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Touro-Ca vs WesternU-Pomona

Started by IamKing
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IamKing

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I am extremely grateful to have been accepted into both of these schools. I am looking for some insight as to which would be the better one for me to attend. From what I can gather about the universities:

Western Advantages:
-Better rotations
-excellent reputation
-better campus
-great volunteer opportunities
-early patient exposure at free clinics

Western Disadvantages:
-Poor availability of professors
-Lectures that are webcast from the Oregon Campus
-surprisingly expensive housing

Touro-Ca Advantages:
-excellent student-professor relationships /open door policy with professors
-opportunity to do dual MPH program
-smaller class size
-close to home for me (Bay Area native)
-slightly cheaper housing

Touro-Ca Disadvantages:
-worse looking campus, although not terrible as many say
-rotation spots that are spread throughout California

If anyone knows which school does better on the boards (How well students do, not how many pass) I would love to know. I would factor this into my decision. I have called both schools and asked many students, but no one seems to know.

Please correct me if any of the information that I have presented is wrong. I am specifically interested in exactly how bad/good are Touro-Ca rotation opportunities. Please let me know what you all think! 😀
 
I would choose Western in a heartbeat. I believe the rotations are much, much better than TUCOM-CA. Also, are there really lectures streamed from Oregon's campus? Granted I didn't interview at Western, but I always thought that Lebanon's campus streamed from Pomona, not the other way around.
 
IamKing said:
I am extremely grateful to have been accepted into both of these schools. I am looking for some insight as to which would be the better one for me to attend. From what I can gather about the universities:

Western Advantages:
-Better rotations
-excellent reputation
-better campus
-great volunteer opportunities
-early patient exposure at free clinics

Western Disadvantages:
-Poor availability of professors
-Lectures that are webcast from the Oregon Campus
-surprisingly expensive housing

Touro-Ca Advantages:
-excellent student-professor relationships /open door policy with professors
-opportunity to do dual MPH program
-smaller class size
-close to home for me (Bay Area native)
-slightly cheaper housing

Touro-Ca Disadvantages:
-worse looking campus, although not terrible as many say
-rotation spots that are spread throughout California

If anyone knows which school does better on the boards (How well students do, not how many pass) I would love to know. I would factor this into my decision. I have called both schools and asked many students, but no one seems to know.

Please correct me if any of the information that I have presented is wrong. I am specifically interested in exactly how bad/good are Touro-Ca rotation opportunities. Please let me know what you all think! 😀
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a7cc6952-8667-448c-80ad-64bca4795736.jpg



Western's my #1. Good luck in your decision bru.
 
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LastPolarBear said:
I would choose Western in a heartbeat. I believe the rotations are much, much better than TUCOM-CA. Also, are there really lectures streamed from Oregon's campus? Granted I didn't interview at Western, but I always thought that Lebanon's campus streamed from Pomona, not the other way around.
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They are live streamed both ways. They have the professors that are "experts" in the topic give the lecture for the day, and then stream it to the respective campus.
 
IamKing said:
I really hope you get an interview here soon man! Why is Western your uncontested #1?
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Number of reasons:

1) Closest to family and significant other

2) Excellent rotation sites

3) California

4) Reputation

5) California

Ultimately, I want to practice in California as I've lived here 95% of my life. I think that Western would offer me the best chance to network with and possibly land a residency here in California. Board scores are great and all that jazz, but I've learned that its mostly up to YOU to score well, not on the school itself. Above all else, it's close to home. My parents live 1hr away from Pomona, and SO lives 2 hours away. Just having them closeby would make me able to study that much harder knowing that if I really had to, I could hop in the car for a quick visit if I'm feeling homesick.

Don't get me wrong though, I'm excited as all hell to get into AZCOM as it was my #2. But if Western called me up and was like yo mang, you wanna roll wit us? I'd be all over that.
 
The question is, do you want to stay in the Bay area for rotations and/or possibly residency? Touro might be a better bet as 90% of their rotations are in the Bay area, and 10% in the rest of CA.

I'd call both schools' clinical directors and get the skinny on where exactly you'll be rotating. Us pre-meds on SDN can only be of limited help (especially me, I haven't even interviewed at either).
 
