Met a former Pre Med that failed...kinda scary

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TheBatman

TheBatman

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I was at a diner and and the server noticed my University t shirt. He asked what I was studying. I proceeded to tell him that I was a Bio major in the hopes of getting in to medical school. He then told me he graduated with 3.8 and a 4.0 science GPA and also wished to become a doctor. I asked if he was working to save up for school. He laughed and said he needed to pay bills because he totally bombed the MCAT with an 18 which caused him to quit. I tried to convince him to retake it but his confidence had been torn to pieces. Anyways cool story bro
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I dont see how someone can score that low... must have not studied much at all
 
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Anyone who really put in the time and effort can score higher than 18. It's not scary cause you're not a quitter.
 
TheBatman said:
I was at a diner and and the server noticed my University t shirt. He asked what I was studying. I proceeded to tell him that I was a Bio major in the hopes of getting in to medical school. He then told me he graduated with 3.8 and a 4.0 science GPA and also wished to become a doctor. I asked if he was working to save up for school. He laughed and said he needed to pay bills because he totally bombed the MCAT with an 18 which caused him to quit. I tried to convince him to retake it but his confidence had been torn to pieces. Anyways cool story bro
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Did he really only try once and decide he couldn't do it? That sort of lack of determination might have been precisely the reason he did so poorly in the first place. Doing poorly on an exam that is extremely difficult by normal standards shouldn't be enough to shred his confidence.

If I got an 18 on my first round, my response would be well ****, time to study for another year and try again. Not, oops well guess I can pass on that doctor thing after all.
 
Pretty sure you can get an 18 through random guessing, right?
 
Arkangeloid said:
Pretty sure you can get an 18 through random guessing, right?
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No. I actually did an experiment where I randomly guessed on an aamc practice test and got a 12. That was a 2 VR, 4 PS and 6 BS.

I must have gotten really lucky with the BS guessing, but getting a 18 would require a ton of luck since you would need 6s in every section.
 
THIS IS WHY THE MCAT EXISTS!!!



.......To cut out those who call themselves pre-meds, but have no ability to study, cannot perform under pressure, or have no drive to retake.



Also, if he really got a 4.0sGPA, this is even more laughable.
 
Spinach Dip said:
THIS IS WHY THE MCAT EXISTS!!!



.......To cut out those who call themselves pre-meds, but have no ability to study, cannot perform under pressure, or have no drive to retake.



Also, if he really got a 4.0sGPA, this is even more laughable.
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Sad but very true.
 
I know exactly same story. Health major, big state school, ~3.8 GPA. 17 MCAT. She just took the classes strategically in CC and with easy professors, Ws, old tests from sorority sisters, etc... Honestly, her level of understanding was nowhere near of what was required to simply stay afloat in med school. MCAT did her a favor.
 
Spinach Dip said:
THIS IS WHY THE MCAT EXISTS!!!



.......To cut out those who call themselves pre-meds, but have no ability to study, cannot perform under pressure, or have no drive to retake.



Also, if he really got a 4.0sGPA, this is even more laughable.
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Yep
 
and which I firmly believe MCAT should be weighed in more heavily than GPA. grade inflation/deflation problems.
 
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TheBatman said:
I was at a diner and and the server noticed my University t shirt. He asked what I was studying. I proceeded to tell him that I was a Bio major in the hopes of getting in to medical school. He then told me he graduated with 3.8 and a 4.0 science GPA and also wished to become a doctor. I asked if he was working to save up for school. He laughed and said he needed to pay bills because he totally bombed the MCAT with an 18 which caused him to quit. I tried to convince him to retake it but his confidence had been torn to pieces. Anyways cool story bro
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Perhaps he had an epiphany realizing that rote learning could only take him so far. The MCAT places heavy strain on one's critical thinking; an indispensable skill that's rarely taught/used in grade school these days and sometimes even at post-secondary education.
 
I understand how he feels. I have good GPA but bad MCAT. No matter how hard I try, I cant get better fast enough. Oh well...inch by inch. Im determined to be a physician.
 
