What's a "good" salary nowadays?

[initialize]

Advertisement - Members don't see this ad

Probably a dumb question based on various factors, I know.

But it seems like everyone and their mom who's an attending seems to be making $400,000+ nowadays.

I'll be an attending in a couple years, but with my specialty I'll most likely be making in the upper 200s, low 300s if I'm lucky.

Too late now obviously, but I'm wondering if I should have sucked it up and went into a specialty I hated like surgery just for the extra income lol.

For those making $400,000+, now depressed/ worse off would you be if your salary went down to $300,000?

 

[mmmcdowe]

I think you really have to keep in context the significant difference a few years of training can make. For example, graduating at 30 and getting an attending salary of 300k versus 35 and getting a higher one may it first seem like a no-brainer for the bigger salary. However, you're wealth multiplier at 30 for invested dollars is almost double what it is at 35. You may not feel as rich making 300k at 40 as if you were making $600,000, but give it a few years and you will see you will easily have more than a million invested in the bank by 40 and then if you wanted you could spend every dollar you made and you'd still be set for retirement. There is always the opportunity for career advancement. You will be board certified by the time the neurosurgeon graduates and you can be negotiating your second job at a much higher salary while also having hundreds of thousands of dollars invested and loans paid off.

The short answer is ultimately what we describe as feeling rich comes from spending money not saving money. I don't feel particularly rich on a day-to-day basis because half of my take-home pay disappears into investments. I would feel a lot richer spending that money on a luxury cruise every month but I wouldn't actually be richer. You can live by all objective standards a very high quality of life in most locations on a 300k salary and still invest a large chunk, but you won't feel rich. I could definitely live my same quality of life on 300k, I just wouldn't be investing as much as I do currently.

 

[initialize]

I think you really have to keep in context the significant difference a few years of training can make. For example, graduating at 30 and getting an attending salary of 300k versus 35 and getting a higher one may it first seem like a no-brainer for the bigger salary. However, you're wealth multiplier at 30 for invested dollars is almost double what it is at 35. You may not feel as rich making 300k at 40 as if you were making $600,000, but give it a few years and you will see you will easily have more than a million invested in the bank by 40 and then if you wanted you could spend every dollar you made and you'd still be set for retirement. There is always the opportunity for career advancement. You will be board certified by the time the neurosurgeon graduates and you can be negotiating your second job at a much higher salary while also having hundreds of thousands of dollars invested and loans paid off.

The short answer is ultimately what we describe as feeling rich comes from spending money not saving money. I don't feel particularly rich on a day-to-day basis because half of my take-home pay disappears into investments. I would feel a lot richer spending that money on a luxury cruise every month but I wouldn't actually be richer. You can live by all objective standards a very high quality of life in most locations on a 300k salary and still invest a large chunk, but you won't feel rich. I could definitely live my same quality of life on 300k, I just wouldn't be investing as much as I do currently.

True! But what's depressing is that I'm already in my mid 30s (did some stuff before med school) so I'll already be a geezer before I feel well-off 😂

 

[mmmcdowe]

True! But what's depressing is that I'm already in my mid 30s (did some stuff before med school) so I'll already be a geezer before I feel well-off 😂

It's all relative to your own story my friend.

 

[thesauce]

2 to 300 is an astronomical amount of money. Be halfway diligent with it and you will have more than enough.

 

[Splenda88]

True! But what's depressing is that I'm already in my mid 30s (did some stuff before med school) so I'll already be a geezer before I feel well-off 😂

You will be fine. Started med school in my mid 30s.

4 yrs out of residency and I have net worth (NW) of 1.5M+ already (started with a NW of ~400k because my spouse 401k when she was working and home appreciation). My salaries have been in 400s.

300k is a good salary despite what you see in SDN. The key is not to go crazy as far as spending when you start making attending salary.

 

[finalpsychyear]

it's not really that 250-300 is low or anything. Circumstances matter specifically debt and phase of life. If your an attending 30-32, single, even with some debt its amazing time to invest/save and progress in your career and you have the energy to do it. But if your allmost 40 like you will be at attendhood, you likely may have kids or are married, which makes things more costly overall.

With the right gameplan you will be fine ultimately but it will be more difficult to say retire or go part time if you want a sub 60 yo retirement lifestyle.

I think you know this its why tech even with lower salaries basically get to earn 6 fig and compound for a decade before we really start to make our salaries. Now if you delay that another decade like in your situation well that's always going to be tougher just based on math.

 

[lobstar]

I wouldn't suck it up for something I hated, but yeah more money is generally better. Sooner to retirement, financial freedom, can take more risks negotiating and spending on hobbies or whatever. I increased my salary by moving and leaving academics and that was for sure worth it.

 

[Pablo Sanchez]

Something else to consider is that the higher your income, the more of it goes to taxes. The difference in $300k to $400k you are paying more in taxes and taking less home than the difference from $50k to $150k.

Add in the fact that you’ll finish residency earlier than some of those longer, higher paying residencies, and that makes the difference less noticeable, too. Invest that money heavily in those earlier years of practicing and you’ll be more than well off.

 

[NRAI2001]

It took me a while of attending money working 6 days a week and making great money to realize that new doctors, residents and students think too much about maximizing salary. I ve never met a doctor who retired and stayed retired. All older doctors I know continue to work atleast 2 days a week into their 70s and 80s even having more than enough money to retire. We all worry about retirement BUT very few of us actually retire. We spend a lot of our youth focusing on retirement to end up not even wanting it later in life.

If you cant find your job enjoyable 2-3 days week then its not a good fit for you. SOOO basically most of us can retire right now by going to a 3 day a week +/- a day now and live the rest of your life retired right NOW!!!