P.S. Touro wasn't even on the map for me. I've heard too many bad things from a current Touro-NV student (an old high school buddy) that put me off about it. Granted n=1, but still... and NV is supposed to be the best one of the three. Could be different at Touro-CA

Edit: I did apply though ^_^b. Beggers can't be choosers.
 
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DrWily said:
Number of reasons:

1) Closest to family and significant other

2) Excellent rotation sites

3) California

4) Reputation

5) California

Ultimately, I want to practice in California as I've lived here 95% of my life. I think that Western would offer me the best chance to network with and possibly land a residency here in California. Board scores are great and all that jazz, but I've learned that its mostly up to YOU to score well, not on the school itself. Above all else, it's close to home. My parents live 1hr away from Pomona, and SO lives 2 hours away. Just having them closeby would make me able to study that much harder knowing that if I really had to, I could hop in the car for a quick visit if I'm feeling homesick.
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That makes a lot of sense. Similarly, Touro-Ca is 50 minutes from family, and about 1.5 hours from my GF haha. Proximity to my friends, family, and GF I think is what is making this decision very difficult. I also know many Touro-Ca graduates are doing well in the bay area. My mom works at a hospital, and she says that many of the lead physicians are from Touro (This is still nor-cal though). Are rotation sites extremely important in landing good residencies? I ultimately want to practice in Nor-Cal.
 
IamKing said:
That makes a lot of sense. Similarly, Touro-Ca is 50 minutes from family, and about 1.5 hours from my GF haha. Proximity to my friends, family, and GF I think is what is making this decision very difficult. I also know many Touro-Ca graduates are doing well in the bay area. My mom works at a hospital, and she says that many of the lead physicians are from Touro (This is still nor-cal though). Are rotation sites extremely important in landing good residencies? I ultimately want to practice in Nor-Cal.
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It's important to have good quality teaching at your rotation sites with a wide breadth of cases for a lot of exposure. Generally smaller hospitals or lesser known ones will have less case diversity which can affect your education. That being said, for landing a residency.. it's much more important to do well on boards, get excellent LORs, and clinical grades. It also depends on what you want to do. If you want to do IM, then probably not so much. More competitive fields will require you to step it up. If Touro-CA has a good network of graduates in the Bay Area and that's where you want to ultimately land, then who knows? Maybe Touro-CA is the one for you. Close to home, good network, want to stay there... Both schools will make you a doctor, it's up to you to apply yourself to be the best you can be at either one.
 
DrWily said:
P.S. Touro wasn't even on the map for me. I've heard too many bad things from a current Touro-NV student (an old high school buddy) that put me off about it. Granted n=1, but still... and NV is supposed to be the best one of the three.
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i have nothing anecdotal crap to add, but I have heard similar. I have heard nothing bad about western but have heard a couple things that make me question touro. mainly rotation stuff, much of which i don't remember, but I do remember negative comments about it.
 
Also remember that you have elective rotations so you can go anywhere if you set it up. Most people use these to audition at potential residency locations they want to go to. If you opt for the ACGME match, then auditioning probably won't help very much. AOA match, its almost mandatory to audition.
 
IamKing said:
Why? Any specific reason?
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-Stronger rotations, at sites that actually have residency programs. Touro-CA has supposedly improved the quality of their rotations recently, but wouldn't you rather go to the school that most definitely has quality rotations?
-Much more established. Better track record.
-Pomona and Vallejo are both crappy cities, but Pomona isn't as bad.
-A few other reasons too, but I need to get back to studying for blocks.
 
I am from Northern California but finishing undergrad fairly near Western. I also have a friend (alumni) who is now a MS1 at Western. I also shadowed Touro-CA graduated DO's as well as shadowed students at the campus for a day.

From my experience, all the faculty at Tucom seemed very supportive. They also seemed very supportive of OMM. Western seemed not as enthusiastic about OMM. Western also seemed a little more board-oriented.

Hope that helps!
 
Western has stronger rotations. Doesn't matter where you go school-wise if you want to practice in Bay Area again, just make sure your rotation sites are strong (i.e. lvl 1 trauma for EM, etc.) and that you have a solid amount of ward-based rotations. Away rotations will fill in your need to show residencies that you can hang, also good opportunity to grab LOR from more reputable place.
 
