1 year non-thesis masters programs

[lunabean19]

Hello,

I am working towards getting into vet school. I applied to several schools last fall and did not get in anywhere. I was told that my GPA is too low and I should look into one year non-thesis masters programs. I seemed to have missed the deadlines for the programs at tufts and CSU. Does anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks!

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[VAgirl]

I did one at Georgetown, and the deadline for it has not passed, but just barely (it's July 1). May not be your area of interest, but here's the link anyway:
http://microbiology.georgetown.edu/education/msemphasis.html

FWIW, I know a good number of people who've done the program and gone on to be accepted to medical school, and I was accepted to vet school.

It also might be worth contacting Tufts and CSU to see if the application deadline is at all flexible. Maybe they'd still accept your application.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[rachroo]

Does anyone know of a one year non-thesis master for a school in Ohio?

 

[jeeney]

Does anyone know of a one year non-thesis master for a school in Ohio?

same question....but are there any in California?

 

[LVT2DVM]

I have posted this before and I know the "online" thing can be an issue for some schools, but Im applying to this program. Dont let the quote/ recommendation at the top of the page from a teacher throw you. They have several graduates who have been accepted to vetschool (Illinois and Louisiana) and med schools following graduation. I have talked to the admissions office and while its posted/ recommended on their website to not take more than 6 credits per semester, you can request to take more and they typically grant it. There is no application deadline and the tuition is pretty reasonable and comparable to other M.S. programs. The online graduate bio courses are equivalent to their on-site courses and your transcripts will not reflect any difference. I found their admissions office very helpfull!

http://www.sjc.edu/content.cfm/pageid/5865

 

[chordy4]

Does anyone know of a one year non-thesis master for a school in Ohio?

it's not quite 1 year...but Ohio State has a relatively new program for a MPH (master's in public health) with an emphasis in veterinary medicine.
I just applied this year when I found out I didn't get into vet school since my grades weren't bad but weren't great, so thought it might improve my chances of getting in/I have a legitimate interest in public health and I got in, yay!

they say it takes anywhere from 1.5-2 years, but that you can fit it into vet school relatively easily, ie. if you apply to vet school at the start of your first year in the MPH program and get into vet school, you can complete that first year in the MPH program, then start vet school the fall after your first year and complete the MPH the summer after your first year of vet school.

sorry if that sounds really confusing...I think it may only apply to Ohio residents, but don't know for certain.
anyways, just a potential option...

 

[Electrophile]

Just in case everyone thinks that the 1 year masters is a ticket to getting in, think twice before signing up. I was told by multiple ad com folks at Missouri at my 3 year research based masters in biology was NOT a by into the program. And mine was like a mini PhD, not just take an extra year's worth of classes kind of thing. So just be careful you're not signing up for something that's expensive and that may not help much anyways!

The ad coms know that in grad school (at least research based), your grades in classes are not particularly important. Most professors give out Bs in the very least (most...) as they know if you get below a 3.0 cumulative, you're out. So while you can't slack, you'll likely do better just because class work is not the focus.

I also personally get really irritated having the "same" degree (an MA) for doing much more work and I really wish these plan B options had a different degree designation as most seem identical to post bacc work (which is essentially doing another senior year), you just get a piece of paper for it. With the popularity of them, I also get really irritated by people who have asked me straight up, "oh, did you get a masters first because you couldn't get in the first time?" Uh...NO. I actually enjoy my area of research, thanks! I wasn't even pre-vet until after I was well into grad school.

