Pharm D or pharmaceutical Sciences?

I'm really not sure what a degree in pharmaceutical science entails - is it a BS or BA? Since it has no clear science emphasis (ie - molecular biology vs chemistry vs biochemistry, for example) I think your career opportunities will be limited to sales in the pharmaceutical field.

There are other areas within pharmaceutical industry, but you need to have a good working knowledge of the scientific portion to be able to interface with research, development, marketing & regulatory parts of a pharmaceutical company. If you want research - the fields of molecular or cellular biology, chemistry or biochemistry are hot. If you want the business side - you could do economics, business, even english (those folks actually write & edit the official inserts). There are even opportunities for web & product design within the industry. I really can't tell you if your major of pharmaceutical science will give you this exposure.

I'd recommend going back to deciding what you want to do? Do you want to be in industry? Do you like research, clinical trials, product design, regulatory issues? If so...then you need to find out what it takes to pursue the career you're interested in.

If you want to be a pharmacist - which involves dispensing, pharmaceutical management, etc, etc, etc....you have to get a Pharm.D - in the US anyway.

good luck!

Well.....again...yes, I do know jobs which utilize those who have degrees in biochem & molecular biology...but, unless those are your major..no I don't know of any area.

Again....my question is - what do YOU want to do? Not what can this degree do for you - what do YOU want?

top1 said:

Hello,
it's science degree. my major courses are like biochem, molecular bio, pharmacology, Bio stat. so any idea of job opportunity related to these course work.
thnx.

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SDN1977...the BS in pharmaceutical sciences or even the major is something a lot of pharmacy schools have started or continued since going to the all PharmD program. Basically it is one of there ways to make a little extra cash by marketing it to pre-med students, some pre-pharm students who are at a stage to complete the degree, and/or any other science majors. However, the unfortunate aspect of the degree is that while it has a similar title to the previous BS in pharmacy the coursework is very different (as previous post mentioned) and the obvious other detractor is that you can't practice pharmacy with it.

To the original post...given your previous coursework it appears that you may have a desire for industry based pharmacy. The various options would be to go for the PharmD, PhD (possibly in pharmaceutical sciences), or PharmD/PhD combo. The PharmD/PhD combo would take the longest but potentially give you the most options. The PhD would be most recommended if you are really into bench research (not into practicing pharmacy) and think that you would like to do similar types of work in industry or in an academic medical center. The typical avg duration for completing the PhD in pharmaceutical sciences or even clinical Pharmaceutical sciences PhD is about 4-6yrs w/ most being ~4-5yrs. The PharmD/PhD combo would give you increased marketability and you'd always have the PharmD to fall back on as a secondary means to generate income.

The straight PharmD pathway would also be an option if you are interested in practicing pharmacy and also an option if you still want to go the industry route. Research w/ a PharmD is still an option; however, it will typically be more collaborative and less independent than a PhD counterpart (unless of course you are willing to spend several yrs in post-doc fellowship training after receiving the PharmD). Possibly ways to get into industry w/ just the PharmD can be done via residency training. Additional aspects in industry w/ a PharmD would be educating other healthcare professionals (i.e. Medical Science Liaisons; typically requires residency training), drug information, post marketing surveillance in clinical trials, drug reviews, and/or kinetics research (kinetics research typicalls requires residency/fellowship training (~2-3yrs whereas drug info & post marketing can be done via 1-2yr residencies or possibly outcomes based fellowships in industry(1-2yrs)).

Sorry if I'm making too many assumptions about you career aspirations, but I hope this works. Feel free to ask further questions if I can help clear up some more things.

Thanks Kwizard! The students I've come into contact with have never mentioned this degree and honestly.....industry is becoming so specialized, I can't imagine this degree being useful in any way to industry, unless it is in sales or perhaps regulatory affairs.

My daughter graduated from UCSD with a degree in molecular biology. Before she decided on medicine, she investigated if she wanted to pursue the molecular/cellular biology to the research level. It was pretty easy for her since there is so much drug & biotech research in San Diego. But, she found the corporate interest was for pure science degrees. A BS in a purely science degree (molecular/cellular bio, chemistry, biochemistry, etc...) will get you a lab bench job. A masters will allow you to do the same with the difference being supervising others & purchasing supplies. The only autonomy & self directed work is done by PhD's & even that is controlled by grant funding.

I don't know anyone who has a PhD in pharmaceutical sciences. I've met many in pharmaceutical chemistry, pharmaceutics, pharmacology...but this is all new to me. I do know many BS pharmacists who have pursued MS in pharmacy & have gone into regulatory affairs....which perhaps this is where this degree might lead in addition to those outlined by Kwizard.

