What is a good reason for fellowship?

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Guillemot

Guillemot

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I am considering fellowship. I think Id acquire some useful skills in fellowship, but dont feel my life would be incomplete without one. Would it be a mistake to do a fellowship without being really passionate about it? Would I be miserable for that year of intense study without that drive?
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In your situation where you don't feel an overwhelming urge to do a fellowship i would contact places where you will want to practice and see what they would expect/require from you. If they do ask you to do a fellowship then make sure you have some binding agreement to have a position when you get done.
 
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I would do a fellowship if that area is what you love doing or it is necessary/looked highly upon for the type of job you eventually want to work in. Outside of that there isn't much reason IMHO.
 
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Guillemot said:
I am considering fellowship. I think Id acquire some useful skills in fellowship, but dont feel my life would be incomplete without one. Would it be a mistake to do a fellowship without being really passionate about it? Would I be miserable for that year of intense study without that drive?
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If for some reason in 3-5 years that private practice gig isn't looking so good then a fellowship gives you options besides another crappy PP job. I have seen plenty of Cardiac anesthesia jobs on gaswork where a fellowship puts you in the front of the line especially compared to other new grads.
 
Guillemot said:
I am considering fellowship. I think Id acquire some useful skills in fellowship, but dont feel my life would be incomplete without one. Would it be a mistake to do a fellowship without being really passionate about it? Would I be miserable for that year of intense study without that drive?
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No, if you do it right after residency. But if you go back after working as an attending, you'd better be crazy about it.
 
A good reason for doing a fellowship? How about, you think you might enjoy practicing the subspeciality and want to get better at it. I cannot emphasize this enough. I think there is too much pressure on residents to do fellowships these days. If every resident does a fellowship, then guesss what? You will need to do a fellowship to get a job. I think this trend deflates the value of residency. (i.e. Residents do not look at their residency as definitive preparation for the practice of anesthesia. It is just a "stepping stone" to another rung on the education ladder.)
This should not be the case. True, a fellowship may help you get a job in some competitive markets and/or academics. If you find you are in this situation, consider it. However, most jobs should not require a fellowship. Remember, many of our skilled senior colleagues out in practice did not even do a four year residency.
 
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Masseter Spasm said:
This should not be the case. True, a fellowship may help you get a job in some competitive markets and/or academics. If you find you are in this situation, consider it. However, most jobs should not require a fellowship. Remember, many of our skilled senior colleagues out in practice did not even do a four year residency.
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You forget that 30-40 years ago there was a completely different threshold for who goes to the OR. Also the general population was much thinner and thus generally healthier. Yes, there were the smokers, but those tended to die relatively young.

Also, they were partners, not employees, and thus there was 40% less production pressure on them, even in an eat what you kill system. The oldies I met worked 7-3 five days a week, had 12-16 weeks of vacation/year, and made much more than my academic ass for less work. Their lives were much less stressful. People died regularly during surgeries, so there was less expectation for perfect anesthetic experiences. Etc. Just a different, more laid-back, world. Or, at least, one exactly as stressful as they wanted it to be, because they ran it.

Nowadays, people do a fellowship to reduce the amount of crap they have to deal with, as employees, or at least to make it routine. It's much easier to excel at a subspecialty than at general anesthesiology. The science has become much bigger, and the expectations have gone through the roof. And generalists are much less appreciated, because there are much more and better subspecialists around.
 
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Guillemot said:
I am considering fellowship. I think Id acquire some useful skills in fellowship, but dont feel my life would be incomplete without one. Would it be a mistake to do a fellowship without being really passionate about it? Would I be miserable for that year of intense study without that drive?
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Oh boy - why did you choose anesthesia?
That's the first question
 
