Be careful what you photograph in OR

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gudog

gudog

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PHOENIX - A surgeon faces a disciplinary hearing for snapping a photo of a patient's tattooed genitals during an operation and showing it around to other doctors.

Mayo Clinic Hospital administrators said Dr. Adam Hansen, chief resident of general surgery, admitted taking the photo with his cell phone on Dec. 11. The tattoo on strip club owner Sean Dubowik's penis reads: "Hot Rod."

Dubowik, who had undergone a gallbladder operation, said he learned of the photo Monday when the Mayo Clinic called.

"I got a strange call after my surgery from a doctor who said there was a problem. He said Hansen was on the phone and would explain," he said.

Dubowik, 27, said Hansen told him he took the picture while inserting a catheter into his penis. A member of the surgical staff made an anonymous call about the photo to The Arizona Republic on Monday.

"He told me he didn't want me to read about it in the newspaper first," Dubowik said.

Hansen wasn't available for comment Tuesday and has been placed on administrative leave. He could face a range of punishment from probation to dismissal.

"Patient privacy is a serious matter, and photographing someone in this manner without a good reason is something we will investigate down to the last detail," said Dr. Joseph Sirven, education director for Mayo Clinic Arizona, the hospital's parent organization based in Scottsdale.

Dubowik said he got the tattoo on a bet and that "it was the most horrible thing I ever went though in my life."

He said he planned to contact an attorney.

"The longer I sit here the angrier I get," he said.

(from AP wire reports)
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gudog said:
PHOENIX - A surgeon faces a disciplinary hearing for snapping a photo of a patient's tattooed genitals during an operation and showing it around to other doctors.

Mayo Clinic Hospital administrators said Dr. Adam Hansen, chief resident of general surgery, admitted taking the photo with his cell phone on Dec. 11. The tattoo on strip club owner Sean Dubowik's penis reads: "Hot Rod."

Dubowik, who had undergone a gallbladder operation, said he learned of the photo Monday when the Mayo Clinic called.

"I got a strange call after my surgery from a doctor who said there was a problem. He said Hansen was on the phone and would explain," he said.

Dubowik, 27, said Hansen told him he took the picture while inserting a catheter into his penis. A member of the surgical staff made an anonymous call about the photo to The Arizona Republic on Monday.

"He told me he didn't want me to read about it in the newspaper first," Dubowik said.

Hansen wasn't available for comment Tuesday and has been placed on administrative leave. He could face a range of punishment from probation to dismissal.

"Patient privacy is a serious matter, and photographing someone in this manner without a good reason is something we will investigate down to the last detail," said Dr. Joseph Sirven, education director for Mayo Clinic Arizona, the hospital's parent organization based in Scottsdale.

Dubowik said he got the tattoo on a bet and that "it was the most horrible thing I ever went though in my life."

He said he planned to contact an attorney.

"The longer I sit here the angrier I get," he said.

(from AP wire reports)
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:laugh:

Wonder what will happen to this poor guy?
 
Oh boy, that surgeon is in trouble. I've seen this done several times but really mostly like for a tumor or an unusual finding... never for a tattoo.

Reminds me of another story. I remember like 6 years back, an OBGYN getting sued for tattooing his tiny initials on the uterus remainder after a hysterectomy. I dont remember how one of the patients found out he does that but she sued him for it and got off big time.
 
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no, it was some ******* who would bovie "UK" i think for kentucky. it was big letters, i saw the tape. he would videotape it, the *****. and one day a patient asked him for a copy of the videotape. and he gave it to her.
 
gasnewby said:
no, it was some ******* who would bovie "UK" i think for kentucky. it was big letters, i saw the tape. he would videotape it, the *****. and one day a patient asked him for a copy of the videotape. and he gave it to her.
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:lol: heh... That's even better than how I remember it.
 
it's not at all uncommon for us to make a lot of intraoperative photos. But they are certainly relevant to the surgery at hand. Somewhere in the consent they sign our patients agree to being photographed and used for educational purposes as long as they can't be identified. However, I bet there is some provision in the fine print that the picture should be relevant.
 
