Upping clinical experience?

[beachblonde]

Ok, so it's looking like I'm going to have to reapply this year (I'm sitting on a bunch of slow-moving waitlists) and I was told by a dean that I need to up my clinical experience. I haven't had time to do anything this past year to due to the demands of grad school, but I've got a month of unscheduled time before my fall classes start. Oh, and one caveat: I HATE shadowing. I've done (to my mind, at least) plenty of it and I have no desire to do more. So what can I do to improve my clinical experience?

The dean told me that volunteering a hospital doesn't count, so I'm a little stuck as to what to do. She also said my clinical research doesn't count. I've signed up to help out at a free clinic, but that's only once a week. Any suggestions for things to do to add some extra stuff to the clinical part of my app?

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[tbo]

You're either getting awful advice from a dean or your story just doesn't add up. If you hate shadowing enough to not go through the motions, you might want to reconsider a career in medicine - MS3 and 4 is an extension of shadowing. Be that as it may, it sounds like you have a reasonable amount of clinical exposure if you've shadowed (enough to make you hurl) and have done clinical research (why the hell doesn't that count?). I suppose what they are looking for is your ability to work with patients, so the free clinic sounds good. I was asked about my time volunteering at Planned Parenthood. Hospices are also good options for clinical exposure. It's bizarre that the dean said hospital volunteering doesn't count. An ED receptionist sounds like another good option as well.

 

[prettyslick]

Ok, so it's looking like I'm going to have to reapply this year (I'm sitting on a bunch of slow-moving waitlists) and I was told by a dean that I need to up my clinical experience. I haven't had time to do anything this past year to due to the demands of grad school, but I've got a month of unscheduled time before my fall classes start. Oh, and one caveat: I HATE shadowing. I've done (to my mind, at least) plenty of it and I have no desire to do more. So what can I do to improve my clinical experience?

The dean told me that volunteering a hospital doesn't count, so I'm a little stuck as to what to do. She also said my clinical research doesn't count. I've signed up to help out at a free clinic, but that's only once a week. Any suggestions for things to do to add some extra stuff to the clinical part of my app?

Is this true????

 

[nontrdgsbuiucmd]

Is this true????

I'm with you, have heard from many schools that this is exactly what they WOULD count (volunteer hospital work). Although 2 schools of the many I've spoken with said that SHADOWING does not count. I'm not sure why this would be, but that's what the 2 schools said.

I'd suggest that you recontact the dean and tell him/her that you're very interested in their school and want to make sure that you obtain sufficient clinical experience to make an informed decision about pursuing a career in medicine, what would he/she recommend? If you can't get the dean, I'd bet anyone from the office would be able to tell you the type of experiences that an "ideal" candidate (for their school) has. Given the school seems to have different views on this than many other schools have, it's hard to say if they'd consider clinic work "clinical" enough.

 

[pygmalion09]

if volunteering at a hospital doesn't count, then what does?

 

[gman33]

The dean told me that volunteering a hospital doesn't count, so I'm a little stuck as to what to do.

You either misunderstood, or they are full of s&^%.
Were they trying to tell you how to improve YOUR app?
Volunteering at a hospital where you can get a lot of direct patient contact is probably the best experience you can get. Most schools want to know that you are comfortable being around and interacting with sick patients.

What did you do in clinical research? Were you interacting with patients or just doing backend work? If it was interacting with patients, this time should count.

 

[beachblonde]

You're either getting awful advice from a dean or your story just doesn't add up. If you hate shadowing enough to not go through the motions, you might want to reconsider a career in medicine - MS3 and 4 is an extension of shadowing. Be that as it may, it sounds like you have a reasonable amount of clinical exposure if you've shadowed (enough to make you hurl) and have done clinical research (why the hell doesn't that count?). I suppose what they are looking for is your ability to work with patients, so the free clinic sounds good. I was asked about my time volunteering at Planned Parenthood. Hospices are also good options for clinical exposure. It's bizarre that the dean said hospital volunteering doesn't count. An ED receptionist sounds like another good option as well.

I'm sick of shadowing at this point because I feel like I've maxed out on my ability to absorb info. Since I haven't taken pharm or path or anything like that, it's not like I can discuss treatment options with the doctor. As an M3 or M4 you have enough background to at least understand what's going on. I know what the clinical years are like, hell, I've even shadowed a med student. I'll look into Planned Parenthood; that's a great idea (I really like the organization).

You either misunderstood, or they are full of s&^%.
Were they trying to tell you how to improve YOUR app?
Volunteering at a hospital where you can get a lot of direct patient contact is probably the best experience you can get. Most schools want to know that you are comfortable being around and interacting with sick patients.

What did you do in clinical research? Were you interacting with patients or just doing backend work? If it was interacting with patients, this time should count.

I don't think I misunderstood the dean; I asked her point blank if volunteering in a hospital would count as clinical and she said "eh, probably not." She told me to go shadow for another 400 hours (yep, that was the number she pulled out).

My clinical research consists of interviewing patients and compiling the data. So I am actually talking to them. The dean, however, said that this is research and doesn't count for clinical experience.


And, I'm not making this up; I swear. I went to go meet with the dean of admissions at one school where I'm waitlisted and this is what she told me. She said my clinical experience was on the weaker side, and that I should shadow. I said, "does volunteering in a hospital count?" and she said no, and then I asked about clinical research and was shot down for that as well. I've shadowed a cardiologist, an orthopedic surgeon, a nephrologist, neurologist, rheumatologist, pm&r, pediatricians, and have seen multiple surgeries. Can you see why I'm tired of it? It's possible I didn't play this up enough in my activities and PS, so I will rewrite them to emphasize this more.