Nymphicus said:
I am from Northern California but finishing undergrad fairly near Western. I also have a friend (alumni) who is now a MS1 at Western. I also shadowed Touro-CA graduated DO's as well as shadowed students at the campus for a day.

From my experience, all the faculty at Tucom seemed very supportive. They also seemed very supportive of OMM. Western seemed not as enthusiastic about OMM. Western also seemed a little more board-oriented.

Hope that helps!
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That did help, thanks!

jinobi said:
Western has stronger rotations. Doesn't matter where you go school-wise if you want to practice in Bay Area again, just make sure your rotation sites are strong (i.e. lvl 1 trauma for EM, etc.) and that you have a solid amount of ward-based rotations. Away rotations will fill in your need to show residencies that you can hang, also good opportunity to grab LOR from more reputable place.
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What do you mean by "away rotations?" Are those the same as audition rotations?

Where do the LOR's come from? Your professors or the people that you rotate with? Also, since Western has a much larger class size with apparently less accessible professors, wouldn't that make it harder to get solid LOR's?
 
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IamKing said:
What do you mean by "away rotations?" Are those the same as audition rotations?

Where do the LOR's come from? Your professors or the people that you rotate with? Also, since Western has a much larger class size with apparently less accessible professors, wouldn't that make it harder to get solid LOR's?
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Away rotations are the same as audition rotations, they're done primarily during your 4th year (maybe 1 in your 3rd year).

LORs come from the attendings you work with during your rotations. Not a problem even with a huge class (seriously, 228 western?!) as long as you have adequate amounts of rotation sites to provide for students.
 
jinobi said:
Away rotations are the same as audition rotations, they're done primarily during your 4th year (maybe 1 in your 3rd year).

LORs come from the attendings you work with during your rotations. Not a problem even with a huge class (seriously, 228 western?!) as long as you have adequate amounts of rotation sites to provide for students.
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The 228 comes from both campuses (they consider us one class). I know that Western Lebanon is accepting 107 so that would mean that Pomona has 121.
 
emtthink said:
The 228 comes from both campuses (they consider us one class). I know that Western Lebanon is accepting 107 so that would mean that Pomona has 121.
Click to expand...

Can anyone else confirm this? It was my impression at the interview that Pomona has around 220 students, and the Lebanon campus has an additional 60.
 
IamKing, I think your idea of the class size is right. I was at WesternU Pomona campus white coat ceremony this year and about ~220 students were inducted into the class of 2015. and i believe there are about 60 students in lebanon may be more. but for sure the number of DO students in pomona is in the 200s
 
IamKing said:
Can anyone else confirm this? It was my impression at the interview that Pomona has around 220 students, and the Lebanon campus has an additional 60.
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I am 100% sure that Lebanon will be accepting 107 student for next year, and the class of 2015 has 107 students. I don't know how many Pomona has though. I know this because I'm Lebanon's class of 2016.
 
I got accepted to both and also am a bay area native. I ended up choosing TUCOM-CA though. It was very important for me to be by my fiance, who is at UCD and I really wanted to get a dual degree. I enjoy the TU campus, and liked the anatomy lab. I am also into OMM and there is more of a concentration on it at TU. Location though was my big reasoning, because rotations lead to residency and so its really where you want to spend a large chunk of your life. Good luck on your choice, Im sure you only have a couple of days left for Touro right?
 
smoodle said:
I got accepted to both and also am a bay area native. I ended up choosing TUCOM-CA though. It was very important for me to be by my fiance, who is at UCD and I really wanted to get a dual degree. I enjoy the TU campus, and liked the anatomy lab. I am also into OMM and there is more of a concentration on it at TU. Location though was my big reasoning, because rotations lead to residency and so its really where you want to spend a large chunk of your life. Good luck on your choice, Im sure you only have a couple of days left for Touro right?
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Thank you for your response! You are the first person that I have talked to that choose TUCOM-Ca over Western. I was leaning towards Touro initially, until I got the negative feedback from the peeps on SDN. I also would like to practice in the Bay Area--I have lived here my whole life. Also, my family and SO are here too. I just want to go to the school that will give me the best opportunity to do any specialty I want when the time comes.