Let's be honest, it was wrong for the guy to photograph the patient for no medical reason. That being said, this is the lamest story in the history of the world. What ***** felt the need to anonymously call a newspaper and create a situation? Some self-righteous scrub tech or something? Fine, but if I reported everyone who violated any regulation or rule, you'd have to shut down every hospital in America. And now we're couching the story in ***** terms, where we're acting like the surgeon literally killed someone: "this is a profound compromise of the utmost and solemn duty that we have and a breach of the trust placed in our hands so delicately by our patients." If I want to talk like that, I can make it so that raising your voice to your child seems like child abuse. You know what? Sitting here, I'm also getting madder and madder, just like Mr. HOT ROD, the loser who tattoed his genitals.
 
I agree with thusell. Of course it isn't right to take that picture, but I really wonder how many malpractice cases have been started due to non-physicians calling in?
 
thusell said:
Let's be honest, it was wrong for the guy to photograph the patient for no medical reason. That being said, this is the lamest story in the history of the world. What ***** felt the need to anonymously call a newspaper and create a situation? Some self-righteous scrub tech or something? Fine, but if I reported everyone who violated any regulation or rule, you'd have to shut down every hospital in America. And now we're couching the story in ***** terms, where we're acting like the surgeon literally killed someone: "this is a profound compromise of the utmost and solemn duty that we have and a breach of the trust placed in our hands so delicately by our patients." If I want to talk like that, I can make it so that raising your voice to your child seems like child abuse. You know what? Sitting here, I'm also getting madder and madder, just like Mr. HOT ROD, the loser who tattoed his genitals.
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I agree to some extent, that these things are often blown out of proportion, but the Hippocratic Oath (which I think Dr. Chief Resident over at the Mayo probably took too) says this:

"What I may see or hear in the course of the treatment or even outside of the treatment in regard to the life of men, which on no account one must spread abroad, I will keep to myself, holding such things shameful to be spoken about."

Maybe if he kept the picture on his cellphone camera and didn't tell anyone about it? :)

This is why I try to keep my mouth shut in the hospital. There are people everywhere and anywhere who would love for the opportunity to bring down "one of those arrogant doctors."
 
This is another example of self-flagellation by the medical community. Sure, you can always
say "here's where you could have been better." That misses the point. What harm was brought to the patient? None. He wasn't identified, his confidentiality wasn't compromised. Is this to say we cannot make fun of patients? Why not? You know how many fatsos I've laughed at as I retracted their pannuses (panni?)? How many drug-users I've insulted while I was dealing with their traumas (including a drunken illegal Hispanic who had been cutting vegetables while she was drunk and was fighting me while I was trying to repair a hand lac)? Are all of you above this? B.S. Everyone can sit around pretending that all they do is "desperately care for the sick, to whom I have dedicated my life!!!" but I've personally sat around wishing some moribund 89-year-old full code would just die already and take their family who made him full code with him. If the lawyers or this scrub tech/nurse/medical student/whoever reported it wants to act so holy about their concern for people, then let's hold them to the same standards. Oh wait, that won't work at all.
 
Castro Viejo said:
I agree to some extent, that these things are often blown out of proportion, but the Hippocratic Oath (which I think Dr. Chief Resident over at the Mayo probably took too) says this:

"What I may see or hear in the course of the treatment or even outside of the treatment in regard to the life of men, which on no account one must spread abroad, I will keep to myself, holding such things shameful to be spoken about."

Maybe if he kept the picture on his cellphone camera and didn't tell anyone about it? :)

This is why I try to keep my mouth shut in the hospital. There are people everywhere and anywhere who would love for the opportunity to bring down "one of those arrogant doctors."
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It was absolutely inappropriate to take the picture, and it was really stupid to show it to a lot of people.

BUT, five to seven years of intense surgical training has likely warped his sense of humor, and he's lost touch with reality to some degree.

Now, thanks to some self-righteous scrub tech, his career is probably ruined. If you have a problem, write the resident up. But why make an anonymous call TO A NEWSPAPER? The snitch had malicious intent, no doubt.

Who knows....maybe the resident is a horrible person, and this was the last straw, but to me it sounds like a career ruined by a couple errors in judgment, and with as much as we put into this thing of ours, our futures shouldn't be this fragile.
 
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SLUser11 said:
BUT, five to seven years of intense surgical training has likely warped his sense of humor, and he's lost touch with reality to some degree.
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I don't know what you're talking about. Anyone who tattoes his penis is asking to get laughed at. In addition, I laugh at women who have tattoes by their vaginas or on their butts. In fact, most things people do are laughable, unless your sense of humor has been crushed by bureaucratic idiots who spend their time scheduling conferences and sending out memos that are "cc"ed to fifty people. Those are the real ******s.
 
