Why is it so hard to quit?

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7175pank

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I really need some perspectives on this.

I haven't been on here for a while and to be honest I'm pretty confident I've pooched myself forever with any chance of gaining admission into a North American med school (eating tons of crow after I bragged about getting 2/5 A's on my last semester which were then followed by the later postings of: B-, B-, C+ which all tallys up to cGPA 3.07, sGPA 2.97 on 153 credits +pity+) I was pretty convinced that giving up would be the right thing to do because 1) I didn't want to lose my fiance over it (although I'm sure med school wouldn't do wonders for the relationship either) and 2) I don't have any family to support me so doing something outrageous like doing an SMP or going to the Caribbean or some other country (residency considerations aside). Before anyone mentions DO, I loathe the idea of learning OMM and loathe the idea of being represented by the AOA moreso.

All of that being mentioned, forgoing dreams of medicine sounds like the wisest course of action, obviously, but I can't help missing it and doing stupid things in my spare time like reading up on pathology or pharmacology (although the latter is for my job, Mental Health Worker, essentially an unqualified RN). If I didn't need somebody else's permission I would gladly study medicine independently (and in a sick sort of way, I kind of am) to be able to practice.

I always knew going into this that there is a very important saying: 'If you can see yourself doing anything else besides medicine, then do it' but the more I try to forget it about and see myself doing something else it seems like the more I'm thinking to myself... ****! I can't!

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I really need some perspectives on this.

I haven't been on here for a while and to be honest I'm pretty confident I've pooched myself forever with any chance of gaining admission into a North American med school (eating tons of crow after I bragged about getting 2/5 A's on my last semester which were then followed by the later postings of: B-, B-, C+ which all tallys up to cGPA 3.07, sGPA 2.97 on 153 credits +pity+) I was pretty convinced that giving up would be the right thing to do because 1) I didn't want to lose my fiance over it (although I'm sure med school wouldn't do wonders for the relationship either) and 2) I don't have any family to support me so doing something outrageous like doing an SMP or going to the Caribbean or some other country (residency considerations aside). Before anyone mentions DO, I loathe the idea of learning OMM and loathe the idea of being represented by the AOA moreso.

All of that being mentioned, forgoing dreams of medicine sounds like the wisest course of action, obviously, but I can't help missing it and doing stupid things in my spare time like reading up on pathology or pharmacology (although the latter is for my job, Mental Health Worker, essentially an unqualified RN). If I didn't need somebody else's permission I would gladly study medicine independently (and in a sick sort of way, I kind of am) to be able to practice.

I always knew going into this that there is a very important saying: 'If you can see yourself doing anything else besides medicine, then do it' but the more I try to forget it about and see myself doing something else it seems like the more I'm thinking to myself... ****! I can't!

You're never getting into a US MD school. Ever.
 
You're never getting into a US MD school. Ever.

You are absolutely correct. I know this. Yet I keep wanting to go. It's like I have some sort of horrible disease which is caused by a combination of a bloated ego and being pathetically enamored with the science of medicine and patient interaction.

I was wondering if there was anybody else who went through a similar experience or could offer anything insightful into this. As per title, I'm trying to see if anyone has any insights into how to let my stupid, and likely self-destructive, obsession die.

I'm at the point where I actually read pathology books for recreation for ****'s sake.
 
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I am in a similar situation as you. My GPA is a tiny bit higher with fewer credits so a little more repairable. I just transferred to a 4 yr university from CC. I was making straight A's at CC and my first semester at uni was straight B's. Granted they were all somewhat difficult classes (Orgo 1, Cell Molec, Microbio, and Calc 2), it was still a difficult pill to swallow and a huge wake-up call to get my act together.

That being said, I don't give a damn if the initials after my name are MD or DO and frankly, if you can't live without practicing medicine, neither should you. If I don't make it to med school, I will settle for PA school and even nursing as a last resort. My future is in medicine in one form or another.

I don't mean to sound harsh but suffering through OMM is a small price to pay to live what you believe to be your calling. It's not like you will be required to use it in practice. Otherwise it sounds like all you care about are the initials MD and not the field of medicine itself.

Good luck to you whatever happens.
 
I don't mean to sound harsh...

Not at all. I prefer the honesty and I think all of the aforementioned points from other posters are valid and appreciate them.

My problem lies in that 1) I know my former goal (getting into allopathic medicine) is unrealistic, at this point impossible, and 2) It's just really hard for me to let go of that. This may not be the most appropriate place to post about this, considering how most people come here looking for advice just to get in not advice on how to give up, but I couldn't really think of anywhere else to ask.

