how much do you care about the MD title as compared to the DO title

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nonsciencemajor

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For me, I simply cant live with the idea of being a DO.... I would rather become an FMG than a DO... but thankfully this whole thing doesnt apply to me as I am becoming a US MD😀😀😀.... i wanted to know how many of you on SDN would never attend a DO school simply because of the DO title after your name even if it meant becoming till age 50 to gain admission into a US MD school
 
Wow. Why wouldn't you ever want to be a DO? I'm thinking that you'll probably change your mind once you actually work with them. I know many excellent DO students and doctors and many of them I feel are much better well rounded people in general than other MDs/MD students I also know.

As for me, the reason I didn't apply DO this cycle, as well as MD, is that I didn't want to take someone else's spot who was truly passionate about being a DO (and yes...they do exist). I felt that wouldn't be fair when my first choice would be MD and I didn't want DO to be my "backup" when it was someone else's first choice.


By the way, this topic may put you right back on probation lol...good job.
 
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I don't. And since you don't even have to "worry" about it why would you make this trolling thread. Good one.
 
Ummm....none? At all? My family has a long history of preferring osteopathic doctors. Every single doctor I saw as a kid was a DO and I was born in an osteopathic hospital. Believe it or not, a DO is not just an MD wannabe who couldn't manage to become a "real doctor" - there are plenty of people who truly feel that it is a better way to practice medicine. While my family is proud that I've gotten into medical school, they've told me they're disappointed I'm not going to attend an osteopathic school.
 
because i am just trying to guage how many people just want to become doctors as compared to being MD's
 
because i am just trying to guage how many people just want to become doctors as compared to being MD's

Even though I'm going to an MD school in the fall...I sure hope that anyone treating me for anything down the line wanted to become a DOCTOR, not just want the title of MD. If you just want the "MD", you might as well attend med school, skip residency and just put the title on your mailbox.
 
because i am just trying to guage how many people just want to become doctors as compared to being MD's

What is so special about MD's? Both DO's and MD's learn the same material.

I really don't understand why these issues still exist? If anything I think people generate a sort of superiority-complex, wanting to always feel like they are 'better' than someone else.

For example, an arrogant US MD student may "look down" on an Osteopathic student for the simple fact that they may not be as competitive to gain entrance into. As another example, an arrogant US DO student may "look down" on a Caribbean student for the simple fact that they are not as competitive to get into.

I think only a truly delusioned individual would start trying to debate the merits of the quality of a medical education. If anything all these biases are derived from a self-centered attitude of one-up-manship.
 
...........isn't this the like 10th thread from the OP about how "MD > DO" and "non-science major > science major"?

Just wondering.
 
Hm. I think I'm starting to get a good handle on what to expect from your posts now. 🙄
 
Class of 2014 here too.

1) DOs can practice pretty much anywhere these days. There was a thread about this a long time ago.

2) I hope you're not in my class, you're portraying yourself as an elitist winbag.

3) You'll be working with DOs at some point in your career, do you expect to act this professionally around them?

Sounds like you got into medicine for the right reasons: MD. I think a white coat says something more important... like "Physician" or "I care about my patients" or "I'm dedicated to being a well balanced person who can effectively communicate with others without belittling them with my knowledge"

Think about these things...
 
Class of 2014 here too.

1) DOs can practice pretty much anywhere these days. There was a thread about this a long time ago.

2) I hope you're not in my class, you're portraying yourself as an elitist winbag.

3) You'll be working with DOs at some point in your career, do you expect to act this professionally around them?

Sounds like you got into medicine for the right reasons: MD. I think a white coat says something more important... like "Physician" or "I care about my patients" or "I'm dedicated to being a well balanced person who can effectively communicate with others without belittling them with my knowledge"

Think about these things...
no🙁
 
I believe that D.O. schools spend quality time learning to exicise uneccesary and unproductive pretense from the practice of medicine. ; )
 
For me, I simply cant live with the idea of being a DO.... I would rather become an FMG than a DO... but thankfully this whole thing doesnt apply to me as I am becoming a US MD😀😀😀.... i wanted to know how many of you on SDN would never attend a DO school simply because of the DO title after your name even if it meant becoming till age 50 to gain admission into a US MD school

gtfo.gif
 
Class of 2014 here too.