My division has a large file of unusual patient tattoos. We do, however, ask the patient's permission before we photograph them (beyond our standard photo consent). The last funny one that I saw was a guy with a "USDA Prime" stamp on his backside.
 
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maxheadroom said:
The last funny one that I saw was a guy with a "USDA Prime" stamp on his backside.
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He must spend a lot of time showing that to other men. I'm just saying.
 
One thing to think about, the surgery resident didn't identify the patient.

According to the article it appears the face etc was not involved in the photo.

If that's the case his identity was only revealed when he came forward.

If he had kept his mouth shut nobody would have ever known who it was :idea:
 
First of all, any place that makes a Chief place a Foley is a POS place. Second of all, that also tells you a little about the mindset of the operative team -- they're probably POS's, too. Third of all, everything I said above is still true.
 
thusell said:
First of all, any place that makes a Chief place a Foley is a POS place.
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The chief, out of the goodness of his heart, wanted to videotape a textbook perfect foley insertion for the poor med students.
 
If this story was remotely true do you think they would have used the patients name.
 
DrDawg said:
If this story was remotely true do you think they would have used the patients name.
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um ya, I believe its true when u type "Adam Hansen" in google news and you get 117 articles about this.
http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/local/articles/1220mayophoto1220.html

The patients name is used bc he is talking to reporters. SO before you make a dumb comment plz do some research.

This is an example of why we need to be nice to the OR staff. If they do not like you, they can hurt you and this is one extreme example.
 
And so.. the million dollar question is... how much in malpractice will this patient get?

a) ZERO

b) $100,000

c) $500,000

d) $1,000,000

e) Over 1 million dollars.:barf:
 
Kimberli Cox said:
The resident is likely covered for 1 mil per occurence, 3 mil aggregate.
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Well lemme just say... if you any of you guys operate on me... you are all more than welcome to take a picture of my penis.. I need to pay off my loans. I'll cut you 20%. :cool:
 
Damn, beat me to the camera joke!

Was just going to say that you'd need a wide-angle lens for mine. ;)
 
Just watch out for mine... It just may pop through your lens and smack you in the pupil.

The thing's got a mind of its own! :banana:
 
Seriously though, I feel bad for this Hansen guy. To put in 4+ years and then cut down when you're just over 170 days to go in your residency and graduate just seems wrong. I mean, I don't think what he did was very smart, but we're all guilty at one point or another in this long road of saying/doing something inappropriate. This guy's screwed! If he can find another program to take him, ABS says he's gonna have to do the R4 and Chief year all over.

Anyone know this guy? Was he on his way into practice? Fellowship?

That's just terrible.
 
They fired him already?! Wow, that's pretty incredible that they moved so fast.
 
Lame. I hope the guy gets picked up by another program. Pretty sickening to believe this guy gets fired for this type of offense after so many years of hard work.

It's so refreshing to see how straight a line we all must walk no matter the amount of time and sweat we sacrifice. :rolleyes:
 
Most surgical permits have a paragraph in them for consent to being photographed for "educational purposes" provided the patient's identity is not revealed. That resident was clearly out of line in taking these photos as they did not have any educational value.

If you had been that patient would you have wanted photos of your genitals passed around among the staff for laughs?

Patient privacy is a huge deal and this patient was clearly violated on many levels. Serves as a good lesson that illustrates "don't do anything stupid". It can cost you.

Hey Kim,
I use the macro lens all the time for small things of educational value. :eek:
 
Castro Viejo said:
If he can find another program to take him, ABS says he's gonna have to do the R4 and Chief year all over.

Anyone know this guy? Was he on his way into practice? Fellowship?

That's just terrible.
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there's always CT surgery!

;)
 
Hating to go against the grain here. I probably wouldn't get too bent out of shape if this were me. I don't really care. However, when I really think about it, if someone did something like this to my wife, kids, or even a close friend, I'd be the one being sued, because they'd be picking their teeth up off the floor.

Yes, we've all made some jokes about our patients, and I'm sure this will get worse as I progress. Howeer, these things should really stay with the team. People do not go to the OR expecting pictures of their genitals to be used for humor in front of a hospital full of people.

That being said, whoever reported this is just as guilty as the guy who did it.
 
EKG2007 said:
Yes, the story is true. The resident is fired.