Koalafied said:
Perhaps he had an epiphany realizing that rote learning could only take him so far. The MCAT places heavy strain on one's critical thinking; an indispensable skill that's rarely taught/used in grade school these days and sometimes even at post-secondary education.
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Nah, a good work ethic and mental endurance in studying for months will get you through the MCAT. What happened is that OP's friend had been playing with loaded dice for years, lining up easy professors and class schedules so he could get good grades, but not developing a shred of a work ethic. You can manipulate and finagle your way through college, but the buck stops at the MCAT.
 
He probably just didn't study.

To get an 18 you only need to get like a 9 on VR and a 9 on BS and just completely skip the PS section...
 
People fail all along the way. This should come as no surprise. So many people start out as pre-meds in college, and then constantly drop it.

It's far better to have dropped pre-med than to either fail out or drop out of medical school.
 
I'd say that, better than as a premed, it's best to drop out in high school if you don't want to be a physician. Lots of high school kids shadowing these days, thinking about medicine.
 
I guess it's better to quit as a premed rather than going for the Carib schools. I find this a little surprising, personally. Unless he was taking courses like Wine Tasting 101 for the GPA, why would you work so hard and then just give up?
 
Arkangeloid said:
Nah, a good work ethic and mental endurance in studying for months will get you through the MCAT. What happened is that OP's friend had been playing with loaded dice for years, lining up easy professors and class schedules so he could get good grades, but not developing a shred of a work ethic. You can manipulate and finagle your way through college, but the buck stops at the MCAT.
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This is hilarious, :laugh:. Oh how I yearn for the pre-dents to be more like y'all.

And perhaps that may also be the case; unless we're in his shoes, we'll never know.
 
Only like 50% of AMCAS applicants get in anywhere. Flip a coin and that could be you.
 
circulus vitios said:
Only like 50% of AMCAS applicants get in anywhere. Flip a coin and that could be you.
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I think that's a misleading statistic. I know that med school admissions is tough, but when you consider how many applications are either profoundly weak, incomplete, late, or to a small number of schools, it becomes clear that any "standard", qualified pre-med with a 3.6/30+ who applies to 25+ schools does not, in fact, have a 50% of admissions (assuming there are no red flags/no lack of clinical exposure). It's much higher.
 
He was probably trolling you OP


Actually this is a great idea.... Im gonna start telling people I got a 20 on the MCAT
 
Strudel19 said:
Guy is a Grade A n0ob.
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👍 don't listen to him. work hard in your pre-reqs and study your ass off for the MCAT and you will be ok.

lazyindy said:
and which I firmly believe MCAT should be weighed in more heavily than GPA. grade inflation/deflation problems.
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I think the MCAT should be weighed heavier but if a student has a 30+ MCAT, then I think that pretty much validates the GPA.

What do you guys think of having volunteer students (former pre-meds) from each university (with representatives from different majors/residential colleges/classes) come in and rate the difficulty of courses and submit their result to AMCAS. In addition, there should be at least one staff member not tied to the interests of the school who can speak about the school's relative difficulty. I know this is done in some form with the committee letter but shouldn't it be done universally?
 
TheBatman said:
I was at a diner and and the server noticed my University t shirt. He asked what I was studying. I proceeded to tell him that I was a Bio major in the hopes of getting in to medical school. He then told me he graduated with 3.8 and a 4.0 science GPA and also wished to become a doctor. I asked if he was working to save up for school. He laughed and said he needed to pay bills because he totally bombed the MCAT with an 18 which caused him to quit. I tried to convince him to retake it but his confidence had been torn to pieces. Anyways cool story bro
Click to expand...

Welcome to the 65-75% of pre-meds who get all the way to the MCAT but never make it to medical school. No, no one talks about them. There's a reason for that.
 