1) DOs can practice pretty much anywhere these days. There was a thread about this a long time ago.

2) I hope you're not in my class, you're portraying yourself as an elitist winbag.

3) You'll be working with DOs at some point in your career, do you expect to act this professionally around them?
1) not sure, but I'll take your word... :shrug:

2) sorry, he is... 🙁

3) Karma will make his boss a FMG. And his boss's boss a DO. 😀
 
MD allows you to practice around the world.
DO . not.

I love this argument. Are there any actual numbers showing how many US trained MDs go off and actually practice (not doctors w/o boarders or the like) around the world? My guess is that the number is extremely low and most of those would be people who aren't from the US to begin with.
 
1) not sure, but I'll take your word... :shrug:

2) sorry, he is... 🙁

3) Karma will make his boss a FMG. And his boss's boss a DO. 😀
I disagree. Karma will put him in a position where either he or someone he cares about has their lives saved by a DO. That'll knock him off his high horse, I hope.
 
I love this argument. Are there any actual numbers showing how many US trained MDs go off and actually practice (not doctors w/o boarders or the like) around the world? My guess is that the number is extremely low and most of those would be people who aren't from the US to begin with.

For realz. Why does this matter?
 
I love this argument. Are there any actual numbers showing how many US trained MDs go off and actually practice (not doctors w/o boarders or the like) around the world? My guess is that the number is extremely low and most of those would be people who aren't from the US to begin with.

Nope.


I guess you do not like keeping your options open.
It matters to me though. 👍
 
I disagree. Karma will put him in a position where either he or someone he cares about has their lives saved by a DO. That'll knock him off his high horse, I hope.
agreed. 😀
 
I feel like the only people who care about the DO/MD thing are pre-meds who have worked their tail off and dont want to feel as thought they wont be given their due by being a DO...which isnt true- youre becoming a doctor because you want to save lives and make an impact, collegues will respect your based on how good a doctor you are, regardless of initials... if anything board scores and the subsequent residency you do really mean more than what school you attended...just my opinion
 
I feel like the only people who care about the DO/MD thing are pre-meds who have worked their tail off and dont want to feel as thought they wont be given their due by being a DO...which isnt true- youre becoming a doctor because you want to save lives and make an impact, collegues will respect your based on how good a doctor you are, regardless of initials... if anything board scores and the subsequent residency you do really mean more than what school you attended...just my opinion

applause.gif


I've had four surgeries in my life. Two of them were performed by DOs. One was an FMG (*Shock and horror!*). They were all fantastic doctors (even if I wasn't happy about needed one of the surgeries) and I have healed beautifully from all of them. Also, every DO I've ever worked with has been just as good as the MDs (better in a few cases).

NO ONE CARES!

P.S. The 4th surgery was my wisdom teeth, so that one doesn't even factor into this debate.
 
There are legitimate reasons to prefer MD to DO, but title isn't really one of them.

Edit: Vice versa is true also.
 
For me, I simply cant live with the idea of being a DO.... I would rather become an FMG than a DO... but thankfully this whole thing doesnt apply to me as I am becoming a US MD😀😀😀.... i wanted to know how many of you on SDN would never attend a DO school simply because of the DO title after your name even if it meant becoming till age 50 to gain admission into a US MD school

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9kpTvm6CYA[/YOUTUBE]
 
i really despise thoughts that DOs are somehow less of a physician than MDs. we all learn (mostly) the same material and take board exams. i didn't apply DO because i didn't have a LOR from a DO physician (a usual requirement). i worked in a clinic that had several DOs, one of whom had been chief resident at columbia nyc in a competitive specialty. the DOs were highly respected, by colleagues and patients...end of story.
 
For realz. Why does this matter?

B/C with every MD/DO debate, someone throws out the international practice rights issue. Yes, MD lets you practice in more countries than DO, but it still doesn't allow you to practice every where. Unless there are a significant number of people flocking to practice outside the US, it is a non issue for most applicants.

Nope.


I guess you do not like keeping your options open.
It matters to me though. 👍

I'm guessing that it matters to you b/c, if I'm not mistaken, you are Canadian (dang Canadians coming to the US for healthcare and med school😉).