Like I said, looking for perspective.
 
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I was thinking being harsh might help make it easier to quit.

There's nothing wrong with DO. Whatever you have against it is probably completely invalid.
 
LOL, in no way is your dream of getting into medical school "impossible." Yes, it will be difficult to get into an MD program but not impossible if you're willing to put the time in.
 
LOL, in no way is your dream of getting into medical school "impossible." Yes, it will be difficult to get into an MD program but not impossible if you're willing to put the time in.

By 'time in' do you mean one ex-fiance and a 6 year PhD 'time in'? The fact that I would find the latter tempting makes me somewhat sad to realize what a nerd I am. -_-
 
I was thinking being harsh might help make it easier to quit.

There's nothing wrong with DO. Whatever you have against it is probably completely invalid.

I appreciate the effort and I agree. Most of the DOs I know of are perfectly competent physicians. Nothing wrong with DO but It's just not for me.
 
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Reading this makes me feel like you have a bad attitude towards things. You either want to be a doctor and will do everything in your power to become one, or you look at alternatives. As someone in her 30's I can tell you that I don't plan on giving up, and it has not been a smooth road for me at all. I left a formal post-bac and went back to finish my pre-reqs at a community college. I'm at a point where I am ready and willing to continue to work hard and try my best and if I don't get accepted to MD or DO schools I will look into PA, and even nursing as a way to help people (and maybe re-apply again in a few years since that's my ultimate goal). You need to make a plan or two for yourself...
 
LOL, in no way is your dream of getting into medical school "impossible." Yes, it will be difficult to get into an MD program but not impossible if you're willing to put the time in.
I agree. There is always a way. It might be a little harder for you, but never impossible. If you want it bad enough you gonna make it. A fellow SDNer got into a MD school with a 2.65 sGPA. She is Caucasian, and non-traditional (I think she is about 40). She just did a SMP, and proved that she can tackle med school classes.
Don't despair my dear friend. The fact that you cannot let go, means that you want it bad enough. Do a SMP, kill the MCAT, and get into a MD school. As simple as that. If someone tells you it's impossible, smile and keep pushing. Don't let go. Don't let go. Don't let go.
Best of luck to you! :thumbup:
 
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I was wondering if there was anybody else who went through a similar experience or could offer anything insightful into this. As per title, I'm trying to see if anyone has any insights into how to let my stupid, and likely self-destructive, obsession die.
You're the mental health worker. If you don't know how to deal with your obsession, what makes you think any of us do? :p

All kidding aside, my guess is that you're more in love with the idea of being a physician than you are actually wanting to be a physician. Because, let's face it, mental health workers are not nearly as appreciated and valued as they should be. Unfortunately, that goes for psychiatrists and psychologists just as much as it does for nurses. You won't find what you're seeking in medical school, my friend.

As for letting dreams go, well, sadly we don't get to stay children forever. Eventually, you grow up and move on to other things that are more realistic. My childhood dream was to be an astronaut. I still feel wistful every time I read or see anything about space travel. But I have this motion sickness issue that would make it impossible, even forgetting about my eyesight being too poor. Still, if I ever manage to scrounge up enough money before I die to pay the Russians for a ride into low orbit, I'd consider it money well spent.
 
All kidding aside, my guess is that you're more in love with the idea of being a physician than you are actually wanting to be a physician.

... I think that's exactly what I couldn't piece together... Thank you. :)

To be honest though, I don't do what I do to feel 'valued'. A lot of the people I work with, no one really cares about and many of them will never amount to anything. One of the biggest highs I get out doing what I do is whenever I see a slight glimmer of shine in someone's eye that shows the better person they can be and everything that we try to bring out in spite of the debilitation.

The other end of it too is that I genuinely enjoy using knowledge that few people may ever fully understand or appreciate to help people. Like you said with the astronaut thing (PhD in physics I assume?) every time I go to work and do something where I feel clinically competent, such as piecing together that a client has been using rock (crack) again which is probably what's been causing his akathisia (cross rxn with antipsychotics but it was his behavior that gave him away really), when I caught a client's ectopic heart beat (didn't know wtf it was and it scared the Hell out of me) or understanding what's happening on a chemical basis when I give someone 10 mg of olanzapine, it gives me a wicked high.
 
