Transferring between clinical programs

[MsAmira]

---

Members don't see this ad.

Hi everyone!

I am currently in a clinical program, I just started this year and unfortunately, it seems that the program is not the right fit for me. In addition, I am coming to learn that the school has limited funding, so financially speaking, I don't even think it will be feasible for me to stay there (especially as an international student). Does anyone know if already being admitted into a clinical program would hinder my chances of being accepted into another clinical program? How can I explain my situation in the interview process without seeming like a student who can't commit to a program?

Thanks! 🙂

 

[50MinuteHour]

I know someone who left a Clinical PsyD program after one semester and a few years later entered a fully funded Clinical PhD program. She couldn't justify the PsyD debt, didn't feel the program was a good 'fit', and missed home. So, it is possible to pull off. I'd imagine it is rare though. Programs will naturally wonder if you'll do something similar to them when the going gets tough, and who can blame them? I'm sure you could get into a PsyD program since they are supported by your money (that you don't have) rather than their money supporting you.

Before you leave your program though, I would really think through whether or not this issue of 'fit' is that insurmountable to getting your degree there. Office politics and grad school are unavoidable, and you may encounter similar issues in the culture of your next program. How will you talk about lack of 'fit' with your next program? How will you know for sure that won't happen again next time? Also, if funding is an issue now, and you offer that as a reason in future interviews for leaving, future programs will ask what you will do if they can't offer you funding every year. How will you respond to a question like that? Again, it is not impossible to get in somewhere else, but it is difficult. I think transferring credits also depends largely on each program and what they are willing to accept, if any of them.

Getting a doctorate is very often fraught with financial and political stress. I've heard of very few instances in which neither of these factors were present in pursuit of a doctorate. I would really think this through more carefully before making any decisions, and sit down with your advisor if you're feeling unsure.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

Getting a doctorate is very often fraught with financial and political stress. I've heard of very few instances in which neither of these factors were present in pursuit of a doctorate.

political?

I consider myself lucky. I went to a fully funded program in a low cost of living area but I understand this is not an option for all people. I took out zero loans while in my clinical training.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

for the OP, good luck. Its murky waters when it comes to transferring. The only offhanded information I heard about this being successful was when the program supported the transfer and the DCT wrote a letter of rec.

On the interview, you can just state that the financial set up of the program was not feasible for you but you did not know that until you started.

 

[irish80122]

As a DCT I agree with the others. It can be done but is quite rare. I would be more skeptical about an applicant who is alto ready at another program and I would want to know why they wanted to leave. A strong letter from the advisor and DCT explaining the situation and saying you are a good student that hasn't caused trouble would go a long way. We want to help and are open to it but we want to make sure we aren't taking on another program's problem student. I cannot tell you how much DCT time one difficult student can take so we are very careful to avoid this, hence the importance of those letters. I hope that helps.

 

[WisNeuro]

I consider myself lucky. I went to a fully funded program in a low cost of living area but I understand this is not an option for all people. I took out zero loans while in my clinical training.

Ditto. Actually, according to the last salary survey, 32% took out 0 in loans related to graduate school.

 

[PsyDr]

I left an experimental psych PhD program and applied to clinical programs. It was a huge mark against me. The general concern seemed to be that I would again enter the program and then leave, which would screw up their funding. In my essays, I always pointed out that I did not need funding because of previous business. I took the first acceptance, which was the PsyD program. Iirc, I got at least 1 offer for a PhD program after my commitment.

 

[MsAmira]

Thanks so much for the feedback. I'll definitely give it more thought. The clinical program I am currently in is at a Christian institution, and as such I am required to take a large number of theology courses (eventually amounting to a Master's, on top of my PhD in clinical psychology). It's hard for me to justify the extra courses, expenses and time that will be required for me to do that.

 

[MsAmira]

I know someone who left a Clinical PsyD program after one semester and a few years later entered a fully funded Clinical PhD program. She couldn't justify the PsyD debt, didn't feel the program was a good 'fit', and missed home. So, it is possible to pull off. I'd imagine it is rare though. Programs will naturally wonder if you'll do something similar to them when the going gets tough, and who can blame them? I'm sure you could get into a PsyD program since they are supported by your money (that you don't have) rather than their money supporting you.

Before you leave your program though, I would really think through whether or not this issue of 'fit' is that insurmountable to getting your degree there. Office politics and grad school are unavoidable, and you may encounter similar issues in the culture of your next program. How will you talk about lack of 'fit' with your next program? How will you know for sure that won't happen again next time? Also, if funding is an issue now, and you offer that as a reason in future interviews for leaving, future programs will ask what you will do if they can't offer you funding every year. How will you respond to a question like that? Again, it is not impossible to get in somewhere else, but it is difficult. I think transferring credits also depends largely on each program and what they are willing to accept, if any of them.