As far as keeping my options open, I don't quite following you there. If you mean being able to practice outside the US, I have absolutely no, zero, none, zip, zilch desire to practice in a foreign country. If you are referring to DO's not getting into ultra competitive residencies or specialties, once again, not really interested in those either (aside from the lifestyle of a dermatologist 😀). I have little interest in academics and little desire to do research (if I want to do research in school, I'd take a summer off btwn 1st and 2nd year and work in the lab I'm working in now). This is why I have no problem going the DO route. If you want to do all of those things, by all means go MD. However, this is off topic from the OP who seems only interested in MD for the title.
 
yet another this kind of thread........

a physician is a physician, no matter what title you have, it all serves the same purpose.
no one should be superior or inferior of the other.

but guess what, reality is cruel. As long as MCAT and GPA exist, and schools keep using numbers to evaluate people, this phenomenon is unavoidable, unfortunately....

If one day MCAT and GPA do not exist anymore, and MD and DO school have the same matriculant stats, then this kind of thread will disappear and never be brought up again.
 
I have been researching osteopathic and allopathic medicine since I read about DO degrees on here - before, I never even knew about DO degrees! Now that I have a good understanding of the two types, I'm not bothered about the initials - I do just want to be a doctor, and in the US the end result is the same no matter the degree.

I think that I would prefer learning osteopathic medicine, but I think this would limit my job opportunites in the future. You see I am from the UK and I plan on moving back after I finish my education in the US. If I was planning to practice in the US I would definitely apply to both DO and MD schools. However, the DO and MD degree are not equal in the UK as they are in the US. US trained DO's are allowed to practice in the UK as physicians, but I'm worried that it would be looked down upon as UK trained osteopaths are not "real doctors". It seems that the prejudice against DO's will negatively affect my future job opportunites and why would I voluntarily put myself through that when I can just get an MD degree?

I still need to do more research on the topic and some of my info about DO's in the UK may not be accurate, but it's the impression I have gotten so far. I have not made a final decision, these are just my thoughts. If anyone does have ligitimate info about US trained DO's practicing in the UK I would appreciate you letting me know about it, thanks 🙂
 
B/C with every MD/DO debate, someone throws out the international practice rights issue. Yes, MD lets you practice in more countries than DO, but it still doesn't allow you to practice every where. Unless there are a significant number of people flocking to practice outside the US, it is a non issue for most applicants.



I'm guessing that it matters to you b/c, if I'm not mistaken, you are Canadian (dang Canadians coming to the US for healthcare and med school😉).

As far as keeping my options open, I don't quite following you there. If you mean being able to practice outside the US, I have absolutely no, zero, none, zip, zilch desire to practice in a foreign country. If you are referring to DO's not getting into ultra competitive residencies or specialties, once again, not really interested in those either (aside from the lifestyle of a dermatologist 😀). I have little interest in academics and little desire to do research (if I want to do research in school, I'd take a summer off btwn 1st and 2nd year and work in the lab I'm working in now). This is why I have no problem going the DO route. If you want to do all of those things, by all means go MD. However, this is off topic from the OP who seems only interested in MD for the title.

I'm sorry for invading the US 😛


haha.. I dont dislike DOs in anyway.
I was really not suggesting anything other than the fact that DO does not get as much leeway in practicing outside of the US.
Whether we are interested in doing so or not... totally new story =)

Yes, I agree it is off topic from OP.
 
I'm sorry for invading the US 😛


haha.. I dont dislike DOs in anyway.
I was really not suggesting anything other than the fact that DO does not get as much leeway in practicing outside of the US.
Whether we are interested in doing so or not... totally new story =)

Yes, I agree it is off topic from OP.

Here is the full list of countries. It's cited from AOA's International Licensure Summary.

http://www.valuemd.com/osteopathic-...s-where-us-trained-osteopaths-recognized.html

I won't deny that it might not be as easy to practice outside the US as a DO, but to say one cannot do it, is not true at all.

If anyone does have ligitimate info about US trained DO's practicing in the UK I would appreciate you letting me know about it, thanks 🙂

It appears that DOs have a tough time practicing in the UK based on that Licensure Summary

Great Britain
Year of Last Request: 1998
Scope of Practice: limited to manipulation
The General Medical Council of Great Britain has consistently denied U.S.-trained D.O.s full practice rights and has declined the AOA's request to permit D.O.s to sit for the medical examination. This may be due in part to the large presence of British "osteopaths," who are non-physician health care providers who practice much like chiropractors.