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You're the mental health worker. If you don't know how to deal with your obsession, what makes you think any of us do? :p

All kidding aside, my guess is that you're more in love with the idea of being a physician than you are actually wanting to be a physician. Because, let's face it, mental health workers are not nearly as appreciated and valued as they should be. Unfortunately, that goes for psychiatrists and psychologists just as much as it does for nurses. You won't find what you're seeking in medical school, my friend.

As for letting dreams go, well, sadly we don't get to stay children forever. Eventually, you grow up and move on to other things that are more realistic. My childhood dream was to be an astronaut. I still feel wistful every time I read or see anything about space travel. But I have this motion sickness issue that would make it impossible, even forgetting about my eyesight being too poor. Still, if I ever manage to scrounge up enough money before I die to pay the Russians for a ride into low orbit, I'd consider it money well spent.

That is what it sounds like to me as well. If it was the work your wanted, something as small (in the big picture) as OMM would not be stopping you. It seems you are looking for a level of prestige and appreciation. If you look at the doctor's board on here, they feel unappreciated. I don't know if becoming a doctor would make you happy.
 
What about Physicians Assistant or NP? They fully understand the complexity of medicine, and see patients. And they consult with doctors all the time. They are not DOs and do the same things doctors do.
 
That is what it sounds like to me as well. If it was the work your wanted, something as small (in the big picture) as OMM would not be stopping you. It seems you are looking for a level of prestige and appreciation. If you look at the doctor's board on here, they feel unappreciated. I don't know if becoming a doctor would make you happy.

I wish I could rule out the bold but I can't. I'm right there with everyone that that is a ****ty and absolutely deplorable reason to want to become a physician. I don't consciously *think* I do but people, self-included, have this nasty of habit of thinking of themselves as more noble then they actually are. Considering my reluctance to go DO, NP, PA it may very well just be that. The reasons that spring into my head for not wanting to do the other three are more practice restriction (NP, PA) and residency options (DO) related than 'status' related, but it could be that I'm just an arrogant prick who hates the idea of being limited. Who knows?

I'm not the type who's interested in making friends or having people *like* him. Is it nice? Sure but it's a ****ty raison d'etre.
 
What about Physicians Assistant or NP? They fully understand the complexity of medicine, and see patients. And they consult with doctors all the time. They are not DOs and do the same things doctors do.

I was considering that for a while. One thing that scared me about that was that I have heard that there are a few PAs (I'm not an RN) who regretted not going to med school, many who say they would even bite the bullet and go DO, and I'm terrified that I would fall into that exact same trap. I'm sure that the work would demystify many of the aspects of practicing medicine but I get a bad yearning to get my ass back into the library and study just to be able to try again just from reading up on someone's mystery hip pain turning out to be an old pelvic contusion I don't know what it would be like if I was actively performing the active leg work for a physician, handling basic cases anyway. Still knowing that there are still a few levels I couldn't handle in spite of my eagerness to learn about it, I think that's what gets me.
 
Nothing wrong with DO but It's just not for me.

You know what, I'd rather be an MD than a DO too, but if I got to the point where it was a choice between DO or not being a physician at all, there's NO QUESTION that of course I would go DO. The fact that you'd rather NOT be a physician at all than be a DO tells me that you're not in it for the right reasons. DOs and MDs do the exact same job. If the letters behind your name are really more important that the role you'd be fulfilling, you need to GET OVER IT already!!!
 
I was considering that for a while. One thing that scared me about that was that I have heard that there are a few PAs (I'm not an RN) who regretted not going to med school, many who say they would even bite the bullet and go DO, and I'm terrified that I would fall into that exact same trap. I'm sure that the work would demystify many of the aspects of practicing medicine but I get a bad yearning to get my ass back into the library and study just to be able to try again just from reading up on someone's mystery hip pain turning out to be an old pelvic contusion I don't know what it would be like if I was actively performing the active leg work for a physician, handling basic cases anyway. Still knowing that there are still a few levels I couldn't handle in spite of my eagerness to learn about it, I think that's what gets me.

That is not what I am saying about PAs and NPs at all.
 
Advice on giving up? Meh, quit worrying so much. You're idealizing the profession of medicine. It's ok and all, but the idea of being a doctor will always be better than actually being a doctor. I mean, in our heads, we can make medicine out to be whatever we want it to be; during shadowing we unknowingly filter out things to fit our perception of being a physician. Who knows, maybe not going to med school is the best thing that could have happened to you. There are a lot of noble ways of helping people, and I personally doubt that being a physician is the most bang-for-your-buck profession in terms of actually helping people the most.

