USAF National Guard Question

[sprin001]

So, I'm an intern in internal medicine. I'm switching to psych but I think that is a topic for another forum. I am in the process of applying to the local 138th fighter wing of the USAF national guard, Tulsa, OK. I am curious about anyones experience with the timing of this. I am scheduled for MEPS on March 6th. How long typically before I start drilling, timeframe from MEPS to Officer training, how soon after can I do flight surgeon school because I would prefer to take a break from residency and complete these so I can do that throughout my residency. Anyway, Thanks in advance. I asked my local people and they didnt seem to have any idea.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[notdeadyet]

A few thoughts:

- Personally, I wouldn't join until I'd made the determination on whether I was going to switch from medicine--> psychiatry. There are very different slots for these roles in the Air Guard and you want to make sure you're joining in an area that has slots for psychiatrists, otherwise you'll have to travel or switch to the Air Force Reserve. For that matter, I wouldn't join until after you make the switch. Presuming you're going to try to match into a PGY-2 slot in psychiatry, you may not even be staying in-state.
- From MEPS to swearing in/commissioning can take 4-7 months depending on how fast your state handles their paperwork and whether you need any waivers for health things and the like. You can start drilling shortly after you swear in. BOLC (officer training) can happen after this. How long depends on when the training is being offered (it's offered multiple times per year) and what has availability.
- For the flight surgery thing, you need to figure out the psychiatry thing. For the Army National Guard, psychiatrists can not serve as flight surgeons. I suspect the same is true for the Air National Guard.

 

[sprin001]

Thanks for the information. I'm Actually staying in the same town, I'm just switching programs so that shouldnt be a problem. That seems strange that I would be able to be a flight surgeon, do you have any idea the reasoning behind that?

 

[notdeadyet]

A flight surgeon's job is essentially acting as primary care provider for a very specialized population. This would be outside of a psychiatrist's area of expertise.

If you have an interest in treating this population, you will likely have plenty of opportunities as a psychiatrist. Flight surgeon's refer out much of the psych issues of their populations to the mental health folks.

 

[sprin001]

Notdeadyet,
I have looked into it a little further and it appears that I could actually still meet the requirements for flight surgeon per "training". 1 year of Internal Medicine internship looks like it should get me through the door, then the other training through the USAF. However, I just attended MEPS on March 6th and have poor high frequency hearing as well as zero depth perception. It is my understanding that these deficiencies could also prohibit me from flight surgeon status. Any thoughts? Anyone else fail the depth perception test or do poorly on hearing and still become flight surgeon?

 

[notdeadyet]

Notdeadyet,
I have looked into it a little further and it appears that I could actually still meet the requirements for flight surgeon per "training". 1 year of Internal Medicine internship looks like it should get me through the door, then the other training through the USAF.

Keep in mind I'm Army, but that loophole wouldn't really work. You would potentially qualify for flight surgeon training if you could dupe them into thinking you were going to be an internist, but as soon as you indicated you were psych pathway, you would occupy a slot in eligible for working as a flight surgeon. So even if you snaked the training, you would never do the job, which seems kind of useless. I feel you, I had it planned to do flight surgeon training during my fourth year of med school til I found I'd never use it.

As for the hearing and sight deficiencies, you'd likely be disqualified, but that is for Army.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[sprin001]

Any idea the timeframe from MEPS to drilling, commissioning, COT. Also, I have read some things about COT being 2.5 weeks to 4.5 weeks. Which is it? I'm lswimming in a sea of acronyms at this point. Thanks. Are there any ANG physicians in here that would speak to their experience?

 

[ANGSFS]

Any idea the timeframe from MEPS to drilling, commissioning, COT. Also, I have read some things about COT being 2.5 weeks to 4.5 weeks. Which is it? I'm lswimming in a sea of acronyms at this point. Thanks. Are there any ANG physicians in here that would speak to their experience?

Some of this information is valid, some is not.
You will be able to drill immediately after commissioning, but will not be fully functional for a while -- until after you get COT done and creds/privileging. The time from MEPS to commissioning is extremely variable, but your medical issues will be the driver in that. Other than the bureaucratic delays inevitable when paperwork has to go through the hands of people at local, state, and federal levels.

Your real issue is not your specialty -- as a matter of fact, the ANG would welcome Psych people among the ranks, and FS is not excluded. Could actually be a great boon to a unit to have you. Large number of our waivers are for Psych/MH things, big emphasis on MH issues right now, particularly with deployment health and family support. To my knowledge ALL the Psych people in the ANG are FS's -- we have no slots for clinical Psych on the manning documents. You would have to qualify for FS training to be commissioned, and that is your problem. The hearing is likely easily waiverable or not a real disqualifier, unless it's pretty extreme. There is an alternate set of depth perception tests that can be performed to make sure you fail -- some people just can't do the VTA-ND, but do OK when tested by alternate means by the optometrist. It is worth pursuing that -- I would talk to the 138th. You might be able to do it there, or may have to pay yourself for a civilian test.

Good luck with this. I qualified as a FS in 1989, and am coming to the end of my time in the AF. I've been AD, AFR, and ANG during that time, and regard the decision to accept the HPSP scholarship as one of the best decisions I ever made. And going vertical in full afterburner in a viper is an experience that is worth a little effort to pursue...

 

[sprin001]

Thanks for your input. Hearing was minor at high frequencies and I feel I could pass a reasonable depth perception test... I very much look forward to a future with the ANG! I'll stay in touch with the 138th and update here for anyone else with similar inquiries.