Guillemot said:
How is going with your triple fellowship board certification? Are you glad you decided to practice in an underserved area?
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I am not in an underserved area :) but I am really happy that a resident is concerned with my well being.
After you pass .... your first board examination....maybe, you can respond back.
BTW - be concerned with the leads placement - my RT is really good at that , send me a private message and we can help/
100$ for him
Where did you get that? Underserved are LOL
I am questioning your IQ. You wanted some answers and now you are aggressive - you asked for help.
I"ll give you my 2 cents .
" I think Id acquire some useful skills in fellowship" - you really think or you are sure about that?
Like ..........what skills do you think?
Like TEE? Neonates? Pain? CCM US?
Please tell us
What do you know now more than a nurse?
Tell us.
Giving the md degree doesn't cut it. Show me SKILLS
Do you have any?
",but dont feel my life would be incomplete without one. "
Your life????
Did you just graduated the med school?
Do you have a psychologist?
Your life and the fellowship - write a book about the subject and let us know when you gonna have a screenplay.
"Would I be miserable for that year of intense study "
You sound miserable now - and in need of psychiatric help.
Get your sh... it together and raise up.
2win
 
dude... who the f is this guy...it's like Jet's bizarro a$$hole doppelganger
 
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vector2 said:
dude... who the f is this guy...it's like Jet's bizarro a$$hole doppelganger
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If you don't know him, you don't deserve the 7+ badge on this section. :p

I think he's changed his avatar, hence the confusion.
 
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Guillemot said:
I am considering fellowship. I think Id acquire some useful skills in fellowship, but dont feel my life would be incomplete without one. Would it be a mistake to do a fellowship without being really passionate about it? Would I be miserable for that year of intense study without that drive?
Click to expand...

The reasons to do fellowship are
1) a personal interest in the subspecialty
2) the belief that the additional skills/certification/networking will get you the job you want

You didn't tell us if you're interested in any subspecialty, and you didn't tell us what kind of job you want. You didn't tell us if you're miserable as a resident, and if so, why.

I don't think there's a useful answer to be given here.
 
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pgg said:
The reasons to do fellowship are
1) a personal interest in the subspecialty
2) the belief that the additional skills/certification/networking will get you the job you want

You didn't tell us if you're interested in any subspecialty, and you didn't tell us what kind of job you want. You didn't tell us if you're miserable as a resident, and if so, why.

I don't think there's a useful answer to be given here.
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Love it :)
 
Guillemot said:
Dont be so hard on 2win. She's probably just on her rag.
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I expected that - cercopithecus...
Against my theory that we are not descendants of the monkey.
And you call yourself a physician?
Do you know a guy named Pasteur, or Osler...
Does the names sound familiar?
If you don't get on the right path you'll be disgrace for us .....yes, the DOCTORS.
Do you speak Latin?
Aquila non capit muscas.
Google it.
I am done with you.
You can be saved.
2win
 
Are we experiencing an anesthesiologist in the throws of a manic episode?
 
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TimesNewRoman said:
Are we experiencing an anesthesiologist in the throws of a manic episode?
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Maybe he should change his name to 2winning

winning.jpg
 
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Guillemot said:
I am considering fellowship. I think Id acquire some useful skills in fellowship, but dont feel my life would be incomplete without one. Would it be a mistake to do a fellowship without being really passionate about it? Would I be miserable for that year of intense study without that drive?
Click to expand...

AS CRNAs become more prolific and doing the kinds of things generalists have traditionally done, a fellowship will allow you to set yourself apart from other anesthesiologists. I did pain, which is also under a different kind of threat, but atleast I have that with the GA skills
 
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IlDestriero said:
I don't know where @2win has been, but it's clear he's been making friends somewhere.
Welcome back!
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Glad to hear from you !
Academic combined with private, locums in my time off ;)
CCM- L list, FOAM, society of neurocritical care, sccm, trauma.org, ...
Biking and free weight lifts - wife and kid. Bourbon and cigars ( Oh where are you JET???)
It is crazy.
I am glad that I pissed off some people - I hope that I wake them up...
For a while,
2win
 
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2win said:
Glad to hear from you !
Academic combined with private, locums in my time off ;)
CCM- L list, FOAM, society of neurocritical care, sccm, trauma.org, ...
Biking and free weight lifts - wife and kid. Bourbon and cigars ( Oh where are you JET???)
It is crazy.
I am glad that I pissed off some people - I hope that I wake them up...
For a while,
2win
Click to expand...
What's up with the Bourbon? I thought you are a Scotch guy?
 
gasoflife said:
AS CRNAs become more prolific and doing the kinds of things generalists have traditionally done, a fellowship will allow you to set yourself apart from other anesthesiologists. I did pain, which is also under a different kind of threat, but atleast I have that with the GA skills
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Hey just had to ask but what different threat were you referring to when you said pain medicine had its own threat?
 