I know now that Western has a better pass rate on the complex, but after talking to one of the Dean's at Touro, he said that it is likely due to the fact that Touro-Ca focuses more on the USMLE for the ACGME residencies. He said there are almost no AOA residencies in California. I have to make a decision soon though...
 
IamKing said:
Thank you for your response! You are the first person that I have talked to that choose TUCOM-Ca over Western. I was leaning towards Touro initially, until I got the negative feedback from the peeps on SDN. I also would like to practice in the Bay Area--I have lived here my whole life. Also, my family and SO are here too. I just want to go to the school that will give me the best opportunity to do any specialty I want when the time comes.

I know now that Western has a better pass rate on the complex, but after talking to one of the Dean's at Touro, he said that it is likely due to the fact that Touro-Ca focuses more on the USMLE for the ACGME residencies. He said there are almost no AOA residencies in California. I have to make a decision soon though...
Click to expand...

I know now that Western has a better pass rate on the complex, but after talking to one of the Dean's at Touro,
Click to expand...

better pass rate on the complex
Click to expand...

complex
Click to expand...


Just messing with you bro :laugh:

Like I said above, board scores are much more about YOU and how YOU study and prepare for it. If you know that you would be happier in Bay Area near your family and GF, that'll just make you better able to study vs having to deal with long-distance relationships. If you know you want to go ACGME residency, then audition rotations don't matter *that* much. There's way too many applicants for everyone to get an audition rotation at a competitive residency. This is where your board scores, Letters of Recommendation, and clinical grades will shine... and you can get this at any school. Go where you'll be happy and better able to study the most and focus.
 
DrWily said:
Just messing with you bro :laugh:

Like I said above, board scores are much more about YOU and how YOU study and prepare for it. If you know that you would be happier in Bay Area near your family and GF, that'll just make you better able to study vs having to deal with long-distance relationships. If you know you want to go ACGME residency, then audition rotations don't matter *that* much. There's way too many applicants for everyone to get an audition rotation at a competitive residency. This is where your board scores, Letters of Recommendation, and clinical grades will shine... and you can get this at any school. Go where you'll be happy and better able to study the most and focus.
Click to expand...

Haha, I actually accidentally said COMPLEX at one of my earlier interviews, and the interviewer got kinda pissed and corrected me. I assure you I learned my lesson, and it was only a typo here. 😎

In Northern California there are almost no AOA residencies, so I wouldn't really have a choice. It was my impression that in Southern California there aren't many AOA residencies either? And, most students go into ACGME there too??
 
Also, what do you all think of percentile grading of 70%-100% for Touro versus the Fail,Pass, Honors system at WesternU?
 
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IamKing said:
Haha, I actually accidentally said COMPLEX at one of my earlier interviews, and the interviewer got kinda pissed and corrected me. I assure you I learned my lesson, and it was only a typo here. 😎

In Northern California there are almost no AOA residencies, so I wouldn't really have a choice. It was my impression that in Southern California there aren't many AOA residencies either? And, most students go into ACGME there too??
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Yea, ACGME. But some ACGME programs do take COMLEX scores... but I'd just commit to taking the USMLE for sure. If Touro-CA has solid rotation sites (nothing glaringly wrong with them), then you won't miss out on anything at Western unless you are dying to go to SoCal and want to attend a more "reputable" med school. You'll still be a physician no matter where you go. Just score well on the boards to land that ACGME residency in Bay Area.


IamKing said:
Also, what do you all think of percentile grading of 70%-100% for Touro versus the Fail,Pass, Honors system at WesternU?
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Pre-Clinical grades don't really mean jack. 240 USMLE in bottom 25% of class is way better than 210 USMLE in top 25% of class. You only really get into the good stuff if you're the top 10%. Even the Fail, Pass, Honors system at Western should rank their students right? (i'm not sure on this) Clinical grades do mean a lot though.
 
jinobi said:
Away rotations are the same as audition rotations
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Not quite. You can do audition rotations at your home program in order to get noticed for residency. You can do away rotations because you do not have that particular rotation available at your home institution but have no interest in the place you are rotating at.
 