(However, note that this is from 1998, which was 12 years ago - times have changed; so this may not still hold true.
 
I want to do a job where I heal people and make enough money for myself and my family. That's all. I'm very proud that I get to go to a fantastic DO school and become a physician... I would have been happy as an MD, too. Arbitrary degree names and "prestige" do not matter to me... living life doing what I want to do is what matters to me.
 
The only thing that would bother me is the respect issue. I personally have as much respect for a DO as I do an MD. But the fact that some people would treat me as inferior, makes me choose MD over DO. I don't want to have to deal with people thinking I'm some chiropractor. But if I didn't have a choice, and I got rejected from all MD schools and only accepted to DO schools, I would matriculate at a DO program and wouldn't waste another year for MD.
 
After I was accepted at both, I chose MD over DO entirely for the title.

I have several DOs in my family. They all said it isn't worth it to explain the difference between DOs and MDs to patients. There is no difference except that you have to educate people about your profession before you educate them on why they shouldn't do whatever unhealthy lifestyle choice they are making.

That being said, all my friends who went to DO schools strike me as both kinder and more knowledgeable individuals than the MDs I know (this perception continues to this day even after the pool of people I know in both groups has grown far larger).

Also, my first acceptance was to a DO school. On that day, google's word of the day was "osteopath" and I'm really superstitious.

When I brought these up to my dad, who is a DO, he said "Those are stupid reasons, just go to an MD school"

And so it was.

I wish I hadn't replied to one of nonsciencemajors posts though.
 
Wow what a troll. Can't wait to see how far you (the OP) get with that type of ignorance.
 
To all the people worried about patients not knowing about what "DO" is -

By the mid-to-end stages of our career; let's assume 2040-2050, it will be flat out negligence on the part of the patient if they haven't heard of what a DO is. By that time 1 in 4 physicians will be DO.
 
To all the people worried about patients not knowing about what "DO" is -

By the mid-to-end stages of our career; let's assume 2040-2050, it will be flat out negligence on the part of the patient if they haven't heard of what a DO is. By that time 1 in 4 physicians will be DO.

Negligence? Believe it or not, the general public is not really concerned about learning the intricacies of medical education. They're busy living their lives.
 
Negligence? Believe it or not, the general public is not really concerned about learning the intricacies of medical education. They're busy living their lives.

Wouldn't you say it's common knowledge today that the average person knows that MD indicates a physician? All I'm saying is, by 2050, it would be common knowledge that DO also means physician - since so many patients would be being treated by DOs. Just look at how many new Osteopathic schools are opening up, and the fact that class sizes are increasing.

The reason I'm saying this is that many DO grads choose to enter Primary care fields, where they would be interacting with the average individual for everyday things - like physicals, routine checkups, etc. So it's very reasonable to think that 40 years from now, the average person would be aware of what a DO is.

edit - I think there are extremely valid reasons why a person would choose MD over DO. I just think the idea that a person would be turned away from being an osteopathic physician for the simple reason that "others haven't heard of it" is a very silly reason.
 
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Alright ...

1. God dammit, when are these threads going to end, and why do we all feed into them (myself included)???

2. OMT - it's hard to make blanket statements and claim schools put a ton of emphasis or time on it, because it is a case by case basis. Some schools are heavy with OMT, other schools aren't so much. Also, some students like it, want to incorporate it in some way, most don't and just see it as something they had to get through or think is interesting, but won't have the time/practice to use it. However, to say there is no evidence for it is pretty absurd. There have been a lot of studies demonstrating it's efficacy for many different conditions. Hell the NEJM even wrote an article explaining how it works for back pain. Here are some journal articles if you'd like to skim a few abstracts:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=99957

People can pick the articles apart, whatever, but the point is OMM is one modality taught in DO schools, it is not the end all, and 95% of DOs (unfortunately) don't use it in practice.