Also, I'm curious: in PP, can one really expect to be able to do hearts without a fellowship? I know it's said on this board all the time "you don't need a fellowship to do hearts/peds/OB/regional/whatever", but is this pretty common? Are cardiac anesthesiologists that hard to come by?
 
You don't need a fellowship to do healthy/moderately ill peds, but if you want to work at a children's hospital you certainly do. You don't need a fellowship to do "healthy" hearts either, but as more and more people are cards trained, a robust cardiac program will want to preferentially hire TEE certified fellowship trained anesthesiologists. As always, location will affect availability.
 
Nivens said:
Also, I'm curious: in PP, can one really expect to be able to do hearts without a fellowship? I know it's said on this board all the time "you don't need a fellowship to do hearts/peds/OB/regional/whatever", but is this pretty common? Are cardiac anesthesiologists that hard to come by?
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Do you need a fellowship to successfully complete most private practice hearts? No way. What I found on the interview trail, however, is some hospital administrations are beginning to mandate that their cardiac anesthesiologists are TEE certified, which is next to impossible these days if you haven't done a cardiac fellowship. A few of my colleagues I've spoken to have told me this is the trend going forward. Nobody really knows, but a good thing to keep in mind if you really want to do hearts going forward.
 
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Man o War said:
Do you need a fellowship to successfully complete most private practice hearts? No way. What I found on the interview trail, however, is some hospital administrations are beginning to mandate that their cardiac anesthesiologists are TEE certified, which is next to impossible these days if you haven't done a cardiac fellowship. A few of my colleagues I've spoken to have told me this is the trend going forward. Nobody really knows, but a good thing to keep in mind if you really want to do hearts going forward.
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The writing was on the wall in 2009 when the practice experience pathway to full TEE certification was closed.

Those who finished their core residency training after June 30, 2009 must have completed a "12 month clinical fellowship dedicated to the perioperative care of surgical patients with cardiovascular disease" ...

Maybe it's possible that the right CCM fellowship could fit that description? If so, that would seem to be the exception rather than the rule.
 
Looking for some insight.

CA2 on the east coast looking to get back to California. Interested in both peds and pain. Drastically different, I know, but interested.

Peds
Pros:enjoy the population, rewarding, more negotiating power potentially in terms of anesthesia jobs, mobility,
Cons: sometimes neonates freak me out, but you get used to that during fellowship,

Pain:
Pros: dig the procedures, don't mind the office, own your patients, appears to be better hours, no in house call, potential to make more money
Cons: office headaches, decreasing reimbursements, some patients can be a drag - (happens in anesthesia too, although in pain you're seeing them more frequently)

I'm originally from California and would like to practice there when all said and done. I think a CA fellowship would open up some doors for some job prospects.

Any advice?

Thanks
 
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pgg said:
The writing was on the wall in 2009 when the practice experience pathway to full TEE certification was closed.

Those who finished their core residency training after June 30, 2009 must have completed a "12 month clinical fellowship dedicated to the perioperative care of surgical patients with cardiovascular disease" ...

Maybe it's possible that the right CCM fellowship could fit that description? If so, that would seem to be the exception rather than the rule.
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How many patients go to the surgical ICU postop without cardiovascular issues?
 
pgg said:
How many CCM fellowships are 12 months in a SICU? Time spent in a MICU isn't perioperative care of surgical patients.
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Touché - haven't looked at CCM fellowships closely.
Maybe they are counting the rare MICU to OR. Or saying the fellowship is dedicated, not the per month.
 
pgg said:
How many CCM fellowships are 12 months in a SICU? Time spent in a MICU isn't perioperative care of surgical patients.
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I think that depends... SICU at our program is mostly trauma/transplant/some ortho. CCM fellows do 2 months there, then spend time on different "teams". Red team is Cardiothoracic, white team covers neurosurg and some ortho, blue team is more MICU.
 
For current residents, a good reason to do a fellowship is so that you will be able to get a job when you are done.
 
turnupthegas said:
Thoughts on regional as a fellowship?
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I don't see how a regional fellowship will help for most PP jobs if you have adequate exposure in your residency and are competent in all of the common blocks. In fact, I think residency has an obligation to make you competent in all the common blocks.
So ask yourself if you really are competent or not.
 
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