IamKing said:
I know now that Western has a better pass rate on the complex, but after talking to one of the Dean's at Touro, he said that it is likely due to the fact that Touro-Ca focuses more on the USMLE for the ACGME residencies. He said there are almost no AOA residencies in California. I have to make a decision soon though...
Click to expand...

That sounds like a BS answer. You need to pass COMLEX in order to get licensed, so while having a good USMLE score is important, not passing COMLEX is a career-stopper.
 
DrWily said:
If you know you want to go ACGME residency, then audition rotations don't matter *that* much. There's way too many applicants for everyone to get an audition rotation at a competitive residency.
Click to expand...

Audition rotations can make or break your chances. An applicant with an otherwise lackluster app who shines on the audition can climb higher on the rank list. Have seen it.
 
tkim said:
That sounds like a BS answer. You need to pass COMLEX in order to get licensed, so while having a good USMLE score is important, not passing COMLEX is a career-stopper.
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Yep. Passing COMLEX I, II-CE and II-PE is also a requirement for graduation at every DO school.
 
Ahhh great thread. I'm in the same situation...trying to decide between touro ca and western.
 
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its kind of funny you guys think Western isn't that great with OMM when it is the only school I have seen that REQUIRES an OMM rotation your 3rd year
 
IDFsoldierboy said:
its kind of funny you guys think Western isn't that great with OMM when it is the only school I have seen that REQUIRES an OMM rotation your 3rd year
Click to expand...


I don't think anyone said that WesternU "is not that great with OMM" only that Touro-Ca concentrates on it a little more. I was not aware that WesternU required a third year rotation in OMM, so thank you for that information.

I know that at Touro-Ca at every OMM session they have 3-4 professors working with students along with a few fellows, and 1-2 T.A's. It was my understanding that at Western there is only one 1 professor, 2 fellows, and a lot of T.A's present. The tour guides when I was at Touro-Ca also said that all the professors that teach OMT are extremely well known in the OMM community--I don't know how much of this is based in fact, all I know is that they prided themselves in having multiple OMT experts at every OMM class.
 
I have now talked to a few graduates of Touro-Ca that say they did all their rotations in the Bay Area, and that their traveling wasn't to extensive. A few current students I have talked to, that haven't started rotations, have told me that 90% of rotations can be done in the Bay and that within 1-2 years (when I will start rotations) that number should be 100%.
 
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dannydickman said:
^

Where are you leaning?
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Touro-Ca. I have spoken with a few first years at WesternU, and they overwhelmingly have stated that the curriculum is unorganized and the professors are inaccessible. Although, WesternU has a better reputation I feel that these two aspects are too important to overlook.

Also, Touro-Ca has been steadily raising their standards for admitted students. Even though WesternU brags a better pass-rate on the COMLEX, some of the data from Touro-Ca is old, and I believe will change for the better over the next couple of years.

Touro-Ca seems to be moving in the right direction too. For example, they have moved to computerizing all their exams so that their students are more equipped for the boards.
 
I forgot to mention that even though a med school shouldn't be chosen based on match lists, Touro-Ca had some pretty impressive matches this last year. Here is a comparison:

Touro-Ca:
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&p...wN2Nk&hl=en_US

WesternU:

Anesthesiology
ACGME
Cleveland Clinic
Univ of Mississippi Med Center
University of Colorado
University of Florida
University of Texas Houston
University of Texas Medial Branch
Virginia Mason
AOA
Riverside County Regional Med Center x2

Emergency Medicine
ACGME
Denver Health Medical Center
Kern Medical Center x2
Resurrection Medical Center
Synergy Med Ed Alliance-MI
AOA
Arrowhead Regional Medical Center x4
Botsford Hospital
Good Samaritan
Pontiac Osteopathic Hospital
St. James Hospital and Health/ CCOM x2
St. Mary Mercy Hospital
UNECOM/Kent

EM/IM
PCOM Aria Healthcare (AOA)

ENT/Facial Plastics
Detroit Medical Center (AOA)

