Vet School= Financial Suicide???

[Kati26]

I suppose I'm looking a vet with eyes a little wider open then many undergraduate sophomores! I've seen the good, the bad, the ugly and it's still my life's dream. I've saved animals and lost them (aided in an emergency surgery on an equine for 2 1/2 hours and still had it go wrong and had to make the decision to put her to sleep). I have no illusions as to what this job holds. The vet I worked for in high school advised me to get my MD if I really wanted to do medicine for a multitude of reasons. I took his advice to heart and enrolled in pre-medicine.

I've found out I HATE hospitals and working around patients (experience acquired as a volunteer in a giant research hospital). My ADHD kicks in and I get overwhelmed by the people and the fact that your hands are tied at every turn. Put me in a vet clinic and I'm at my prime. I have an instinct for what to do. I can handle people just fine in that environment. I don't hesitate. I'm good with animals. I know how to do things and get them done.

I started looking at vet school again. I know I don't want to be an MD, despite the fact that I love medicine. My readings say that vet school is financial suicide. Am I crazy for not caring? The extra money as an MD won't buy the happiness that comes with doing something you're passionate about.

^ I suppose it's worth noting that I'm not completely idealistic about what I know. I understand that I know nothing in reality. What I do know is that I felt at home in a vet clinic whether it was helping neuter my cat, set a broken leg, giving a horse stitches, or comforting an animal as they were euthanized.

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[Gwenevre]

I'd suggest checking out the Estimated Costs of Veterinary school thread that's at the top of the forum. That's a good place to start to help understand the debt load that most vet students take on.
I'm glad though that you checked out human med too, because it is a more stable financial route than vet med. Vet med is do-able, but financially, there's a long trek ahead.

 

[Kati26]

I've looked at a lot of the estimated costs an such already. I've already picked my two schools which are financially doable (but a long trek, as you said). I mostly just want reassurance that I'm not crazy and not naive. I think I know what I'm doing, but that's what I thought when I volunteered for the hospital!

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

I suppose I'm looking a vet with eyes a little wider open then many undergraduate sophomores! I've seen the good, the bad, the ugly and it's still my life's dream. I've saved animals and lost them (aided in an emergency surgery on an equine for 2 1/2 hours and still had it go wrong and had to make the decision to put her to sleep). I have no illusions as to what this job holds. The vet I worked for in high school advised me to get my MD if I really wanted to do medicine for a multitude of reasons. I took his advice to heart and enrolled in pre-medicine.

I've found out I HATE hospitals and working around patients (experience acquired as a volunteer in a giant research hospital). My ADHD kicks in and I get overwhelmed by the people and the fact that your hands are tied at every turn. Put me in a vet clinic and I'm at my prime. I have an instinct for what to do. I can handle people just fine in that environment. I don't hesitate. I'm good with animals. I know how to do things and get them done.

I started looking at vet school again. I know I don't want to be an MD, despite the fact that I love medicine. My readings say that vet school is financial suicide. Am I crazy for not caring? The extra money as an MD won't buy the happiness that comes with doing something you're passionate about.

^ I suppose it's worth noting that I'm not completely idealistic about what I know. I understand that I know nothing in reality. What I do know is that I felt at home in a vet clinic whether it was helping neuter my cat, set a broken leg, giving a horse stitches, or comforting an animal as they were euthanized.

Honestly, this sounds a lot like vet med to me. The vast majority of your interactions are going to be with people (i.e. clients), not animals, and your hands are tied much more often than not due to finances or owner compliance.

 

[bbeventer]

Honestly, this sounds a lot like vet med to me. The vast majority of your interactions are going to be with people (i.e. clients), not animals, and your hands are tied much more often than not due to finances or owner compliance.

Like what WTF said, if anything in vet med your hands will be more tied.

 

[Kati26]

Honestly, this sounds a lot like vet med to me. The vast majority of your interactions are going to be with people (i.e. clients), not animals, and your hands are tied much more often than not due to finances or owner compliance.

My issue isn't hands tied in that sense. I can handle/accept that. By hands tied in the MD field I was referring to the way you fight with insurance companies and /they/ refuse very necessary aspects of care (I worked as a pharmacy tech for 2 years and you wouldn't believe how many times a doctor prescribed a much needed medication and insurance companies would refuse to comply.)