Radon XP said:
I think that's a misleading statistic. I know that med school admissions is tough, but when you consider how many applications are either profoundly weak, incomplete, late, or to a small number of schools, it becomes clear that any "standard", qualified pre-med with a 3.6/30+ who applies to 25+ schools does not, in fact, have a 50% of admissions (assuming there are no red flags/no lack of clinical exposure). It's much higher.
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lol... clearly someone has not yet applied.
 
The Kraken said:
Or isnt from California
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I'd say more specifically is probably from Texas, Florida, or New York, where the chances of getting are WAY higher. Actually, anywhere on the East Coast gives you pretty good chances. Anywhere West of, say, Illinois (and north and/or west of Texas) puts you at a disadvantage
 
Actually yeah, might be true for the west coasters....it be tough over there. Applying on the east coast though, it certainly seemed like any decent applicant had more than a 50% chance if they did okay on interviews, but I don't really know.

Radon XP said:
I think that's a misleading statistic. I know that med school admissions is tough, but when you consider how many applications are either profoundly weak, incomplete, late, or to a small number of schools, it becomes clear that any "standard", qualified pre-med with a 3.6/30+ who applies to 25+ schools does not, in fact, have a 50% of admissions (assuming there are no red flags/no lack of clinical exposure). It's much higher.
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I agree. I think there was a chart floating around where you used your MCAT and GPA to estimate chances of getting in. If the GPA and MCAT are just a little above avg with decent ECs and interviewing skills, I can't imagine why an applicant wouldn't get into at least one mid or low tier school.

Just my two cents though, I have no data to back this up, so I could be wrong.
 
zeppelinpage4 said:
Actually yeah, might be true for the west coasters....it be tough over there. Applying on the east coast though, it certainly seemed like any decent applicant had more than a 50% chance if they did okay on interviews, but I don't really know.



I agree. I think there was a chart floating around where you used your MCAT and GPA to estimate chances of getting in. If the GPA and MCAT are just a little above avg with decent ECs and interviewing skills, I can't imagine why an applicant wouldn't get into at least one mid or low tier school.

Just my two cents though, I have no data to back this up, so I could be wrong.
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~43-46% is for all applicants, which is kinda a weird way to measure.

This grid gives a better way to estimate chances. Then again though, even at 3.8+ and 39+ 6% still don't get in.

https://www.aamc.org/download/321518/data/2012factstable25-4.pdf
 
LuciusVorenus said:
This grid gives a better way to estimate chances. Then again though, even at 3.8+ and 39+ 6% still don't get in.
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...and the problem is we don't know why? Did they only apply to 'arvard and Stanford? Are they terrible at interviewing? Felony convictions? You can be a 4.0 and 45, but if no one wants you around, than it doesn't matter.
 
LuciusVorenus said:
~43-46% is for all applicants, which is kinda a weird way to measure.

This grid gives a better way to estimate chances. Then again though, even at 3.8+ and 39+ 6% still don't get in.

https://www.aamc.org/download/321518/data/2012factstable25-4.pdf
Click to expand...

Thank you! That's the chart.

From that, it looks like an applicant with a 3.6-3.79/30-32 (assuming decent ECs, applying broadly and early, and good interviewing skills) which are pretty average accepted student stats had a 72.7% chance of getting in. Knowing that, I guess I can understand if the acceptance rate is near 50% among ALL applicants.
 
Siggy said:
...and the problem is we don't know why? Did they only apply to 'arvard and Stanford? Are they terrible at interviewing? Felony convictions? You can be a 4.0 and 45, but if no one wants you around, than it doesn't matter.
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👍

I've been on mdapps and seen people with those stats apply to only 5 MD/PhD programs, or turn in their primary in September, or get 12 interviews and no acceptances. It happens I guess.
 
Siggy said:
...and the problem is we don't know why? Did they only apply to 'arvard and Stanford? Are they terrible at interviewing? Felony convictions? You can be a 4.0 and 45, but if no one wants you around, than it doesn't matter.
Click to expand...

Yup. I've seen it myself, high stat applicants only applying to 5 or less schools, and late, and get in nowhere. That's why the data is skewed.
 
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