Edited to add: the dean also suggested that I look into going to Africa to do a medical service trip there. Yeah, that's feasible for a grad student.

 

[tbo]

There could be a whole slew of more logical reasons for all of this "bizarre" advice you're getting from deans and adcoms. They might be giving you suggestions to show, for example, a stronger commitment to medicine or activities that exemplify your compassion for patients. If I was in your shoes and had access to people like deans, I'd go a step further and ask what the thought process is behind a "trip to Africa". What exactly are they picking up on that's lacking?

Based on the information you've provided, it's really difficult to make that assessment. So be self-critical about your own story and ask yourself if you had to locate weaknesses in your clinical exposure, strengthen those things.

 

[Mattabet]

Just to complicate the situation a little further, I've been told (by the premed advising people here) that volunteering at a hospital is 'good' clinical experience, provided you're actually close enough to patients and doctors that you can see what's going on, and help out in some ancillary fashion.

Conversely, shadowing is okay, but my advisers thought that some schools look at it as kind of a limited experience because you're not really doing anything, you're just standing around... probably part of the reason the original poster is so bored with it (it sounds to me like you've had more than enough).

It's pretty sticky. I've always wondered what they really want here. I'd love to come to them and tell them that I performed a bunch of major surgeries in the back of a van or something. Patient contact? Check. Also egregious legal violations. How close to a patient do they expect a non-professional to be able to get?

 

[RockHardIce]

Just to complicate the situation a little further, I've been told (by the premed advising people here) that volunteering at a hospital is 'good' clinical experience, provided you're actually close enough to patients and doctors that you can see what's going on, and help out in some ancillary fashion.

Conversely, shadowing is okay, but my advisers thought that some schools look at it as kind of a limited experience because you're not really doing anything, you're just standing around... probably part of the reason the original poster is so bored with it (it sounds to me like you've had more than enough).

It's pretty sticky. I've always wondered what they really want here. I'd love to come to them and tell them that I performed a bunch of major surgeries in the back of a van or something. Patient contact? Check. Also egregious legal violations. How close to a patient do they expect a non-professional to be able to get?

couldn't agree more! its ridiculous.

 

[TexasTriathlete]

I got great clinical experience, with tons of patient contact, and I learned a lot that I didn't know before, from my volunteer work.

I also got a job offer from it.

From that job, I have been invited to return during my break between MS1 and MS2 to do trauma surgery research, by the director of the surgery residency, and the director of trauma services. We are the nation's busiest Level II trauma center.

The key for me? Volunteering on the night shift. All the administrative people are gone, and they can use all the help they can get.

I didn't apply to work the night shift. I went for whatever time they put me at, and one day, I ended up staying late, and I loved it. The charge nurse told me that, regardless of what the volunteer coordinator said, I was welcome to come back and help out any time I wanted. So I quit my job as a bartender, and started coming late nights on the weekends.

I wasn't afraid to get dirty, or stick up for the nurses, or do **** work, and I was offered a job very quickly. I was unable to make it work with my schedule until late last year, but it has been a great experience. I'm around a lot of great and experienced doctors and nurses, and I learn a ton from these guys. I've also made a lot of good friends who I work out with, drink with, and socialize with.

Anyone who doesn't try to get as much clinical experience as they can before med school is ******ed. This has been the best experience of my life, and it has solidified my decision to continue down this path.

 

[Instatewaiter]

You're either getting awful advice from a dean or your story just doesn't add up. If you hate shadowing enough to not go through the motions, you might want to reconsider a career in medicine - MS3 and 4 is an extension of shadowing.

No she's not. I assure you this dean knows a lot more than your advisor.

The reason volunteering at a hospital isn't looked at as positively is because often you just wheel pts around or are a go-for. That's not very medically relevant. There is little you can legally do at a hospital so volunteering there may not be seen as strong clinical exposure.

At least shadowing they know you were around the doctors and they also know you have exposure to different fields.

M3 and M4 has very, very little to do with shadowing. Shadowing is a very passive thing while being a medical student isnt.

 

[Jesus DO]

Ok, so it's looking like I'm going to have to reapply this year (I'm sitting on a bunch of slow-moving waitlists) and I was told by a dean that I need to up my clinical experience. I haven't had time to do anything this past year to due to the demands of grad school, but I've got a month of unscheduled time before my fall classes start. Oh, and one caveat: I HATE shadowing. I've done (to my mind, at least) plenty of it and I have no desire to do more. So what can I do to improve my clinical experience?

The dean told me that volunteering a hospital doesn't count, so I'm a little stuck as to what to do. She also said my clinical research doesn't count. I've signed up to help out at a free clinic, but that's only once a week. Any suggestions for things to do to add some extra stuff to the clinical part of my app?

Maybe you might want to consider doing a short time volunteer thing with a state or government EMT group. The only problem is you will have a month of time to do this. If you had more time, such as several months, being with an EMT group might help. Becoming an EMTB with experience would help even further.

Perhaps in this one month off you could find out if there are any medical missionary groups that will to traveling during your time off to do medical work in a third world country. This may be difficult to do if you don't have the right connections - but if you ask around, you'll probably find some group or organization around you that does this on a regular enough basis and could somehow fit you in.

I wish you the very best!

 

[nick_carraway]

I had a similar experience with a lot of advisors/deans saying that clinical research (in which I actively recruited patients for research projects) did not qualify as clinical experience. All 5 schools I've spoken with all said that a purely clinical experience, without any research, would be ideal.