Undergraduate degree and residency application?

[BlueJay25]

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[mvenus929]

Residency programs are probably more likely to look down on you for going to a Caribbean med school. I'm not sure I follow your reasoning for why you did that.

 

[ram006]

Residency programs are probably more likely to look down on you for going to a Caribbean med school. I'm not sure I follow your reasoning for why you did that.

Agreed. If you were such a strong undergrad, you prob would have had a shot at going to a decent school or at least one that wouldn't have handicapped your career before it even starts. You didn't find it odd they accepted an 18 year old with no degree? Was there no pre-med adviser at your university?

I guess what's done is done, though, and I suppose an undergrad degree isn't technically a requirement.. Destroy step 1 and see how far you can run with it.

 

[dhavalp]

Hi all,

This is a bit of a rare situation but I thought I might as well seek out the SDN community for some guidance, and I would like to just thank everyone in advanced for their insight.

I knew I wanted to be a physician since before high school. In high school I had an average of 90%. Got into every undergraduate program I applied to in Ontario (since I'm from Toronto, Ontario). Finished my first year with an A in every course except Calculus. I realized that I was putting in hard work into an undergraduate degree, where if I put 100% effort into med school I must be fit to be a physician and if not then I must not be fit. So, after first year, I looked into a bunch of 7 year programs in the states but none of them would accept me since I was not an american citizen nor a resident of the state. So I took a look at Caribbean med schools and finished up my premed courses here in a Carib med school. Since being here (I'm currently finishing my last semester in my 2nd year, getting ready to write Step 1) I've been in the top 5% of my school academically and my CV also includes publications, international health conferences, and lots of extra curriculars like founding a free health program for local residents.

I was wondering if residency programs will look down on me since I'm 20, I have only completed one year at an actual undergraduate program, and don't hold a degree of any sort.

I have had a similar experience as you. I am a Canadian citizen as well, and I applied to combined BS/MD programs in the US right after high school. I was not considered by many of the programs due to the lack of an American citizenship/green card status, and I ended up being unsuccessful. I chose to go to a Caribbean medical school that offered a similar combined premed/MD program and recently graduated.

I matched into internal medicine in this past match. On the interview trail, I was rarely (maybe once or twice) asked about my undergraduate course work. Regarding your question about age, I went through through the entire match process at the age of 20, and didn't feel like I was being looked down upon because of my young age. Interviewers often asked about my age because they were curious, but from my experience it neither hurt nor improved my application. You will probably be a few years older than me so I don't imagine your age being too big of a factor. At the end, I matched at one of my top choices, and am very happy.

Don't worry too much about the factors that you cannot control, like your age or choice of medical school. Focus more on the things you can control, like your Step 1 score. Your USMLE scores will play a much more important factor in where you end up than anything else. The lack of an American citizenship/green card will also be a negative factor in the residency match. I noticed that some of my American colleagues with similar or worse applications ended up receiving more interview invitations than I did. So if there is a way that you can obtain your green card, definitely do so.

Feel free to send me a message if you have any questions. Jdh71 and aProgDirector were very helpful in responding to my many messages throughout the match process, so its only fair that I pass on their advice to you. Or you can send them a message directly... Whichever you prefer.

 

[rokshana]

Hi all,

This is a bit of a rare situation but I thought I might as well seek out the SDN community for some guidance, and I would like to just thank everyone in advanced for their insight.

I knew I wanted to be a physician since before high school. In high school I had an average of 90%. Got into every undergraduate program I applied to in Ontario (since I'm from Toronto, Ontario). Finished my first year with an A in every course except Calculus. I realized that I was putting in hard work into an undergraduate degree, where if I put 100% effort into med school I must be fit to be a physician and if not then I must not be fit. So, after first year, I looked into a bunch of 7 year programs in the states but none of them would accept me since I was not an american citizen nor a resident of the state. So I took a look at Caribbean med schools and finished up my premed courses here in a Carib med school. Since being here (I'm currently finishing my last semester in my 2nd year, getting ready to write Step 1) I've been in the top 5% of my school academically and my CV also includes publications, international health conferences, and lots of extra curriculars like founding a free health program for local residents.

I was wondering if residency programs will look down on me since I'm 20, I have only completed one year at an actual undergraduate program, and don't hold a degree of any sort.

shoulda, coulda, woulda…as said before, your age isn't the big red flag…its graduating from the caribbean(and needing a visa)….and the fact that you're in the top 5% doesn't boost you in the eyes of US PDs….get the highest step score you can, don't screw up in clinicals and apply everywhere….