Mental health workers and social workers are an amazing part of the healthcare team. So much of the pathology I see in the ED has social problems as the route cause. Physicians don't have the time nor training to solve many of these complex social problems and are merely treating the symptoms. People on the mental health team actually have a chance to fix the patient. So cheer up! You're in a field already that deserves the respect of everybody, including MD's and DO's; don't let any doctor make you feel less than important than you really are.
 
Cut off your hands and go be a DO. Then you won't even have to do OMM
 
So cheer up! You're in a field already that deserves the respect of everybody, including MD's and DO's; don't let any doctor make you feel less than important than you really are.

My God there are some pleasant folk on this board. Thanks for the kind words. :)

(I do feel it only fair to mention we have a Hell of a long way to go with mental health though on many, many fronts :/)

I never felt 'inferior' to DOs/MDs and I have yet to meet one who was ever condescending or anyone who was condescending to my work (in fact, the worst I usually get is a weird look followed by the question 'how do you do it and do the people you work with see dragons?')

It's a freaking cool job. The coolest? Maybe not. Is the path one has to take to get there worth it? Debatable, pending on who you are. But I still think it is bloody awesome. It's just a bitch to process after you feel like you put so much of yourself into it.
 
Before anyone mentions DO, I loathe the idea of learning OMM and loathe the idea of being represented by the AOA moreso.

OMM isn't that bad.

I was aiming for MD, too, simply because I want to work in academia and research. But sometimes life hands you lemons and you make lemonade.
 
PA schools are also very competative.

I am in the camp of "I will do ANYTHING, doesnt matter what or which way, to become a doctor, so I have nothing to offer you. Sorry.
 
I saw your post and had to add my input here because I was in a similar situation. I was a chiropractor for over 10 years and finally decided to take a chance and go for it. My cGPA and sGPA was terrible, below your gpa by more than a bit. In chiro school, a 70% was a D so my GPA there was bad as well. But I didn't let that deter me as I was a great doctor already and I knew in my heart that I wanted to be a physician more than anything. I applied to several postbach programs and was (somehow) accepted to 2 of them. I chose the one that was in a medical school, anxious to prove that I could do well.

The first trimester I got my butt kicked in biochem but didn't let it get me down. I re-evaluated my studying techniques and the following 2 trimesters did great. But at the end of it, I ended up wit a 3.24. I've been told to give up and that I wouldn't make it into a US med school, that I was making a mistake and that I was an idiot for trying at my age (40's). Hell, even my parents tell me that they don't see why I don't go back to chiropractic and that I'll probably fail to get in.

But here's the difference between us from what I take from your posting, I don't care what anyone else says....I'm going to do what ever it takes to make it into medical school. I'm doing a second year at the same school to get a masters degree and I WILL get straight A's. On the off chance I don't, I won't focus on it and I'll change what ever I did wrong to improve the next semester. YOU can do the same thing and you CAN get into a US medical school...IF that's what you truly desire.

And this DO vs MD thing is just a stupid premedical/medical student ideal. Believe it or not, the same kind of in-fighting happens with pre-DC/ current DC students. I've worked in 2 multidisciplinary clinics and have dealt with hundreds of providers of all different types. 99% of the people don't care if you are a MD or a DO. Sure, there are a few idiots out there that are against DOs, but they are just like the racist or sexist idiots in society. As for your argument about residency, If you went DO and would like a MD residency you would just take the MD boards. I've talked to residency directors at diff MD programs and they gave me that advice by the way. Just take a long hard look at why you are adverse to DO school and objectively evaluate your opinions.

My advice, don't listen to anyone on here or at home IF you honestly want to go to medical school. Get into a postbach masters or cert program if you can or take postbach classes if not. Then figure out what you're doing wrong studying and get those A's!
Best of luck to you in what ever you decide to do.
 
I'm doing a second year at the same school to get a masters degree and I WILL get straight A's. On the off chance I don't, I won't focus on it and I'll change what ever I did wrong to improve the next semester. YOU can do the same thing and you CAN get into a US medical school...IF that's what you truly desire.

Thanks for that.