If I can tell an owner why 'Fluffy' needs x procedure and a) owner is dumb, or b) owner can't afford it, I can handle/accept that. In MD you don't even get that much. I've been here before as well. I once had to watch a perfectly treatable foal waste away because 'only the strong survive.' The next year I saved one with the exact same problem for a whooping $17. Was is sad and pointless? Of course. Did i tear myself up about it? No, life goes on. In the end, Fluffy's owner has the final day, and if it's not outright cruelty, there's nothing to be done. In human medicine, an insurance company with no education has the last say over even your most compliant patients.

Plus animals can't drug seek (i.e. Fluffy isn't going to lie through his teeth for hydrocodone. Which will then result in my losing my license/paying hefty fines)

I could go on, there are many things I hate about human medicine. People are NOT the problem. I can interact with people just fine. I'm not a misguided soul getting into vet med because 'I hate people.'

 

[Coquette22]

Plus animals can't drug seek (i.e. Fluffy isn't going to lie through his teeth for hydrocodone. Which will then result in my losing my license/paying hefty fines

No but Fluffy's owners can. "I spilled the bottle of pills", " Fluffy is still sore", "My partner accidentally threw away Fluffy's buprenorphine"....

 

[Kati26]

No but Fluffy's owners can. "I spilled the bottle of pills", " Fluffy is still sore", "My partner accidentally threw away Fluffy's buprenorphine"....

That is true

 

[lailanni]

Put me in a vet clinic and I'm at my prime. I have an instinct for what to do. I can handle people just fine in that environment. I don't hesitate. I'm good with animals. I know how to do things and get them done.

Maybe consider being a technician. They do A LOT more hands on work than a veterinarian. (I'm talking from the perspective of a busy small animal multi doctor practice). Most of a vet's time here would be spent talking to clients, interpreting lab results, returning calls and then some surgery. Most of the animal handling is with the techs and assistants. They're "doing things and getting them done". Vets are calling out the orders and ducking back into the exam room to keep their production high.

I should note things are different in a solo/small practice, mixed/LA practice, or an emergency practice. But for people who aren't fond of client interaction and enjoy hands on animal work I'll always suggest being a tech first.

It's also much, much less painful financially to start. The earning potential is capped but you're not financially sunk to start. And you can always decide to be a vet if you find that you enjoy tech work but want to take things a step further.

 

[Kati26]

Maybe consider being a technician. They do A LOT more hands on work than a veterinarian. (I'm talking from the perspective of a busy small animal multi doctor practice). Most of a vet's time here would be spent talking to clients, interpreting lab results, returning calls and then some surgery. Most of the animal handling is with the techs and assistants. They're "doing things and getting them done". Vets are calling out the orders and ducking back into the exam room to keep their production high.

I should note things are different in a solo/small practice, mixed/LA practice, or an emergency practice. But for people who aren't fond of client interaction and enjoy hands on animal work I'll always suggest being a tech first.

It's also much, much less painful financially to start. The earning potential is capped but you're not financially sunk to start. And you can always decide to be a vet if you find that you enjoy tech work but want to take things a step further.

I suppose I didn't mention the kind of vet work I'd like to do huh? I was shooting for a solo combined practice. I really love horses, so would love to do equine work. Small animal as well. In my area (where I grew up) vet techs just aren't really a thing. So in high school, that's essentially the kind of work I did for my vet.

I suppose it's misleading when you say you hate hospitals and really don't want to be an MD. I don't mind client interaction whatsoever. I don't mind working with people whatsoever. In fact it's part of the reason I want to do medicine in general. It's 100% I don't like the hospital environment. And if I become a private practice physician (read: GP or pediatrics) the pay gap isn't all that large according to my research. And I'd have to touch people. Which sounds weird, but I don't like it.

I suppose this conversation has taught me that I really do want to be a vet. You guys have mentioned all of my potential cons and I've rebutted them without getting irational (I hope I don't sound irrational, I've been sick the past few days and who knows what this fever has done to my logical processes).

 

[DVMDream]

I started looking at vet school again. I know I don't want to be an MD, despite the fact that I love medicine. My readings say that vet school is financial suicide. Am I crazy for not caring? The extra money as an MD won't buy the happiness that comes with doing something you're passionate about.