 

[NotAProgDirector]

Obviously the most useful post is 2 above mine. I'm assuming you're in the same boat -- that you'll get an UG degree from your carib school. If not and you'll only have an MD, this MIGHT be a big problem. My state (for example) requires two years of undergrad coursework in order to get a license. However the board could waive this requirement if they wanted to -- so it may not matter at all. As mentioned above, now all you can do is focus on doing as well as possible.

 

[Raryn]

Obviously the most useful post is 2 above mine. I'm assuming you're in the same boat -- that you'll get an UG degree from your carib school. If not and you'll only have an MD, this MIGHT be a big problem. My state (for example) requires two years of undergrad coursework in order to get a license. However the board could waive this requirement if they wanted to -- so it may not matter at all. As mentioned above, now all you can do is focus on doing as well as possible.

Pretty sure your state makes exceptions for foreign MDs, given that most countries don't require undergraduate education at all and simply have a 6 or so year medical school track.

 

[BlueJay25]

Btw - thanks everyone for your insight and wisdom, it is much appreciated

 

[mvenus929]

And if I didn't get accepted to a Canadian school I'd have to come to the Carib anyways. But now, I feel like that fear was a little misplaced and I could've been one of the few that made it into a Canadian med school had I stuck it through.

I'm asking this purely out of interest, since there's obviously nothing you can do about your school choice now, and you'll just have to rock it and show what you can do. Why couldn't you have come to a US med school? We had two Canadians in my class (granted, I'm pretty sure one was a green card holder, since he got naturalized during med school), and several international students (who did undergrad in the US).

 

[Raryn]

I'm asking this purely out of interest, since there's obviously nothing you can do about your school choice now, and you'll just have to rock it and show what you can do. Why couldn't you have come to a US med school? We had two Canadians in my class (granted, I'm pretty sure one was a green card holder, since he got naturalized during med school), and several international students (who did undergrad in the US).

I think the loan situation gets a little complicated for them (not being able to qualify for federal subsidies), but I can't imagine that it's any less complicated to do caribbean school either.

 

[BlueJay25]

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[ThoracicGuy]

Yeah, what's done is done. I'm currently thinking, if I perform really well on Step 1 maybe there is a chance I can transfer in to an US med school. I know its a rare circumstance if at all possible to allow a transfer into 3rd year (especially as a Canadian citizen) but, that's something I'm really going to push hard for. If I did transfer in, my understanding is I'd be treated as an American grad rather than an IMG, is that correct?

You don't have an undergraduate degree, so I doubt a US med school would allow a transfer.

 

[dhavalp]

You don't have an undergraduate degree, so I doubt a US med school would allow a transfer.

+1. Only a handful of schools accept transfers from the Caribbean. All of the ones I know will require undergraduate coursework completed in the US/Canada. They will also require you to have taken the MCAT.

 

[rokshana]

Yeah, what's done is done. I'm currently thinking, if I perform really well on Step 1 maybe there is a chance I can transfer in to an US med school. I know its a rare circumstance if at all possible to allow a transfer into 3rd year (especially as a Canadian citizen) but, that's something I'm really going to push hard for. If I did transfer in, my understanding is I'd be treated as an American grad rather than an IMG, is that correct?

you will still have visa issues…

and its not really about doing well in the caribbean med school and saving the 3 years…because now you have set yourself up for disappointment, esp if GS is something you are seriously considering…cat GS is difficult at best from the caribbean…

can you go back and complete the UG in Canada and then apply to canadian med schools? it would probably be worth it.

 

[BlueJay25]

you will still have visa issues…

and its not really about doing well in the caribbean med school and saving the 3 years…because now you have set yourself up for disappointment, esp if GS is something you are seriously considering…cat GS is difficult at best from the caribbean…

can you go back and complete the UG in Canada and then apply to canadian med schools? it would probably be worth it.

Thanks for putting things in perspective for me. Honestly, after learning all that I have learned in my first two years I don't think I have it in me to go back and take classes that will be irrelevant to medicine. Especially after knowing I'm made for the rigors of med school and loving every bit of it. Going back for 3 more years of undergrad vs where as if I continue on my current path, I'd be a resident in 3 years (if I match). It just feels like a huge set back. I haven't yet had much exposure to other specialties so maybe when I'm in rotations I'll be just as interested in other specialties and figure it out from there once I have my scores and know how competitive I am.

Again, thanks everyone for replying here to my thread.