LAZY S.O.B.!
You are A BUM!! McDonalds has a fast application process. You should look into it. It is probably the same in utopian Europe with their 10-15% unemployment.

 

[Obedeli]

Really, what would the ramifications of an easier application process be?

I know what it would be like after meeting those who want shortcuts "efficient cuts" to life. Speaking to kids about medical school, I am usually asked by the creepiest kid in class the exact length of time it will take to finally be "rich." After telling him, he usually says "No way dude, I can begin working on air conditioners out of high school." Is it coincidence that the ones with desires for early gratification are they same nimrods who ask these questions? No. The loser who posted this thread is a great example. This does not mean that those who want to work on air conditioners are losers. If that is what you want to do, awesome. If it is what you choose because you are too lazy to invest time in more education. Then stamp an "L" on your forehead.

This loser wants a Drive Thru M.D. That should be his new handle.

 

[SitraAchra]

Ok I think...obedeli...needs to settle it down.

 

[Obedeli]

Ok I think...obedeli...needs to settle it down.

Saying it like it is. A bum is bum is a bum. Those who want things easy, get what they deserve.

 

[Ross434]

Those who want things easy, get what they deserve.

But at the same time, there are indeed easier ways to achieve the same level of success. Maybe the inefficiency of the system is keeping bright minds out, because they realize they will get more return on their talent if they invest it elsewhere. I agree - nothing that is worth it is easy. But there's a sense of having something be much more difficult than it needs to be, for the reward. This is what is bad about medicine.

I want a road to success. I'm willing to work at it, but maybe medicine offers less success than could have been obtained elsewhere in the same amount of time. I want a fairer balance -- maybe medicine should only be 2 yrs of undergrad and 3 years of med school. (ie: your pre-reqs, and then only the stuff that is actually useful, from what would have been your first 2 med school years)

 

[superdavykinz]

Let me ask u something. How do u measure maturity? by age? or by experience?
Guess what? there are lots of young people who are more mature than old people.
Or even some people that have less experience are more mature than some people with more experience.
I hate it when people say u arent mature because u are young. Bull****

I think he was referring to that other poster's comment. The comment made showed a lack of maturity to say that non-traditional students with families shouldn't be in school, don't take medicine seriously, etc. You're right that there are those that are young and are mature well beyond their years but I think that in general, most of the younger individuals lack maturity due to their experiences and ignorance.

 

[DrMojorisin]

Disclaimer: If you like to see the world through rose-colored glasses or have severe problems with cognitive dissonance, please do not read the rest of this post.

Where are the cynics in this thread?

Why has no one mentioned that med school is drawn out in the US moreso as the result of capitalist forces than over our concern with producing quality physicians? Special interests such as AMA and AAMC are the ones lobbying our government for changes to medical schools, not the general public. These organizations have profit motives, regardless of whether they are nonprofit. So do medical schools (****** to the AMA). The general public (which is poorly represented in the US special interest system) is the group that actually cares about the quality of medical care.

According to the World Health Organization "The U.S. health system spends a higher portion of its gross domestic product than any other country but ranks 37 out of 191 countries according to its performance, the report finds. The United Kingdom, which spends just six percent of GDP on health services, ranks 18 th." Hmmm, perhaps we are spending too much money educating physicians.... In the areas where we do have superior medical care, it is due to superior technology moreso than superior physicians. In other words, more money and better medical research is the US's strength, not better physicians.

The AMA is the most powerful union in the world. Essentially they have a monopoly on medical labor services in the US, where the government spends money like a drunken sailor on medicare. The primary goal of the AMA has been to keep the number of physicians low so that physicians' salaries stayed high. As a result, US physicians have more hoops to jump through than physicians anywhere else in the world.

So, there you finally have it, a cynical view on the way things are. You can reject it if you like, but it is the only post in this thread that addresses the forces that actually played a role in the development of the US health system, rather than focusing on the principles of what would make a good health care system.

 

[masterMood]

Disclaimer: If you like to see the world through rose-colored glasses or have severe problems with cognitive dissonance, please do not read the rest of this post.

Where are the cynics in this thread?

Why has no one mentioned that med school is drawn out in the US moreso as the result of capitalist forces than over our concern with producing quality physicians? Special interests such as AMA and AAMC are the ones lobbying our government for changes to medical schools, not the general public. These organizations have profit motives, regardless of whether they are nonprofit. So do medical schools (****** to the AMA). The general public (which is poorly represented in the US special interest system) is the group that actually cares about the quality of medical care.

According to the World Health Organization "The U.S. health system spends a higher portion of its gross domestic product than any other country but ranks 37 out of 191 countries according to its performance, the report finds. The United Kingdom, which spends just six percent of GDP on health services, ranks 18 th." Hmmm, perhaps we are spending too much money educating physicians.... In the areas where we do have superior medical care, it is due to superior technology moreso than superior physicians. In other words, more money and better medical research is the US's strength, not better physicians.

The AMA is the most powerful union in the world. Essentially they have a monopoly on medical labor services in the US, where the government spends money like a drunken sailor on medicare. The primary goal of the AMA has been to keep the number of physicians low so that physicians' salaries stayed high. As a result, US physicians have more hoops to jump through than physicians anywhere else in the world.

So, there you finally have it, a cynical view on the way things are. You can reject it if you like, but it is the only post in this thread that addresses the forces that actually played a role in the development of the US health system, rather than focusing on the principles of what would make a good health care system.

that pretty much sums it up!

 

[ppa93]

LAZY bums have great rationalization skills. YOU ARE A LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZZY *SS! Now matter what you call it. I am thankful for system that will hopefully keep bums like you out!