I actually dislike the idea of "marketing" a degree to students if indeed this is what has happened. But...thanks for the info!

sdn1977 said:

I actually dislike the idea of "marketing" a degree to students if indeed this is what has happened. But...thanks for the info!

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Yep I agree that the marketing of the degree is just a little bit confusing. Off the top of my head, I think Purdue is one of the schools that offers a BS in Pharmaceutical Sciences. Unfortunately again there are way too many BA/BS degrees that can be obtained w/o any real world application. They appear to just be gateway degrees to other professions. Pharmaceutical science PhDs go by many various venues within drug development, kinetics, biotechnology, etc. The best place to check would be the American Association of Pharmaceutical Sciences (www.aaps.org). Mostly all of the research affiliated schools of pharmacy have some type of PhD track; however, the name by which the PhD is in will vary so Pharmaceutical Sciences just might not be the title of choice in some places.

Back to the original post...Don't worry about not knowing for sure what you want to do. The best thing you can do is to explore your options. Pharmacy is a great profession that has many options, but all professions have their respective "ups and downs". Try not to let anyone convince you into thinking that you can't make money and enjoy what you are doing. There is always more than one way to accomplish a goal. Retail pharmacy will probably always pay the most initially just b/c that is where the demand outweighs the supply.If you really like bench work types of research and would like to get paid well for doing it there are ways to supplement your income (i.e. speakers bureaus, drug review boards, etc.). Other options would be to find a job in an academic medical center that does research independtly and also in collaboration w/ the university. Therefore you may be fiscally supported by the community teaching hospital or government facility (i.e. VA or Naval hospital) so your pay may be a little more competitive than your academic counterparts in the research arena. Before SDN points out the VA caveat, please let me mention that all federal jobs (VA included) typically have varying salaries across regions so it may be a good salary or a not so good salary. It just depends, but possible postings can be viewed at www.usajobs.gov or www.vacareers.va.gov. Industry also pays very well for those who are already established.

To get with the network process, check out www.accp.com (American College of Clinical Pharmacy) as they have student fees and you can also join the various listservs (they have one for pharmacokinetics/dynamics and another for pharmaceutical industry).

kwizard said:

Yep I agree that the marketing of the degree is just a little bit confusing. Off the top of my head, I think Purdue is one of the schools that offers a BS in Pharmaceutical Sciences. Unfortunately again there are way too many BA/BS degrees that can be obtained w/o any real world application. They appear to just be gateway degrees to other professions. Pharmaceutical science PhDs go by many various venues within drug development, kinetics, biotechnology, etc. The best place to check would be the American Association of Pharmaceutical Sciences (www.aaps.org). Mostly all of the research affiliated schools of pharmacy have some type of PhD track; however, the name by which the PhD is in will vary so Pharmaceutical Sciences just might not be the title of choice in some places.

Back to the original post...Don't worry about not knowing for sure what you want to do. The best thing you can do is to explore your options. Pharmacy is a great profession that has many options, but all professions have their respective "ups and downs". Try not to let anyone convince you into thinking that you can't make money and enjoy what you are doing. There is always more than one way to accomplish a goal. Retail pharmacy will probably always pay the most initially just b/c that is where the demand outweighs the supply.If you really like bench work types of research and would like to get paid well for doing it there are ways to supplement your income (i.e. speakers bureaus, drug review boards, etc.). Other options would be to find a job in an academic medical center that does research independtly and also in collaboration w/ the university. Therefore you may be fiscally supported by the community teaching hospital or government facility (i.e. VA or Naval hospital) so your pay may be a little more competitive than your academic counterparts in the research arena. Before SDN points out the VA caveat, please let me mention that all federal jobs (VA included) typically have varying salaries across regions so it may be a good salary or a not so good salary. It just depends, but possible postings can be viewed at www.usajobs.gov or www.vacareers.va.gov. Industry also pays very well for those who are already established.

To get with the network process, check out www.accp.com (American College of Clinical Pharmacy) as they have student fees and you can also join the various listservs (they have one for pharmacokinetics/dynamics and another for pharmaceutical industry).

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Kwizard - am I too predictable ? Yeah...the pay is awful in CA, but its a great experience. In fact...I did 2 summer internships at a VA in S CA when I was a student & learned the most there than nearly anywhere! You can't beat the experience for learning. I have friends who are at the Palo Alto VA & love it - the benefits outweigh the pay differential for them. So...it can be a good gig.

Thanks again for that pharmaceutical science info!

sdn1977 said:

I don't know anyone who has a PhD in pharmaceutical sciences. I've met many in pharmaceutical chemistry, pharmaceutics, pharmacology...but this is all new to me. I do know many BS pharmacists who have pursued MS in pharmacy & have gone into regulatory affairs....which perhaps this is where this degree might lead in addition to those outlined by Kwizard.

