What can we expect in the future of dentistry?

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yangwang

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As times are tough because of our economy, i am beginning to see more and more posts about how dentists are struggling during these times. Even specialists are finding it hard to make a good living. This leads me to wonder whether paying $300,000 for a dental education is a financially sound choice. In recent years several new dental schools have also openned to add another several hundred graduates to the workforce every year, not to mention in major cities dentistry is already saturated. How is everything looking for a prospective dentist?

In my experience working in the field as an assistant, i have also noticed general dentists picking up a lot of work that are usually refered to specialists, is specializing in dentistry also becoming difficult to make a living?

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As times are tough because of our economy, i am beginning to see more and more posts about how dentists are struggling during these times. Even specialists are finding it hard to make a good living. This leads me to wonder whether paying $300,000 for a dental education is a financially sound choice. In recent years several new dental schools have also openned to add another several hundred graduates to the workforce every year, not to mention in major cities dentistry is already saturated. How is everything looking for a prospective dentist?

In my experience working in the field as an assistant, i have also noticed general dentists picking up a lot of work that are usually refered to specialists, is specializing in dentistry also becoming difficult to make a living?
Your view about the future of general dentistry and dental specialties is correct. I think it is foolish to choose a more expensive ivy school over a cheaper state school. The more loans (student, auto, business, home) you borrow, the longer it will take you to pay them off and to start enjoying the kind of lifestyle that dentists/doctors are supposed to have. You can’t really be your own boss when the banks still own you.

I work hard now and save as much as I can because I know that I will lose patients to the younger, more energetic competitors. My orthodontic business has already reached its peak. The only way for me to make more is to open a new satellite office.
 
As times are tough because of our economy, i am beginning to see more and more posts about how dentists are struggling during these times. Even specialists are finding it hard to make a good living. This leads me to wonder whether paying $300,000 for a dental education is a financially sound choice. In recent years several new dental schools have also openned to add another several hundred graduates to the workforce every year, not to mention in major cities dentistry is already saturated. How is everything looking for a prospective dentist?

In my experience working in the field as an assistant, i have also noticed general dentists picking up a lot of work that are usually refered to specialists, is specializing in dentistry also becoming difficult to make a living?

In as few words as possible: GO TO THE CHEAPER SCHOOL! Don't pay over a quarter of a million dollars for something that you can get for cheaper.
 
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Those dental therapist and "advance" dental therapist might add to the problem in the future. Schools are also saying "expect tuition to rise every year". Not so great.
 
In my experience working in the field as an assistant, i have also noticed general dentists picking up a lot of work that are usually refered to specialists, is specializing in dentistry also becoming difficult to make a living?

I think it depends on the type of specialist, the location, and the business model that is being followed. There are still plenty of smart ways for a specialist to make money. Opening an expensive office (high rent and lots of expensive brand new equipment) in a market saturated area is not a smart thing to do. Some dentists could get away with this 5 years ago, but it would be the death of the practice now.
 
Is the main issue that current dentists are having regarding income more to do with the current economy or competition? Also I reside in the Midwest where "rural" means your neighbor is a couple miles away. So when posts talk about money and opportunities lying in rural areas do they truly mean rural or just areas outside of the major cities (Chicago Dallas St Louis) or populated areas (i.e Southwest and Northeast)?
 
Is the main issue that current dentists are having regarding income more to do with the current economy or competition?
Both. Due to high unemployment rate, loss of medical/dental benefits and medicaid cuts, many patients elect to go with cheaper procedures….e.g. extractions instead of RCT and PFM, get one filling done at a time instead of all of the fillings done in one appointment. An increase in the number of new grad dentists (due to increase in class sizes at most dental schools and openings of new dental schools) in the last 10 years has worsened the dentists/patients ratio. To stay competitive, many dentists have to lower the treatment fees and accept medicaid.

Sorry for sounding so negative. Choosing dentistry was the best decision I ever made. I have a lot of friends who are physicians, pharmacists, and optometrists. In my opinion, we, dentists, have the best lifestyle. Like many Asian parents, I try to do my best to persuade my kids to follow my footstep.
 
So who is it that approves or denies the opening of new dental schools? Don't current dentists on the ADA board have a say in this? Opening of new schools and having larger class size has already started to saturate the market for pharmacists. I would hate to see the same happen to dentistry.
 
So who is it that approves or denies the opening of new dental schools? Don't current dentists on the ADA board have a say in this? Opening of new schools and having larger class size has already started to saturate the market for pharmacists. I would hate to see the same happen to dentistry.

Unfortunately it seems "organized dentistry" ie ADA and state organizations seem to be on the side of more schools. more schools equals more potential dues paying members. and don't forget most of the higher ups in these organizations are older, in the twilight of their careers, and often practice very little.
 
Unfortunately it seems "organized dentistry" ie ADA and state organizations seem to be on the side of more schools. more schools equals more potential dues paying members. and don't forget most of the higher ups in these organizations are older, in the twilight of their careers, and often practice very little.

Well, I guess they are not stopping the opening of more schools, but they are trying to prevent MLPs from entering the scene:

ADA paper disputes predicted dentist shortage
By DrBicuspid Staff

February 22, 2011 -- Workforce changes alone cannot overcome the many barriers that prevent too many Americans from attaining good oral health, according to a new paper published by the ADA, "Breaking Down Barriers to Oral Health for All Americans: The Role of Workforce."


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The authors warn that focusing on only this one barrier is "the policy equivalent of bailing a leaky boat." Future ADA papers will address other barriers, including the tattered public health safety net and the need to dramatically increase both disease prevention and financing, the organization announced.

The paper disputes the conventional wisdom of a coming shortage of dentists, projecting that later-than-predicted retirement, increased numbers of dental school applicants, and the opening of new dental schools will provide an adequate number of dentists through 2030.