 

[Mman]

It took me a while of attending money working 6 days a week and making great money to realize that new doctors, residents and students think too much about maximizing salary. I ve never met a doctor who retired and stayed retired. All older doctors I know continue to work atleast 2 days a week into their 70s and 80s even having more than enough money to retire. We all worry about retirement BUT very few of us actually retire. We spend a lot of our youth focusing on retirement to end up not even wanting it later in life.

If you cant find your job enjoyable 2-3 days week then its not a good fit for you. SOOO basically most of us can retire right now by going to a 3 day a week +/- a day now and live the rest of your life retired right NOW!!!

give me a break, working 3 days a week isn't "retired". It's working part time. I know docs that worked full time taking overnight in house call in their 70s and I know docs that retired in their 50s and never set foot in a hospital ever again. There is no chance that the majority of docs are working at least 2 days a week in their 70s and 80s.

 

[mmmcdowe]

Financial Independence Recreational Employment

 

[finalpsychyear]

Financial Independence Recreational Employment

Financial Independence Recreational Enjoyment.

-fixed. Bonus points if ur able to sub or early 50s.

 

[NRAI2001]

give me a break, working 3 days a week isn't "retired". It's working part time. I know docs that worked full time taking overnight in house call in their 70s and I know docs that retired in their 50s and never set foot in a hospital ever again. There is no chance that the majority of docs are working at least 2 days a week in their 70s and 80s.

I m saying working 3 days a week right now you can save yourself the realization that even when you retire you ll be back to work after 2-3 years. Like I said I have never met a doctor that retired. All of them were working 2 days a week in their 70s. Maybe if you re a surgeon and unable to preform the manual aspects of it you maybe pushed into retirement.

The most miserable doctors I know are the ones in their 40s and just purely looking to when they can retire... later to realize that 2-3 years into retirement they return to work. What a waste of their early years.

 

[finalpsychyear]

I m saying working 3 days a week right now you can save yourself the realization that even when you retire you ll be back to work after 2-3 years. Like I said I have never met a doctor that retired. All of them were working 2 days a week in their 70s. Maybe if you re a surgeon and unable to preform the manual aspects of it you maybe pushed into retirement.

The most miserable doctors I know are the ones in their 40s and just purely looking to when they can retire... later to realize that 2-3 years into retirement they return to work. What a waste of their early years.

This has not been my friend circle experience. One retired at 45 the other at 48 and both have a lot of hobbies and big social groups. They did quite well in their careers. 3 years in they wish they had done it sooner but it wasn't financially feasible. This type of personality i have only seen in first gen docs whose identity was medicine so yeah those guys are still working if they are able to and dont know what to do without work. Gen x, millenials def with the shift into lifestyle balance i just dont see this trend.

 

[Mman]

I m saying working 3 days a week right now you can save yourself the realization that even when you retire you ll be back to work after 2-3 years. Like I said I have never met a doctor that retired. All of them were working 2 days a week in their 70s.

I know dozens of doctors that have retired and never worked a single shift afterwards. I get paid very well, but when I have more money than I could ever possibly need, there are plenty of things I enjoy doing more than going to work and dealing with the ever increasing burden of admin that is put upon us each year. I mean I like my job, but I love things outside my job even more.

 

[NRAI2001]

I know dozens of doctors that have retired and never worked a single shift afterwards. I get paid very well, but when I have more money than I could ever possibly need, there are plenty of things I enjoy doing more than going to work and dealing with the ever increasing burden of admin that is put upon us each year. I mean I like my job, but I love things outside my job even more.

I ve known doctors in that position as well. They take frequent vacations and have many hobbies and great social lives. They CHOOSE to work 2 days a week or so because they love the field of medicine and their colleagues. They all took 2-3 years off at the start of their retirement and returned.

 

[emergentmd]

It took me a while of attending money working 6 days a week and making great money to realize that new doctors, residents and students think too much about maximizing salary. I ve never met a doctor who retired and stayed retired. All older doctors I know continue to work atleast 2 days a week into their 70s and 80s even having more than enough money to retire. We all worry about retirement BUT very few of us actually retire. We spend a lot of our youth focusing on retirement to end up not even wanting it later in life.

If you cant find your job enjoyable 2-3 days week then its not a good fit for you. SOOO basically most of us can retire right now by going to a 3 day a week +/- a day now and live the rest of your life retired right NOW

I am at FIRE in my early 50's where my work income does very little to my NW. Over the past 3 years, I have continued to cut down until I feel the correct balance. I went from 5 dys/month to 3 dys, and now down to 2 days a month to stay clinically competent. Still on those days that I am scheduled to work, part of me still wants to play golf. I think I will stick with 2 dys a month for the next few years and see how I feel.

I play golf 2-3 times a week and keep myself busy the rest of the time with teenagers. I do not want to look back when I am in my 60's/70's regretting that I didn't take advantage of my health and somewhat youthful age.

I doubt I will ever work more than 2 dys/month.

Working 2-3 dys/week is not my idea of being "retired"

 

[Mman]

I ve known doctors in that position as well. They take frequent vacations and have many hobbies and great social lives. They CHOOSE to work 2 days a week or so because they love the field of medicine and their colleagues. They all took 2-3 years off at the start of their retirement and returned.

sure. But to say you don't know anybody that stayed retired? I have former colleagues that have been retired nearly 20 years. And their previous colleagues that have been retired for almost 40 years. None of them came back to work a single day. They occasionally swing by the hospital to say hi to friends and tell stories and catch up. They don't come back to take care of patients.