Family Medicine
ACGME
Baylor College of Medicine
Contra Costa
Glendale Adventist Medical Center
Harbor UCLA
Kaiser Fontana x2
Kaiser OC x5
Kaiser Riverside
Loma Linda University
Long Beach Memorial
Northern Colorado Medical Center
Northridge Hospital Medical Center
O'Connor/Stanford x3
Palmetto Health
Pomona Valley Medical Center
San Joaquin General Hospital
Scripps Mercy Chula Vista
UCI x2
UCLA- Santa Monica
UCSD x3
University of Massachusetts
USC - California Hospital
UT Southwestern Medical Center
Valley Medical Center x3
White Memorial x3
ACGME/AOA
Central Maine Medical Center
Glendale Adventist Medical Center
Martin Army Community Hospital
Providence St. Peter
Raleigh General
University of Wyoming
AOA
Arrowhead Regional Medical Center
Christ Hospital
Downey Regional Medical Center
Good Samaritan Reg Med
Lutheran Medical Center
Riverside Regional Medical Center
St. John's Episcopal
Wilson Medical Center
Military
Womack

General Surgery
ACGME
Oregon Health and Sciences University
AOA
Arrowhead Regional Medical Center

Internal Medicine
ACGME
Dartmouth-Hitchcock Medical Center
Gundersen Lutheran Medical Foundation Program
Legacy Good Samaritan/Emanuel Hospital x2
Loma Linda University x7
UCI
UCLA-Olive View
UCSF Fresno x2
University of Arizona
University of Chicago/NorthShore
University of Pittsburgh Medical Center
ACGME/AOA
Geisinger Medical Center
AOA
Arrowhead Regional Medical Center x5
Genesys Regional Medical Center
Henry Ford Macomb Hospitals

IM/Flight Med
WPAFB/WrightStateUniv. (Military)

Neurosurgery
North Shore Long Island Jewish (AOA/ACGME)

OB/GYN
ACGME
Harbor UCLA
Loma Linda University x2
Ohio State University
Sinai Hospital of Baltimore
UMDNJ Newark
University of Tennessee
AOA
Arrowhead Regional Medical Center x2
Mercy St. Vincent Medical Center

Orthopedic Surgery
AOA
Botsford Hospital
Ingham Regional Medical Center
St. James Hospital and Health/ CCOM

Pathology
ACGME
Cedars - Sinai Medical Center
University of South Alabama
USC x2

Pediatrics
ACGME
Greenville Children's Hospital
Harbor- UCLA
Levine Children's Hospital/CMC
Loma Linda University
Lutheran General Children's Hospital
University of Nevada, Las Vegas
USC

PM&R
ACGME
Carolinas Medical Center/CMC
Loma Linda University
Mayo Clinic
Nassau University Medical Center
NYU Rusk Rehabilitation x2
Sinai Hospital of Baltimore
Stanford School of Medicine
UT Southwestern Medical Center
ACGME/AOA
Nassau University Medical Center

Psychiatry
ACGME
Advocate Lutheran General Hospital
Banner Good Samaritan/U of A x2
Harbor UCLA
Harvard South Shore
Loma Linda University x3
U of Kansas, Wichita
UCSF Fresno
University New Mexico SOM
University of Michigan, Ann Arbor
University of Nevada, Las Vegas x2
USC
ACGME/AOA
John Peter Smith Hospital
AOA
Arrowhead Regional Medical Center
Good Samaritan Reg Med
Millcreek Community Hospital (LECOM)

Radiology
ACGME
Kaiser Los Angeles Medical Center (Sunset)
AOA
Botsford Hospital
Mount Clemens Regional Medical Center

Also, keep in mind that even though Touro-Ca seems to have less matches in specialties, their class size is nearly half of WesternU's.
 
Go to the cheaper one. Both are in CA and will put you in good stead to match in-state if that is your aim.
 
In case anyone was curious, after much deliberation, I choose to attend WesternU-Pomona over Touro-Ca.

Good luck everyone in your applications, and thank you for providing me with answers that assisted me in making a very difficult choice. If anyone has any other questions please feel free to pm me.
 
IamKing said:
In case anyone was curious, after much deliberation, I choose to attend WesternU-Pomona over Touro-Ca.

Good luck everyone in your applications, and thank you for providing me with answers that assisted me in making a very difficult choice. If anyone has any other questions please feel free to pm me.
Click to expand...

Good choice! 👍
 
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