All kidding aside, when pre-vets tell me that they "don't care" about the money it sets off alarm bells. Sure you might "not care" right now thinking about it. But in 10 years when you are done with vet school and have been working for a few years you will want to buy a house, a car and heck maybe even some chocolate. The large student loan debt and low income (especially as an equine vet) don't make it feasible to obtain those few simple things that most people can obtain. That isn't to say that no one can do it or make it work, clearly people make it work. But seriously be more aware of what the financial responsibility is going to vet school. And really think about if you actually do "care", because chances are you do care to own a house, a car less than 10 years old or to maybe retire one day.

 

[Kati26]

All kidding aside, when pre-vets tell me that they "don't care" about the money it sets off alarm bells. Sure you might "not care" right now thinking about it. But in 10 years when you are done with vet school and have been working for a few years you will want to buy a house, a car and heck maybe even some chocolate. The large student loan debt and low income (especially as an equine vet) don't make it feasible to obtain those few simple things that most people can obtain. That isn't to say that no one can do it or make it work, clearly people make it work. But seriously be more aware of what the financial responsibility is going to vet school. And really think about if you actually do "care", because chances are you do care to own a house, a car less than 10 years old or to maybe retire one day.

I mean I'm doing my research and making pros and cons lists with financial being my number 1 con, so saying I don't care was probably just a bit of a stretch. It also helps that my fiancee is getting a full ride through law school and has connections to multiple law firms already. One has a starting salary of $150,000

 

[pinkpuppy9]

No but Fluffy's owners can. "I spilled the bottle of pills", " Fluffy is still sore", "My partner accidentally threw away Fluffy's buprenorphine"....

OMG.

This happened to me a few weeks ago! "My husband accidentally gave all of the buprenorphine you sent home at once, we need more! Fluffy is hurting!" "Well, ma'am, if that were the case, Fluffy would likely be dead right now. *Hangs up*"

Like DVMD said, you probably "don't care" because the financial aspect of veterinary school is not tangible to anyone until you are already weighed down by the debt. Being independently wealthy is always helpful.

 

[JosephKnechtDVM]

I mean I'm doing my research and making pros and cons lists with financial being my number 1 con, so saying I don't care was probably just a bit of a stretch. It also helps that my fiancee is getting a full ride through law school and has connections to multiple law firms already. One has a starting salary of $150,000

It seems obvious that both of you need to face some reality about higher education in that a JD and a DVM degree almost guarantee poverty for you both because of the debt and poor salaries in both fields. Even a "full ride" through law school may not end up with a job in the actual legal field unless you graduate from a top ten law school. Big law firms are not necessarily hiring everyone who even graduates from the top ten anymore. Having a life outside of work and the money to finance that is very important to your well-being(physical and mental) and future.

 

[Country_roads]

I suppose I'm looking a vet with eyes a little wider open then many undergraduate sophomores! I've seen the good, the bad, the ugly and it's still my life's dream. I've saved animals and lost them (aided in an emergency surgery on an equine for 2 1/2 hours and still had it go wrong and had to make the decision to put her to sleep). I have no illusions as to what this job holds. The vet I worked for in high school advised me to get my MD if I really wanted to do medicine for a multitude of reasons. I took his advice to heart and enrolled in pre-medicine.

I've found out I HATE hospitals and working around patients (experience acquired as a volunteer in a giant research hospital). My ADHD kicks in and I get overwhelmed by the people and the fact that your hands are tied at every turn. Put me in a vet clinic and I'm at my prime. I have an instinct for what to do. I can handle people just fine in that environment. I don't hesitate. I'm good with animals. I know how to do things and get them done.

I started looking at vet school again. I know I don't want to be an MD, despite the fact that I love medicine. My readings say that vet school is financial suicide. Am I crazy for not caring? The extra money as an MD won't buy the happiness that comes with doing something you're passionate about.

^ I suppose it's worth noting that I'm not completely idealistic about what I know. I understand that I know nothing in reality. What I do know is that I felt at home in a vet clinic whether it was helping neuter my cat, set a broken leg, giving a horse stitches, or comforting an animal as they were euthanized.

You just described pretty much everyone in this field. Generally speaking, we all feel like that about being in the vet clinic/being with animals/whatever. To put it bluntly, your story is hard from special (not trying to be mean there, just honest). We all still chose to do it.