Instead, the ADA argues that the challenges are the following:

Placing dentists -- whether in private practice or government-assisted clinics -- in more underserved areas that otherwise cannot support a full-time dental practice
Addressing issues that impede securing and keeping dental appointments, such as excessive paperwork, transportation, child care, and permission to take time off from work or school
"We know that the existing delivery model can accommodate millions more people, provided that we address administrative and financing barriers and workforce distribution," said ADA President Raymond Gist, DDS, in a press release. "Everyone deserves good oral health, and everyone deserves a dentist."

The ADA cites several examples in which states or municipalities have dramatically increased dental services provided to disadvantaged children through a combination of relatively minor funding increases and administrative reforms. These include the children's dental Medicaid programs in Tennessee, Alabama, and Michigan and the creation of a public-private dental clinic in Vermont.

The authors caution against a rush to create midlevel dental providers who, with as little as 18 months of training after high school, could be allowed to perform such irreversible/surgical procedures as extracting teeth. Such experiments, it argues, are likely to sap resources better directed toward proven methods for extending the availability of care from fully trained dentists.

It does, however, endorse such workforce innovations as the ADA's Community Dental Health Coordinator (CDHC) pilot project. CDHCs follow the medical community health worker model, providing health education and preventive services, identifying patients needing dental care, and helping those patients secure and keep appointments with fully trained dentists.
 
Well, I'm going to be a juggling dentist so I don't think I will be starving and broke like you jokers who can't juggle.
 
Do any older dentists have any infromation about the massive infusion of dentists after the vietnam war? How did that affect dentistry then?
 
Do any older dentists have any infromation about the massive infusion of dentists after the vietnam war? How did that affect dentistry then?

I'm pretty sure there aren't many of these on these forums as they would have to be able to run an "internet machine".
 
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My advice, do one of three things

1)go to a cheaper school if you can
2)get on the hsps scholarship or something of that nature(really the only sane option for a private school unless your going omfs)
3)forgo dentistry for medicine, there is a lot more opportunity in this field despite it being a more painful route.

I personally chose #3 even after starting a dental program. I hated the work and couldn't stomach the idea of having to plop down nearly 1million in debt(tuition+practice costs) before I could even hope to make the 200k+ salary. Psychiatry(what interests me now) is a very similar practice model except that start up costs are minimal, the work is more interesting(for me), and income potential is much higher. Best of all jobs starting in the 200k+ range are plentiful and residency placement is non-competitive.
 
My advice, do one of three things

1)go to a cheaper school if you can
2)get on the hsps scholarship or something of that nature(really the only sane option for a private school unless your going omfs)
3)forgo dentistry for medicine, there is a lot more opportunity in this field despite it being a more painful route.

I personally chose #3 even after starting a dental program. I hated the work and couldn't stomach the idea of having to plop down nearly 1million in debt(tuition+practice costs) before I could even hope to make the 200k+ salary. Psychiatry(what interests me now) is a very similar practice model except that start up costs are minimal, the work is more interesting(for me), and income potential is much higher. Best of all jobs starting in the 200k+ range are plentiful and residency placement is non-competitive.

3 year necro. Also, some of what you stated (mainly in the second paragraph) is wrong. The earning potential between the two professions is nearly identical and ultimately, its typically the dentist who limits his/her own earning potential based on where they chose to setup shop (SoCal vs anywhere else). 1 million dollar debt is more of a buzzword (phrase?) than a reality unless you plan on buying an office that produces over 2million dollars annually. Also, if you measure income by $/hr (specialists included), dentists fair better than good majority of their medical counterparts. Not to mention future medical compensation is questionable due to the meddling of our wonderful gov.
 
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As times are tough because of our economy, i am beginning to see more and more posts about how dentists are struggling during these times. Even specialists are finding it hard to make a good living. This leads me to wonder whether paying $300,000 for a dental education is a financially sound choice. In recent years several new dental schools have also openned to add another several hundred graduates to the workforce every year, not to mention in major cities dentistry is already saturated. How is everything looking for a prospective dentist?

In my experience working in the field as an assistant, i have also noticed general dentists picking up a lot of work that are usually refered to specialists, is specializing in dentistry also becoming difficult to make a living?

My impression is that things are going just fine right now, so I don't know what you're referring to when you say dentists are struggling.

But....
Yes, utilization has been falling for awhile, and has the potential to rapidly drop at some point in our careers.
Yes, at least one (well I guess now two including the one mentioned above) projection of the dental workforce numbers show demand being met and probably surpassed by the supply of new dentists. (Maybe I can post the study I read if I can find it again)
Yes, mid-levels are most likely going to be a thing. They will be trained at the community college level and typically have 2-4 years of post-high school training, and do mostly bread-and-butter dentistry.
And as an added bonus, at least one state will allow foreign-trained dentists to practice here without doing one of the advanced placement programs they historically had to do. I'm not sure if that's significant or not, but I guess we are going to find out.

So to give my take on your question about dentistry being worth it: Maybe. Probably if you just like the job, and were not doing it for the money. And in fact, I might even say doing it for the money isn't a bad idea. After all, even with a drastically reduced salary the job isn't so bad. It could still be looked at as a lower-stress, residency-free alternative to medicine, just with a pay-scale more similar to what pharmacy has. (Ever see a pharmacist begging for food on the street?)

If you were doing it for that $200K income though, I would be wary. I still think you'd pay off that $300K just fine, but how much you could get beyond that might be sort of disappointing.

As for specialists? I've never heard of a specialist really hurting. Maybe perio or prosth?
Then again, there were never midlevels before, and what does a generalist do when someone else does his restorative?
 
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