 

[sprin001]

Preliminary update. I spoke with the officer recruiter who I presume is still wet behind the ears. The concensus is that poor hearing/lack of depth perception will likely preclude me from USAF flight doc status. More updates to follow as I go through the process. Anyone with questions please feel free to post or PM me.

 

[Snowdon48]

Any idea the timeframe from MEPS to drilling, commissioning, COT. Also, I have read some things about COT being 2.5 weeks to 4.5 weeks. Which is it? I'm lswimming in a sea of acronyms at this point. Thanks. Are there any ANG physicians in here that would speak to their experience?

COT is 4 weeks

 

[sprin001]

Thanks Ryu

 

[sprin001]

Update: I have been back to my local unit. The recruiter had me sign a waiver which is being sent to the USAF SG? she said approximately 2 weeks and we should know more.

 

[sprin001]

My waiver requests has been returned, it took about 3 weeks. The National Guard Bureau is requesting that I be evaluated by an audiologists and orthopedists. The letters have specific details that need to be discussed during the visit with each specialists but sound relatively easy and when completed I will have my medical records from these visits returned to my local unit then transferred to the national guard bureau.

Just an update. Anyone going through the process with questions just let me know.

 

[deuist]

The military will definitely make you do largely unnecessary medical tests for relatively minor issues. When I applied I mentioned that I had occasional acid reflux that generally required no medication and an innocent murmur a child that could not be into adulthood. The AF made me get ECG's, an echocardiogram, upper GI series, and upper endoscopy---all to say that I could indeed work in the military. The whole process took several months and must have cost the government over a thousand dollars just to obtain waivers.

 

[sprin001]

Thanks deuist. Hopefully, no EGD's here! I had an audiologist appt today and it was pretty straight forward. Will update when I get more info but suspect neither my hearing nor retained hardware will DQ me at this time.

 

[ANGSFS]

Good luck. sounds like it's on track.

 

[sprin001]

Thanks ANGSFS.

I had both ortho and audiology medically cleared, at least that's what their notes state. Took all of this back to my local unit and once medically cleared, my whole packet will be turned in. Best guess from recruiter is total time ~ 1 month left

 

[sprin001]

My medical packet has now been cleared. I am going to meet with the recruiter, fill out the final paperwork and that will be sent in for the final process...

 

[notdeadyet]

Glad you're getting the news you wanted, sprin001

 

[sprin001]

Thanks notdeadyet. Another update, I have finished the "credentialing stage." My packet is supposed to go to the National Guard Bureau and that's what they're calling "The final step." 1-2 weeks I guess.

 

[Mtn Doc]

Keep in mind I'm Army, but that loophole wouldn't really work. You would potentially qualify for flight surgeon training if you could dupe them into thinking you were going to be an internist, but as soon as you indicated you were psych pathway, you would occupy a slot in eligible for working as a flight surgeon. So even if you snaked the training, you would never do the job, which seems kind of useless. I feel you, I had it planned to do flight surgeon training during my fourth year of med school til I found I'd never use it.

As for the hearing and sight deficiencies, you'd likely be disqualified, but that is for Army.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

In the USAF, a flight surgeon can be any medical specialty. Shoot, most of us are GMO's. When I was an intern and did a month of flight medicine at DGMC at Travis AFB, we had one GMO, a Family Medicine doc, and a psychiatrist who had done his GME at Harvard. You just need to be a licensed physician (passed all board exams and completed internship) and graduate from the Aerospace Medicine Primary course.

Regarding medical exams, to become a flight surgeon in the USAF, you do an IFC II (pilots do an IFC I). If you don't meet a medical standard, there is VERY HIGH chance you will get a waiver as there is a huge demand for flight docs...and to be quite honest, there is not really a need for you to have normal depth perception. You are not a pilot, you're the doc. The best thing to do is just schedule the IFC and see what happens...

And along with that, ask to see the regs. There a lot of novice flight docs that will completely mess up the physical and possibly misinterpret the medical standards!

 

[sprin001]

In the USAF, a flight surgeon can be any medical specialty. Shoot, most of us are GMO's. When I was an intern and did a month of flight medicine at DGMC at Travis AFB, we had one GMO, a Family Medicine doc, and a psychiatrist who had done his GME at Harvard. You just need to be a licensed physician (passed all board exams and completed internship) and graduate from the Aerospace Medicine Primary course.

Regarding medical exams, to become a flight surgeon in the USAF, you do an IFC II (pilots do an IFC I). If you don't meet a medical standard, there is VERY HIGH chance you will get a waiver as there is a huge demand for flight docs...and to be quite honest, there is not really a need for you to have normal depth perception. You are not a pilot, you're the doc. The best thing to do is just schedule the IFC and see what happens...

And along with that, ask to see the regs. There a lot of novice flight docs that will completely mess up the physical and possibly misinterpret the medical standards!

Mtndoc thanks for the reply. What you're saying is more like what I'm being told from the local unit. I'll keep updating as I go. Thanks again for all the input from everyone.

 

[sprin001]

After a long process, I swore in as a captain on the 22nd this month. Thanks everyone here for your input. I'll continue to update as I go. Looks like I'll likely go to RCOT late this year.

 

[Mtn Doc]

After a long process, I swore in as a captain on the 22nd this month. Thanks everyone here for your input. I'll continue to update as I go. Looks like I'll likely go to RCOT late this year.

Good luck! Enjoy the adventure.