3. The international practice thing ... biggest LOL of this argument. I bet if you interviewed a whole group of pre-medical students, you'd find a TON of them who wanted to do international medical missions, etc. Interview that same group in the middle of residency ... see if they give a shizznit. My guess ... they will tell you to leave them alone, they still have 60 hours to work this week. Not only this, but DOs do have a nice sect and continually expanding international practice rights. Furthermore, people assume just because you get a US MD, you can waltz into any country and hang a shingle ... this is also false. Is it easier than a DO in most cases ... yes, sure, I'm not going to deny it ... but it still isn't the international visa some people make it out to be. ALSO, most people who will do international work won't actually move to another country and open up shop, they will volunteer through an organization like doctors without boarders, etc. These organizations are DO friendly ... so you're fine.

4. Whoever said they would rather be a FMG ... look at DO match rates vs Caribbean match rates for ACGME residencies. Now factor in that DOs have their own separate, DO only, set of residencies. Landing a residency of your choice > pointless ego.

5. Educating patients - the general population is so clueless about the path to becoming a physician. It's seriously shocking. Just speak with someone you know some time ... you'll be blown away. I've had people ask me if I'm going to be just an MD or like a special doctor (the conversation ended with me thinking my bud was asking if I was going to be a GP/FP doc or like go into surgery or something), I've explained the concept of a residency to my parents a ton of times - still fumble it up, I think my dad is still convinced I get paid for my last two years of medical school, I've had people assume I already have an MD because I was pre-med in undergrad, etc, etc.

What's my point ... people are clueless, and to them, ignorance is bliss. It's a confusing situation, and they don't want to know. If you walk in a room wearing a white coat with the letters, John Doe, DO across it and say ... Hi, I'm Dr Doe, I'll be your physician today ... that's the end of that discussion. You are a doctor, they are nervous and relieved to see a doctor, end of discussion. Also, people aren't going to identify you based on your MD/DO, they will identify you by your field. The average person will google 'Dermatologist in X area,' not 'MD dermatologist in X area.' if the first, easiest result is a DO, or they are referred to a DO, they are going to the DERMATOLOGIST ... period.

Ask any DO resident, attending, etc ... they will tell you they've received the 'what's a DO' question maybe 2-3 times in like 5-8 years, and each time a 20 second explanation resulted in an 'Oh, cool.' I've never explained it to a person and had them think I'm going to some voodoo chiropractor school. It's rumors and perpetuated assumptions.

6. Choosing DO over MD ... most people don't. No argument here. At this stage in our lives, we are pretty caught up on the titles. And guess what (drum roll) there is nothing wrong with that. If you've worked your ass off and got into the US MD and you want it strictly based on the title ... go for it. Congratulations, and god bless. It's not like you're going to be at any disadvantage with it. In fact, there will be cases where you'll be in better shape for rotations and ACGME residencies. I seriously have no problem with people who just say, I want the MD so I choose it over DO, etc. I do have a problem with people who would choose FMG over DO, but that's another story.

However, it does happen ... people choose DO schools for other reasons than simply they could not get into US MD. Location, cost, family, fit, emphasis on PC, or even (gasp) an interest in OMM. Is it common ... I dunno. I personally know a few people who did it. None of them seem to regret it at all. None of them seem too caught up in this stuff though, so whatever.

Well ... there's my rant. I probably won't respond to anyone who breaks it down or anything, but feel free.
 
+1 Jagger. But don't waste anymore of your time on threads like this! I have read many of your "DO vs. MD" responses and they are all excellent. Let this ignorant fool burn his/her bridges further down the road. He/she will NOT be a quality PHYSICIAN. Ignorance catches up to people.
 
A doctor is a doctor, you get to help people and study what you love. The differences in MD and DO don't really matter except they tell patients whether or not you subscribe/practice the osteopathic philosophy. I myself was more interested in allopathic and not the osteopathic way, so I only applied MD. I completely respect DOs. They are capable of everything MD's are, but there are differences in the philosophy.
 
+1 Jagger. But don't waste anymore of your time on threads like this! I have read many of your "DO vs. MD" responses and they are all excellent. Let this ignorant fool burn his/her bridges further down the road. He/she will NOT be a quality PHYSICIAN. Ignorance catches up to people.
Jagger - When I saw you posted, I had to go to it. LOL right out of the gate. If I'm getting into pen fight, you're on my team. Kirksville, eh?
 
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