Getting a doctorate is very often fraught with financial and political stress. I've heard of very few instances in which neither of these factors were present in pursuit of a doctorate. I would really think this through more carefully before making any decisions, and sit down with your advisor if you're feeling unsure.

Thanks so much for the feedback. I'll definitely give it more thought. The clinical program I am currently in is at a Christian institution, and as such I am required to take a large number of theology courses (eventually amounting to a Master's, on top of my PhD in clinical psychology). It's hard for me to justify the extra courses, expenses and time that will be required for me to do that.

 

[Justanothergrad]

Ditto. Actually, according to the last salary survey, 32% took out 0 in loans related to graduate school.

Per the last match information it was 19% with an average debt increasing 12% (apx 10k) over the last cycle with a mean debt of about 95k and a SD of about the same as I recall. I think its been quite a while since 35% have taken out 0 in loans. Almost half (44%) of applicants reported debt of more than 100k.

 

[WisNeuro]

Per the last match information it was 19% with an average debt increasing 12% (apx 10k) over the last cycle with a mean debt of about 95k and a SD of about the same as I recall. I think its been quite a while since 35% have taken out 0 in loans. Almost half (44%) of applicants reported debt of more than 100k.

Maybe time, or sample differences. My data was from the APA salary survey, which I don't think they've updated in an in depth report since 2009.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

For future people reading this thread, I just wanted to mention that "transferring" doesn't really exist, though sometimes students will leave one doctoral program and enroll in another one. The process should be seen more as a 2 or 3 step process, and not necessarily a "transfer"…which in the undergrad world means something different.

 

[WisNeuro]

True, traditionally, the only way someone transfers from one clinical program to another is if their faculty mentor takes another job and negotiates bringing a grad student in with them. Outside of that process, you are just going to have to apply all over again and gain admission. Also, if you do apply and get accepted into a new program, it's up to them on whether or not they accept any of your previous coursework, or if you are starting from ground zero.

 

[PBCocce]

FWIW: I know of someone who was in a fully funded clinical PhD program and left after 1 semester. He ended up working for a few years, and is now in a less competitive clinical PhD program. So it obviously can be done, especially if there is a good explanation for why you left the program other than "I didn't like it there." That will serve as a major red flag for someone on the admissions committee that you will do the same there too.

 

[Justanothergrad]

Maybe time, or sample differences. My data was from the APA salary survey, which I don't think they've updated in an in depth report since 2009.

That would make sense if it were an issue of time. 2009 APPIC data has about the same % finishing internship with zero debt (16% in 2008, 18% in 2009, and 19% in 2015) although average debt was about 30k lower (a troubling rate of inflation). Seems 20% rate is the best estimate for those going through programs at present.

 

[WisNeuro]

That would make sense if it were an issue of time. 2009 APPIC data has about the same % finishing internship with zero debt (16% in 2008, 18% in 2009, and 19% in 2015) although average debt was about 30k lower (a troubling rate of inflation). Seems 20% rate is the best estimate for those going through programs at present.

APPIC presents it as debt only attributable to graduate training, correct? And yeah, 20-ish percent goes with my personal experience. Some in my fully funded programs took out loans. Although they were also people who did not do any outside work, and seemed to like living a bit beyond their means (e.g., nicer apartments, going out a lot).

 

[Justanothergrad]

APPIC presents it as debt only attributable to graduate training, correct? And yeah, 20-ish percent goes with my personal experience. Some in my fully funded programs took out loans. Although they were also people who did not do any outside work, and seemed to like living a bit beyond their means (e.g., nicer apartments, going out a lot).

yes, for debt incurred only in pursuit of psychology graduate programs.

 

[MsAmira]

So I suppose I am applying to a new clinical program and hoping some of my courses transfer over

 

[temppsych123]

I know several people very well who have had to transfer schools because their advisors moved, and even in those cases (with advisor backing and new program backing), it was difficult, and often involved retaking classes or being behind on starting clinical work because of rules about needing to do certain coursework first (even if you'd done similar coursework at a previous location). So I would say that the odds of getting a lot of credit for the work done at your current institution isn't huge, particularly if you're not transferring with a faculty member. Although, if you are currently at an APA accredited program, that may help, since coursework and other requirements have to follow APA standards (hence making it easier to argue that those courses should count at some future, also accredited school).

Also, at such time that you apply to other places, you should definitely address the issue in your cover letters, explaining why you are leaving your existing program and why the new program would be a better fit. Particularly emphasizing anything that you couldn't have known before going there (for example, did you know you'd have to take all the theology classes before you got there, and just didn't think it would be that onerous, or was that requirement only clarified once you arrived?)

Finally, one other thing to consider is that the people at the institution you're leaving may end up being your colleagues in the future, particularly if you want a research career and people at your old institution study similar things to people at possible future institutions. So, to the extent you can, try not to burn any bridges on the way out (even though it may be tempting!)

Good luck with it!