It just irks me that if you get a BA/BS in biology somewhere, everyone knows that you'll have taken similar amount of classes and the degrees are fairly similar, perhaps unless you go to a real small liberal arts school, whereas the plan B type MA/MS programs are not in the same level as my MA. I'd say if you want a masters in biology, etc, do the research experience, do the thesis, do the grad level classes. That'll help you a lot more in the long run than just a year of classes. And the PhD faculty during vet school will respect you a lot more if you've done real research and you understand from first hand experience the research method. You're more on their level as peers, which is cool. I did some pretty in depth research during undergrad (definitely a lot more than being a dish bitch in the lab!), but it's not nearly to the same level and intensity as grad school. If you just want extra classes to help get into vet school, do an MPH especially if public health is an interest (and even some of them require research) or a post bacc. I hate to have it boil down to saying "my piece of paper is worth more than your piece of paper," but yeah...and it may not even help in the end!

 

[SweeTeaPie]

I was told that my GPA is too low and I should look into one year non-thesis masters programs.
Thanks!

Seems like someone (either admissions or an adcom) told lunabean specifically to look into one year non-thesis masters program. There's really no need for you to get better about it. His/her goal is obviously to get into vet school, not spend three years and a lot of money working towards a thesis-based masters that may or may not be beneficial to him/her.

Electrophile, like you said, you didn't even go pre-vet until you were already in grad school; this is obviously not lunabean's case. I myself spent the past three years in research and wouldn't even consider getting a thesis based masters just to get into vet school. In my opinion, it's a waste. But that's because I have no interest in research at all anymore. If this person can get into school with a non thesis based masters, well then good! It's not like a Masters is REQUIRED to get into vet school! If it was, then that would be a different story. However, there are plenty of us that go in with a B.S. Obviously, Electrophile, you are also in vet school, so don't be so bitter. You chose to put a lot of hard work and effort into your Masters, and I'm sure you personally benefitted from it, but that's not for everyone.

 

[VAgirl]

I also personally get really irritated having the "same" degree (an MA) for doing much more work and I really wish these plan B options had a different degree designation as most seem identical to post bacc work (which is essentially doing another senior year), you just get a piece of paper for it.

Electrophile, you're coming off fairly obnoxiously here. First of all, one year masters programs are not all "Plan B" programs. Some people are legitimately interested in what they studied. I'd even venture a guess that the people who are exploring these programs after not getting into vet school on round one are also (more often than not) genuinely interested in the programs they're looking at.

Second, yes, you did a long, grad program with lots of research and that was good for you. I did a one year masters (though I did it in 2 years while working full time and tailoring my program exactly to what I wanted, including doing some research and an amazing internship, all as a part of my program). And that was good for me. It'd be really nice if you stopped putting down masters programs you see as less than yours. Seriously, different strokes for different folks. Why can't you let it be at that?

 

[Electrophile]

I'm not bitter at all, I'm just warning you all that it's no guarantee like some people make it out to be. As I said, I was told by several folks at Missouri who either are or were on the adcom that even a thesis based masters degree does not necessarily help you get in. So it's a warning that it's not a free ticket and so to be careful of signing up for something that may be expensive, won't help necessarily you get in, and may be a waste of your time. I wouldn't be surprised if some schools with plan B programs pushed them to applicants lower in the pool as a cash cow more than anything.

I clearly NEVER said that everyone needs to get a masters degree, thesis based or no. What my point is that these plan B programs may not even help and from what I've seen of the requirements and the coursework, they're not really any much different than taking 5 years to graduate than 4 years.

You're absolutely right. I did put a lot of hard work and effort into mine, which is why I maintain that a 1 year plan B "masters" should be differentiated from a 2-3 year research based masters. People can do them if they like, that's just fine, but if someone claims that their 1 year plan B program is the same as the work in research based masters, that's like a communication major saying their program was just as intense as a honors biochemistry major. They are just not the same. Heck, they couldn't even spell "masteres" right on that St. Joseph College site.

I did mine not to improve my application for anywhere, but because I was in between going to law school straight away (I already had my spot in law school) or doing a PhD and it was a good segway as I liked research, but didn't absolutely love it. If you just want to improve your app, there are MUCH MUCH less painful ways of going about it. Anyway, point is, they should just call it something else. Simple as that. It could be a Diet Coke Masters. Or a research masters could be a Mini PhD. Whatever works. It's just confusing nomenclature which IMO needs to be clarified because it seems misleading one way or the other.