Do not put any faith in your fiancee getting a starting job at 150k. I understand being bright-eyed and bushy-tailed about some things (I know I am sometimes), but try to reel it in. "Not caring about money" is preposterous. If your fiancee is going to have loans (even a small amount), that's going to hinder you guys too, however you'll have two incomes after graduating whereas plenty of vets only have one.

Let's not beat around the bush: How many of us have known that it's a huge financial burden? Pretty much everyone. How many did that discourage? Some, but not a whole lot.

Did you honestly think if you heard us say don't do it, that you'd change your mind?

 

[Cephal0pod]

There are definitely wiser financial decisions you can make than going to vet school. I don't think anyone could honestly recommend vet school as a "good" financial decision. Whether or not it is horrifically catastrophic "financial suicide", from what I have observed/read/learned from people around here, is a multifaceted question.

How much debt you are taking with you from undergrad, where you are going to vet school (ex: super pricey OOS school vs still pricey but less so IS school), what area of vet med you go into (note: salary to debt ratio is not great across the board, but more brutal in some areas of vet med than others), what the cost of living is where you go to vet school as well as take jobs eventually, etc, are all matters that can significantly influence how heavy your loan burden is and feels. Keep in mind that 200k+ in loans is no small chunk of change.

It is good that you are starting to investigate such things now, but as others have alluded to, remember that passion for the field alone doesn't pay bills or put food on your table.

It is a matter worthy of brutally honest consideration.

In the Estimated Costs of Veterinary School thread, there is a really helpful spreadsheet that Gemgrrrl put together of actual costs of loans for vet school tuition and fees. Super helpful, and a great reality check. Note that it does not take cost of living into account. Here's a link to the page that post is in:

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/estimated-costs-of-veterinary-school.849671/page-10

 

[lailanni]

Do not put any faith in your fiancee getting a starting job at 150k. I understand being bright-eyed and bushy-tailed about some things (I know I am sometimes), but try to reel it in. "Not caring about money" is preposterous. If your fiancee is going to have loans (even a small amount), that's going to hinder you guys too, however you'll have two incomes after graduating whereas plenty of vets only have one.

Ah, reminds me of that one quote "Maybe you have a trust fund. Maybe you'll have a wealthy spouse. But you never know when either one might run out."

Not being a downer, but I'd caution against thinking of spouse income as something reliable when planning your future. You may want to think in terms of what you are willing to do - the loans will be in your name.

 

[femmedusiecle]

Regardless of the path you choose, planning your future with your spouse's potential income in mind is a huge no no. As @lailanni so gracefully quoted, "Maybe you have a trust fund. Maybe you'll have a wealthy spouse. But you never know when either one might run out."

 

[Minnerbelle]

Not being a downer, but I'd caution against thinking of spouse income as something reliable when planning your future. You may want to think in terms of what you are willing to do - the loans will be in your name.

Yeah for serious. I was in two 4 year long relationships, one a chemical engineer and the other a computer engineer. Both were supposed to pay for my vet school and buy me a house. It wasn't even a speculative probable high spousal salary after graduation thingie. The latter one actually had a very well paying jobs in hand (though the former I can't imagine is doing too bad himself after getting the engineering degree from Berkeley and a graduate degree from caltech). Ugh was so close with that last one too... Broke up during the last 8 months of vet school.

So yup, don't count on it. Unless you marry now and sign a prenup with money that your fiancé isn't guaranteed to have.

 

[pinkpuppy9]

Ah, reminds me of that one quote "Maybe you have a trust fund. Maybe you'll have a wealthy spouse. But you never know when either one might run out."

Not being a downer, but I'd caution against thinking of spouse income as something reliable when planning your future. You may want to think in terms of what you are willing to do - the loans will be in your name.

I had something similar typed out in my post....but totally didn't have the guts to post it haha. My boyfriend has offered to help me with my loans down the road, and he already has a well-paying job. I nod my head and tell him I would never expect that of him. Partially because that's not expected of him, partially because I'm being realistic.

Connections are great. But until your fiancee has that job offer in his hand (With such a high salary), don't count on that money being there. Anything can happen in 4 years.

 

[Lissarae06]

One of my vet friends had a Facebook status that said something about her loan getting restructured leaving her with a smaller payment this month. She was excited that she could afford go grocery shopping. So yeah.