I highlighted this section because I feel as though it is very applicable to my own conflict. I first got my interest into becoming a physician when I was around 20 and just before my final semester at undergrad (I graduated early). I've been wanting to finally take my prereqs and start applying for over a year before I could finally get into an institution and get working on it. I was delayed due to familial and economic reasons. The point being that when I finally DID get a chance to start working towards that I had the exact same attitude as you did 'I want this way too badly. There is not way I can possibly fail!'. I even did get into HES for their premed program but because I was young and very, very stupid my fiance wanted to move to NYC to get a career in fashion going. I knew there was CUNY Hunter and Columbia out there so I figured I could do that AND support myself and her working... I never really took the time to appreciate how ******ed that was until now. We get an apartment, I struggle like a mofo to get work out there (couldn't even get a job as a ****ing grocery bagger), blow my savings and the rest is history. Thankfully, I am a dual citizen of the USA and Canada and when **** really hit the fan I was able to move to Vancouver Canada where I currently reside and actually have a decent paying job amongst other things. (and if anyone is wondering Canadian Med schools are more competitive to get into than American schools unfortunately...)

I got my feet on the ground and I was finally able to start. Again, I had the same attitude 'I want this way too badly. There is not way I can possibly fail!' But sure enough... Did a bunch of stupid things such as: work full-time hours, while volunteering, while involving myself in psych research while taking a full time course load of science courses at UBC. It got to the point where I would work graveyard shifts before coming to class because I wanted to make sure that I would be able to pay tuition outright and not add to my debt load (in hind sight, ****ing foolish). I even went to a Chem Lab final the following day from 2-5 after working a graveyard shift and attending an entire day of lectures (Amazingly, I got an A- though). Get my grades back from semester 1, I thought that spending all my spare time time doing nothing but studying (always reading on the buses during commutes for instance) FOR SURE I got As: B+, B+, B, B. ****! I then thought maybe that I was working too much so I made a deliberate effort to take a 2 week work hiatus during finals week next time but lo and behold: A-, A-, B-, B-, C+. Double ****... And that is why I have been toying with the idea of giving up. If I'm performing this poorly now, what guarantee is there that I'll perform well on the USMLE to get into a decent ACGME residency? What guarentee is there that I'll get a 3.8+ if I go into an SMP (the thought of the latter almost makes me lol)? I'd like to think that I have all the time in the world that if I wanted this badly enough (I'm not going to lie, I still totally do) that I'd find a way but I can't shake the feeling that pursuing it would require either putting people who mean the most to me through too much and that I'd ultimately loose them. Or even worse, I'd lose them, still **** up and have nothing.
 
Then cry me an f-ing river. You know what your options are, so if med school is out, sad day for you. This isn't live journal website to cry around. Seriously, we all deal with enough in our own lives to have to hear your whining. Stop wasting people's time.
 
OP, what are you going to do?

(I didn't read the posts in this thread, give me the TL;DR answer)
 
I think a BIG thing to consider: do you really want your fiancee more than being an MD?

Yeah, it sounds harsh, but being single has soo many opportunities.
 
I think a BIG thing to consider: do you really want your fiancee more than being an MD?

Yeah, it sounds harsh, but being single has soo many opportunities.

The sad thing is that the thought had crossed my mind before but it never stuck around for very long. I can't reconcile telling someone you love them, and meaning it, with leaving them because you loved a job that much.

To your question Edwards, you're not missing much and I don't have a bloody clue. It could run the gambit from working for a while, getting my crap togther and just making peace with my lot in life and moving on to saying '**** it' and trying for an SMP/postbacc anyway.

p.s. My apologies to any SDNers who wasted their time reading this thread. I promise I will not waste your time by making another thread you actively choose to read and post in. Honest Injun.
 
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Also just wanted to add I do appreciate the insights and well wishes ladies and fellas. :thumbup:
 
The sad thing is that the thought had crossed my mind before but it never stuck around for very long. I can't reconcile telling someone you love them, and meaning it, with leaving them because you loved a job that much.

Seems no worse than them not supporting your dreams.
 
The sad thing is that the thought had crossed my mind before but it never stuck around for very long. I can't reconcile telling someone you love them, and meaning it, with leaving them because you loved a job that much.

To your question Edwards, you're not missing much and I don't have a bloody clue. It could run the gambit from working for a while, getting my crap togther and just making peace with my lot in life and moving on to saying '**** it' and trying for an SMP/postbacc anyway.

p.s. My apologies to any SDNers who wasted their time reading this thread. I promise I will not waste your time by making another thread you actively choose to read and post in. Honest Injun.
Guess what? We had to read it to know it was a load of bs, so yes, your fault and please don't make threads again. Thanks.
 