However, the person who made the anoymous call is also in trouble. Allegedly, s/he reported the incident along with the pt's REAL name to the newspaper. His/her identity is not yet know. But you can bet Mayo is pulling all the stops to find who s/he is.
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I'm glad they dealt with this in a fair way. The resident, after putting in 90 hours/week x 5 years and getting abused by everyone in the hospital to the tune of -$100,000 (after debt) gets to try to find a job with a huge black spot on his resume. Meanwhile, some scrub tech or something with a high school education will probably spend two months getting retrained as a floor nurse and promptly join a union and get overtime. Justice is served!
 
Faebinder said:
And so.. the million dollar question is... how much in malpractice will this patient get?

a) ZERO

b) $100,000

c) $500,000

d) $1,000,000

e) Over 1 million dollars.:barf:
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Note to you: this doesn't constitute malpractice in any sense of the legal definition. However, since most of our juries are made up of total ******s, I'd say this case is worth at least $30 million for pain and suffering. But at the trial, at least the resident can testify under oath that this guy has a small penis and have it entered into the judicial records. I'd just have my lawyer spend about two days asking me repeatedly to point out the guy with a small penis so I could point at him and say, "let the records show that he is pointing at the plaintiff."
 
thusell said:
Note to you: this doesn't constitute malpractice in any sense of the legal definition. However, since most of our juries are made up of total ******s, I'd say this case is worth at least $30 million for pain and suffering. But at the trial, at least the resident can testify under oath that this guy has a small penis and have it entered into the judicial records. I'd just have my lawyer spend about two days asking me repeatedly to point out the guy with a small penis so I could point at him and say, "let the records show that he is pointing at the plaintiff."
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dude. where have you been all my life? did you just stumble across this board?
 
I've been here way before you, dude. I'm kinetic. Look me up, I've been banned about fifty times.
 
thusell said:
But at the trial, at least the resident can testify under oath that this guy has a small penis and have it entered into the judicial records. I'd just have my lawyer spend about two days asking me repeatedly to point out the guy with a small penis so I could point at him and say, "let the records show that he is pointing at the plaintiff."
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:laugh: :laugh:
 
According to the story, the guy never divulged the patient's name. Therefore, it's not a HIPAA violation. I can tell you at any time in any public place that a guy came in with a large black dildo in his rear end that he couldn't remove (true story) and even give you his initials. We could laugh about it right in front of him, too, which is pretty sweet. Also, I could come up with inventive and clever names for him to entertain the entire team.
 
sounds like a story of 3 idiots.

One gets his penis tatooed
Second takes a picture and shares it w/ ppl he can't trust
Third calls press over something like this (not trivial, but definitely not something u want whole world to know).

What remains to be seen is how much sense Mayo has and what it does to stand behind its resident...will show how much as an institution it believes in the idea of a family.
 
They stood behind him long enough to kick him out the door. Like I said, sounds like a POS place with a lot of POS people.
 
Tired said:
This guy was in his hospital, and even if he didn't use the pt's name, if he provided enough information that a reasonable person could identify him ("Hey, look the pictures of this guy's penis that I just operated on!") then it is a HIPAA violation.
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The only way you could identify some guy based on "look, it's a picture of a guy's tattooed penis" is if you knew the guy and had seen him naked for some reason prior to his hospitalization. In which case, probably you'd be better off not admitting that you knew who the resident was talking about.
 
Do you guys believe just about any residency would offer the resident as a sacrificial lamb here, or is Mayo in the minority?

And I'd be willing to bet that this isn't the first time a picture of this dude's penis has been spread amongst people. You just don't get something like that and not want to show it off.

This story does make me mad, and sick, but only b/c the MD got fired....disgusting. :mad::rolleyes:
 
Southpaw said:
Do you guys believe just about any residency would offer the resident as a sacrificial lamb here?
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Yes. they don't want the publicity. should have just waited- this guy sounds like a tool and it would have died down quickly. more "patients as consumers" BS
 
Everyone keeps on bringing up the whole "photographs will only be taken for educational purposes" thing. I'm pretty sure that this is educational in that it's teaching people that getting silly tattooes will get you laughed at. Also, yeah, any program would gladly use a resident to save itself. Programs demand ethical behavior from everyone but themselves. It's pretty neat.
 
Carpenter said:
What remains to be seen is how much sense Mayo has and what it does to stand behind its resident...will show how much as an institution it believes in the idea of a family.
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But how on Earth is the Mayo Clinic supposed to defend their resident over something like this? That he used his camera phone to take a picture of a patient's penis for kicks and then proceeded to show it to his colleagues?

There's just no acceptable reason for it.
 
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