It KILLS me how idiots are always the first to cite freedom of speech. When pushed against a wall, *said in a whimpering voice* "um I do have the freedom of speech." Hey, Gandi, nobody is threating your freedom, I HAVE THE FREEDOM TO THINK AND SAY YOU ARE A LAZY S.O.B.!
You are A BUM!! McDonalds has a fast application process. You should look into it. It is probably the same in utopian Europe with their 10-15% unemployment.

haha I believe u arent a good listener. You just wanna tell people that they are lazy. u dont care about what they are talking about. Well, guess what? I dont care what u think of me. I know I am not lazy. I am just letting people know what should be done instead. IF u dont want to listen, I dont care. Dont insult people. Only pathetic people say such things.

 

[ppa93]

There is a lot wrong with this post. It's about quality more than quantity. I'd rather have a trustworthy doctor who spent an extra few years in training than some factory line practitioner who got churned out.

Also - government has no business telling medical schools how to produce a physician. That's one reason why the US has excellent doctors, it's not completely socialized.

Let me ask u a question. Are u saying that Doctors in UK, Australia, etc arent trustworthy? How do u measure it? u think extra few years in training can make people more trustworthy? There are lots of American med graduates who make mistakes. No one is perfect and u cannot measure such things either. You better come up with proofs.

 

[ppa93]

I love the way it is here. I think the fact that you must go through 4
years of undergraduate let's you not only experience a social life
outside of science, but also learn other academic disciplines. I think
medicine is something someone should consider (same with all other
graduate schools) after experiencing other lines of study, and work.
The fact that only a small percentage of the population is willing to
go through such a pipeline to practice medicine leaves more room for
serious and passionate applicants, and not people that are either in
it for the job securities, or people that are going to have a change
of heart midway.

Of course there are the 'bad' doctors, and students, but if one were
to be able to apply directly after high school would there not be huge
numbers of drop outs, and/or a surplus of physicians? It seems 1 out
of 3 teens want to be doctors based on the fact that all 15 of the
medical drama's currently on TV are so exciting. Does this upset
anyone else? Is there or is there not a risk to the future of
medicine?

Really, what would the ramifications of an easier application process be?

remember not one out of 3 teens can go to med school. They still need to have good score. I dont think a lot of people have dropped out of med school in UK. You'd better come up with some proofs instead of claiming like this. Surplus of physicians? well, I believe that will be a good thing. everyone will receive healthcare cheaper since doctors are competing each other. I dont think you guys wanna be doctors just because u want money. I hope so too.

 

[ppa93]

I know what it would be like after meeting those who want shortcuts "efficient cuts" to life. Speaking to kids about medical school, I am usually asked by the creepiest kid in class the exact length of time it will take to finally be "rich." After telling him, he usually says "No way dude, I can begin working on air conditioners out of high school." Is it coincidence that the ones with desires for early gratification are they same nimrods who ask these questions? No. The loser who posted this thread is a great example. This does not mean that those who want to work on air conditioners are losers. If that is what you want to do, awesome. If it is what you choose because you are too lazy to invest time in more education. Then stamp an "L" on your forehead.

This loser wants a Drive Thru M.D. That should be his new handle.

Well, calling people losers? how pathetic. I wanna be a doctor not because of money, but because of wonderful things doctors can do. any consideration for those doctors? They wanna do what they want in a very short time. Telling people losers isnt right. I hope u arent the future doctors because I dont want u to tell patients that they are losers. Grow up. Be mature. You can do better than that.

 

[45408]

Let me ask u something. How do u measure maturity? by age? or by experience?
Guess what? there are lots of young people who are more mature than old people.
Or even some people that have less experience are more mature than some people with more experience.
I hate it when people say u arent mature because u are young. Bull****

I really hope you aren't trying to say you're mature, because you're just atrocious.

 

[ppa93]

Disclaimer: If you like to see the world through rose-colored glasses or have severe problems with cognitive dissonance, please do not read the rest of this post.

Where are the cynics in this thread?

Why has no one mentioned that med school is drawn out in the US moreso as the result of capitalist forces than over our concern with producing quality physicians? Special interests such as AMA and AAMC are the ones lobbying our government for changes to medical schools, not the general public. These organizations have profit motives, regardless of whether they are nonprofit. So do medical schools (****** to the AMA). The general public (which is poorly represented in the US special interest system) is the group that actually cares about the quality of medical care.

According to the World Health Organization "The U.S. health system spends a higher portion of its gross domestic product than any other country but ranks 37 out of 191 countries according to its performance, the report finds. The United Kingdom, which spends just six percent of GDP on health services, ranks 18 th." Hmmm, perhaps we are spending too much money educating physicians.... In the areas where we do have superior medical care, it is due to superior technology moreso than superior physicians. In other words, more money and better medical research is the US's strength, not better physicians.

The AMA is the most powerful union in the world. Essentially they have a monopoly on medical labor services in the US, where the government spends money like a drunken sailor on medicare. The primary goal of the AMA has been to keep the number of physicians low so that physicians' salaries stayed high. As a result, US physicians have more hoops to jump through than physicians anywhere else in the world.

So, there you finally have it, a cynical view on the way things are. You can reject it if you like, but it is the only post in this thread that addresses the forces that actually played a role in the development of the US health system, rather than focusing on the principles of what would make a good health care system.

Now u have the answer. We have to change that monopoly.

I hope obedeli never ever become a doctor because with his temper, a lot of patients can die. It is really ironic that he thinks he is mature or extra years make him more mature. God Bless obedeli. I hope u didnt kill anyone yet.