Guess what? We had to read it to know it was a load of bs, so yes, your fault and please don't make threads again. Thanks.
+1. OP, if you really want to practice medicine without a license please just save us the time by contacting the AOA or AMA directly it'll make the process of tracking you down much easier (practicing medicine without a license is illegal in this country and no President will be able to bail you out). Also, don't even for a moment consider going NP or PA, your stats are too low for those programs as well without significant experience to back your application. Thanks.
 
Still posting on a thread that is an admitted waste of time for you guys? Y'all are just way too kewl for me fellas.

:laugh:
 
Still posting on a thread that is an admitted waste of time for you guys? Y'all are just way too kewl for me fellas.

:laugh:
Actually we're saving the others that will be reading your post. We already know that you're a lost cause from all appearances.
 
Actually we're saving the others that will be reading your post. We already know that you're a lost cause from all appearances.

Would you like a medal?

I'm also surprised that you so eagerly discount the possible value that people could get from getting a real understanding of how difficult getting into med school is and that it isn't something that shouldn't be approached without understanding all of the hard work and potential risk involved.

And yes, you're correct, I view myself as lost cause as well. Why do you think I posted a thread asking strangers for advice on how to move on?
 
Would you like a medal?

I'm also surprised that you so eagerly discount the possible value that people could get from getting a real understanding of how difficult getting into med school is and that it isn't something that shouldn't be approached without understanding all of the hard work and potential risk involved.

And yes, you're correct, I view myself as lost cause as well. Why do you think I posted a thread asking strangers for advice on how to move on?
Actually, you underestimate who I am, where I've been, etc and no I'm not whining about it, giving irrational conclusions or anything else. I know my dreams, I know what it will take to get there, and in the end I am a healthcare professional that's already spent years in healthcare where I'm wondering if you've even held a real job yet.

Your options are delineated by you, not anyone else but in the end all you have to blame is yourself, not the system, not the DO who saves your family member's life or any other DO that you happen to "accidentally" be the patient of. Not to mention your closed mind has killed your dreams, not anyone else.
 
Your options are delineated by you, not anyone else but in the end all you have to blame is yourself, not the system, not the DO who saves your family member's life or any other DO that you happen to "accidentally" be the patient of. Not to mention your closed mind has killed your dreams, not anyone else.

Jesus tap dancing Christ laddie... I swear to God, post anything on SDN admitting defeat and a self-flaw and everyone thinks you're after a pity party.

I have been typing situations where I have gotten myself into this situation by making a bunch of decisions that I made. Me. Not Jebus. Not Satan. Not my nor pa. Not my fiance. Me. Goodness, all I've been saying is that I clearly should give up because it just isn't realistic and the route for which it would take for me to get there would put a strain on people close to me which I don't think is fair just because I want to be a physician that bloody badly.

I know I 'could' do it, if it took me 5, 10, 15 years, whatever and if I didn't care about dragging other people through the constant absence and stress I would. But ,like I said, I don't think it's fair to give something like that up for the sake of a career.
 
Jesus tap dancing Christ laddie... I swear to God, post anything on SDN admitting defeat and a self-flaw and everyone thinks you're after a pity party.

I have been typing situations where I have gotten myself into this situation by making a bunch of decisions that I made. Me. Not Jebus. Not Satan. Not my nor pa. Not my fiance. Me. Goodness, all I've been saying is that I clearly should give up because it just isn't realistic and the route for which it would take for me to get there would put a strain on people close to me which I don't think is fair just because I want to be a physician that bloody badly.

I know I 'could' do it, if it took me 5, 10, 15 years, whatever and if I didn't care about dragging other people through the constant absence and stress I would. But ,like I said, I don't think it's fair to give something like that up for the sake of a career.
Had you only admitted defeat, you might have received a warmer reception. However, you moved to bash DOs in your seceding statements. This is where two DO Attendings as well as some fellow non-trad students tried to save you from your reckless self in ending your potential career as a physician before you even started.

However, you clearly ignored them (DO Attendings) because you feel them to be inferior in a dream that you will not succeed in. For many of us, especially anyone that has spent time in the healthcare field, we know that becoming a physician and effecting change is not a mere career but a lifestyle. We also know that DO is not an inferior physician, but an equal to an MD (I know it's hard to believe for many pre-meds, but this is where it ends in today's healthcare system).

You do not want to be a physician that "bloody badly", you are enthralled with a dream as one Attending already stated. It truly is sad that you cannot even consider options, i.e. applying to DO programs, still succeeding in your career, even being an EM physician (which will allow way more time with your family than any other "career") without spending more years in an SMP for that dream of an MD title but you've written yourself off. Since you're so enthralled with becoming a physician, good luck with being happy in any other "career".
 