I actually dislike the idea of "marketing" a degree to students if indeed this is what has happened. But...thanks for the info!

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I think this is partly a nomenclature issue - my sister has a PhD in pharmaceutical sciences, although her BS is chemistry, and what she has always done for a job would be more accurately called pharmaceutical chemistry. Her degree is from the pharmacy department of a medical university, and she did take some classes with the regular PharmD students (to make it even more confusing!)

you could do both.... creighton has an ms in pharmaceutical sciences that you could do with the pharmD degree. i've looked into it a little but i dont know a whole lot about it.

top1 said:

kwiz & Sdn @...really i dont know what i want to do....for me ..as a under grad.. right now both sectors, research work and pharm d, are NEW. rite now i m workin part time as pharm. tech in a drug store. The pharmacist told me that pharmacy is a good rewarding job, but its kind of boring job. While i found from online sources that work in pharmaceutical industry is a kind of challenging, but not good salary... so now i have to choose either Job satisfaction(research) or Money(retail). im now confuse bw this two options. hopefully u can understand my situation.

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I do thank everyone for bringing me up to speed on this degree!

But...back to you, top, & your dilemma of what to do, what to do?

How old are you & do you have a huge time &/or money constraint which forces you to make a firm & final decision on a career path? (ie....do you have a family to support, have you committed yourself to a mortgage, etc..) Certainly, most children don't abuse their parent's largesse when it comes to the financing of their education (as least mine didn't) & we, as parents, expect them to take a few twists & turns to find what's right. I hope that's the case with you.

When our daughter was thinking about pursuing a PhD in molecular bio...she asked us what the job was like. Well...I didn't know at alll & her Dad was a biochemist in a lab @ Harvard before he was a dentist, but that was sooooo very long ago (the 60's!). So...our best recommendation to her was she'd have to find out herself & we advised her to get a job in a lab, which she did.

She worked in a lab for 1 & 1/2 years & did a summer internship doing research at a pharmaceutical lab. So....she gave it her best shot - met & spoke with everyone from the BS lab tech to multiple PhD PD's on many different research projects and found.....that wasn't her cup of tea.

Her Dad suggested dentistry & she spoke with lots of his colleagues, because of course, as her dad, he knew nothing . She spent time in many different dental offices & in lots of specialties. Ultimately found - that wasn't her cup of tea either.

Its funny - she never wanted to be a pharmacist like her mom

My point.....now you're working in a retail pharmacy. Good. How about seeing if you can get a lab job on campus for a few hours during the year? Usually campus jobs are very accomodating to students, particularly during exam time. This might give you a way to find out if you really like research.

Also....go online and check out the large pharmaceutical companies - they often hire for summer internships - go to Pfizer, Lilly, MSD, Smith-Kline/Beecham - but you have to apply early - January is not too soon!

Good luck & pursue lots of avenues. Check out the links Kwizard mentioned. Goodness...you might consider something you've never thought about - what about biotech engineering or clinical laboratory areas? You'll never regret spending time deciding on what interests you, but you might regret not! You have to spend the bulk of your life working & altho lots of people make the choice of satisfaction or money...I've felt you can find the compromise that will satisfy both. You'll never have as much money as you want & your job will occassionally be awful &/or boring....but, you want to find the compromise which will give you the most interesting way to make a living so you can have the kind of life you want.

Good luck!

top visit this
http://www.pharmacy.purdue.edu/academics/bsps/
it might help u.

If I were you, I would apply to a PhD in pharamceutics and specialize in pharmacokinetics. This is a combination of biochemistry, physiology, AND differential equations (calculus). This is basically what the body does to the drug, and pharmacodynamics is what the drug does to the body. There are very good jobs in the pharmaceutical industry in this area, so look into it! They pay as much as a pharmacist starting and you can go much higher.

cdpiano27 said:

If I were you, I would apply to a PhD in pharamceutics and specialize in pharmacokinetics. This is a combination of biochemistry, physiology, AND differential equations (calculus). This is basically what the body does to the drug, and pharmacodynamics is what the drug does to the body. There are very good jobs in the pharmaceutical industry in this area, so look into it! They pay as much as a pharmacist starting and you can go much higher.

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To bring this back from the dead....

Pharmacokinetics and Pharmacodynamics is a field that will always be in demand. Its a small niche field that not many people go into. Yes you can make alot, but be prepared not only to work hard, but to think hard and get down and dirty with your research. PK/PD easily takes the cake as one of the most challenging career routes in my book.