 

[Electrophile]

Btw, I'm really not trying to sound like "OMG, I'm so awesome cause I stuck with it for 3 years, everyone worship me." I would have actually finished mine in two years if we didn't have to kill our whole mouse colony cause they had mouse hepatitis and parvo virus and start from scratch, wasting 6 months of my time. It's just that even folks in academics are not always certain of the distinction, let alone the average layperson.

 

[nyanko]

Well but, once you get to the interview stage don't you think that they'll pay attention to that sort of thing at that point? I mean, ostensibly your research experience still serves to set you apart from the other applicants without it, regardless of whether they have a BS or an MS...

 

[Electrophile]

Oh, I know! I was totally incredulous when I first heard that. My faculty adviser from grad school was like "WHAT? How does a 21 year old who's applying for the first time and still wet behind the ears even compare with what you have to go through in grad school?!" But I did indeed hear it from more than one source.

So during the interview and on my app, what I did instead of saying "yeah, I am just about done with my masters degree in biology," I emphasized the fact that it was an extra 3 years of graduate level classes, 3 years of experience teaching non-science major undergrads about basic biology as a TA (which is VERY important to relating to future clients), 3 years of extra maturity (HA!) from having grad level classes, 25-60 hours a week in the lab, teaching, and so on all it one time, presented research results and attended at multiple national conferences, etc. I made sure to emphasize the differences in experience I had versus someone applying right out of undergrad and I think that helped.

 

[lunabean19]

Originally posted by VAGirl - "I did a one year masters (though I did it in 2 years while working full time and tailoring my program exactly to what I wanted, including doing some research and an amazing internship, all as a part of my program). And that was good for me."

Where did you do this program? Thanks!

 

[VAgirl]

Originally posted by VAGirl - "I did a one year masters (though I did it in 2 years while working full time and tailoring my program exactly to what I wanted, including doing some research and an amazing internship, all as a part of my program). And that was good for me."

Where did you do this program? Thanks!

lunabean--This is the program:

I did one at Georgetown, and the deadline for it has not passed, but just barely (it's July 1). May not be your area of interest, but here's the link anyway:
http://microbiology.georgetown.edu/education/msemphasis.html

FWIW, I know a good number of people who've done the program and gone on to be accepted to medical school, and I was accepted to vet school.

 

[rachroo]

If you just want to improve your app, there are MUCH MUCH less painful ways of going about it.

Although, for those of us with a poor GPA, improvment in grades (be they grad courses or post bacc) may be a reality.

I for one, am glad that these "1 year-non-thesis master programs" exist. If I do not get into vet school on my first try I am only going to apply to programs that I have a genuine interest in learning more about. But to be honest, I do not have interest in research/working in a lab at this time (but I have the utmost respect for those who do) and am glad there are other options.

 

[tastrophe]

I am absolutely amazed that there are online science-based masters' programs out there now. I searched for years (99-02) for something that would fit my work schedule, and there was nothing, not even a traditional program in my area that would allow part-time status. So I think these programs are long overdue, and I do not think they will be confused with traditional programs anytime soon.

Although, I can see our grandchildren saying "you mean you actually had to leave your house to go to school??"

 

[Apollo84]

This thread has been really informative. I have applied to vet school twice and haven't gotten in, most likely due to my GPA. I didn't apply this past year because I don't know if I want to keep trying. It seems like the only chance of getting into vet school would be to go to grad school first and help my GPA. Of course, there is first the issue of getting into grad school. I'm glad to hear there are so many options, including online programs. Nothing is a guarantee, but I think it would help if I did more school after undergrad. I resisted going this route but I don't think there are any other options (other than going to foreign countries, which I am really not sure about). I know these online master's programs definitely weren't around a few years ago, so I am going to look into it.