Had you only admitted defeat, you might have received a warmer reception. However, you moved to bash DOs in your seceding statements. This is where two DO Attendings as well as some fellow non-trad students tried to save you from your reckless self in ending your potential career as a physician before you even started.

However, you clearly ignored them (DO Attendings) because you feel them to be inferior in a dream that you will not succeed in. For many of us, especially anyone that has spent time in the healthcare field, we know that becoming a physician and effecting change is not a mere career but a lifestyle. We also know that DO is not an inferior physician, but an equal to an MD (I know it's hard to believe for many pre-meds, but this is where it ends in today's healthcare system).

You do not want to be a physician that "bloody badly", you are enthralled with a dream as one Attending already stated. It truly is sad that you cannot even consider options, i.e. applying to DO programs, still succeeding in your career, even being an EM physician (which will allow way more time with your family than any other "career") without spending more years in an SMP for that dream of an MD title but you've written yourself off. Since you're so enthralled with becoming a physician, good luck with being happy in any other "career".
Agreed. In addition to what you said, if he had really just wanted to say he had been defeated, he would have faded graciously. Instead, he took shots at people and showed that his true interests are not medicine but the glorified ideal that he wants to live in. I consider him a weak person. He's such a weak person that even with an MD from say UCSD he'd feel it wasn't as good as an MD from Johns Hopkins. But in the end I'm happy because we won't be seeing someone like him in medicine. We don't need that.

One last thought, isn't this guy way too similar to some clown we had a few months ago that was depressed for being south asian and not getting into an MD school and he was a total failure? I wonder if it is the same person.
 
Had you only admitted defeat, you might have received a warmer reception. However, you moved to bash DOs in your seceding statements. This is where two DO Attendings as well as some fellow non-trad students tried to save you from your reckless self in ending your potential career as a physician before you even started.

However, you clearly ignored them (DO Attendings) because you feel them to be inferior in a dream that you will not succeed in. For many of us, especially anyone that has spent time in the healthcare field, we know that becoming a physician and effecting change is not a mere career but a lifestyle. We also know that DO is not an inferior physician, but an equal to an MD (I know it's hard to believe for many pre-meds, but this is where it ends in today's healthcare system).

You do not want to be a physician that "bloody badly", you are enthralled with a dream as one Attending already stated. It truly is sad that you cannot even consider options, i.e. applying to DO programs, still succeeding in your career, even being an EM physician (which will allow way more time with your family than any other "career") without spending more years in an SMP for that dream of an MD title but you've written yourself off. Since you're so enthralled with becoming a physician, good luck with being happy in any other "career".

Lots of legit criticism and argument in there.

Bare in mind I did say the following earlier: "... Most of the DOs I know of are perfectly competent physicians. Nothing wrong with DO but It's just not for me." I don't view a DO as 'beneath me' and I think that's just rediculous and arrogant (All DOs and most DOs to be have all ready accomplished a lot more than I have). I simply don't believe that it is a good match for reasons aforementioned and several others that I won't go into because they aren't relevant to this discussion. They may not be very good or rational reasons to those posting here but it's how I view it, no offence meant (unless you find the majority of these posts grating massochistic nonsense in which case I can't help ya).

You also have to bare in mind that *if* I ever did get into an allo school it wouldn't be anything 'prestigious' (for whatever value that has) and that wouldn't bother me. I brought up the whole prestige and ego thing because med school is big ****ing decision. If I was going to go through this I know there would be heavy sacrifices to get there I loathe the idea of doing it for any of the wrong reasons and there is a lot of emotion to set straight. If life circumstances would have permitted, and it wouldn't prove financial/career suicide, I would have even gone Carribean/Europe/Oz even if I'm viewed as 'lesser than'. If I do that then I'm sure the majority of DOs would beat me out in terms of 'prestiage' for residency which wouldn't bother me so long as I could get into a good one.

I'll just add this: I am sorry if you interpreted my comments to meant that I view DOs as lesser doctors. Maybe I should have been more clear about that but it was not my intention and I'm sorry if you construed it that way. Best of luck to you.
 
I'm going to take a vacation from this thread. For a post that essentally amonted to an emotional dump you guys did offer some good insights and I appreciate them along with the well wishes. I only hope this thread was at least *somewhat* conducive to this board.

p.s. TriagePreMed don't ever change man. The world needs more of your kind of medicine. :laugh:
 
You can claim you are all for DO being equal and what not, but the passive language implies something different. You have yet to establish any concrete reason as to why Osteopathic medicine is a real problem. You vaguely allude to residency options and to say you dislike OMM.

Well, residency options are limited because you failed to get into an MD school. Even if you get into an MD school, you can have limited options if you fail to have the right grades and recommendations for it. What would you do if that happens? Not complete any residency because you might be limited on fellowships or something? The rational approach is that if you want to be a physician, you would much rather face your problems and even have to "settle" for a residency that's not your top choice, the same way people "settle" to go to Yale because they didn't get into Harvard and so on. Therefore, limit in residency options is not even an argument based on any rationality.

Your argument about OMM is clearly an exaggeration. Hate it? Good. Also probably >50% of DO students. The day you're done with your boards you don't need to do it ever again. Don't like the AOA? Good, join the AMA. You aren't forced to be a part of the AOA.

Lets not get into how you don't want to do an international MD program or SMP as a compromise.

Do you understand why people simply don't believe that you're a genuine person? It all points to a lust for prestige which is a by-product of problems with your self-esteem. You seek for things to make you happy instead of being happy you can do things. There are millions of people out there that would gladly give away a kidney to have the life of a doctor, even Caribbean. You keep torturing yourself because you couldn't get into an MD school and you enjoy that much more than pushing on against problems. That's why I have a hard time believing you'd be happy even if you got into University of Washington or another great college because you'd be moping over not being at Harvard. Your problem is really your self-esteem. You need to work on that.

Lots of legit criticism and argument in there.

Bare in mind I did say the following earlier: "... Most of the DOs I know of are perfectly competent physicians. Nothing wrong with DO but It's just not for me." I don't view a DO as 'beneath me' and I think that's just rediculous and arrogant (All DOs and most DOs to be have all ready accomplished a lot more than I have). I simply don't believe that it is a good match for reasons aforementioned and several others that I won't go into because they aren't relevant to this discussion. They may not be very good or rational reasons to those posting here but it's how I view it, no offence meant (unless you find the majority of these posts grating massochistic nonsense in which case I can't help ya).

You also have to bare in mind that *if* I ever did get into an allo school it wouldn't be anything 'prestigious' (for whatever value that has) and that wouldn't bother me. I brought up the whole prestige and ego thing because med school is big ****ing decision. If I was going to go through this I know there would be heavy sacrifices to get there I loathe the idea of doing it for any of the wrong reasons and there is a lot of emotion to set straight. If life circumstances would have permitted, and it wouldn't prove financial/career suicide, I would have even gone Carribean/Europe/Oz even if I'm viewed as 'lesser than'. If I do that then I'm sure the majority of DOs would beat me out in terms of 'prestiage' for residency which wouldn't bother me so long as I could get into a good one.

I'll just add this: I am sorry if you interpreted my comments to meant that I view DOs as lesser doctors. Maybe I should have been more clear about that but it was not my intention and I'm sorry if you construed it that way. Best of luck to you.
 
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I really need some perspectives on this.

I haven't been on here for a while and to be honest I'm pretty confident I've pooched myself forever with any chance of gaining admission into a North American med school (eating tons of crow after I bragged about getting 2/5 A's on my last semester which were then followed by the later postings of: B-, B-, C+ which all tallys up to cGPA 3.07, sGPA 2.97 on 153 credits +pity+) I was pretty convinced that giving up would be the right thing to do because 1) I didn't want to lose my fiance over it (although I'm sure med school wouldn't do wonders for the relationship either) and 2) I don't have any family to support me so doing something outrageous like doing an SMP or going to the Caribbean or some other country (residency considerations aside). Before anyone mentions DO, I loathe the idea of learning OMM and loathe the idea of being represented by the AOA moreso.

All of that being mentioned, forgoing dreams of medicine sounds like the wisest course of action, obviously, but I can't help missing it and doing stupid things in my spare time like reading up on pathology or pharmacology (although the latter is for my job, Mental Health Worker, essentially an unqualified RN). If I didn't need somebody else's permission I would gladly study medicine independently (and in a sick sort of way, I kind of am) to be able to practice.

I always knew going into this that there is a very important saying: 'If you can see yourself doing anything else besides medicine, then do it' but the more I try to forget it about and see myself doing something else it seems like the more I'm thinking to myself... ****! I can't!
"Never, never, never, never give up" (Winston Churchill).

You can get into medical school if you want it badly enough.

PM me if you are open to mentoring.
 
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