 

[ckgilabert]

I was told that if you do a non-thesis masters that if you want to go for your PhD that you can't. is that right?

 

[LucyLoo]

I think it depends on the school and the program. I was looking into the 1 year masters at CSU and asked the coordinator about that. She said that a PhD is still an option, I just have to do a couple of extra steps (probably like right a thesis )

 

[CBRGrl]

I was told that if you do a non-thesis masters that if you want to go for your PhD that you can't. is that right?

Just some thoughts Im currently set to start a one-year non-thesis masters, and I asked that very question to one of the advisers here before committing to the program (just in case i don't get into the DVM program, I think a PhD would be my next choice...and I didnt want to rule myself out of either option!). Basically, it depends on the program. But most PhD programs will allow you to transfer a certain number of grad level courses to their PhD program (especially if they are taken at the same institution). A lot of PhDs out there are designed to conform to the student's ultimate research interest, and the program itself is structured around a plan laid out by the student and his/her adviser...so if your master's helps you find some direction, I'm sure you'd be able to find a groove and set in on your PhD.

 

[lailanni]

In all fairness to Electrophile, I can see where she (he?) is coming from.

It would be frustrating to have the same degree recognition (putting in 2 or more years of time and research) as someone who did 1 year and no research.

I haven't heard of 1 year non-thesis masters programs, and honestly I'm surprised there are 1 year science masters that don't have a research compenent - science and research go hand in hand. I was under the impression that a masters required a thesis, even for the non science folks. Being that it's just more classes, I'm not sure I understand how it differs from doing just extra post-bacc?

That said, the 1yr program is a great idea for some people. Great to study further and improve grades if you're trying for vet/med school. I'm not down on anyone at all. I can see why people would want the 1yr, kudos to anyone going though more school.

I would agree though that a different designation or degree title would be appropriate, and really a bit more fair if the time/workload is really that much of a difference. Just seems to me that if you're putting in the extra effort and extra time, you should get extra recognition.

 

[nyanko]

In all fairness to Electrophile, I can see where she (he?) is coming from.

It would be frustrating to have the same degree recognition (putting in 2 or more years of time and research) as someone who did 1 year and no research.

I can certainly understand her viewpoint as well, since I'm entering a thesis-based masters program this year and it does tick me off just a little that a person who just took some classes is going to look the same on paper as I am for having taken classes and put the effort forth to do good enough research to be able to write a thesis on it. However, the experience I'm going to gain from the research I'm going to do is enough to justify it on its own - plus anyone in the scientific community will be able to differentiate between the two degrees easily with a cursory look at a person's CV. So I'm not too angry about it.

 

[Electrophile]

plus anyone in the scientific community will be able to differentiate between the two degrees easily with a cursory look at a person's CV. So I'm not too angry about it.

I had one vet school professor ask me if I did it just to get into vet school, which is kinda ironic because I wasn't even officially pre-vet until two years into grad school. Before going to grad school, I had my spot in law school and was all set to go, but figured a masters in biology would be extremely helpful for doing environmental/toxic tort law (which it would have!). The law school was trying to talk me into doing a dual masters/JD thing because they never had anyone try it in biology (lots of dual MBA/JDers out there, of course) and I got talked out of it by my faculty adviser, thank God. I also had someone on the admissions committee kind of ask that indirectly. So you will get asked, even though I think it's honestly kinda rude, but eh. That's why I get touchy about the non-thesis masters because even academic folks are getting confused.

But...the cool thing is, especially if you talk to the PhD (non-DVM) faculty in particular at the vet school once you get there with your thesis masters is that they really like talking research stuff with you. I had pretty robust projects as an undergrad and ran two large experiments, but it wasn't to the level as grad school and they'll appreciate that. So suck up points, bonus! Ah, if only I would have done an extra two years and finished a PhD. I woulda gotta straight As first year! Or...not.